SapphiraTriX298

150W, but maybe consider at least a 4080 or a last year's 3080/3080ti. Early testing does not shine favorably on the 4070 in terms of performance. Also 17" model is a true 17" 16:10, apparently So only about 2.5cm or 1" wider, imperceptibly thicker, and 0.25lb heavier. I find it an odd choice of screen size, or rather the two seem too close. Back to your friend, with the $100 discount at Cyberpower PC that would put a 17.0" 16GB RAM 4080 config at only $2309, essentially the same as the Eluktronics 16 or 17 with the same RAM, SSD, and OS, and 4070. That is a hard deal to pass up. Not sure if 4080 would benefit performance-wise from Liquid cooling like the 4090 is supposed to, or if it would just benefit the fan noise

How is the display, I know it doesn't get as bright as some of the competitors. Also curious about the color accuracy

Many years ago, when XP was still relevant and 7 was still young, I was a young kid, new to forums, interested in gaming computers. I needed information and landed on a site known as the NotebookReviewForum. I didn't understand what exactly a forum was, how to use it, what bumping was, why posts appeared on the bottom instead of the top. Definition of the awkward new kid. But people were helpful, patient, and friendly. They explained things when I didn't understand and answered questions. Following recommendations on the forum I upgraded some components and tried to sell them in the marketplace. This was well before the 3 month, 100 post requirement existed. Some troll decided to give me a hard time under my post (again, when things were a bit looser then and people could and did reply under ads). I didn't know what to do, didn't know what trolls were, maybe the criticism was correct, I was young and froze. Another Forum-member whose name I don't recall, PM'd me out of the blue, probably the first PM I ever received, and said "Hey, don't let them s*** on your post." and then something along the lines of 'Stand up for yourself' or 'Let somebody know.' So I did. Never tried to talk to a mod before, but I PM'd one, in a probably overly-considerate/polite way. Next thing I knew, the troll's post disappeared, slapped along with a 3 day ban, there was a new warning on the forums about inappropriate commenting on posts, and I got a one word PM from the Mod, "Done." Maybe that forum-member also reported the troll, maybe not, but they did make sure I knew I could and should. The community was really good. It took care of me when I could have crumpled, taught me a lot of things, including how to stand up for myself within the context of a forum. As a result, I dove into the hobby, built, bought, and sold As the spiritual successor, let's make this a good one.

Yep definitely want to see more data.

These any good? Seem to have an overall rep for being a solid TLC with good endurance, particularly compared with modern budget QLC in the same price category. I have heard some comments discussing changes to the lineup, including component changes (controller and DRAM), overheating, errors, but not confirmed whether these affected the higher end 4tb versions or even how prevalent the problems actually are. I don't know the all the details regarding nvme ssd's so any input or experiences would be appreciated. The idea of getting 4TB of robust internal storage for about $250 seems more important than peak Gen4 speeds. PS, why the 'sudden' drop in prices for things memory related?

Cyberpower PC has their version of the water cooled XMG/Mech 17 gaming laptops 4070-4090 series for extra $100 off for winter coupon and $50 off daily deal today only 2/23/23 Tracer VII Comes in around $2800 for the 4090 version pre tax. You have to manually select both of the discounts https://www.cyberpowerpc.com/page/Tracer-VII-Laptops/ I think this is the best price to date for a full power 4090 laptop. Get $150 off or put it towards the water cooler

Cyberpower apparently has the same model under their own branding. ~$2850 with RAM, SSD, and Windows. $3000 with the Cooler

So in traditional rasterised performance, the full wattage 4080 mobile is about ~25% above the 3080ti mobile, and the 4090 mobile just under ~10% higher than that in modern games?

That is true, but the 1080 - 2080 (even the 980 to a degree) were exceptions to the rule. Where the increase in efficiency (but limited max TDP due to architecture) allowed the two to be much closer than they ever could have been prior. Generational leaps and bounds in architectural process = greater efficiency (today), meaning that we can gain some performance at efficient levels, but then dump loads of power (actually possibly only as a way to stay competitive with TSMC using Samsung 8nm with significant diminishing returns) to boost performance even higher, thus separating the mobile GPU and Desktop markets once again. Recall that the TDP of the 2080ti was 250w, while the 3080Ti grew to 350w. While still a nominal number, the typical real world 30%~ increase in generational performance came at the cost of raw energy more than the design improvements from Nvidia. This set the standard at the same time for previously 'outrageous' levels of wattage being tolerated in the desktop community that are not feasible in the laptop side. Or put another way, hamstring the desktop cards back to 250w, and the difference between desktop and mobile comes much closer again. I don't yet see a direct connection, but I suspect something about this may be why Nvidia is limiting the TDP of the Mobile cards, considering that manufacturers have traditionally tolerated 200w+ from the GPU's alone. I also don't see this changing until AMD is able to match the performance of nvidia at notably lower TDP, or put another way, when simply dumping more watts into a card no longer matters. This trend however, is likely limited. TSMC's year over year breakthroughs in die shrinking are probably not sustainable long term (at least not at the current manufacturing timelines/materials/PRICES). So the giant leaps/improvements we see now may be temporary to a few generations, I suspect. You can only shrink so small with current materials before quantum mechanics starts getting in the way. Or put another way, most of the performance we have been seeing, I believe, is due mainly to TSMC's manufacturing, and less to do with Nvidia's design improvements. Perhaps when AMD matches those improvements, it will no longer be a power/TDP game, but true design/driver gains.

