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Today, a strange thing happened, or two. So, yesterday evening I have been working on the machine, transitioning from the old laptop, moving databases, installing software, etc. I have also opened the laptop to insert a 990 PRO 2TB drive from my former laptop. Everything was working fine at this point. Once everything was properly set up on the new machine, with the old drive already inside it, I have wiped the 990 PRO with DiskPart and then did a complete read test, zero fill and read test again (to check for degraded NAND). No problems there, however, the common read speeds for the 990 PRO were somewhere at PCIE GEN 3.0 level, hovering around 2.500 MB/s. Also, the factory OS Drive (PM9E1 which is an OEM 9100 PRO) runs somewhere between 6000 to 10.500 MB/s in benchmarks, dont know why. I know that the Sequential R/W is not important, however, I dont know why does it act like this. I yet have to perform a full test in Anvil to see IOPS, but I suspect that the drives are not working to their full potential in this laptop. Could anyone with PMP18 please confirm the drive performance with either CDM, AS SSD or Anvil? After I have finished the work with the drives, I have launched a Passmark Performance Test 3D benchmark to run in a loop till the morning, to test the GPU for possible errors before I fully commit to this machine. This morning (7 hours later) i came to the machine, ended the test, checked HWInfo and tried to restart the OS. When I came back from kitchen, the PC was in recovery mode, unable to post. No luck with startup repair, always loaded just into recovery. The filesystem was fine, the drive was detected, files were accessible. Ran 3 different diagnostics on the OS drive, all fine. Fixed the bootloader partition with bcdboot, everything started working again. I am flabbergasted. Now, is the OS drive failing in some weird, unpredictable way, or it was some Windows shenanigans?

I will certainly try to observe such behavior, once Ill be able to spend more time with the laptop. Could be during this weekend. 7 - Yes, exactly this. Nvidia tray monitor says that the GPU is inactive, but it keeps getting active. Once I got rid of the Intel control panel, it is almost always off, but the corellation with the monitoring software is a spot on! Each time that I open HWInfo from tray, the GPU comes alive for a split second. So no hardware monitoring in the background when I want to maximize the battery, okay. 9 - I do not see any eventlog entries for connecting or reconnecting the FP Reader device. It seems like it only becomes active about 3 second after the login screen appears. First, there is only PIN option, but after a few seconds the fingerprint option appears. It is a FIPS reader, so I get that its a slowpoke. 11 - I know where you are aiming at, but I perfectly understand what is the SC slot - I use Smart Card reader for our Govt application. However, I have done my research regarding this issue, and everything points me to the WWAN. The actual SmartCard reader is called "Broadcom Corp Contacted Smart Card 0" and shows under Software Devices in the Device Manager. This SC Reader is also detected by our Govt software that works directly with the SC Readers. It also registers the Contactless one, and then the third one - Microsoft UICC ISO Reader. I believe that it handles the SIM / Virtual eSIM slot as a SmartCard. https://www.dell.com/support/kbdoc/en-us/000200467/inspiron-latitude-and-precision-wwan-with-esim-causes-login-issues-for-smart-cards

24 hours with this machine. My feelings and findings so far: The body is really sturdy with amazing torsion strength, does not twist, just acts like an ingot. One screw (front right corner) was loose from the factory. I have not opened the device, yet. As for the problem with the bottom door, well, in the 3D Visualisation on the Dell´s website, the laptop is pictured with some sort of a halved, sliding bottom door (the one that I have posted prior to this post). I do not have this, I have normal bottom cover that is one piece. Anybody here has a PMP18 with this sliding door? Keyboard is...well, its not a ThinkPad but it is not that HP abomination as well. Its quite good. No complaints except for the arrow keys. The 2560x1600 120Hz panel looks amazing color-wise, almost like IPS Black from the new Ultrasharps, but its slow AF. Ghosting is just there. Lenovo had way better panel in the P16G2 regarding this. I miss that screen, it was really good. Touchpad is very pleasant to work with, both its surface and the click feedback are good. Fan behavior is very good, at least during office work and basic multitasking its like passive or just very quiet, have not had a chance to try out some proper loads except benchmarks. Surface temperatures are pleasant. Sound coming from the speakers is nice. Not MacBook Pro level nice, but usable for both movies and some background music. Weirdly bugged Optimus. I have installed iGPU drivers from Dell. They install as a driver only, without the control panel. If I install the control panel for the Intel iGPU manually from MS Store, it results in bugged Optimus, with the dGPU (RTX 4000) running at 8W idle basically non-stop. Have you encountered this as well? The battery life is all over the place, ranging from 2 to 6 hours in idle with no apparent causes. The total system consumption is very wild, going from basically zero to 50W, again, without doing anything other than web browser with a few tabs (brightness at 7 out of 10) Fingerprint reader dropped once in 24 hours, was missing in device manager with no apparent cause, was fixed by a reboot. I hope that I wont have to RMA this week after the delivery. The internal, factory 1TB Gen5 (Samsung PM9E1) drive tops out at +- 8400/4000 R/W and I do not know why. Eventlog keeps getting spammed with "Smart Card Reader 'Microsoft UICC ISO Reader rejected IOCTL TRANSMIT: Parameter is incorrect" - seems like a SIM/eSIM issue, I do not use WWAN currently. Anyone getting these errors on their machine? Same thing with PCI Express Endpoint / PCI Express Legacy Endpoint WHEA Corrected errors. I am unable to find the source of these. Laptop seems to be working fine. Score in Passmark seems okay, getting about 62k / 4.8k MT/ST ratings, which are quite higher than the median for the 285HX. This is just some basic rambling about the machine, I will do a proper review once I feel "at home" with it. That feeling aint coming yet.

