2 hours ago, Papusan said:

Intel: "Over 500 watts not on the map with Arc"

• Graphics card
• yesterday 19:31

Linus Tech Tips is visited by Intel representatives and the company's sharpest graphics card Arc A770, which is a central part of the long graphics card conversation.

 

Intel values efficiency above maximum performance. Overclocking and unlocked power budget must, however, be functions that come with Arc, LOOOL. 

Why not follow same pathern as they do for their power hogs of processors? Yep, Intel will try go for budget/ low end for mainstream gamers. There is nothing Nvidia and AMD should be afraid of from this mess of a grapics card collection forwards. What a downturn regarding increased competition in the graphics cards market. 

 

 

Intel ceded their ARC BS hype lol. Basically nothing but smoke. They do not have performance with Alchemist, some people think their next GPU arch something called Battlemage or whatever can compete. If they failed to get the Drivers and Low end there's no scope for this to fight at xx70 even. 4070 is going to be at 3080Ti level & Nvidia 5000, AMD 8000 will be even more fast with new ATX 3.0 16 pin dGPU connectors.

 

Their idea is to flood the market with BGA TRASH, BigLittle junk - Check, BGA Trash bundle with Intel Xe ARC - Check. Stamp some marketing nonsense stickers on the BGA book, fools will flock to buy it regardless.  I think they see more money this way rather than try and fight vs the established high performance dGPU market which is not BGA. Also even on BGA they will be  destroyed because Nvidia will stamp 3090 also on Mobile and performance will be worse than any desktop card with it's infinite throttling, Memory castration, Cuda castration, RT core castration lol.

2 hours ago, Papusan said:

My 2080 Ti (not the best OC version) compete within top 4 for 3070 cards in TSE graphics leaderboard. So I don't think coming RTX 4070 will fall behind the 3080. And then we have Nvidia pumping up the TDP for 4000 series cards to try compete with AMD. We'll see. But my best guess... More closer to 3080 Ti, if it not beat it 🙂

 

Couple of things that Ngreedia will do, First would be the VRAM gimp on the 4070 and 4080 cards again, and push the 4090 more for that 24GB, maybe this round they will give 4080 16GB of GDDR6X but I doubt. Second is $699 4080 might not happen this round, Add the inflation (US 9.1% right now), and slowly the BTC is rising again (I hope not), so they might give it $749 or $799 price tag.

 

As for the VRAM + Cache thing, I think that will reduce the VRAM choke on 4K res but any productivity = massive hit if we have less than 24GB VRAM. Apple will brag to moon again with their Unified BS with their Pro and Ultra SoCs (irrelevant... but thought to mention).

 

Also this time note that AD103 is a new silicon created for 4080 cards (Nvidia doesn't like 3080 being 3090 in performance and really wants to avoid that with Ada) and the AD102 will remain premium only for 4090 and up.

 

Price estimates ?

4070 $559 or $599 - 300W 10GB

4080 with $749-$799, performance at 3090ti+ level - 400W 12GB / 16GB ?

4090 $1599 - 450-500W 24GB NVLink (because if they axed that SLI no prosumer will touch these cards and they will rot)

then the mid cycle milking - 4090Ti $2000 full AD102 - 650W, 4080Ti $1249 - 500W-600W

 

I think they will upgrade NVENC with Ada this round for sure, Ampere uses same NVENC as Turing. So it's 4 years old. That is going to get an upgrade for sure maybe AV1 Encoding finally ? (Ampere has AV1 decode) or H.266 (too early), this will make 4090 cards solid for the Video encoding and other Transcoding, 3D work.

 

I'm not interested in these at all. Esp given the fact none of them will have Windows 7 support and all my games list is old now as new ones I do not like the direction they are going plus these would be useless for them on top a Gen to Gen upgrade imo is not a good choice at all esp when one has top silicon GPU. Instead I would love to sell the 3090FE which is unused and grab a 3090Ti FE and run it at 350W cap.

 

About RDNA3, AMD is adding some specialized core this round for RT also the whole MCM thing rumors ended up not accurate, they are using Cache Dies and I not see them as the true GPU MCM like MI250X Instinct which is a real beast 500W 2xCDNA2 HBM dies HPC Accelerator. So I do not think AMD can grab the crown from Nvidia, AD102 will take the crown from GA102.

@Papusan @Mr. Fox

 

This has to be a joke.

Windows 12 could be coming in 2024 as Microsoft shakes things up

Quote

Starting with Windows 11 version 22H2 (Sun Valley 2), Microsoft is kicking off a new “Moments” engineering effort which is designed to allow the company to rollout new features and experiences at key points throughout the year, outside of major OS releases. I hear the company intends to ship new features to the in-market version of Windows every few months, up to four times a year, starting in 2023.

 

This dumpster fire of an OS is so buggy on multiple levels, we keep on seeing the insanely long BS changelogs of mess the company pukes out. Esp remember how they were spouting that Windows SAC releases is for better, and guess what ? Since the debut of Windows 10 1511 to Windows 10 21H2 that update policy ruined the OS completely. Also RTM is complete dog feces level now. While Vista, XP, 7 and heck even 8.1 never had such instability problem this is for all versions.

 

Now with this dumbest pile of trash move with 3 year cycle, the OS will be a clusterf***. Honestly look at Android, Google started to copy iOS hard and it became worse and with yearly cadence the OS quality is also dropped and feature updates and most necessary changes gets gated behind the SoC chips and causes lack of updates / software quality issues  and the lock down of the OS increases ever after plus the mandatory SDK enforcement, lot of trouble.

 

Back to Windows, Enterprise users have to pay a ton to get their updates tested out for SAC, with Windows 11 release M$ finally realized how worse the system was and moved to 1 year update Annual Channel system. I thought they finally got some sense still Windows 11 RTM is utter BS, so many issues what not. Even CPU related issues esp with AMD processors and new Intel BigLittle processors. Do not even remind me Taskbar, Explorer, Win32shell massive downgrades on top of the utter junk UI which is mobile centric first. This is going to break a ton of computers without a question. Also sad part is so many fools will be ready to consoom this junk, look at Windows 11 so many people love that OS because it's latest trash.

 

Also such a big move means, Enterprise will definitely show middle finger, who wants to get this headache of useless junk bloat releases and unwanted trash updates ? Windows 7 got extended beyond XP !! It is now going to be 17 Year old OS that is on support while Windows 10 gets booted by 2025 permanently if this move happens. I hope LTSC stays on since 1809 is guaranteed to get 10 year cycle, maybe it will take the Mantle of Windows 7.

 

All in all games, software, even pirated stuff all of them will break with this garbage move. Longevity of software and the x86+Windows will be ruined completely. This is a very bad future if happens. I really am decided not to go with Windows 11 but now definitely nope. Also what about LTSC ? Will there even be an LTSC since 3 Year EOL policy with a major damn OS not 10 years. That's a 70% reduction of life of an OS.

 

I really think this news is PURE BULL FECES. It's truly unimaginable in the era of low trust society that America has become from 20s to 60s to 90s to now. Horrible, this has to be the lowest IQ of human decisions, yes this is a big deal because Windows enables computers on this planet.

 

Quote

This isn’t exactly new. Microsoft said in February that it was exploring new ways of rolling out new features for Windows on its own arbitrary schedule. Microsoft said it would do so through the use of “experience packs,” bits of code that would basically just show up in Windows Update. These new features will simply appear. Microsoft has also put various Windows applications on their own release schedule, freshening them up with the Windows 11 look and feel or adding new functionality.

 

On 7/15/2022 at 5:32 PM, Papusan said:

Good news. Microsoft intends to extend paid support for Windows 7 for another three years. I'm sure they know a lot business just don't want their new and flawed OS. Not every day we get such good news bro @Ashtrix @Mr. Fox +++

Microsoft intends to extend paid support for Windows 7 until 2026

Earlier in 2020, Microsoft finished extended support for Windows 7. The company expected users and companies to switch to newer versions of OS, but some of them couldn't do that. So for enterprise customers who had to stay on Windows 7 Microsoft continued supporting Windows 7 on a paid basis.

 

Wow, this is really solid news. I'm really glad to hear this because 2023 Q1 was the EOL for Windows 7 ESU channel, for the paying customers. But now M$ in damn years did one good thing for money or whatever reason, 2026 ?! That's the Windows 10 EOL (official one at-least, since 1511 Windows 10 first RTM released in 2015). Simplix will keep on releasing the ESU Windows 7 updates as long as M$ releases them.

 

I just hope all the browsers esp Chrome keeps the support going forth. But for the rest of the Hardware and Software it's unfortunately not the case, Latest QBittorrent which uses QT6 is axing the support, Dolphin Emulator axed it because of same reason but there is an option to get the QT6 working (the #2 comment in that thread mention it). RPCS3 also uses QT for it's front end, nothing yet on their side probably they are just focusing on the backend since RPCS3 is pretty much perfect on the UI side not much is needed. PCSX2 also left Windows 7 support.

