4 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

I'm glad we don't have that here and I hope we never do. The "me too"  mentality and expecting to gain public acceptance of individual preferences no matter what they are is really effed up. In fact, that anything goes, I'm OK/you're OK mentality is a fast track to self-destruction. Some things are not okay and we need to call the balls and strikes. People that don't like it can leave. Especially those that are here uninvited and without proper authority. They are trespassers and don't have a voice and shouldn't have. They need to go home, or get rounded up and sent home. 

No idea what you are talking about - "me too" is a completely different topic.  PR enables a society to address the problem Meaker mentioned earlier: people look at the 2 main parties and both suck big time. At the moment, if someone in the US did want to start a new party they would stand very little chance of gaining any significant power even despite massive popular support. This weakens democracy by reducing competition.

12 hours ago, Papusan said:

 

Hmmm. I wonder what Intel can see but not the others. See above. Not  the first time Intel saw totally different results vs the reviewers. Have Intel posted more improvement patches the last 4-5 days @Talon? 

 

Intel claims Core Ultra 200 patches improve gaming performance by up to 26%

Synthetic benchmarks show even bigger potential gains

The problem is that they complicated the architecture even further. First P-Cores/E-Cores, now chiplets and E-Cores grouped into separate cache NuMA-like clusters. Looks like a mess but interestingly even Ubuntu was outperforming Wingross 11 back in October.

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Intel-Lunar-Lake-sees-up-to-20-performance-boost-in-Linux-vs-Windows-with-iGPU-caveats.899475.0.html

Any word on an Extreme/KS variant of Ultra 200?

My 13900K failed to even boot after mobo upgrade to microcode 0x12b (facepalm). Running on 12900KS now but it's noticeably slower, so kind of weighing my options (also no time for a mobo upgrade job RN): 

• 13900KS and pray  (£450)
• 14900KS and pray  (£680)
• AMD (would need to lose space to a TB card) - not sure £1100-1200 all in + TB card
• Ultra 285 - not sure £1100-1200 all in
• Wait for Ultra 295

12 hours ago, Papusan said:

 

Thermal Grizzly Releases Duronaut High-Performance Thermal Paste with Exceptional Long-Term Stability

Press Release  Yesterday, 13:52

 

Thermal Grizzly's Duronaut thermal paste stands out due to its combination of exceptional long-term stability and excellent thermal conductivity. Its outstanding performance in heat transfer is further enhanced by the ability to apply Duronaut in an extremely thin layer. This is made possible by its unique composition of aluminium microparticles and zinc oxide nanoparticles, optimized for particle shapes and sizes. These features ensure excellent adhesion of the paste to the surface. The powders are mixed into a specially developed silicone oil, resulting in extraordinary long-term stability.

For optimal application, the high-end thermal paste comes with the new TG Spatula Pro. The redesigned spatula allows for more pressure to be applied to the surface during application, enabling the paste to be spread more efficiently in a thinner layer. Duronaut is available in 2-gram and 6-gram packaging options.

Nice, I would give this a go - Kryonauts are not durable enough for my purposes. Running TFX for now, let's see how long it holds out. Using LM on the IHS could void warranty according to Intel.... just fed up with this.

On 1/14/2025 at 6:46 PM, Mr. Fox said:

While I like the concept and agree with the idea, in practical application there is also a downside to having more than two parties as well. The small niche party siphons votes away from the party that would have won an election and sometimes it can allow the wrong/worst candidate to win an election due to people wasting a vote on a candidate that has a snowball's chance in hell of winning. There are no perfect candidates, but the lesser of evils is usually not hard to identify.

Ta-da! Introducing Proportional Representation....

While the UK system is also ridiculously broken, with the outdated and unfair FPTP alone, I would argue the US with the electoral collage system and strictly 2 parties is one or two levels of borked above that. The argument for the two party systems use to be that they are more robust to populism and extremism. Well, here we are: democracy, if you can keep it.

Anyway, good luck to us all. If the US democracy outright fails, or even just withdraws to extreme protectionism (arguably a huge driving factor behind WWII) - the West will break down and fall apart. I guess 80 years of relative peace and prosperity has been a good run.

16 hours ago, Papusan said:

Btw. I hope Trump  have the balls to  stop Nvidia....