Hey guys! Just unpacked mine. Abnormal behaviour that I have noticed so far: There were some corrected WHEA errors regarding PCIE Endpoint / Legacy Endpoint. Could be related to the first power-on and the driver updates, as they were logged at that time. Have you noticed these? Also there were about 5 ACPI Errors about EC timeout, again, at the same time as the WHEA ones. I am updating the factory OS to the current day, so all the devices will get their firmwares updated (as well as the BIOS and EC itself) and then i am going with a fresh install. PS: I have ordered the system with the SSD door, but the system came with the normal bottom cover. Does anybody here have the PMP18 with the sliding bottom door? The one that you can see on the 3D Visualisation:

Guys, perhaps someone here will know, who is the OEM for the 1/2TB Gen5 drives in the PMP18?

I am now looking at the comparison between the PMP18 and 7770 side by side, and the new model has way more reinforcements / underlay on some places. Particularly above the keyboard (between the hinges) and in the battery area + the additional magnesium cage there. If the keyboard baseplate is some sheet metal, I do not know, but that would also help + the gargantuan heatsink screwed into the motherboard, running across the entire back will do its part. I repeat, I have no first hand experience with this model (yet), but from the looks of it, the palmrest should be very stable, rock solid almost. Definitely the most heavy-duty palmrest design since 7720 era. Does it feel that way when you pick up the laptop by the side? What about bending under pressure, some squeaks, etc? Sorry for being so curious 😄 Anyways, the plastic surface might be better for me after all. Liked it a lot on the P16. The metallic palmrests of the Zbook series always collide with the clasp of my watch, resulting in scratches on both. That is great to hear. Any notable issues, freezes, hangs or similar, so far?

Brass nuts molded in, thats definitely plastic. On the other hand, the black ribbed material to the left and right will definitely be metal. If you search for Precision 7770 palmrest, its more or less the same thing, but without the rubber. Lets see how the paint will hold up.

And of course I love when I can look at some comparison data, its just that it would be nice to have it in one room 🙂 About the case material, well, I do not have the laptop yet, but from all the videos, spreadsheets and also from the 3D rendering of the internals on Dell site, it really appears to be bonded from two different materials, main body + some reinforcements here and there: But the official PDF only mentions Magnetite, and magnesium in the chassis: Magnetite is not really suitable for laptop bodies, it is essentially a common iron ore. If the thing feels like plastic - not having the common "cold" touch, it will probably be an Elektron or other, similar alloy, with some additional magnesium cage underneath it. Does ThrottleStop or XTU, or other similar utility works, at least for undervolting / limiting the ratios or power limits? Also, this tool, you have to run it on each POST/BOOT for it to be active, or you set it once and its done?

TBH I was just about telling you that the performance measurements should be moved either here, or to a new, dedicated Pro Max Plus owners thread 😄 And as we are long past release, this thread should be renamed. I am fine with the 8x PCIE, the mobile (and almost all of the current) GPUs cannot saturate it anyways - waste of lanes to go x16 in a laptop. I have a desktop 5090 running at x8, and I am still competitive in 3DMark with it. However, the plastic palmrest is kind of disappointing to me, to be honest. I fear that it will smooth off and then wear out very fast, just like the common Dell plastic surfaces on Latitudes. Is it at least feeling sturdy? Is there any kind of tutorial / manual for the SREP tool? What exactly can it do? First time hearing of that.

