electrosoft

Oh I recognize that hand writing! 🤣 Fun times incoming @Mr. Fox Congratz! ^^^This For those who want to run G2 mode on AM5, they are really good sticks in what is 99% of AM5 chips out there that top out at 6400 but past that? Good luck. I'd be curious to see if dual rank at 6000-6400 nets you any better performance than single rank 6000-6400 with the same timings like old school used to do for us.... what's the model # if the sticks you have @Mr. Fox? I wouldn't exchange just yet (unless your return window is 15 days). I would get another CPU or MB first (or both) to really dial down on what is holding you back. If I had just stuck with that Apex and assumed it was not the problem, I would be all over the map. Luckily, I had two motherboards to test against it (Z890 AYW, Z890 Strix-A) and three sets of memory which let me know the Apex was the problem.

I usually end up bouncing two off each other and sometimes more. It also helps flesh out your MB, but that Dark Hero should be able to do 8000 easy. I think it's rated up to 9600? That doesn't mean you couldn't receive a problematic board like many of us suffered with the Z890 Apex boards that were crapping out past 8400 for some reason. Like @Mr. Fox said, check what rank your sticks are. I tend to go with 2x24GB kits as they are primarily single rank and not problematic. X3D is pretty righteous especially when a game loves the cache but at 4k things get real close real fast. Yeah, I posted an analysis yesterday on his video: 270k is easily the best bang/buck Intel has brought to market in quite some time and that video backs up a few things I've been spewing especially cache saturation at higher resolutions so I posit with cache in play you can no longer arbitrarily use 1080p as a watermark for future performance metrics at higher resolutions with more powerful GPUs down the pipeline (IE 6090, 10070xt) Right now, if I was in the market for a banger gaming setup on a budget I would go 270k along with all the heavily discounted Z890 MBs on the market and a decent set of 8000 sticks and call it a wrap. DDR5 is a constant regardless if you go with AMD or Intel. I know him and Jufus were friends (maybe still are), but he goes after his testing methodology pretty hard along with others.

Sounds like a potential imc dud albeit you can't rule out the MB either.... I would snag another to compare it against for chip to chip check and to check the MB. Ditto on my first 9800X3D that couldn't do anything past 2000 fclk and 5600 on memory stable. I returned that and my next one is my current one. 2200 fclk and 6400 along with 8200. I haven't really pushed it past that though in light of the newer 9200 sticks. Might need to revisit that.

The difference between 6000 and 8000 in real world applications and games has been shown on average to be much of nothing due to the memory architecture of AM5, but with that being said it is better to run 8000 if you're able to because at worse, with tight timings, it basically equals 6000 tight but in pockets the extra bandwidth can come into play. 6000 tight if your program really happens to be latency sensitive but even something like WOW which is traditionally known to be latency sensitive on Intel literally ran the same (or close to it) 6000 vs 8000 on AM5. If I couldn't hit at least 8000, I would go back to 2133/6400 or even 2000/6000 but that's personal preference. Did you test your fclk yet to see where it posts up to at least? You posted 7200, are you just scaling up to see how high you can post at this point before running some stability tests later? I've had that problem before where an aggressive EXPO/XMP timing was causing no post. At that point, even scaling the frequency down to Jedec but still retaining the stock EXPO/XMP speeds would fail to post. Usually at that point (pro tip) use Asus tweaked/optimized timings. More times than not it will adjust a bad timing into a proper range then compare EXPO/XMP timings vs Asus tweaked timings to pinpoint the problem(s). You can also go old school JEDEC, set SOC/VDDIO close to max and scale up from there unless you had problems booting JEDEC too?

Ultimate shootout with bonus crapping on Jufus's testing methodology (and others): 4k gaming really shows any of the CPUs finely tuned are on average close to each other capping out even a 5090 and the 10 game average when tuned it is a wash overall except for those rare titles that love X3D enough to make a meaningful difference even at 4k. His results are basically in line with my testing even harking back to 7800X3D vs 13900KS and on but as always YMMV. I would say 1080p is a portend of future 4k potential removing the GPU as a potential bottleneck with more powerful GPUs coming down the pipeline but the problem is X3D cache saturation diminishes as resolution lowers so you can't just predict future gains using a more powerful GPU at higher resolutions (thus lowering or removing the GPU as a bottleneck) using 1080p straight forward... The overall king is now the 9950X3D2 taking into consideration everything. At 4k, I found it interesting the extra X3D on the other CCD actually helps level out some of the saturation deficiencies you can experience at such high resolutions vs the 9850X3D (further adding evidence to X3D saturation issues at higher resolutions). It's a pricey thang though..... ...either way bring on the bLLC! 270k is an absolute banger of a CPU and with the drastic cuts to MB pricing the real challenge is tracking down a set of decently priced 8000+ sticks either as sold or a 6000+ kit and OC'ing it. ------------------------------- Shockingly, those same two $5300 Gigabyte 5090 Infinity GPUs are still in stock at our local Microcenter.... As a matter of fact, they're still in stock at all 10 Microcenters within a 150 mile radius too.... 🤣