 

Sure, that's why he tried to stop the TikTok ban. Look at his "efficiency advisor" and what his stance and dealings around that are. Believe it or not but it's actually all about money for the billionaires.

7 minutes ago, electrosoft said:

I had a very length reply at the ready, but the TL;DR is I concur.

Fair enough. Don't get me wrong, I'm hoping we will beat the odds and somehow make it, warts and all, but given the direction of travel it looks it will take a battle the humanity hasn't seen before. In theory we could grow a super-intelligent hive mind and shut this shit down right now (we haven't so far, but perhaps an impending catastrophe would help focus the minds), it's just extremely hard given who controls both the traditional and social media, never mind numerous other (even more serious) human challenges. Maybe not the best place to discuss this, but all definitely related to NVidia's CES keynote unfortunately.

12 minutes ago, electrosoft said:

4070 Super obviously going back to Best Buy at the end of January.

"Damn it, it's him again" 

Worth watching Jensen's latest keynote to see what the game plan is: virtual HR departments for AIs, onboarding AI employees, humanoid robots following closely behind to join the ranks etc...

Meanwhile, apparently Meta pulled their "official"  fake AI profiles off the site, but is also ending fact-checking on the site:

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2025/01/meta-axes-third-party-fact-checkers-in-time-for-second-trump-term/

1 minute ago, electrosoft said:

I love the idea of a dystopian world with sentient AI roaming and knocking us down a peg.....of course I'm a nihilist at heart so...yeah.

Yeah, if you hate humanity and are fed up, then AI will definitely provide a final solution to that. It'll only be rational. Unfortunately, prior to that billionaires will become trillionaires, and almost everyone else will end up on UBI if they are lucky (can't really imagine UBI in the US).

17 hours ago, Clamibot said:

 

If the 5070 truly shifted performance up by 2 performance classes vs the previous generation, then the pricing seems a bit better to swallow, but I'm still not going to allow them to condition me to higher prices. A 70 class card should still not be that expensive, but I digress. I'm conditioned to Pascal era prices.

The performance claims are likely exaggerated based on ideal case scenarios when using the new DLSS vs previous gen. They say up to 2x 5090 vs 4090 thanks to the latest DLSS (which itself is supposed to be, I lost track 2-8x? faster).

BTW This will be a hot take, but I love the 2 slot form factor, and no doubt they realised there is a market for multi-GPU rigs, which are hard to put together when most cards on offer are 4.5 slot chunguses.

Anyway, worth watching the whole keynote, maybe 5% of which is dedicated to gaming, to see what Jensen&co are really up to (people in the AI community sometimes say "thanks for all the GPUs gamers"): virtual HR department for AIs, humanoid robots doing any kind of work, "virtual humans" etc... Enjoy!

  Edit: more super-duper exciting news, I'm sure bros @Papusan and @Mr. Fox can't wait

https://tech.slashdot.org/story/25/01/07/1527237/nvidia-to-deploy-ai-teammates-in-video-games-this-year

29 minutes ago, electrosoft said:

 

From my perspective, I prefer a 2-dimm laptop just like as 2-dimm motherboard when able for better overclocking and signal integrity.

 

But from the perspective of those who look to the Titan and other laptops to be able to support 128GB+ of memory for their select work loads, it limits their choices especially if you consider the Titan a "workstation" class laptop with expanded memory and storage options.

 

With the cut down memory options, the Raider or other models now become very viable even with half the storage slots as you can always run external storage if needed like Macbook pro users have done for decades 😞 (present company included) but you can't run RAM externally.

 

 

Alienware might have been told by the HQ that customers can purchase Precision workstations if they need 4 DIMMS in a Dell laptop ;) Bad news is that performance kind of sucks in comparison, but hey - can't please everyone if you are in Dell family.

15 hours ago, serpro69 said:

A long, but quite interesting article if you want to get more into the "business side of things" of openai : https://www.wheresyoured.at/oai-business/

 

I wonder when this thing is going to finally burst...

Good read, meanwhile Sam is hyping his shit up: AGI is coming soon, AI agents will enter workforce in 2025.

Well if the socipaths actually succeed then they will need an army of terminators to defend them from the angry US workforce or a good escape to a "safe country" plan. 