The Pro Max Plus 18 has a plastic palmrest? It surely looks like a unibody aluminium chassis.

Same here in CZ/SK, the pre-configured models are probably identical across our region. Anyways, its not a problem to order even for a private person, but you would have to pay the VAT of course. Send me a PM with the config you would like and I can forward it to them, they will make an informational, non binding price offer with the same discount as I got.

About the same price, or about the same config? 🙃 This is a Dell AD that I have long term relationship with, ever since I bought my Precision M4800 back in 2014. Would you be ordering as a company with VAT ID? Oh and guys, I cannot find any document regarding the M.2 config on this laptop. Is it gen 5/4/4/4 or 5/5/4/4?

I have receivIed a price offer from my sales rep, specced exactly as I have requested: The OEM drives I do not care for, taking the Gen5 1TB as a base for the OS (for 100% compatibility and firmware updates) other than that I will fill the remaining slots with Samsung 990 PRO´s. I dont know about prices elsewhere in EU when going through sales rep, but this is priced roughly at €3900 (non-VAT), which seems like a very good price, considering that for this money you can usually get something with RTX3000, no WWAN, basic battery and Gen4 drive. Also, Lenovo is asking me €4400 for the same configuration of P16 Gen3, and that is with 4k60 screen, which I would swap for 2560x1600 165Hz afterwards (adding more cost). Plus, their machine has a 100W lesser power budget as was mentioned previously. Have to mention that I am buying a single unit, so no bulk company purchase etc. What do you say? I guess that I am sold at this point.

Basically what @Aaron44126 has said. The only reason for the RTX5000 is the VRAM, otherwise it is a waste of money to buy that kind of GPU in a laptop. The RTX4000 is the smart choice here, as it is just a bit more expensive than the lower RTX3000 + has a decent 16G VRAM, but still hugely cheaper than the RTX5000. Besides, its still the same die / chip, just with less cores enabled. As usual, Dell completely screws up the display choices - they should look at the possibilities HP is offering. The DreamColor panels on the Fury series are amazing. I must say that the current offering on the Pro Max Plus 18" is something that I am absolutely fine with, as the 2560x1600 is my go-to resolution in laptops, but I get your feeling. And as for the flagship model, yes. I do not like the aesthetics and I am an avid hater of the naming scheme, but otherwise, it is the first Dell laptop since M6800 that has caught my attention. Oh, and I also have to mention that I just received a price offerings from both Lenovo and Dell. Funny thing, the Pro Max Plus 18" configured with RTX4000 (other specs are the same) has the same price as P16 Gen3 configured with RTX3000 + of course the significantly reduced power budget.

The actual screen is the same, you just have the option to choose Microphone, Webcam and WWAN antennas.

Even the Pro Max 18 peaks at that 105?

What was the CPU temperature during the first seconds of heavy load (PL2) ?

Back when I tested the Fury G11 I remember the fans were really loud, especially ramping up and down with no apparent reason. It was really, really annoying. If the new Fury acts in a similar way, then that is a hard pass from me.