 

As for GPUs RTX 3090Ti is the last most powerful GPU that supports Windows 7. For games, I will try to do a test and compare with Windows 10 LTSC vs Windows 7 to see how DX11 and Vulkan (also DXVK) fares in these. My project, still the blow from ASUS was a huge one that knocked me out in finishing my PC.

 

@raptordddFollow this video guide for MSMG, it makes it easier and helps you out. As I also followed the same since It was a long time back I serviced by 8.1 iso.

 

 

5 hours ago, Papusan said:

Today’s blooming Joke. Tomorrow’s Intel processors may get 3 different cores. One of those 3 is the baby’s babysitter core, LOOL @Ashtrix

 

Imagine 8+16+16 cores. That will be 40 cores and 48 threads. A fantastic leap in core counts. S why not just scrap the few P-cores and instead fill the silicon up with only small E-cores? If they started use LP E- cores they could probably cram in a lot more cores. Wouldn’t it be nice have a real Intel Threadripper variant as mainstream desktop processors? They could even offer it for laptops.  
 

The tech adoption from Smartphones into desktops/laptops has to stop. And AMD is tempted to do the same as well. Unisex can be nice but not this messed up tech for computers.

https://www.sweclockers.com/nyhet/34572-intel-meteor-lake-till-barbara-far-tre-olika-karnor

 

”It is also the first time that Intel divides the energy-efficient cores into two different variants, where one is referred to as "LP E-Core". It is possible that LP stands for low power and that Intel takes another leaf from ARM and the mobile manufacturers' book for a hybrid configuration with three different sized cores. However, the diagrams only show information about the portable series. How the configuration can be for the stationary variants remains to be seen”

 

What a shame really.

 

Intel is really hardcore into the BGA DUMPSTER. Pathetic display of ceding the CPU design prowess and efficiency. They found out this way to rip off ARM design, not only they ruined Desktops but now doubling down on this cancer. Ugh. Now I do not think Intel will stop adding E nonsense even if they release CORE series successor at this point, doesn't matter if 2026 or not. Intel is clearly into this.

 

Also notice bro papu how Windows 11 abandoned Desktop centric UI to a mobile junk. And worse is Pluton processors that block Installation of other OSes thanks to Microtrash's silicon level backdoor. Fresh out of oven news.

 

Microsoft’s Pluton prevents Lenovo ThinkPad laptops with AMD Ryzen 6000 PRO from booting with Linux

Quote

This laptop is equipped with Lenovo exclusive AMD Ryzen PRO 6860Z processor with built-in Microsoft Pluton security co-processors. This is a dedicated chip that is supposed to increase security for Windows systems by verifying UEFI certificate keys. The problem is that it only trusts Microsoft’s key, not any 3rd party UEFI keys that are used by various Linux distributions.

 

Quote

 

“This means that given the default firmware configuration, nothing other than Windows will boot. It also means that you won’t be able to boot from any third-party external peripherals that are plugged in via Thunderbolt. There’s no security benefit to this. If you want security here you’re paying attention to the values measured into the TPM, and thanks to Microsoft’s own specification for measurements made into PCR 7, switching from booting Windows to booting something signed with the 3rd party signing key will change the measurements and invalidate any sealed secrets. It’s trivial to detect this. Distrusting the 3rd party CA by default doesn’t improve security, it just makes it harder for users to boot alternative operating systems.”

— Matthew Garrett, Security developer at Aurora

 

What a disaster ? do people care ? Nope they will simply chug it all down. Windows 11 adoption rate is really faster than 10 imagine even after GWX nagware Windows 10 failed because people thought it was garbage vs 7. Now 11 is used by so many fools.

 

Also there's some good news, AMD's Threadripper is going to wreck havoc on Intel Sapphire Rapids XEON (MIA delayed atm). Genoa is 96C192T beast.

 

AMD EPYC 9000 “Genoa” processor lineup leaks out, up to 96 Zen4 cores and 360W TDP

Quote

 

The full configuration of EPYC Genoa silicon offers up to 96 Cores and 192 threads. Thus far only one production ready processor with such a core count is known, the EPYC 9654P. This CPU would operate in 2.0 to 2.15 GHz frequency and feature 360W TDP by default. However, according to YuuKi’s chart, there is also an engineering sample operating with up to 400W, it may simply be a pre-production sample of the same processor though.

 

The EPYC 9000 series would feature various core configurations, including 96, 64, 48, 32, 24 and even 16 cores. Each of those variants will also have different total cache, ranging from 384MB to just 64MB. The 16-core EPYC 9174F would be the highest clock SKU up to 3.8 GHz but also requiring 320W TDP.

 

AMD Genoa CPUs are set to launch later this year. Officially Zen4 data-center CPUs should become available in the fourth quarter

 

 

 

Zen CCD is evolving while Intel is devolving into this madness of E cores, granted Sapphire Rapids doesn't use E cores and uses EMIB to link 14C24T Tiles x4 still AMD is really pushing x86 to new heights.

 

Still shame since AMD abandoned the HEDT, Intel also. Now with SPR delay and without pressure from Intel AMD won't even bother and on Desktop side many do not even care about HEDT they just want those pathetic trash woke gaming performance not the PCIe or I/O or etc.

1 hour ago, Papusan said:

LOOL. ALL is a absolute single threaded performance. Yep, higher memory speed for single threaded performance. Can’t beat that. Intel know how to sell in performance to compete with next gen  Ryzen chips. A very minor upgrade to make ready for 14th gen chips and new forced MB upgrade. At least you can re-use your DDR5 sticks. 
 

“Meanwhile, Intel's next-generation CPUs will gain support for DDR5-5600 memory, which will boost the processors' single-thread performance”

 

 

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/intel-raptor-lake-leaked-slide-confirms-ddr5-5600-more-pcie-lanes

And you get those wimpy small baby cores together with the real Raptor cores in a single processor, LOOL

 

 

Yep higher ST and DDR5, I think AMD will also definitely be ready because they are abandoning the usage of XMP as DOCP and want to debut a brand new AMD brand and standard. So Intel is also preparing for that.

 

The good things are more PCIe 4.0 chipset lanes while AMD is hampering their lane counts as per the old news. Also Intel is adding Maple Ridge / JHL8540 Thunderbolt 4 native now, a.k.a USB4 / 40Gbps speed I/O on RPL Z790 chipset itself ? Also Maple Ridge / TB4 demands to have x4 lanes cut for it, no bifurcation the board must dedicate the lanes. But it is 3.0x4 lanes.

 

I would like to see what Intel does for ILM LGA1700 will they fix the mounting and CPU bending or not. Also more E baby cores is kinda expected as they just want that 8C / 8P ST perf for that "GAMING" Marketing. I still think AMD's Zen4 will have a solid performance but it all depends on how they execute their plan, esp the Firmware which has been a MESS for AMD.

 

Unfortunate part is despite all these extra lanes and PCIe upgrades the damn Mainstream mobos have max 3 lanes one being the x4 electrical lane and no x8 electrical PLX lanes or x1 lanes (only few mobos have this). We are getting higher lanes AND Bandwidth of PCIe 5.0/4.0 but the damn physical PCIe slots are staying same !!

 

HBA SAS / Soundcards / 10GLAN cards / NVMe RAID cards etc...so many others we can use on PCIe expansion slots.

 

I wonder what Intel will do for Intel 14th gen Z890 chipset series..... More 5.0 lanes ? more NVMe 5.0 ? 10G LAN native ? but one thing is for sure, more E CORES LOL. Shame.

 

Also notice Intel is putting VNNI Instructions aren't those AVX512 ? hmmmm so Intel may actually put them back since AMD Zen 4 basically confirmed it.

6 hours ago, Papusan said:

Thanks to yo all. I’m on vacation as bro Fox said. But I’m sick due my bad health. Can’t almost not hold an phone or look in the laptop. I will post when my health is better. God bless you all. 
 

Bro Papusan 

 

Good to hear back !! Get well soon bro Papu.

1 hour ago, Mr. Fox said:

Things don't feel right without Brother @Papusan posting stuff in our community. I really miss him, but he is on vacation right now. Hurry back, bud. 🙂

 

 

Was about to reach out to him just now, good to hear you already did. Cheers !

Well here goes nothing.

 

I built everything carefully. The ASUS board says Q-Code 99. DIMM.2 plugged in, DRAM plugged in. PS/2 KB+M, ASUS ODD to the SATA connector which is using ASMedia controller (Planning to get Windows 7 installed). Nvidia RTX3090 FE. Seasonic Prime TX1000 (I already checked with their internal tester) the board lights up RGB and even has the BIOS LED working, all RGB zones light up fine.