OpenAI Now Knows How To Build AGI, Says Altman

On 1/5/2025 at 4:58 PM, Mr. Fox said:

Having everything metered and controlled really ruins things. PCs are becoming nothing more than electronic equivalents of hammers, wrenches and screwdrivers. Having one that is gold plated doesn't make it any more functional than one painted black. The gold plated screwdrivers are designed for people that derive pleasure from wasting money on shiny things that do not perform better. In other words it will be business as usual for turdbook lovers. It's the performance desktop enthusiasts that will be left with nothing worth buying, and a worthless option available for every budget.

Did I miss something? What's being metered on desktop HW side? (apart from Windoze etc)

You could build a massive Xeon or Epyc "gold-plated" $50K workstation, and it would be more functional if you had a use case for such a machine.  Perhaps what's needed is some offering in between (that doesn't melt down under load = larger socket).

People are just not that technical and need something that's foolproof. Chromebooks seem quite popular, and that's Linux under the hood, but obviously someone would need to commit the resources to making something more open along those lines without having to rely on monetising people's data.  

15 hours ago, Papusan said:

 

I mean @Mr. Foxhave tried Silver King.

 

Btw. Happy new year brother. Long time since I have seen you. Hope all is well 🙂

Good news. May try it out between coldplate and IHS. Happy New Year again bro.

All is well - just have been extremely busy, but hoping to be able to spend a bit more time on hobbies now. Glad to see the gang is alright.

On 1/4/2025 at 3:17 AM, Papusan said:

 

Remember U.S Government is after Nvidia now due improved AI performance for China. They need to improve ways to stop hacking/cross-flashing of firmware due risk of ban. We pc enthusiasts/consumers have to pay the price for all this. 

An unintended consequence of the restrictions is that the Chinese have apparently figured out how to train models 10x more efficiently using the substandard hardware that was still allowed in. That is a game-changer which will lead to further AI advancements and proliferation. We all know the spiel, but it will be very interesting to see what Elon (sorry: Donald, the mastermind, of course), actually do about all this. Here is a hint:

https://www.reuters.com/legal/trump-asks-supreme-court-pause-law-that-could-ban-tiktok-2024-12-27/

19 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

Happy New Year to you as well, brother. Sorry to hear about your CPU.

 

Both of my Z790 systems are still running like a top. I needed something new to play with and decided to give AMD another chance since the top dog Core Ultra offered zero interest. I hated the X570/5950X that I previously owned. This new AM5 build is pretty decent overall. While I still prefer my two Z790 builds, I am content with the 9950X overall and don't regret buying it. It was definitely the better option compared to Core Ultra 285K. All modern platforms have at least a few things that are disappointing. I think the days of awesome PC stuff are behind us now.

Yeah, myself and others have fallen victim of the mantra (and all the experience confirming this) that "CPUs don't die". Well, normally they don't unless the manufacturer is desperate enough to overtune everything to be able to show competitive benchmark results, severely compromising reliability. TBF I have put extended loads in the 200-275W range on the CPU, which likely contributed to the degradation. That said I've recently seen a CPU failure rate chart and there is a massive spike for 13/14th gen compared with 12th and obviously a whole range of users are affected.

I'm quite constrained on time at the moment and don't anticipate an immediate need for a new rig or a massive overhaul, so would probably just cough up on a 14900KS to get the extra 25W of safe TDP.... the new 15th gen stuff doesn't actually look that bad from my perspective, but indeed doesn't really add a massive amount of value and is certainly underwhelming given the fab process improvements (and I guess one would be wise to wait at least a year before Linux support stabilises and issues are ironed out). Too bad mobos are quite expensive too, so socket/platform changes need more of a justification. 

In terms of overclocking fun, I would think it will get tougher and tougher since CPUs are more fragile now that they used to be given the improvement in the process, and everything will be more and more fine tuned out of the gate. 

16 hours ago, electrosoft said:

 

Happy New Year Bro! And yes, when @Mr. Fox not only picked up but KEPT the AM5 (along with @talon and some others who usually stuck to Intel), that was very telling. 🙂

 

Sorry to hear about the 13900k issues. You, too, can always switch to AM5.