I don't think the prices are all that different as they are made out to be. In Ivy bridge days, a top end laptop was around $2700 That is around $3500 today In 2020 a Legion 7 top end was $3200 or so, that is around $3700 today. These numbers are based on inflation only, not the increased demand of the last couple years, which would invariably drive prices higher as we see. It is still expensive, certainly, but not far outside the historical norm. Nor do I expect that will ever change. Couple other things for S&G In 1996 console games cost around $50 each. That is almost $95 today. A low/midrange EVGA (rip) 1080ti cost around $1100, that is almost $1400 today. You can find 4080's above and below that price today. So for those that want a laptop because they need the mobility and power, and can afford the cost, in intrinsic value, they haven't changed though you are getting more features for the money and a large uptick in performance over previous laptop GPU. Also full power SFF are not as small as they used to be, so to take advantage of desktop performance demands also an even larger PC than previous generations. Not so important in a house but much more important to those who travel. Plus screen of appropriate quality and resolution to make gaming worth while. At this stage also, graphical demand is not increasing at the same rate as GPU performance (4k has yet to become the 1080p of yester year) So while GPU performance is expected to make a large jump next year also, 4k performance on this generation of top end laptop chips is pretty good, still exceeding top end desktop numbers from last year in at least a few applications. In terms of real world usability, I would not be surprised if today's 4090 laptops will be capable at high resolutions for a couple years if portability is what you need. Just pay to play

Scar 18 delayed until April from what I heard from one reseller. This has basically been the argument for literal decades, it doesn't change.

I have been in this situation for several years, and I think two things are worth mentioning. Depending on how far you go How powerful you want And how much you want to carry. Things changed with the 3000 series as cards got a lot bigger, so cases got bigger on the SFF front. The Sugo SG13 was capable of handling a 2080ti dual slot in a small package without performance hit. Now to fit a 4080 or larger would require a, still small in the scheme of things, but notably larger case and design than the general SG13. And as mentioned cooling in even these larger smaller cases can be challenging for the top end cards limiting performance. A modern 4090 mobile seems to outperform a desktop 3080/3090. So if you have the money and don't need/won't use desktop 4080+ performance I find it hard to recommend building an SFF. Because a SFF will still need keyboard, monitor (of sufficient resolution and size to justify hauling desktop power around 1440p would be pointless for a 4070+ desktop gpu), ancillary items like HDMI, and a way to safely pack and ship (pull GPU for transit) or bring on airplane. A light SFF of sufficient power to justify hauling it around is going to be a lot heavier and less convenient than any powerful laptop. I had both a powerful 3080 mobile laptop and SFF that I would take, but only because I had the SFF previously built with 3070ti (most powerful at the time that was smaller dual slot). The desktop came in car trips. I did not bother if I was flying. But since the 4090 laptops beat both in terms of performance, both will probably be sold to fund one powerful laptop. If I was doing it for the first time now and traveling, I would just go laptop if I could afford it.

So who are the major retailers at play for the different brands in the US? Newegg seems to have high end models, but what about amazon, or even in store at bestbuy? Or is availability supposed to be spotty?

Any idea on what a 60w 4070 can do? The Asus flow series also looks interesting

Those numbers seem fairly impressive to me. Close to the 4080's numbers indeed, around 10% or so. Those temps are pegged at 85c, so definitely maxing the thermal capabilities of a laptop. Dynamic temp targeting, or was that an AMD thing? It definitely beats a 3080 so it will work for me. When were the new laptops supposed to release/order?

That is my concern and why I emphasized sustained load. Benchmark will only tell so much in terms of heat dissipation/saturation

That is why I am thinking about turning in both Desktop and Laptop for this gen. 9900k in SFF desktop is limited by space to a 3070ti. It doesn't make sense at this time to run two setups, or upgrade the desktop in pieces when a single larger laptop might exceed both in both GPU and CPU. Then I will wait until next gen for a new desktop as I plan to be more stationary then.

Is it realistic for a big DTR '4090' laptop to be bale to meet or exceed 3080 levels of performance under Sustained load? If that is the case I may sell off my Legion 7 and disassemble my desktop in favor of a single, more mobile unit.

Might be getting back into the laptop game again since life is more mobile now.