 

 

No idea what should I do, It did the same for both BIOS slots. Removed ODD, I flashed the BIOS which had Windows 7 support (1202) and see if it worked, as someone was saying latest BIOS caused code 99 but other versions work. Same thing, Unplugged PS/2 and replaced with wireless KB/M same thing, removed DIMM.2 which had M.2 SSDs same thing lol.

 

AIO liquid is flowing, GPU fans spin up, All Noctua fans front, back & AIO attached fans all of them spin.

 

Welp. I had to return like 2-3 boards of ASUS without powering them on because stupid QC has chipping around the boards. Now probably nothing is going to fix this, I even unboxed by monitor for this occasion everything brand spanking NEW.

 

I'm just sad. Going to RMA it, it was having like last week left. Thank goodness at-least I could return this, now have to build everything again !!

 

Oh yea the board is ASUS Z590 APEX.

 

I went with this because it had optional PCIE4.0 if I ever want to install 11900K binned one and get PCIe4.0 lanes without cutting off the GPU bandwidth plus PS/2 Ports for Windows 7, DIMM.2 and top of all the V_Latch feature for accurate VCore readings, 8x SATA in which 2 of them come from ASMedia for that Windows 7 through ODD, the board has all top HWBot ranks for DIMM speeds and OC performance plus ASUS BIOS. Shame shame and I'm beyond annoyed.

 

I even had to order a bunch of Thermal pads with various thickness because DIMM.2 slot had a small pad for M.2 resting, and that was bending the M.2 SSD PCB so I got 2.5mm pads and cut them, placed it now it's very proper no flexing of M.2 PCB. All of the small things effort gone in vain. Maybe just an experience of building a dud !

 

20 hours ago, Papusan said:

Hi bro Ashtrix. Forget use an air cooler. 

 

Regarding the fans for the AIO. I have replaced them with better fans who is directly connected to the MB. I have the Corsair chassis aka have the Corsair commander center. But I don't use it. I prefer manual or tuned fans from the MB. And if you want the fans connected to the pump and you want to regulate the fans, the pump will be affected by this. Low fan speed means you'll force the pump to run at lower speed. Not adviced. The fan need to run at max rated speed (but there is no noise run it this way).

 

I have rolled up the original fan cable for the fans and stripped them / hidden them (having them still in there means I can sell this AIO complete kit with the original fans later). You could of course remove them totally if that is something you want/prefer. But don't connect much stronger fans on the same fan cable from the pump head if you want to swap out the weak fans for something better.

 

 

 

Thank you bro Papu. I went with Arctic LF II AIO, mounted it with a lot of hassle because storage pane had to be installed first (not HDDs themselves yet & good that I went with XL version, the basic one would have been PITA with it's small size) and then AIO, and only a pair of hands. Removed those Arctic P12s and replaced with Noctua NFA12x25 Chromax and controlling them through CPU headers on mobo, 2x fans go to one header. Then rear one + one more on the radiator go into another header, so did not overload anything here. Should be pretty good and also every single fan can be controlled through BIOS / Mobo.

 

Also rolled that Arctic's fan cabling and tucked it to sideways to hide it. For thermal paste I'm going with Thermalright TFX. A few more finishing touches and soon I should it and running unfortunately I shattered the Tempered Glass by mistake now I have to pay $40-50 for the replacement.

Any advice is appreciated.

 

Basic Idea of build and parts...

I got my final build panned out, already built 3/4 of it & waiting for Corsair SATA sleeved cables because the motherboard has criss-cross arrangement of 8x SATA ports and the stock cables are too hard and the plug is also long causing a massive PITA. Now only final pieces are left. I'm still thinking on the AIO vs Noctua DH15 Chromax because of pump whine, noise etc vs full air with high static pressure fans.

 

AIO Choice - Arctic LF II 360mil

 

A) The Meshify 2XL won't fit top 420mil LF II in storage layout**

B) no RGB trash and no annoying garbage software needed to control AIO it goes to the header and Mobo controls it, irrespective of the OS machine is running. Plus the Radiator is thicker than usual crowd.

 

Case choice - Fractal Meshify 2XL

 

Phanteks Enthoo Evolv X - It looks all great but It cannot sustain 8-10 SATA Enterprise class HDD with 7200RPM and cool the rig due to it's front panel being completely closed off and top also with minimal vents.

 

Lian Li O11D XL is a big nope as it has poor design for HDDs as they will be running at hot temps in the side of case with ZERO ventilation. Esp when you consider with WD and Seagate Enterprise / NAS class drives which run at 7200RPM and need to be cooled properly.  Nobody even mentioned this at all because this case has 4x 3.5" option but 4 of them will die lol if I use their stupid cage.

 

Corsair 7000D is having good accommodation with venting option for 6x 3.5" drives but the biggest issue is Corsair's HDD Cage is shoddy as it will rattle (GamersNexus review mentioned it).

 

Moving on...

 

Case cooling**

So the Meshify 2XL is basically having Noctua NFA12x25 Chromax (120mil high static pressure top of the line fans), 4x in the front, 1x in the rear. Also have 4 of the NFA12x25 Noctuas left with me as I mentioned in the Storage layout I can fit either 480mil which is 120mmx4 fans of Noctua NFA12x25 OR 360mil AIO since we do not have 480mil AIO the 420mil LFII is again using 140mil fans which won't fit because the Storage pane obstructs the fan screw locations, so couldn't get the bigger AIO from Arctic.

 

And I'm using the storage layout because I plan to use all 8x SATA ports on the motherboard, with 1-2 being SATA SSDs and rest 6 drives being WD Red or Gold or Seagate Exos. Maybe add an HBA SAS expander to the PCIe3.0x4 (won't cut the CPU lanes) at a later point if possible to get more drives maybe 10-12 in the chassis which is the future plan and future proofing just in case as I do not have a NAS machine and do not intend to build one anytime soon want to have my data in my only machine and access at my fingertips. I do not use a phone to consume movies or such it's all my PC only.

 

 

Now the question....

 

So would you suggest going with the AIO which LF II 360mil over DH15 + 4x NFA12x25 fans on top ?

If yes I have one more thing, I read the LF II uses fan cabling in sleeving which is really a novel thing, and makes the machine look very neat.

 

But how do I replace the fans or should I even replace the 3x Arctic P12s with 3x Noctua NFA12x25 Chromax. (I like how Noctua fans have rubber anti vibration pads while P12s from Arctic do not and overall the Noctuas do not have any hum or other noises across the full fan RPM curve), and plug into the mobo,

 

Option A - Using the existing LF II 360s wiring from the fans to the AIO which goes to pump and that whole thing controls the entire AIO is that a good method ?

 

Option B - Or Should I route them separately ? but in this case I cannot even load all 3 because no splitters available for Noctua which can take 3x fans and more over only AIO header will take all 3 as loading more fans will cause overload on any other mobo fan header due to high wattage.

 

Thanks for your time.

 

P.S - Found this thread for some basic info, https://www.overclock.net/threads/arctic-liquid-freezer-ii-is-it-possible-to-replace-the-fans.1751708/

@Papusanare you ready bro for this nonsense ?

 

"Hertzbleed" Exploits Intel and AMD Boost Frequencies to Steal Crypto Keys

 

Quote

"Heartzbleed," the new exploit can steal secret AES cryptographic keys when observing CPU's boost frequencies. The attack works by monitoring the power signature of any cryptographic workload. As with any other element in a CPU, the workload's power varies according to the processor's frequency scaling in different situations. Observing this power information can be converted into timing data, allowing an attacker to steal cryptographic keys. This is done using Dynamic Voltage Frequency Scaling (DVFS), a part of any modern processor.

 

Quote

It affects all Intel processors, and Zen 2 and Zen 3 AMD CPUs. The attacker can exploit this vulnerability remotely without requiring physical access. Intel and AMD will not offer microcode mitigations that should prevent this type of exploit from executing successfully. Additionally, Intel stated that this attack is not very practical outside of laboratory research, as it allegedly takes hours to days to steal cryptographic keys.

 

Best part is no Microcode BS thankfully. I wear my tinfoil hat and say how these exploits show up every now and then, more and more negative PR. Put more ARM trash in good spotlight (ARM is also effected by Spectre but majority do not know).

 

A few months back we got CVE related to Branch Prediction and this is now fresh for both Intel and AMD x86 processors.

 

🤡

11 hours ago, Papusan said:

"HOW TO FIX INTEL"

 

 

 

 

What’s wrong with Intel, and how to fix it: Former principal engineer unloads
The principal engineer who worked on CPUs from the Pentium III to Core i7 says Intel has lost focus, and it's "lucky" AMD can't make enough CPUs to do more damage.
https://www.pcworld.com/article/393285/whats-wrong-with-intel-and-how-to-fix-it-former-principal-engineer-unloads.html

 

 

 

Bro Papu, I remember this guy, and it was not a good memory of this fellow.. I recall him being not a good Engineer to speak or anything. Better watching Dr, Ian Cutress, even though Ian never criticizes any corporation directly in his articles or such. This guy comes off like some guy who got kicked out of Intel and is now trashing them hard.