Thank you it has been an annoyance and a time sink, but I am chalking it up to hobby expenses :) Certainly the first delid was memorable! Yeah, if I had to build a new machine now it would probably be AM5. I would need to check how it performs on Clear Linux though.

On 12/14/2024 at 11:51 PM, Meaker said:

They do a lot of vaccine delivery and outbreak assistance.

Wonder if they ever got audited by some independent trustworthy entity. By construction: probably not, because I imagine no such civilian entity exists in the US, would have to be the Feds.

On 5/25/2024 at 10:32 PM, 6730b said:

https://www.androidauthority.com/shut-down-google-ai-overview-3446038/

I mean it's pretty solid advice to provide useless depressed humans with. The more jump the better now.

On 8/26/2024 at 5:55 PM, serpro69 said:

Quite an interesting read: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/article/2024/aug/24/yuval-noah-harari-ai-book-extract-nexus 
 

  

 

I was waiting for Asahi Linux to mature a bit more before I would seriously consider getting a Macbook for work, but after this... I'm pretty sure I'll pass just out of principle, if nothing else. Anyone willing to partner with OpenAI... thanks, but no thanks.

Thankfully this is opt-in, but the issue is that of a lack of a good alternative on the mobile side.  

What's the current king of the hill? I've switched to Conductonaut and have not really looked back, although issues such as the price/availability and potential impact on any RMA/resale prospects are real.

What's the view on Thermalright SilverKing?

https://www.thermalright.com/product/silver-king-1g/

M$s attempts to force people off of Win 10 might get more people to move to Linux. My guess though is they will drop the HW requirements closer to the dealine.

Happy New Year, hope everyone is doing well.

Kind of catching up on where Intel is at... what a disaster: massive job cuts ("we have some wood to chop" (C) Pat ), Pat The AI Guy is actually out, 13/14th gen broken without much explanation. Last but not least @Mr. Fox pulled the trigger on an AMD flagship... that's all anyone really needs to know lol

My 13900K seems to be on its last legs, has problems booting into Windows, doesn't run at stock voltages etc. Switched back to 12900KS and that's solid. In retrospect the right approach was to RMA when first instability/thermal issues hit. Will try to see if the latest BIOS helps,  not sure it's worth even trying an RMA on a delidded CPU. Kind of reluctant to buy a 14th gen CPU, or any Intel CPU for that matter.

BTW thanks MSI you dumb fcks for defaulting to 4096W PL1/PL2 limits on these CPUs when we now know that the TDP levels specified by Intel need to be observed to "ensure" (improve the odds really) reliability (125/253W in the case of 13900K)

https://community.intel.com/t5/Processors/PL1-and-PL2/m-p/1649853

https://www.reddit.com/r/overclocking/comments/1axepvu/optimizing_stability_for_intel_13900k_and_14900k/

Performance based off of 300W+ power draws it's just a launch review benching gimmick as Intel was trying to hold on to the performance crown using a deprecated fab technology... 

5 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

I have had mixed results with the Rockit IHS. Sometimes better, but often worse than stock IHS. You really do not need to glue the IHS. It is not necessary whether using the stock ILM or aftermarket frame. Using the stock ILM you just need to press down on it with your thumb to keep it from sliding when latching the ILM. If you want to tack it in place, a tiny dot of T7000 under each "wing" on the IHS will suffice. More than strong enough. It is used to attach things like the back panel on a cell phone not intended for user access. But, it is not permanent.

 

Always important to sand down the bottom of the IHS so that is moves freely sitting on the die when not glued in place. If the perimeter touches the CPU or remnants of original IHS adhesive the die contact will be impaired.

 

If you bake the Rockit copper IHS in an oven with liquid metal applied it will accelerate the absorbing process and saturate the copper so it no longer has the ability to absorb it. It takes a couple of baking intervals, cleaning off the slag, applying fresh liquid metal and baking again.

Yes, that T7000 looks very similar to the silicone glue I used just to hold things together a little.

I did the baking lol - albeit internally only, as I wasn't sure if I want to do LM on the IHS or not. I'm not too worried given how phenomenal the temps are now.

27 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

That is wonderful news, and it only makes sense. I mean, anything put out by crApple is just a dumbed down de-evolved proprietary and defective version of Linux for Dummies and an unacceptable alternative to Windows, and anything put out by Micro$lop is just a screwed up mess loaded with bloat and data collection filth. And, like crApple's trash, a product dumbed down for dumb-dumbs.

