RTX 4000 mobile series officially released.

[Shark00n]

1 hour ago, 1610ftw said:

 

Check out the Asus G18, too  - that one might be priced very competitively and it has a nice big 18" screen. Alienware could also be a candidate depending on the CPU you want.

 

And indeed no point waiting for Clevo - if it comes to BGA books others can do that better unless you need a 3rd or 4th SSD slot.

 

 

 

Thanks, but I wouldn't be caught dead purchasing an Asus laptop 😅

Fixed plenty of friends machines to develop some sort of resistance to it. They are just a b*tch to work on and look unprofessional, IMHO!

 

Alienware will be up there I think, with the best performing this year. But they're not present in my country. I've done it before with a friend's address when I purchased a 17 R4 a few years ago, but the support is very crummy where I'm located.

 

Yeah... The Clevo doesn't appear to bring anything new or different to the table. Shame 😐

[1610ftw]

24 minutes ago, Shark00n said:

 

Thanks, but I wouldn't be caught dead purchasing an Asus laptop 😅

Fixed plenty of friends machines to develop some sort of resistance to it. They are just a b*tch to work on and look unprofessional, IMHO!

 

Alienware will be up there I think, with the best performing this year. But they're not present in my country. I've done it before with a friend's address when I purchased a 17 R4 a few years ago, but the support is very crummy where I'm located.

 

Yeah... The Clevo doesn't appear to bring anything new or different to the table. Shame 😐

 

LOL@Asus looking unprofessional - my thoughts exactly which is a shame as they seem to know a thing or two about cooling and I also like their keyboard layout. 

 

[Papusan]

On 2/14/2023 at 3:14 PM, Shark00n said:

4080 has 12GB

 

nVidia is going crazy 

Nvidia prefer that you buy a new laptops at least every second year. And 12GB vram is cheaper than 16GB, so.... Why not?😀 And from what I know the 4060 come with 8GB vram. Gaming laptops with 4060 is probably ok for e-mail, YouTube and internet😎

 

Only from 16 GB you are really carefree...

 

[ssj92]

Clevo 

 

https://xoticpc.com/collections/ultimate-series-gaming-laptops/products/xotic-g370snw-g-x370snw-g

[MyPC8MyBrain]

1 hour ago, Papusan said:

Gaming laptops with 4060 is probably ok for e-mail, YouTube and internet

everyone got spoiled now days, how about any basic 32-64MB integrated will do the trick for email, browsing the web, and watching some videos, as it did for the past decade with zero issues (mostly unless one insists on watching 4k streams), not to mention newer generation of far more capable integrated video chips exist now days, i was doing just fine before with 32mb UHD chip for casual browsing,
 

 

there's a slew of application beside gaming that benefit from a powerful GPU rendering like physics engines, modeling, AI, and various simulations, all run heavy mathematics calculations that requires sometime ECC and every bit of resources to compute in a reasonable time,

these gamer focused marketing campaigns will fade out in the next few years and the lines will become more and more blurred between different category needs nowadays, it used to be only gamers cared or needed these, as we learned from the past few years shortages there is far more business needs for these well beyond gamer community scope, 

[Shark00n]

5 hours ago, Papusan said:

Nvidia prefer that you buy a new laptops at least every second year. And 12GB vram is cheaper than 16GB, so.... Why not?😀 And from what I know the 4060 come with 8GB vram. Gaming laptops with 4060 is probably ok for e-mail, YouTube and internet😎

 

Only from 16 GB you are really carefree...

 

I understand your point and agree, but Harry Potter is a broken mess of a console port 😂

[KING19]

14 hours ago, Papusan said:

Nvidia prefer that you buy a new laptops at least every second year. And 12GB vram is cheaper than 16GB, so.... Why not?😀 And from what I know the 4060 come with 8GB vram. Gaming laptops with 4060 is probably ok for e-mail, YouTube and internet😎

 

Only from 16 GB you are really carefree...

 

 

They probably got tired of people of not buying new laptops every 2 years ever so they're trying to go back to the pre-pascal days 😁

 

Hogwarts Legacy is just one game and the graphics isnt anything special to use a lot of VRAM with its textures so i dont get why its using so much VRAM for no reason, another bad console port but not as bad as Forbroken (Forspoken).

[Papusan]

1 hour ago, KING19 said:

 

They probably got tired of people of not buying new laptops every 2 years ever so they're trying to go back to the pre-pascal days 😁

 

Hogwarts Legacy is just one game and the graphics isnt anything special to use a lot of VRAM with its textures so i dont get why its using so much VRAM for no reason, another bad console port but not as bad as Forbroken (Forspoken).