 

My take on Intel's failure is simple - Investors did not care as they had other prospects which is other corporations,  esp what is happening under Brian Krzanich, so they let everything go on and on and rot. Because the x86 was entire computing industry. So nobody cared as long as their profits soared.

 

Let's go back , Intel's actual talent like Gordon Moore, and CEO Andy Groove, this man was a master he did some great things during his tenure and he predicted there will be only one pureplay foundry in the end and almost it's true now we have just 2 - Samsung, TSMC. Rest all vanished. Also he owned that issue of Intel back in 1995

Intel recalled a major chip in 1995 and turned them into keychains inscribed by the CEO — and the message speaks to Intel's current crisis

 

 

 

Going back again, so yeah since the HPC, Servers, Mainstream all were occupied by Intel the Investors did not care, and what happened ? braindrain. Slowly Intel starting losing focus which is why they put a lot of money into 5G and failed there, then they even lost focus on their NAND, I remember when M18xR2 was there Intel's SSD was top class MLC technology. now ? Sold off dead to SK.Hynix rebranded all of their IP called as Solidgm. 5G thing failed hard, but the suits were fine. Since majority of these corporations are run by same sect of people who have deep pockets and run Banks too. Their new love was found - Apple corporation.

 

So the entire focus was on Apple. And also meanwhile Intel stagnated since Mobile chip industry was booming. Finally the big shots left leaving lesser frys, who demanded change at Intel which caused them to rattle when AMD started with Zen hitting at 6950X HEDT class with mainstream processors. The left over talent took the weight, pressure and tried to keep the boat float. Intel was squandering over 10nm failure which we all know. They sold off their entire 5G smartphone to Apple for peanuts, (Wait now how Apple will claim in-house lol just like their GPU which is basically PowerVR stolen or better put poached from Imagination Technologies)

 

Ultimately they even axed Optane. It's the world's best Memory technology. Destroys SLC to oblivion and 3D NAND as well.

Intel Optane SSD DC P5800X Review: The Fastest SSD Ever Made

Again it needed a ton of cash. So Intel after reeling their focus back trying to find a CEO for years, failed upwards with 14nm while TSMC caught up. When Haswell started Intel was first on the planet to debut FinFet. Now look where they are. Now Optane for consumers is gone as well sold off entire 3D-XPoint technology to Micron and now Micron abandoned it sold off Utah plant to Texas Instruments.

 

Also that guy Murthy Renduchintala, was probably eying for a CEO position after the ousting of Brian on sexual misconduct ROFL. He also left the corporation.  Then they even announced Jim Keller leaving too. See how many holes are there in this company history, this is supposedly a new uArch design entirely and that project is now axed or we will never know the reason. Edit - I missed mentioning how Keller and Murthy probably had clashes. No wonder Keller left and that guy also left. Also Keller is a notable expert on the CPU design, the other person nope.

 

Also I want to put this too. Intel's all SVP and VP roles are now Women only. Sorry but I cannot keep this fact in dark. It's the CA political spectrum. The company is really if you ask me rotting inside. They replace tech and IT guys with MBA hires. Their interim CEO was an MBA guy to keep the company afloat.

 

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Bryant’s replacement is Intel EVP and Chief Revenue Officer Michelle Johnston Holthaus. She is another Intel lifer, having spent 25 years at the company, joining in 1996. She has held multiple roles in reseller management, HQ central marketing and operations, global account management, and currently sits as GM of the Sales, Marketing, and Communications group. In recent memory Holthaus was the keynote speaker at Intel’s Partner Summit. Bringing her to the role is likely a move to strengthen Intel’s bonds with its OEM partners, an aspect that is seeing increased competition in traditional client OEM markets. It also means that Intel has two women leading its largest business units – Holthaus for Client Computing, and Sandra Rivera for Datacenter.

 

Intel is a massive corporation and it's too big and too many politics inside. Also now with all this mega mess of a situation at Intel corporation. Finally they fixed 10nm and it's now denser than TSMC 7N. But their CORE architecture is still from old era, basically Nehalem / Westmere (Core i7 brand 2008) and major change with Sandy Bridge where the RING bus evolved and then added a ton of Cache to it and etc, it was hardly scalable after 2016 so they created MESH Skylake era XEON and HEDT which was worse in every way as it drank power and wasted a ton of electricity plus heat.

 

Still miracle how they pulled off Comet Lake 2020 on that RING bus beyond 8C with 10C20T, but it couldn't take more which is why Intel 10th gen has Cache errors and OCing cache far too high 24.7 might result in Cache degradation (We can see it in latest Z590 BIOS where ASUS AI Algorithm doesn't put insane Cache Ratios vs launch BIOS). Bet that's why RKL also got axed 2C along with 14nm backport (double whammy).

 

Now 2022, they are stuck with P cores 8 Max for 2024-2025, they will add cache, improve front end add more Clocks more Voltage regulation and more as much as they can optimize and then they will debut a new Architecture.

 

After Pat Gelsinger came, he started hiring the old brass, real people who made Intel CORE series. Ian covered it here at Anandtech & here

 

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News in the last 24 hours, based on public statements, states that former Intel Senior Fellow Glenn Hinton, who lists being the lead architect of Intel’s Nehalem CPU core in his list of achievements, is coming out of retirement to re-join the company. (The other lead architect of Nehalem are Ronak Singhal and Per Hammerlund - Ronak is still at Intel, working on next-gen processors, while Per has been at Apple for five years.)

 

That guy right there, he is one behind the uArch not that Francis guy who acts like that on media bashing Intel and claiming. So yeah I hope that Intel's talent whoever left and rehired back put x86 in higher position esp Overclocking and Tuning of Hardware which we buy & own (Ignoring that Management Engine CIA spyware).

 

I hate ARM processors they are junk because they rely heavily on garbage IP blocks to do their work and on top the Software is a gigantic mess. On Android for eg if you do not get the Baseboard firmware and blobs your hardware will never work on newer OS and Kernel. On x86 what we see ? Alder Lake not officially supported on Windows 7 2009 OS, running it scott free. And ability to run Windows 3.1 .exe on Windows 10. That's what called Computing is, not this BS Smartphone addiction of crappy Social media junk with constant algorithm fed propaganda.

 

Anyways felt to post this lol sorry.

 

AVX512, it's used for some AI math, yeah we do not use much but from the Igor's Lab testing AVX512 enabled makes Alder Lake scream fast (Faster Uncore, Ring, IMC and everything) Not disable and waste the damn transistors (irony here is we disable E cores, yeah unfortunate but that's what it is, beefier silicon yes but weak nope).

 

I welcome anything more for x86 processors NOT LESS. Anything new that works ? Sure sign me up. But why cut off when you already have. Pathetic move by Intel because Toy Trash cores cannot handle the AVX512, and since very few care to run ADL with E junk disabled, so Intel thought it's fine to axe it plus they save money on validation process too esp on Desktop, they give the people 8P here game on them lol pathetic and BGA junk ofc E core = more cores marketing to fool dumb and easy cash milking with tons of SKUs. Big shame, since AMD is going big on AVX512, anything given to us mere mortals is good move no matter how you dice it.. See how pathetically Nvidia castrates GeForce for that licensed Quadro Drivers ? awful.

Big News Drop by AMD

 

They are firing on all cylinders now. Here's some nice slides for you to understand.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

To summarize

 

Zen 4 is basically going to be a beast no question esp in MT workloads. Also Zen 4 with 3DV is also in pipeline plus Genoa-X 1GB L3 cache lol epic... and Zen 4 shares both 5nm and 4nm, not sure which will end up on 4nm maybe those BGA junk, they also confirmed Zen 5 on 4nm / 3nm with 3D V Cache too. I do not think we will see all of these on consumer side of things, since X3D is hotter, and with 5GHz+ clocks on all cores with heat is a no go maybe another locked down Gaming only chip ? no idea. But I think they might do a short term socket ? Zen 4 will have AM5 and Zen 5 will have AM6 ? Gotta see if they hold AM5 a long lived one or not.

 

Also Zen 4c and 5c is interesting, this is not big,Little junk, these are Bergamo (4c) server parts and 5c is unknown. They are doing this because ARM's Neoverse V1 and N2 platforms are coming soon with big ST performance across a huge number of cores without SMT technology. So AMD is prepping up x86 for that, Intel delayed XEON Sapphire Rapids it was known news as Anandtech reported it, And Intel's XEON with E cores is in 2023-2024.

 

Also AMD confirmed Zen 4 Threadrippers. but it will be probably Pro series garbage only, I hope I'm wrong. But Intel existing SPR itself is delayed and W class is put in favor more, same for AMD they axed basic Threadrippers and using TR Pro with Octa channel memory.