Yes, Apple disappointed me greatly by teaming up with OpenAI on its "Apple Intelligence"...

14 minutes ago, electrosoft said:

 

Hey @Etern4l!

 

Did your 13900k used to run fine at auto but now won't pass those same tests? Did you change BIOSes? Does it fail on 0x129 using the Intel Enforced Limits? Usually for a degraded CPU downclocking and a positive offset are required. The fact it responds well to an undervolt is encouraging it may be ok or the degradation is minimal.

 

Delidding a CPU and not using LM really defeats the purpose of replacing the stock sTIM especially with the stock lid as there is usually no absorption/hardening (3rd party copper top can be a different story).

 

 

Hey! :) The CPU actually behaved very well during my relatively short Windows testing, pulled 350W+ on stock BIOS settings, whereas my previous record was around 330W IIRC.

Unfortunately it exhibited some crashes on Linux. It's clear Linux, which basically squeezes out another 5-20% out of the CPU, maybe that's part of it. However, these crashes never occurred during the first month or so of CPU use on stock settings, leading me to believe that there is some sort of HW issue. Another thing which started happening earlier was the system would stop seeing SSD drives - that resolved consistently after the repaste.

52 minutes ago, tps3443 said:

What about these boutique XOC thermalpaste like KPx or Kryonaut Extreme maybe TFX? How does PTM7958 compare to these? I always notice large changes when swapping to a different paste. 
 

 

OK, so this was not a scientific study, but best effort, so I have tried probably 10 different pastes before TFX, SYY, CryoFuze etc. They all performed quite similarly, the difference is that the performance would degrade fairly quickly vs 7958 held  up for months. Now, as far 

1. Liquid metal on the die

2. Lapped  the bottom of the RockIt IHS to hopefully increase pressure

3. Used a tiny amount of this Weld rubber gasket glue instead of the Super glue - rationale, more compressible

In my initial attempt I did actually try to assess if LM on the IHS is of benefit, and used SYY - this also exhibited great temps. I then applied LM on the IHS and was initially gutted since the temps were pretty bad, but then figured out there wasn't enough LM and there was not enough contact between the surfaces (evidenced by one-sided patch after removing the coldplate). Very carefully applying more LM resolved the problem.

All in all, my best effort before - the machine would run in the 90s undervolted and underclocked. 

Now, it's in the 90s stock and in the 70s undervolted and underclocked. Probably around 15C difference. Also 15C core deltas before vs maybe 5C now. Again, the caveat here is that some of that performance delta could be due to the IHS lapping and different glue.

On 5/23/2024 at 5:04 PM, serpro69 said:

More people leaving OpenAI due to safety concerns - https://www.theverge.com/2024/5/22/24162869/another-openai-departure-signals-safety-concerns

Yes, co-founder John Schulman left recently to focus on "alignment". People sitting on a gold mine departing to try and find a way out of the mess (which clearly seems impossible at Open/MicrosoftAI, gives us a strong indication of how grave the danger really is.

On 6/13/2024 at 4:43 PM, Mr. Fox said:

 

An excellent video. People might be duped into thinking that Neural Processors are there to run a "personal AI" for them, whereas they are really there to shift some off the processing onto unsuspecting customers' machines, to reduce the load on the servers and vastly increase the amount of data that can be collected. Is Win 11 basically unusable now, or is it possible to effectively disable all the cancerware?

The second video is spot on as well, thanks.

On 8/10/2024 at 5:56 PM, Mr. Fox said:

So, now the DNC is using AI (among other equally deceptive tactics) to make things appear differently than they actually are. 

They're even paying thousands of dollars to young people to post propaganda on YouTube, TikTok and Twitch. Listen to some of these young influencers talking about being bought by DNC PACs. Most of them are very upset by the effort to "buy them" (who wouldn't be)

Well, the reality is these new technologies are being used by whoever can lay their hands on them. Remember that DTs original presidential election was boosted by the marketing / influencing technology developed by Thiel's company and its UK subsidiary Cambridge Analytica. Very robust regulation is required here, but fair to assume this is hardly forthcoming. 

Meanwhile, some good news:

Linux Market Share Hits Record High