Expect more of the same. Broken or not, the intention is to push you on next gen HW. Just put specs barely good enough for games requirements around launch date. 

[KING19]

Overclocked Nvidia mobile RTX 4090 GPU can beat even a desktop RTX 3090 Ti

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Overclocked-Nvidia-mobile-RTX-4090-GPU-can-beat-even-a-desktop-RTX-3090-Ti.695685.0.html

 

But it is worth it to spend over $4000 for a RTX 4090 laptop to barely beat a desktop RTX 3090ti? The cooling plays a major part in order to achieve it.

 

Imagine it wasnt gimped to 175W then things would be interesting.

[Papusan]

5 hours ago, KING19 said:

Overclocked Nvidia mobile RTX 4090 GPU can beat even a desktop RTX 3090 Ti

 

But it is worth it to spend over $4000 for a RTX 4090 laptop to barely beat a desktop RTX 3090ti? The cooling plays a major part in order to achieve it.

 

Imagine it wasnt gimped to 175W then things would be interesting.

You can get a 4090 laptop below $3000 but why should you? You pay premium for the cheaper 4080 silicon thats on top power castrated.

The good news is that you can grab an RTX 4090 laptop for for $2,851 

[Etern4l]

3 hours ago, Papusan said:

Please delete. Thanks

 

You can click "..." in the upper right corner of the post, then "Hide post". Poof!

[KING19]

16 hours ago, Papusan said:

You can get a 4090 laptop below $3000 but why should you? You pay premium for the cheaper 4080 silicon thats on top power castrated.

The good news is that you can grab an RTX 4090 laptop for for $2,851 

That's a steal there instead of spending over $4000 for the big brands for the same specs. But It doesnt mention the wattage of the RTX4090 though even on their website which is a turn off:

 

https://www.cyberpowerpc.com/system/Tracer-VII-Edge-I17E-LC-500

 

Currently its sold out

 

The biggest sellers will be the mid range gaming laptops (RTX 4070, RTX 4060, and RTX 4050) which are releasing sometime this week and things will get interesting.

[Papusan]

2 hours ago, KING19 said:

That's a steal there instead of spending over $4000 for the big brands for the same specs. But It doesnt mention the wattage of the RTX4090 though even on their website which is a turn off:

 

https://www.cyberpowerpc.com/system/Tracer-VII-Edge-I17E-LC-500

 

Currently its sold out

 

The biggest sellers will be the mid range gaming laptops (RTX 4070, RTX 4060, and RTX 4050) which are releasing sometime this week and things will get interesting.

That's a steal? I don't think so. Even $2850 is all too much. All 4090 mobile is castrated in one or another way. But why pay +40% premium for slightly less crippled performance? You could buy a decent desktop pc for the money in between those options(1300$+). Or just save the money/lower your credit card debt. The best would still be to stay far away from the laptop models. None of these models is meant for 4K gaming anyway. The most crippled 4090 model should manage 1440P without much drawback vs the less crippled for +4000$. And same for 1080P gaming.

 

See also Eluktronics Mech-16 GP and Mech-17 GP2 are the first GeForce RTX 4090 laptops to retail for under US$3000

 

Max-P 175W. They should instead use Max-Q 175W or just brand it 4090 mobile. The best would be 4080 Max-Q (+150W) because the laptop card don't perform as a true 4080 desktop card.

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Eluktronics-Mech-16-GP-and-Mech-17-GP2-are-the-first-GeForce-RTX-4090-laptops-to-retail-for-under-US-3000.695621.0.html

[Etern4l]

@Papusan Message received loud and clear. It used be the case that for a premium, you'd get a basic high spec desktop performance out of a laptop. The premium is still there, seemingly ever larger, but the performance gap is now glaring. Fair to assume that at least some people who are not married to, deeply in love or simply dependent on laptops will be taking this situation into account and at least reviewing their computing spend strategy, especially if they desire top performance or most bang for their buck.

[Papusan]

13 minutes ago, Etern4l said:

@Papusan Message received loud and clear. It used be the case that for a premium, you'd get a basic high spec desktop performance out of a laptop. The premium is still there, seemingly ever larger, but the performance gap is now glaring. Fair to assume that at least some people who are not married to, deeply in love or simply dependent on laptops will be taking this situation into account and at least reviewing their computing spend strategy, especially if they desire top performance or most bang for their buck.