 

For GPU RDNA is looking mighty interesting but I think those ridiculous rumors of 2.5x RDNA2 i think might not be true lol, same for Nvidia, too much hype. Still gotta see what is in the store for us. Oh also chiplet design for GPUs too, very interesting and finally they confirm it haha.

 

 

Anandtech covered all in detail if anyone is interested.

 

P.S - No idea why the images are appearing squished if I use the high resolution ones... the sources for these are from Videocardz, @Reciever maybe you can look into it ? Update - Using URL fixes it, thanks for the PM.

Great work @Azther, I love Windows 7 and Vista aesthetics. I personally think that Desktop OS peaked around Windows 7 era, and the beautiful effects it has. I plan to run Windows 7 Dualbooted with Windows 10 LTSC 2019 / 1809 for the time being so Glass8+, I may look into Windowsblinds later. Aero is just king of the hill !!

 

I think only very few nowadays care about the beauty of an Operating System @Mr. Fox is one who shares that feeling, glad to see few more who love that design and style. Ever since Apple abandoned Skeuomorphic design after Steve Jobs death, entire world shifted slowly to the death of UI to now degenerate art. Also note before Apple's refinement upto iOS 6, Palm Web OS did absolutely fantastic job in perfecting it. Google's Material did something unique but now it's horrible garbage Material You which is 100% trash.

 

Peak moments of Human Machine Interfaces - Windows Vista/7, Apple iOS 6, Palm Web OS, Sony Playstation 3 XMB, Xbox 360 Blades & Android M / 6.x, I think these days will never come back, the OS is now bland boring junk with zero personality copying from here and there and zero originality and passion, no respect for Computing more for garbage News propaganda and mindnumbing social media addictions.

 

You know this same thing spread to games too, back then we had fantastic Main Menus, Options, Fonts, HUD and what not a quick memory flash from what I can remember, these games are the ones which fit in that category that take the Immersion to stratospheric levels -> BioShock, Metro 2033, Red Dead Redemption, Far Cry 2 & 3, Assassin's Creed II, Assassin's Creed Unity, Watch_Dogs, Batman Arkham Trilogy, God of War III, , Ninja Gaiden II, Crysis 3. Only few good games still retain the depth of the design - PREY 2017, Dishonored, DOOM 2016 (sadly they abandoned all with DOOM Eternal for mainstream appeal). Now more and more games have that same bland big boxy ugly textures and design styles worse they have that mobile UI, this mobile cancer spread to OS design and functionality and even games as well.

 

Anyways I digress, thanks and keep up the good work. Here's Wallpaper packs for Windows XP,, Vista and 7. Bonus is you get HD of these pictures, these wallpapers  bring back my memories always and the beautiful wallpapers are just serene.

  

On 3/30/2022 at 11:09 AM, Ashtrix said:

Just wanted to share this... Windows Vista and Windows 7 wallpaper pack click the first Drive link,  Windows Vista and 7 HD Wallpaper Pack 4.0.7z (195MB).  And XP HD wallpaper pack too, Windows XP HD Wallpaper Pack 4.0.7z (242MB), there's a bonus archive org page (here's the link anyways) for higher quality.

 

Beautiful timeless pictures from all old Windows XP, 7, Vista, ME, 2000, 98, enjoy !!

 

I use these only on my machine. I feel like I'm back in old times. I love the old design of Vista and Windows 7 era, everything was beautiful the glossy and nice glows it had for every small thing from highlight, hover to click. It was really a pleasant serene experience. Now all we have is some plain numb flat boring trash for design. Which is why Windows 7 will forever remain the best Windows OS ever made, that era is gone. It won't happen even in the next 10 years. Infact if you see the corporate degenerate art nowadays on Facebook, Google, Microsoft promotions esp in their apps and their home pages or user guides etc you will understand how bad things are.

 

 

 

Updated Unlocked BIOS files with link in OP.

 

BIOS versions include

Javers - A14+

Remek002 - A16 but with microcode v22,

Remek002 - A16 but with microcode v25 (note - this will reduce your Haswell processor ST/MT performance by a large factor and not worth

NOTE - I do not have the Unlocked v25 microcode Unlocked A16. Do not flash official A16, they patched the sleep bug you will lose both Unlocked BIOS option AND Worst microcode making the machine a huge junk.

 

5 hours ago, Papusan said:

The beauty with Intel. Let you have the chance to upgrade your MB. Maybe they are able to fix their flawed loading mechanism (ILM) design with a new socket? 

 

Intel 14th Gen Core desktop “Meteor Lake” allegedly requires new LGA-2551 socket

It would appear that the rumors stating Intel will keep 3 generations on the same socket are untrue. In the fourth quarter of 2023 when Intel is expected to launch a new desktop series codenamed Meteor Lake, an entirely new socket might be required.

 

And look at this beaty.... Wouldn't it be nice with 32 Baby cores bro @Ashtrix 😀 More cores has to be good (8P + 32-E cores). Intel know exactly how to improve/compete and please the performance enthusiasts.... Very fast P-cores for single threaded tasks and loads of baby cores to help the few P-cores in multi threaded tasks. Jam, Jam. Nice.

 

15th Gen Core Arrow Lake

The Lion Cove/Skymont cores might already debut with Arrow Lake. These new microarchitectures were previously rumored for Lunar Lake. As mentioned in previous leaks, the 15th Gen Core would not see an increase in Performance cores, but Efficient cores count would double over Raptor Lake, now counting 32 in total.

 

 

 

Both AMD and Intel are really massively deep into screwing customers. Shame that Intel is again following same garbage 2 CPU per socket formula as always while AMD is giving so many damn things. I think Intel might fix the ILM in a way it doesn't break the cooler compat with LGA1700 on upcoming Z790 if not they also should be avoided unless one knows how to fix the ILM and handle that DIY tweak.

 

 

Intel is deadlocked into this 8P fixed and will keep on adding small improvements to the P cores while adding more E JUNK. Because their Core is same architecture. I think after 2026 they might do a full new micro architecture. Meanwhile Zen will bulldoze them, god I hope. I hate this E junk nonsense and giving 8P max for that gaming performance joke and milk more on BGA TRASH 🤬

 

Check this information out. I learned some information on AMD's upcoming Zen 4 Chipset. This lane business is always confusing no matter what lol...

 

AMD Zen 4 & Socket AM5 Explained: PCIe Lanes, Chipsets, Connectivity

 

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Connectivity from the Processor
Starting with the Zen 4 processor's lanes, all of its PCIe lanes are PCIe 5.0 and there are a total of 28 lanes. The first 16 PCI Express lanes will be used for a single x16 PCIe slot, or they can be split into two x8 slots. AMD's requirements only enforce PCIe 5.0 on the X670E boards, which means PCIe 4.0 will be applicable to lower cost motherboards.

The remaining four PCIe lanes are used for connecting to the chipset. Just to clarify, on the processor side these do support PCI-Express 5.0, the chipset only supports PCIe 4.0, so the link negotiation mechanism will downgrade the link to Gen 4.

 

 

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Promontory 21 offers a total of 16 PCI-Express lanes. Four of these are used to connect to the CPU, over a Gen 4 interface, as mentioned before. In the X670/X670E daisy-chained configuration the secondary chipset connects to the primary chipset, it has no direct link to the processor. This means that on the primary chipset another four lanes are used up, leaving eight usable PCIe lanes, whereas the secondary chipset has 12 usable PCIe lanes. Four of the lanes are PCIe 3.0, although these are muxed interfaces with SATA 6 Gbps. This allows the motherboard manufacturers to choose how they want to implement those interfaces and as we've seen, ASRock has gone for eight SATA ports, whereas most other board makers appear to be going for six on their X670 and X670E motherboards.
 

Compared to Intel's Z690 chipset, which has support for a total of 28 PCIe lanes, AMD has clearly decided to scale things back a little bit. In all fairness, Intel doesn't support more than 12 PCIe 4.0 lanes from the Z690 chipset and four of those lanes are shared with SATA 6 Gbps ports. Intel wins by having support for an additional 12 PCIe 3.0 lanes though, but two of those are shared with an Ethernet MAC, something AMD doesn't do, as the company relies on PCIe based Ethernet controllers. It's worth noting that Intel has a wider bus to some of its chipsets, as their CPUs support eight DMI 4.0 lanes. Comparing AMD's B650 chipset with Intel's B660, AMD comes out slightly ahead if high-speed interfaces matter, as the B660 chipset only supports six PCIe 4.0 lanes and eight PCIe 3.0 lanes, although none of its four SATA 6 Gbps ports are shared with PCIe.