I know it's not "in fasion" for AM5, but I would test a max static OC just for reference/capability and then carve out a PBO OC against it for comparison. I've done this with every AM4/AM5 CPU I've owned. I did it on my 5800x platform I ran and all subsequent 7800X3D/7950X3D/9800X3D platforms. And as @Mr. Fox referenced, this will definitely blast your temps and give you an "Intel like" experience OC'ing. SP118 is a solid average or slightly above average chip but check the IMC and see if it can do 2133/6400 at least and hopefully 2200/6400 on the G2 level then push for 8000+ and see what it can do. I've done that before. Bought something then sat on it for a week or so getting over buyers remorse and finally cracking it open. I JUST did that with my replacement iPad M5 13 2TB Wifi+Cell Nano Texture I picked up open box saving ~$1k. I left it on the table all week while I limped along on my slowly dying Ipad 12.9 M1 128GB peasant edition. 🤣 I told ya the switch from that capable but old Intel HEDT to X3D with that 5090 was going to change your life. 🤣 Well, maybe not that extreme, but you could tune up another 14900, 270k or X3D and any of them would best your soon to be old rig. The real sweet sauce is when you run across select titles that absolutely love that X3D cache and really sing.

How did you end up with an 8hr layover? 8hr layover for a ~5hr flight = fun. What problems and what SP rating did you end up getting? I do like the look of the RGB panel on that Dark Hero though.... Something new and fun to play with. That was my logic to fill the time till Nova.... Yep, just checked and they're still $249.99.....

If you have a local Microcenter, they're $249.99 atm...$237.49 with a Microcenter credit card. It's a crazy good processor. -------------------------------------------------------------------- Wireview Pro 2 in white looks slick..... ---------------------------------------------------------------------

Have we heard of widespread meltdowns in AI farms / data centers where these cards are pushed 24/7/365? The connector is problematic, but I am curious about locations that have large, widespread deployments in use all the time. --------------------------------------------------------- Sugi's run on PR with no optimization tweaks like those who "play" 3Dmark 🤣

One thing I love about Microcenter is they test all returned GPUs even 9070xt's and have a series of testing and steps to verify the cores and memory are there. When I returned both open boxes the Ventus 5090 (opting to keep the Vanguard) and the Challenger 9070xt (flat out defective), they tested and visually inspected both with a fine tooth comb. Still, the Challenger 9070xt open box managed to make it out of the store into my hands though clearly defective but I described how that happened in a post here months ago. Such scumbags out there it just grosses me out sometimes....... I'm thinking he tried to return it after the 15 day return period non BB plus members have. I figure the cost of the $50/yr membership gives me a 60 day return window and I usually end up racking up enough savings from member plus specials to make it worthwhile. I know playing the open box game I've gotten my fair share of stinkers from CPUs to GPUs to cameras and more. There's always a small bit of apprehension but the savings are insane sometimes. I've easily saved 10's of thousands of dollars over the years shopping open box or buying used or doing your due diligence. But stripping 5080's now?!...... Well this should be a fun ride. 🙂 Congrats on the hardware pickups and looking forward to seeing it all up and running and hopefully a good bin comes your way bro! Always did like the look of the dom platz and continues on with the titanz. -------------------------------------------------------- Same two are still in stock at our local MC for the Gigabyte Tron Edition 5090.....$5299 is insanity.... I love the look of the new Asus Astral 20 but that price? Well, I guess if people keep paying these prices they will keep selling them. I don't blame Asus at all. I blame consumers who can't say no....

Agreed, I can't see the upside for the price for a 9950X3D2. Find one priced the same as a 9950X3D? Sure, why not, let's have some fun but current status? It just doesn't make sense at least for my use case. I know you would have fun with an Arrow Lake setup @Mr. Fox. Even better DDR5 OC'ing than Raptor and then some and a much more nuanced approach to overclocking. It will truly leave your memory sticks gasping for air potentially even in G2 let along G4.....