I know you can't get full desktop performance from laptops nowadays. Hence they need to go back to the old SKU naming. Max-Q fits well or justuse  M for mobile as in the older days. And name the SKU correct. If the chips is a 4080 die then name it correct as 4080 Max-Q and not 4090 🙂 Can't be that difficult... Or can it?😎

[Etern4l]

10 minutes ago, Papusan said:

I know you can't get full desktop performance from laptops nowadays. Hence they need to go back to the old SKU naming. Max-Q fits well or justuse  M for mobile as in the older days. And name the SKU correct. If the chips is a 4080 die then name it correct as 4080 Max-Q and not 4090 🙂 Can't be that difficult... Or can it?😎

 

Well, apparently NVidia does sometimes listen to community feedback. On the desktop side they were laughed off with the "4080" 12GB and forced to cancel a launch in progress.  In contrast, on the laptop side, the community response we seem to observe a lot is along the lines of "OMG mobile 4090 is awesome, because it can sometimes beat 3090Ti desktop card in games!!". Music to the ears of the crafty marketing folks at NVidia :) 

[Papusan]

7 hours ago, Etern4l said:

 

Well, apparently NVidia does sometimes listen to community feedback. On the desktop side they were laughed off with the "4080" 12GB and forced to cancel a launch in progress.  In contrast, on the laptop side, the community response we seem to observe a lot is along the lines of "OMG mobile 4090 is awesome. Music to the ears of the crafty marketing folks at NVidia 🙂 

 

 

And it gets better… What a massive upgrade over previous gen xx70 mobile. Why waste money on this?

Mechrevo claims GeForce RTX 4070 Laptop GPU is only 11% to 15% faster than RTX 3070

 

https://videocardz.com/newz/mechrevo-claims-geforce-rtx-4070-laptop-gpu-is-only-11-to-15-faster-than-rtx-3070

[Etern4l]

10 hours ago, Papusan said:

claims GeForce RTX 4070 Laptop GPU is only 11% to 15% faster than RTX 3070

 

https://videocardz.com/newz/mechrevo-claims-geforce-rtx-4070-laptop-gpu-is-only-11-to-15-faster-than-rtx-3070

 

To be fair, NGreedia got used to these kind of releases on the desktop side as well. For example, the crypto boom era 3060 12GB performs about the same as 2060S, probably due to much lower memory bandwidth :(

[SapphiraTriX298]

So in traditional rasterised performance, the full wattage 4080 mobile is about ~25% above the 3080ti mobile, and the 4090 mobile just under ~10% higher than that in modern games?

[KING19]

On 2/18/2023 at 7:31 PM, Papusan said:

That's a steal? I don't think so. Even $2850 is all too much. All 4090 mobile is castrated in one or another way. But why pay +40% premium for slightly less crippled performance? You could buy a decent desktop pc for the money in between those options(1300$+). Or just save the money/lower your credit card debt. The best would still be to stay far away from the laptop models. None of these models is meant for 4K gaming anyway. The most crippled 4090 model should manage 1440P without much drawback vs the less crippled for +4000$. And same for 1080P gaming.

 

See also Eluktronics Mech-16 GP and Mech-17 GP2 are the first GeForce RTX 4090 laptops to retail for under US$3000

 

Max-P 175W. They should instead use Max-Q 175W or just brand it 4090 mobile. The best would be 4080 Max-Q (+150W) because the laptop card don't perform as a true 4080 desktop card.

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Eluktronics-Mech-16-GP-and-Mech-17-GP2-are-the-first-GeForce-RTX-4090-laptops-to-retail-for-under-US-3000.695621.0.html

 

Its still a steal for a laptop that is normally over $4000 for its specs and i agree with you. If i was gonna spend that much money for a PC it would be a desktop by far and it'll be a much better investment. 4K gaming is pointless on a laptop anyways as there not much to gain from it due to the small screen size.

 

NVIDIA hasnt learned anything from the 30 series and its worse with the 40 series and more confusing than ever because each of the 40 series mobile GPUs has a bigger wattage gap than the 30 Series. Consumers purchase a RTX 4090 laptop but it turns out to be a lower wattage version that is weaker than a Max-P RTX 4080 mobile... Either calling them Mobile or laptop GPU would help somewhat so noone will compare them with the Desktop versions.

 

 

23 hours ago, Papusan said:

 

 

And it gets better… What a massive upgrade over previous gen xx70 mobile. Why waste money on this?

Mechrevo claims GeForce RTX 4070 Laptop GPU is only 11% to 15% faster than RTX 3070

 

https://videocardz.com/newz/mechrevo-claims-geforce-rtx-4070-laptop-gpu-is-only-11-to-15-faster-than-rtx-3070

 

Im not surprised look at the spec sheet above. Lesser CUDA cores than their predecessors and on a 128-bit bus.. DLSS 3 and frame generation will be the selling points.