 

 

 

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What we obviously don't know at this point is how much of a performance penalty there will be for AMD having two chipsets, especially when it comes to high-speed storage devices. We've seen some concerns about this implementation in virtualized environments and how these devices will appear to the OS in such a case, but we don't share those concerns. We expect the primary chipset to appear as PCIe bridge to the host system, a mechanism that is part of the specification and has been supported and used for many years. These are things we're going to have to wait and see how they play out, but AMD clearly deemed the tradeoffs reasonable enough versus the cost of developing multiple different chipsets.

 

Basically the X670E / X670 Dual Chipset Design has to prove it's Reliability - which AMD didn't show with AM4 as they are still busted with USB issues thanks to GloFo12nm IOD which is JUNK and doesn't work properly with Zen 3 chiplets, and Performance.

 

Also looks like AMD wanted to go somewhat cost effective route (why not when you spend tons of cash on the BS garbage dumpster class junk called BGA trash and give it TSMC 6N, for those BGA money minting) so they worked with ASMedia to make the chipsets, and went with a 2x system rather than single Chipset, so there is a slight possibility of handoff issues, if they happen or other unknown variables.

 

So Ultimately the PCIe5.0 is downgraded to PCIe4.0 on Zen 4 launching boards regardless of X670E or the budget one B series. Because there's a massive cost there apparently as per the article author who has good comments there, as the Switch might cost in triple digits per unit. On top of the daisy chaining. So the Zen 4 chipset link is same as AM4 Zen 3 only.  What this means is Zen 4 is having same DMI speed like Zen 3 at 4 lanes 4.0 instead of 4 lanes 5.0 and then switch to 4.0 and split with PLX at Chipset (cannot do because high cost), unlike Intel which upgraded from CML 4 lanes 3.0 to RKL 8 lanes 3.0 to ADL 8 lanes 4.0.

 

Anyways thought something is interesting to learn, esp we know that HEDT is DEAD. X299 being last from Intel and half cooked Threadrippers. Rumors are next gen HEDT will be having W class from Intel (meaning no more X series and more Workstation BS) and Threadripper Pro meaning ultimate high price. So we need to know more about the Mainsteam Processors and their I/O capabilities.

@Papusan and @Mr. Fox I think you guys are not going to this like this absolute BS of the idiots nowadays.

PC Components with High Power Draw an Issue for an Overwhelming Majority of Users: Survey

 

 

 

 

The world has become a total Clown show. These fools who buy those overheating piles of pure garbage with BGA trash and also make a whole fuss about how it's toasting, dumb as rocks. They want top performance and also thin and light BS like Apple garbage soldered mess and later whine.

 

Why not just simply give a middle finger to those scum corporations like Dell and all of them and buy a damn Desktop ? Oh probably even in Desktop it's a mess I think. People who buy RTX3090 are miniscule, not many buy that card. Forget 3090Ti which is 450W, and as for Intel PL2, it's 300W only if you push all heavy P95 like workloads on all 10C, in realistic scenario who will stress their CPU that much except the benchers ? Until 10th gen it was fine to be honest. 300W on games which is what these dumbfools will do most of the time is not happening, at best 150W peak that too on heavy titles like RDR2 or Metro Exodus. As for GPU 3080 and combined with that = under 1000W PSU at best.

 

Yeah 12900K is hot and it needs an AIO, Intel is the foolish one here investing more into E junk than improve their lithography node and P core, look at Zen 4 under 300W and hitting 5.5GHz clocks, 5GHz+ on many 16C on TSMC 5N. I'm really annoyed at seeing this nonsense pop up on Desktop side of all things. It's annoying to have that pump and etc yes, but that's what the Intel is now, they put more R&D and money into BGA basket because it makes them most of the cash. People who buy them in masses for that gaming are the real culprit.

 

Plus more over with AMD's Ryzen era, why are even people crying ? lol those CPUs are already saturated a LOT of Market for PC mainstream they barely can clock let alone function properly with USB IOD nonsense, the marketshare for ADL is far less vs CML , Zen parts even maybe mid range is slowly picking up due to Summer and new machines it's a drop in ocean.. GPUs are MIA for 2 years flat out period let alone owning a top end at scalping price,

 

All in all one must own a TOP END hardware to even whine about them on Dekstop, I doubt folks who even own top end hardware even care about the damn power FFS. Like how many are using 10900Ks and 12900Ks and 6900XT / 3090s ? And do they care ? Nope. This whole poll is just riding on the new garbage virtue signalling. It's probably more than 85% of the voters on LapJoke JUNKYARD trash BGA than a proper MXM slotted P870 P570WM P770 Alienware's old Socketed machines and Desktop users.

 

Also ATX12VO garbage didn't fly thankfully - more mobo complexity adding SATA power delivery to the already damn crowded PCB of the ATX formfactor is stupidest things ever heard. I had a hope that with dawn of PCIe5.0 there will be a new ATX standard that becomes BIG because PCIe5.0 is 3x times more bandwidth per lane than PCIe3.0 and that means a single PCIe5.0 x16 can electrically satisfy PCIe3.0x8 so many times that you will make a pure Server class SSI-EEB size for us mere mortals similar to the Enterprise class. But nope, we need that overheating junk of an NVMe SSD which barely can shoot up in RAID (DMI is maxed out at 2x drives at best through chipset) or that precious top slot for that GPU to play latest politically motivated trash games and have 2 lanes at best, all on top of death of HEDT.

 

I hope Nvidia / AMD / Intel push for 600W to spite these fools, let them buy Apple garbage or Consoles or best they can stick to their daily dose of Propaganda through "Smartphone" trash where basic thing of an Operating System - Filesystem doesn't even exist to user. So much so for Performance or Tree hugging nonsense. The absolute hypocrisy of the EPA scam and others is a whole new level though. What about the damn Lithium and Cobalt mining used for EV cars ? yeah no sound.

 

 

AMD Answers Our Zen 4 Tech Questions, with Robert Hallock

Not much new but a few bits and pieces on the chipset to those who didn't understand and AVX512 confirmation (While Intel axed it in 12900KS. if 13900K and RPL also removes the AVX512 at factory level but wasting Silicon space it's a massive bummer). And a subtle hint at Xilinx, I hope AMD makes an x86 CPU with FPGA integrated so that ARM junk can bugger off forever esp in those selected Davinci Resolve by those Apple cores and etc.

 

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What are your thoughts on 3D Vertical Cache (3DV Cache) for Zen 4?
3DV Cache will absolutely be a continuing part of our roadmap. It is not a one-off technology. We are a big believer in packaging as a competitive advantage for AMD, something that could meaningfully enhance performance for people, but we have nothing specific to announce for Zen 4 yet.

 

At Computex, you showed a 15% single-thread performance gain over the Ryzen 9 5950X. Wouldn't that only put the gaming performance on par with 5800X3D?
I think it's too early to say actually. We were deliberately conservative with our number on single-thread performance. We do intend to publish the exact breakdown of IPC vs. frequency contribution later in the summer, also including performance, power, and area on the new process. As far as what stacks up against what, I think it's too early to say, we're still in silicon bring-up.
 

Your presentation mentioned "AI acceleration." Is that AVX-512 or something more exotic, like Intel GNA?
Yes. Specifically, AVX 512 VNNI for neural networking and AVX 512 BLOAT16 for inferencing. Both are pretty nice speedups, we're not using a fixed-function acceleration, this could be something we could do with our Xilinx acquisition. We are starting to see more consumer applicability of AI workloads, like video upscaling, which has grown a lot in the last two years. I think there is a general trend for the average enthusiast to take on more AI-type workloads. The time felt right to bring these features into the chip, given we moved to a smaller process node with better performance, power, and area capabilities.
 

What can we expect from the processors in terms of CPU overclocking?
I'm not gonna make a commitment yet on frequency, but what I will say is that 5.5 GHz was very easy for us. The Ghostwire demo was one of many games that achieved that frequency on an early-silicon prototype 16-core part with an off-the-shelf liquid cooler. We're very excited about the frequency capabilities of Zen 4 on 5 nanometer; it's looking really good, more to come.

 

 

Also they confirmed that AMD PPT a.k.a PL2 for AMD, max power draw is 230W on LGA1718 (AM5).

 

AMD Corrects Socket AM5 Power Specifications: 170W TDP and 230W PPT

 

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The overall increase in power specification figures for the AM5 platform was not unexpected – part of the benefit of the move to LGA sockets is additional pins for power delivery – but this finally settles the matter of just how much power AMD's new socket and platform are designed to deliver. Motherboard vendors will no doubt go (well) past this on their high-end boards, of course, but 170W/230W will be the baseline for any motherboard that wants to officially support high-end AM5 chips.

 

CPU power consumption has been on the rise for the past several years, as we're now well into the Dark Silicon era. While an individual CPU core still only draws a modest amount of power – on the order of 20W to 30W for a high-performance core – the total power requirement quickly balloons for high-end processors, which pack upwards of 16 cores. As a result, power delivery limits are typically the constraining factor for heavily multi-threaded workloads, as CPUs have to back down on clockspeeds in order to stay within their power envelopes. Increasing platform power limits, in turn, offers more headroom for keeping more cores clocked higher more often.