Just to be clear, some of you may remember my struggle last year in the ZBook Fury thread. Tl;Dr: After a great disappointment with Fury G11 I have decided to give P16G2 a try and was genuinely impressed, to the point of ordering one, but then cancelled everything once the Intel Raptor Lake problems unveiled. So here I am, delaying my purchase month after month, patiently waited for P16G3 and having mixed feelings about it, after the actual release. I want to buy a workstation laptop that will last me almost a decade again, just like my old ZBook 15 G1 did. It does not have to be a true DTR, I have a workstation desktop as well. It has to have a decent GPU for playing outside of home, be as repairable (after warranty) as possible, and has to have a good cooling solution (no ramping up and down, quiet when idle or browsing). Other than that: Ideally 16" (no less and preferably no more) form factor with 16:10 screen GPU must be on a separate daughter board Arrow Lake HX CPU + RTX Must be dockable by a dedicated Thunderbolt dock (not some 3rd party solution) Must have IPS non-touch AG panel with at least 120Hz refresh, absolutely best at 2560x1600 res. As many connectors as possible At least 3 year NBD On-Site warranty So basically those three. Now: P16G3: Best, defacto unrivaled keyboard with ideal layout, replaceable Subjectively awesome aesthetics Dedicated TB5 dock TrackPoint Dedicated power button Horrible display options, have to perform a panel swap right after purchase, means more investment OOB Greatly reduced power means uncompetitive burst CPU performance and sustained GPU performance Most expensive out of them ZBook Fury G1i 16: Stellar display options with both 2560x1600 and 3840x2400 Great aesthetics More storage options 5 Year warranty as a base option Possibly plagued with same issues as previous unit TB5 dock non-existent, cheaper TB4 dock Only one USB-A port (WTH?) Horrible keyboad, horrible layout, replacement is a nuisance Pro Max Plus 18": POWERRRRRRRR Seriously unrivaled power CAMM/CSODIMM RAM with top speed Best price (I have a good sales rep) More storage options Dedicated TB5 Dock Best warranty service Awful aesthetics, its just plain ugly, resembles a fat MBP Great display only comes in 18" Probably better keyboard than HP, still horrible layout, replacement is a nuisance Now, I was absolutely and fully satisfied with the power I got from the evaluation P16G2 unit, which had 14700HX + A2000. I would configure P16G3 with something like 265HX + RTX PB 3000/4000. It looks great, rings all the bells and whistles except for the price. Problem is, I can configure the Dell Pro Max for cheaper, or, with a league better hardware for the same price, with a better warranty, and +100W of power budget. At this point IDK what to do. I will try to source all three for evaluation, but the chances of getting them all to try out are low and I dont really have time for this. I mean, if the P16G3 CPU will be able to turbo to at least 120-130W when the GPU is not loaded (PL2), AFAIK it should, I am fine with 95W GPU sustained, for the RTX PB 3000. The Arrow Lake is amazingly efficient and does not lose significant % of power even when power constrained. Same could be said about Ada/Blackwell. The thermals should be awesome with such low wattage (if the cooling solution will be good) and the board components will be more durable. Its just me hesitating to pay V8 money for V6 power.

I am deciding between ThinkPad P16 G3, Fury G1i 16" and Dell Pro Max Plus 18. With the Dell I would go 18" purely because of the better screen option. I was hell bent on getting the P16, but now I am torn and confused.

Keyboard still needs complete disassembly of the device, but at least its not fixed to the palmrest, there are screws. Hinge / exhaust design looks a bit better, still far from ideal, but better. Keyboard still weird with arrow keys cramped together Power button still part of the keyboard Chassis design and fittment looks to be the same as G10/G11, my previous evaluation might apply here as well Who the hell, in his sane mind, designs a workstation class 16/18" powerhouse, with one, and i repeat, ONE USB-A port? Its not lightweight, nor thin, there should be 3+3 A/C ports at the bare minimum. This, and the fact how i felt about the G10/G11 when I had the opportunity to try it for two weeks, hard pass. Awaiting P16 Gen3.

How did you configure the P16 with RTX 4090? It is not even mentioned in the PSREF, and I have no such option here 😞 What was the cost difference vs. the ADA 5000?

I would say that it will differ on two things, the actual configuration and the silicon lottery of the particular chip. Because it is a known fact that one i7 may operate at (for example) 1.2V, the other on 1.35V, achieving the same results with two digit difference in thermals. Numbers are wrong but you get the idea. But overall, I found the fan profiles and the power managament more potent and impactful on the Lenovo. Large chassis will have larger fans that move a lot more air, multiplied by the dissipation of the area of the heatsinks, so definitely better cooling. On the other hand, this is heavily influenced by the specific choice of fans, some may have unpleasant frequencies in their acoustic signature. There is a possibility that there are more fan suppliers for these laptops, just like you have 2 or 3 for Dell. I had some experience with the older P1 / X1E laptops (8750H/9750H era) and I would not touch that thing with a pole. YMMV.