[saturnotaku]

3070 Ti vs 4070 - the only real improvement the 40-series realizes is from the use DLSS frame generation. Otherwise, the two GPUs are pretty much equal, at least when comparing models with maximum power limits (140W for the 4070 and 150W for the 3070 Ti).

 

 

[1610ftw]

50 minutes ago, saturnotaku said:

3070 Ti vs 4070 - the only real improvement the 40-series realizes is from the use DLSS frame generation. Otherwise, the two GPUs are pretty much equal, at least when comparing models with maximum power limits (140W for the 4070 and 150W for the 3070 Ti).

 

 

 

That has got to be one of the biggest blunders in this generation - take a family of far superior chipsets and go down so many tiers that finally with something like the 5th tier chip you cannot even surpass the direct mobile predecessor in raster performance with what used to be the second best and now third best mobile card.

 

What is interesting is that when there was an early leak the 4070, 4080 and 4090 were really close with regard to performance in Time Spy and now the difference between the 4070 and the 4090 is huge and that is even before we are looking at memory:

 

This was wccftech via notebookcheck:

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Nvidia-Ada-RTX-4080-Ti-mobile-and-RTX-4070-mobile-score-significant-leads-over-the-RTX-3080-Ti-Laptop-GPU-in-leaked-Time-Spy-benchmark.669440.0.html

 

 

Apparently somebody at Nvidia had second thoughts about performance and both made the 4070 20% worse and the 4090 20% better. All of a sudden the 4070 does not look like a good value any more relative to the 4090 and 4080!

 

[Papusan]

 

On 2/19/2023 at 2:28 AM, Papusan said:

And it gets better… What a massive upgrade over previous gen xx70 mobile. Why waste money on this?

Mechrevo claims GeForce RTX 4070 Laptop GPU is only 11% to 15% faster than RTX 3070

 

https://videocardz.com/newz/mechrevo-claims-geforce-rtx-4070-laptop-gpu-is-only-11-to-15-faster-than-rtx-3070

 

Nice start with 4070 Mobile. Now you'll may see what to expect from 4060 laptops. What a failure. And what a money grab. 

 

 

Gigabyte Aorus 15X Review: Brawny Raptor Lake, Laggard RTX 4070

Graphics performance fails to impress.

Conclution... It seems like for every step forward; the laptop also took a step backward.

 

What did the review editor expect? He failed to see that nvidia don't want avesome for laptops. No profits in that. They want that you upgrade every year. Small increments in performance for each new gen is to be expected. And the laptop manufacturers hail that. 

[VEGGIM]

1 hour ago, 1610ftw said:

 

That has got to be one of the biggest blunders in this generation - take a family of far superior chipsets and go down so many tiers that finally with something like the 5th tier chip you cannot even surpass the direct mobile predecessor in raster performance with what used to be the second best and now third best mobile card.

 

What is interesting is that when there was an early leak the 4070, 4080 and 4090 were really close with regard to performance in Time Spy and now the difference between the 4070 and the 4090 is huge and that is even before we are looking at memory:

 

This was wccftech via notebookcheck:

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Nvidia-Ada-RTX-4080-Ti-mobile-and-RTX-4070-mobile-score-significant-leads-over-the-RTX-3080-Ti-Laptop-GPU-in-leaked-Time-Spy-benchmark.669440.0.html

 

 

Apparently somebody at Nvidia had second thoughts about performance and both made the 4070 20% worse and the 4090 20% better. All of a sudden the 4070 does not look like a good value any more relative to the 4090 and 4080!

 

 

"With the RTX 4070 laptop GPU, this is 2,400 MHz, which are in 11 of the 14 games with an average consumption of well below 115 watts. With the RTX 4060 laptop GPU it is 2.610/2.625 MHz – in 10 of 14 games this clock is already reached at an average of less than 115 watts.

This behavior is fundamentally different from that of the two larger GPUs, which operated at over 150 watts in each game in the test, because they were able to convert the additional electrical budget available via Dynamic Boost into even higher clock rates. The maximum possible clock (2.355 MHz for the 4090 and 2.520 MHz for the 4080) was reached only in Far Cry 6. So the clock was almost never the limit, but with the smaller variants this is the rule."

Nvidia GeForce RTX 4070, 4060 & 4050 Laptop GPU Review - ComputerBase

[VEGGIM]

Basically the 4070 and 4060 are not wattage constrained. but frequency constrained.