 

 

Finally, it would seem that we should expect to see the Ryzen 7000 family hit that full TDP out of the gate. According to a comment from an AMD spokesperson on Reddit, the top TDP of the Ryzen 7000 series will indeed be 170 Watts, with PPTs reaching 230 Watts.

 

 

I hope those stupid YouTubers stop whining about the damn power like they are using some kind of use and throw garbage BGA dumpsters.

 

 

 

Greetings all, hope everyone had a great weekend !!

 

Horrible opening with BGA shilling to hell about how thin it is, absolute sad nonsense GARBAGE paired with Win11 and ChromeOS both being absolute dumpster class. Disgusting but yea, BGA mints cash AMD wants that like Intel, Ngreedia, crApple. We also have Azor the ex-Dellienware anti socketed pro BGA guy also comes to add his share of PR "Gamers looking for a Desktop like experience in a gaming laptop" "Alienware M17 R5" and also his BS about how thin these new BGA dumpsters are, hey please forget the throttling pile what it is lmao. 1/2 of the video is about BGA. Why not open with Desktop beast Zen 4 ? I digress.

 

Looks like they are adding some BIOS / Firmware level Direct Storage option like Smart Access Storage, more Microshaft propreitary garbage to BGA machines. I hope Vulkan have something, but anyways all this for Gaming is just mostly smoke and mirrors as it's mostly useful for consoles of 8th gen because they are having slow molasses storage. And game devs tailoring for them. I doubt there would be any sort of resource contention reduction like CPU cycles and GPU which will impact in higher performance with that DX Storage except for load times. That upcoming DOA Forspoken already demoed it with even SATA SSDs but they didn't put what's the loading speed without that option...moving on..

 

SKIP TO 17:35 to get to the actual Hardware

 

AM4 legacy is shown, no doubt it's a massive achievement even it it's flaws, I like it. So new IOD means I think all the existing nonsensical flaky chips in Zen 3 are things of past ?. No X3D stack on Zen 4, probably as we all know it's just an experiment for AMD.

 

 

Zen 4 - New IODie on TSMC 6N with iGPU (waste of space but yeah they want to get more SI orders and also streamline their pipeline probably). 5GHz+ sustained clocks. TSMC 5N node with higher TDP than Zen 3, 15% IPC growth and extra L2 Cache. Yep Cache is the future, Intel knew this with i7 5775C but axed it and made it only for Apple BGA. But AMD cashed on it on EPYC and X3D Gaming processor. And unfortunately no X3D Cache stack, probably AMD decided it's not worth for the extra heat and more cost and they need high speed clocks now.

 

 

 

New IO capabilities are very good, it's having 4 more CPU PCIe lanes over 12900K (20 CPU lanes) (which is same as of 11900K only PCIe link speed changed and Chipset with DMI), AM5's having dual chipset design. Ton of I/O here...ofc the new X670E Segmentation where they are having PCIe5.0 on all and they also say it's having more VRM components too. I feel this is a very bad point they added a segmentation on top Mobo now... Esp the fact is all boards have PCIe5.0 SSD M.2 and GPU X16 lanes slot. Wonder what the extra I/O would be.

 

So basically AM5's X670E gets an x4 speed PCIe5.0 SSD option on 12900K this has to be done on PCIe slot and not a direct option (meaning X16 GPU lane top slot will be X8 if using 5.0 SSD). I bet Z790 will be on par like this, since LGA1700 has 1800pins so easy for Intel to add more PCIe lanes to the RPL processors. Also insane I/O, I want to know what's the DMI link speed on X670. Z690 got PCIe4.0x8, X570 had PCIe4.0x4, Z590 with 11th gen was PCIe3.0x8 (Same as X570) and Z590 with 10th gen was PCIe3.0x4. But how much does PCIe5.0 SSD even do over PCIe 3.0 even lol in reality, I doubt many use SSDs to max, because if they do the DMI will be choked. Look at it, just 2x NVMe SSDs max throughput is enough to saturate the DMI on Z690. 

 

A shame how segmentation is coming, this marks HEDT death ? I hope not. Fingers crossed for Sapphire Rapids XEON.

 

Also Extreme Overclocking lol, how AMD will do the OC now is interesting, I want to see if AMD allows like Intel fixed high speed Clock on ALL CORES and not that PBO2 again and call the annoying Curve Optimizer BS and Voltage as OC. They are having new XMP rival though. Gotta see the battle in Fall 2022 🙂

 

5.5GHz clock rate is shown in the demo btw, that's a big achievement for AMD. Plus Blender workload is clearly shown as Zen 4 based pre-prod CPU is beating out 12900K by 31% in speed (the CPU is 7950X  as Lisa Su says both are 16C processors lol). No wonder Big Little gets destroyed by real Big Cores running at super fast speeds.

I wanted to mention Anandtech and other coverage to all folks here but I forgot about it...was occupied with my own issues. But I think most of you are aware and use heavy backplates for the AIOs and etc but still I think this consolidated post would have better information.

 

Enter Intels' 12th gen LGA1700 ILM disaster.

 

The first reports came from Igor, then we got Luumi, Buildzoid and Anandtech also report. Now Intel apparently deflected this issue. Horrible BULLFECES behavior from this company.

 

Check out the articles below and modify your Motherboards accordingly.  Oh no reports from Gamers Nexus, he is so busy doing his garbage takes at his horrendous gaming suite benchmarking which has like 5-8 games lol... No report from Hardware Unboxed either. I do not think even that Linus covered it at all. Well that's why I consider them at a lower category than the better ones mentioned above. Also nothing from Optimum Tech either ? Pathetic.

 

LGA1700: Reports of Bending Sockets

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The implications of this are two-fold. Firstly, from a cooling standpoint, it will and can lead to increased thermals due to the gaps this creates between the cold plate of the cooler and the IHS on the CPU. While thermal paste will generally fill some of the gaps, the problem is the nature of the gap and its size that the increased pressure the ILM creates. The second and perhaps the most fundamental part of this, it should NOT be happening.

 

While PCBs can be flexible, the nature of heat creating further expansion could lead to damaged sockets damaged processors and ultimately leave users with an expensive headache. There's also the potential to create permanent bends in the PCB area around the socket. This is not a good thing. It should be noted that LGA1700 motherboards either use ILM's manufacturers by Lotes or Foxconn, but it's reported that both ILMs are affected by this issue.

 

3D Printed LGA1700 Bracket Counters Alder Lake CPU Warping Disaster

 

 

Intel Comments On Alder Lake's Warping and Bending Issues, Mods Void Warranty

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Intel has finally commented on the issues, stating that this condition isn't a problem and that modifying the socket can void the chip's warranty. It told Tom's Hardware:

"We have not received reports of 12th Gen Intel Core processors running outside of specifications due to changes to the integrated heat spreader (IHS). Our internal data show that the IHS on 12th Gen desktop processors may have slight deflection after installation in the socket. Such minor deflection is expected and does not cause the processor to run outside of specifications. We strongly recommend against any modifications to the socket or independent loading mechanism. Such modifications would result in the processor being run outside of specifications and may void any product warranties." —Intel Spokesperson to Tom's Hardware.

Intel's statement does acknowledge that the condition exists but says it doesn't cause performance issues. However, it's important to take these comments in context: First, deflection is an engineering term to describe "the degree to which a part of a structural element is displaced under a load (because it deforms)," so this is the technical term for what the enthusiast community refers to as 'bending,' 'warping,' or 'bowing.'

Second, Intel's statement that it hasn't received reports of the chips running outside of specifications means that the deflection doesn't cause the chip to run higher than the 100C maximum temperature and that any increased thermals don't cause the chip to drop below its base frequency. That doesn't mean there isn't an impact on cooling — it just isn't severe enough to cause the chip to run out of spec.

 

 

Thermalright launches Bending Corrector Frame for Alder Lake processors

 

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Despite Intel comments, 3rd party companies are now working a solution that would prevent bending from happening. Thermalright has just released its “Bending Corrector Frame” for Alder Lake processor. It is available in two colors, and it was designed for LGA1700 socket specifically.

 

 

 

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The frame costs just 39 RMB which is 6 USD, so it is not very expensive. It’s compatibility with specific motherboards and other cooling solutions has not been confirmed, but the seller claims it supports H610, B660 and Z690 motherboards. It is not yet available for sale in other regions.

 

I think Intel may fix this in LGA1700 Z790, with new engineering changes probably. If I were AMD I would cash in heavily on this...their AM5 ILM is very robust and has all the fault tolerances with double screw down and more built in I think we all know that but here's a refresher.