Hey! Partly copied from my post on Reddit. I ended up ordering both, then I have done a 2 week evaluation. TL;DR, the P16G2 is a much better and refined workstation laptop than the Fury is. The reasons: Leagues lower and stable DPC latencies. I dont know what the guys at the HP are doing, but their drivers are terrible. Simply terrible. The whole machine has power, the numbers in benchmark are there, but the feeling is not. It simply was not so snappy as the Lenovo. I have tried both factory OS and a clear installation. No difference. Better than average results in benchmarks. For example CPU/GPU in Passmark. HP was always producing a tip below average or average results, Lenovo was always clearly above average, around 5-10%. For the GPU, the difference was even higher. I suspect the Lenovo equipped with A4000 would easily outperform the A5000 in HP under heavy load. Better fan management. With the right profile, Lenovo is dead silent to pleasantly quiet during browsing and lighter loads, and still quieter than HP under full load. The HP fans just blow with erratic spinning up and down, air pushed against the hinge. The SmartSense (or similar named) profile on HP Helps, but its not much of a difference. On the Lenovo, you can choose between maximum power, balanced and maximum efficiency. And the last one is the best. CPU results in benchmark go down but the temps drop 20-30° instantly, the fan noise completely disappears, and the overall power is still there. With the Lenovo, you can actually feel how the laptop sucks the air from underneath and moves it through the rear vents, its a massive amount. On the HP, half of air goes under the hinge, half above it , pushing against the display. Bad for the long term usage. Not even speaking about the fact that when docked, the HP venting area is obstructed massively, trapping the air underneath the screen. Metal around the keyboard dissipates the heat on the HP. VERY uncomfortable during longer sessions under full power, to the point of burning your fingers while holding keys longer. Battery life. The HP has a bugged Optimus (tried 5 different drivers and 2x OS reinstall, various results) that powers the GPU for a fraction of second to like 2 seconds. Does this 4 - 10 times a minute. The result is that the battery life sucks. Sometimes you get 70 minutes, sometimes you get 180 minutes. On the Lenovo, it was common to get 150 to 280 minutes without significant power saving measures. More power for the GPU resulting in more stable GPU performance. Noticeable in games during intensive scenes. Moreover, Lenovo features a MUX Switch, HP does not. What were they thinking. Keyboard is simply on another level. Noticeably larger keys with pleasant travel and feedback, visible key markings, actually usable arrow keys, backlight not bleeding through edges. Trackpoint, which may or may not be a plus, for me it certainly is. Oh, and it is a fully contained replaceable unit, no other stuff to disassemble or replace. Actually good hinge design on the Lenovo. Protruding above the main body, the upper screen edge is higher, resulting in more natural posture behind the laptop. I was shocked how much of a difference can those few centimeters make. Also this allows the rear to be fully utilized with ventilation ports and connectors. At least for me, this is the only rational way to do it on a workstation class laptop. This deserves a paragraph of its own. Physical power button that is not part of the keyboard and has a visible LED indicator. Funny how things that we took for granted in the past are now the selling points. Last but not least, the quality. Both screen lids can be twisted and bent, but it requires significantly higher force and dedication to do it on the P16. Same thing for the body. Believe it or not, the P16 with its plastic or composite body (i do not know the exact material they use) feels more sturdy and durable than the aluminium sheet body of the HP. You really have to hold them both in your hands to appreciate this. For a $6000 laptop, the fit and finish of the HP was below average. I would expect MacBook level of detail for such sum. You get sharp uneven edges, small imperfections underneath the paintjob, quite large gaps. I understand that this may not be important to most of the potential buyers, but for this sum? Its a shame. Now, keep in mind that I have started this whole thread based on my plan to retire the ZBook 15 G1 after 9 years of usage and move on to the ZBook Fury G9. Needless to say, did not happen. Ended up with Firefly 14 G10A and G11, both of them resulting in a disappointment and a decision to return to full sized mobile workstations. I was a huge HP fan and it makes me sad that I cannot continue using their products because of their bad designs. Of course, Lenovo also has its flaws, namely: Absence of RJ45 Ethernet on such large and expensive machine is unacceptable. For this price, the thing should have a 10Gbit, or at the very least a 2.5Gbit port. The small area above the SmartCard reader is flimsy and can be bent. Palmrest is very thin there. It is only a small area near the edge and likely will not cause any issues, but it should have been reinforced more. It has only 2 M.2 internal connectors. Not a problem for me, but such a device should have at least 3 if not 4 like the HP does. The WLAN module is a BGA unit, not user replaceable. It is replaceable on the HP . CAMM RAM with its higher frequency would be the better option, at least in my opinion. Two USB-A ports on a workstation device is a nuisance. But such is the state of the laptop market right now. Overall, the Lenovo is not a perfect laptop, but it is a much better device than the HP is. In the end, I chose to return both due to the current apocalypse regarding Intel CPUs, but if it will be resolved, I am ordering the Lenovo. If it wont, then I will have to wait for the Arrow Lake HX + Blackwell combo and hope that it will be just a facelift, not a new model with potential issues. Currently typing this on a borrowed, refurbished HP Elitebook 840 G5 with 8250U, my fingers hurt, my eyes bleed and my patience is at its limits.