That's a sound approach. I've done that before using 0% financing in the moment for 12-18 months to snag some deals and know I could just pay it off selling off excess hardware and never touch my main funds in any way, shape or form. As @Mr. Fox is alluding to, it comes down to what you expect and how far do you want to push the platform? A lot of variables need to come into play as you well know between CPU, Memory and motherboard binning and on AM5 what gear you're looking to run. I have three sets of memory Team Group 8200, KingBank 8400 and Vengeance 9200. On my AM5 platform, the 9200 can do CL26 while the other two can not.They both top out at CL30. Coincidentally, those 9200 sticks also are the only ones that can do 9066 G2 with zero extra voltage on my 270k. The 9200 are late production 2025 sticks. I wish I had two pairs of them but they are never in stock and sell for $900+ on eBay and get snapped up every time. I paid $370 for them. I would never pay the outlandish prices now but if I only had my first two sets, I would be hitting a wall on my modest set up. I DO think you will have much better success if you rip the heatsinks off your sticks and add them into your loop than my setup and I guess since this is BB, you could try binning some sets and see where it takes you. I can vouch for Arrow Lake being fun too. Either platform will give you plenty of new things to learn and tweak and it is much cheaper than a 9950X3D2 and even a 9950X3D. If you stick with 4k gaming, it really neuters a lot of the X3D pizazz on most case by case games. Either way, you're gonna have fun. 🙂

His better bin did 8200 so he's looking for 8400+ so good luck. Sugi's 8800 binned unicorn is bonkers good. Also another reason I was hesitant over his delidded one for sale with F&F..... Tempting with the delidded heatsink and offset mount, but not for $800 and SP117. Seems like a good dude, though that loves hardware so +1 on that. Hmmmm, I might have to give the Noctua a whirl then. I've been using my LF II 420 for years now and it gets it done and has held its own against just about everything I've thrown it against so far but it's Noctua! I know Nova is going to be beast.... I'd really go with the G.Skill C26 from Amazon if you're going to be paying that much from BB for those or at least the sticks quoted from @Talon unless you have a crapton of reward points saved up or want/need to use BB credit instead. I also think the 9850X3D is the smart move too. Like you said, you're not into extreme OC'ing anymore. I think you've come back down to my level where I tune and apply a modest OC but everything I do is tuned around D2D stability. You still run custom water though which is nice.

@tps3443 Those sticks with G are available on Amazon for $699.99 direct from G.Skill: F5-6000J2636H16G: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0F1WX47YD?lv=shuf&channelId=500&plpRedirect=mhFallback&th=1 $799.99 for the 2x24GB variants $1299.99 for the 2x32GB variants If you want a set, might want to snap them up now.

You could move to 4K 240hz which is what I run with fps capped to ~175fps so I don't get a monster differential between 1% lows and fps for more consistent game play experience. Yeah, a lot of those kits can crank 8000. I'm still stuck in Arrow Lake mental land where everything is 8800+ or bust and tuning around 9066 G2 atm while fighting the urge to bin some more boards.... If you're mainly looking for gaming, get s 9850X3D and call it a wrap. If you want the best of both worlds, get a 9950X3D (or Epyc like @Mr. Fox alluded to) and call it a wrap. If you absolutely do NOT care about value and want the best of the best, get a 9950X3D2 which I can't see being worth it but good for testing. Either way, when I ran a 7950X3D, I just took the 20 seconds it took to enter the bios and enable my profile that turned the non X3D CCD off when gaming and had the X3D CCD tuned up. No muss, no fuss. This was my preferred way of gaming after dealing with M$ and even PL. Them: "Hey, here's some software so you can properly park and/or manage core isolation" Me: "Or, I can just shut it down completely and fine tune around the X3D binned CCD only for gaming and it takes a hot few minutes tops to just enable that user profile" You will need absolute Sugi level binning to find a super unicorn golden chip to hope for the 8800 he's running properly on his rig. You're most likely going to do 8000 for proper sync and either board can handle that. 14900KS is still a viable option and like I've said numerous times, that SP109 14900KS dialed in still at 59/45/50 (on an AIO no less) running crisp and cool running on the wife's system with my original launch edition Asus Z690-A Strix and 2x16GB G.Skill B.die tuned at 4133. She'll run that thing into the ground as I don't see anything coming out that will hinder it anytime soon at 4k. If you DO stick to 4k gaming, Arrow Lake is also a very viable platform vs AMD and testing has shown it matches X3D and actually can have better lows too on top of it if that is something you'd want to entertain. It is also different enough to present a new challenge and fun OC'ing and tuning. Not as radically different as AMD vs Intel, but enough vs Intel to make it fun. One thing to keep in mind X3D is a, "better to have it and not need it vs need it and not have it," tool in your arsenal. It really is a game by game situation. One game will show nothing and another will have insane results. If you go dual CCDs, you can even enable and disable them back and forth to really see the difference in certain titles which is what I did with Fallout 76 and the 7950X3D vs my 13900KS tuned because I just wasn't believing the performance gains X3D was bringing but they were valid. In WoW? Not so much....