12900KS SP rating comparing to non-KS is not accurate as we all know, and more over Intel this time finally changed the IHS branding too, the old iconic swirl is gone with that new rectangle overlapping boxes reflecting their new logos (I hate their new logos and BS font). Plus TjMax is now capped at 90C instead of 100C. And the OC roof is higher on 12900KS due to binned chips plus better IMC too but extra $150 is too much if you ask me, esp when the new Raptor Lake is dropping soon in 4-6 months. Also Intel completely disabled AVX512 now at the Silicon leve on KS level, so all that silicon space is permanently wasted on the KS chips.

Intel’s finest crowbar selection – Core i9-12900KS binning and OC comparison with 12900K/KF

 

I expect Raptor lake to drop it completely. I wonder if the big x86 Cove will it have the AVX logic on the silicon ? I think yes, but again laser cut off, that's a real waste. But I think Intel knows except niche who want to get more performance with disabling entire E Core cluster and Cache speed boost are very few and many simply run with at-max PL2 off. So they are deciding this path.

 

Also I think RPL won't be on Intel 4 (which I was thinking it will be in my previous post). I think that Intel sheet on their plan just shows their tech readiness but perhaps not actual CPU shipments. Also do note Sapphire Rapids XEON is delayed until this year end (not fresh news it was reported long back by Anandtech) and that will be on Intel 7 only. So I doubt without the XEON shipping in High Volume on Intel 4 they won't put it on mainstream ? could be and not... Tiger Lake was on 10nm SF and ADL is on 10nm ESF / Intel 7, XEON is on same Intel 7, Ice Lake 3rd Gen XEON is still on Intel 7 only.

@Papusan Zen 4 leaks are showing some bad news going forth .. we knew this is coming but now I think AMD will be even more on point.

 

Looks like AMD is tightening even further. I didn't knew until recent time that Ryzen 5000 is pretty much peak due to that 1.4v at stock, all that PBO2 does is simply unlock the Power limits. AMD added those features like - Curve Optimizer, for per core tuning, and Ryzen Master. Even that Hydra tool, too many knobs but in the end you barely can even Overclock. The voltage is already high. And only binned locked down silicon is 1.3v VCore.

 

Plus the primary reason many say AMD with PBO2 is better, well of course it's better why not because with most all core OC without great cooling esp the Temperature sensitivity that Zen architecture showcased since first Threadripper series which had 70C max, and Ryzen scalability with low heat makes the CPU lose those boosting clock of a Single Core ultimately resulting in lower performance.

 

MSI MAG B650 AM5 Motherboard Allegedly Spotted Running An AMD Ryzen 7000 ‘Zen 4’ Desktop CPU At Up To 1.532V

In contrast with Intel processors upto 10th gen, we had a lot of space to make the CPU run +300-400MHz on all 10 cores 20 Threads. 10900K good SP and Top Silicon will get the 5.2-5.3GHz up from 4.9 PL2 off to 5.3 Boost, this can be tamed on an AIO and even DH15 upto 300W (AVX / Prime 95 loads) and that's all on 1.3v. 

 

With 11th gen backport disaster the CPU was too hot to handle, it had barely any space left plus they added that Adaptive Boost which is similar to PBO2, essentially killing off Manual OC on top of disastrous  IMC binning. With 12th gen the 10nm / Intel 7 even if it's denser than TSMC 7N, struggles to cool because of high density of heat and thus making 12900K need an AIO at all costs and OC needs more cooling potential demands. Oh also pushing 1.4v VCore 24x7? that was only acceptable for long times on 11th generation processors. Not sure for 12th from what I know,  but the high SP still is in the 1.3v voltage zone for ADL processors for 5.3GHz and pushing post 5.4GHz is still at 1.4v from what I have seen a little.

 

AMD on the other hand needed high voltage on TSMC 7N, with upcoming TSMC 5N which is probably tuned for high performance for AMD x86 processors, is having 1.5x+ high voltage on VCore out of factory !! That means OC on AMD platform is 100% dead. I do not think any CPU can push over 1.6v on Air. Maybe that's why they are talking or making noise about DDR5 with AMD X Samsung to show masses here we killed OC on the CPU now consume this Memory OC.

 

 

Anyways on a side note look at the below picture, maybe that new Raptor lake 5.8GHz boost coming in Q3-Q4 shows the node is Intel 4. Wonder how much VCore will Intel push here...Intel always gave something for Overclockers and tuning, I hope they keep that spirit alive. I hate CPUs or HW which is locked down like Apple trash.

 

 

But will Intel commit on Desktop ? They want maximum profits at all costs, but perhaps they will because adding more E cores means they need to expand the power plane on existing Alder Lake which will blow a hole, so perhaps they might commit for Intel 4 on Z790 debut CPUs. Oh also Intel is debuting a new technology for RPL too that DLVR which reduces power consumption at silicon level.

 

Intel Raptor Lake’s Digital Linear Voltage Regulator (DLVR) could reduce CPU power up to 25%

6 hours ago, Talon said:

 

6Ghz out of Raptor Lake with light boost would be cool to see on regular cooling but I don't think were close to 6Ghz all cores anytime soon, or even 5.8ghz unless something has radically improved with Intel "7".

 

For gaming that cache is going to be a nice improvement.. It's double the cache of a 12900K and will definitely help if you're chasing crazy high fps when looking at the sky or blank scenes during a benchmark that can all fit into the cache. 

 

I watched the review of the 5800X3D from various outlets this morning and it definitely looks like a great gaming CPU, but a 5600X, 5700x, 12600K, 12700K, etc all perform very similarly in games. They all cost less, and 2 of them offer far higher performance in everything else for less money. I went back and watched a GN review of the 9900K where he basically shits on the 9900K in the conclusion stating that in a nutshell it's a CPU for those that are neurotic over FPS and yet the gap between Intel and AMD was larger back then. Yet today he's basically falling over himself with praise for the 5800X3D that gets absolutely curb stomped in everything not gaming and value. It's hard to take a channel them or HWU seriously with their obvious bias. 

 

5800X3D looks interesting for sure, I wish it was unlocked, I think I'd likely buy one to tinker with, but just like a 12900K/KS, it's a bad value for just gaming. 

 

 

Yeah their biases are too stupid and annoying. Did they mention 5900X is selling at $380 Retail at NewEgg ? which is $60 less cost for more Threads and more in everything. Stupid gaming this that changes what about overall performance with 4C8T extras ? yeah no do not consider that at all buy this junk, well nobody is going to buy this processor. X570 has been in the market since Ryzen 3000 was in the market due to PCIe4.0 which means 2019 that is  3 year old and Ryzen 5000 is 1.5 years old now, how much market saturation AMD got ? PLENTY. Which is why Intel slashed prices heavily on Alder Lake and offered DDR4 to get that marketshare back.  Also I remember how Steve at GN was like yeah buy this 9700K it's best for gaming lol, absolute pile of trash. Look how it struggles due to lack of SMT.

 

A locked down experimental dog feces processor which is only made to show off their TSMC technology while getting massive profits by EPYC-X Cache stack refresh while Intel is having no XEON competition to that. Plus the worst is, this 3D Cache is not even there on Genoa which is Milan / EPYC successor arriving later this year, and then 2023 Bergamo with cut down no SMT Server CPU. And ofc that means ? Ryzen 7000 won't have X3D presumably. Which is why it's a real experimental SKU.

 

I want to point one big finger at Intel, they axed their top class L4 Cache series with 577C and Apple's BGA Crystalwell dumpster being last. They could have added it to all of their stack but never did because more cash and more pins Intel didn't want to spend any money on R&D anymore. Well now they are adding that to the CPU Arch itself, Raptor Lake's new Game Cache lol.

 

This AMD experiment is expensive technology and probably has a lot of limitations as well, which is why they just did this Frankensilicon like Intel 10nm to 14nm++ LGA1200 but heavily castrated it from the factory with no OC at all, plus garbage IF clocks. Well Ryzen would crap out on itself if we push hard.

 

And games ? Broken garbage since Day 1. Honestly look how awful AAA titles have been on PC and PC crowd is fine with that garbage behavior top rating for broken trash and selling millions and what do they get for such PC hardware costing 3x more than a Conslow box ? 3X FPS ? Nope 3X MSRP of GPUs and nonsensical garbage optimization broken from get go.

 

1 hour ago, Papusan said:

Yep, they couldn't have used same binning as for 5800x. If they did, it wouldn't reach their targeted boost clocks as today within use of same voltage and power cap. Remember that 5800X3D run at same temp as the 5800X but with 35W less wattage.

 

 

Bro papu, this BGA like dumpster 5800X3D trash runs at 1.3v boost clocks, while 5800X runs at 1.4v boost clocks it's not same voltage, that's what I read on Tech Power Up comments as W1zzard mentioned. Yes it's a binned silicon. B2 stepping has been there in the market for a while and it didn't fix any of the issues with AMD, which are those notorious WHEA cancer and USB diseases.