install windows softwares in bottles ?

[i.bakar]

is it possible to install a huge software and its plugins like for example , 3DS max +vray  or adobe in-design ?

i wanna move completely to linux but adobe and Autodesk products is the base of my work. 

i'm new to linux and i'm doing a lot of research and came across bottles and wine but i couldnt install adobe acrobat pro...

 

please share whatever you have on the subject..

 

 

[Etern4l]

Quite interested in this topic. I primarily use Linux these days, but have to dip to wretched Windoze on regular basis. 

[Aaron44126]

Complex applications like this generally don't rank well with regards to compatibility with Wine.

https://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.php?iId=343&sClass=application

https://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.php?sClass=version&iId=35781

 

There are sometimes tweaks that you can do to make things work better for one application.  Sometimes that will break things for other applications which is why you see people using Wine "prefixes" to basically run problematic Windows applications on their own Wine configuration.  As I understand it, "Bottles" are basically a way to bundle Windows software with a tailored Wine configuration and maybe an easy installer, but that's about it, they can't magically make Wine work better.

 

I'm not too deep into this, but my impression is that there has been way more work lately to get Wine working well with games (largely because of Valve's investments, paying the CodeWeavers guys to work on Proton), so the Windows-games-on-Linux space is in pretty good shape these days, but that work hasn't exactly translated to greatly improving support for professional applications like Adobe CS / MS Office / AutoDesk products / etc.

 

If you want to switch to Linux but you are tied to these products, the outlook is bleak 😕

I would suggest that you look at some larger, more Linux-specific online communities and see if anyone has had luck with your software running in Wine.  Otherwise, if you can't use open source alternatives, the other option would be to run it in a Windows VM on Linux, or remotely on another Windows system.

 

(Sort of a shame that this isn't a "solved problem" by now.  I fully realize that it is a complex problem, but at the same time, Wine has been around 30 years.  I'd switch in a second if I could expect "most" Windows professional applications to work on Linux without hassle.)

[i.bakar]

i believe what u said shed a it of light on a complicated subject for me curranty... i'm trying to learn more and more about linux. searching in a more oriented linux forums is a good idea and more specifically Arch linux.

 

for the time being i'm dual boot windows and Linux. i'm just starting to learn and i know its a long way to go .. hopfully one day the politics of the current business in the market will shift and we will get official versions from these software for Linux.

 

i know that there is a few equivalent software to adobe and Autodesk products but for the purpose of work flow i cant just switch to them + the learning curve after 20 years is not going to be as good.

 

its just when i heard about wine and bottles for the first time i was very optimistic that i could work my way around windows. lets see what the future may hold.

 

thanks for the links and sharing.

 

 

 

[Aaron44126]

39 minutes ago, i.bakar said:

hopfully one day the politics of the current business in the market will shift and we will get official versions from these software for Linux.

 

I think it basically comes down to money and return-on-investment (or lack thereof).

 

On one hand, it's obviously possible to build high-quality multi-platform software that runs on Linux in addition to Windows and macOS.  (Look at Firefox/Chrome/Edge.)  Fully realized complex but closed-source applications for Linux are also out there and making money (VMware Workstation, Microsoft SQL Server, ...).

 

I saw this answer from someone who used to work at Adobe on his perception of why Adobe doesn't release their software for Linux.

 

Why doesn't Adobe think of releasing its suite to Linux?

 

I worked for Adobe as an engineer 5 years ago. I was not in on these meetings and my knowledge is out of date, but I can add a little info.

 

First they do think about it. All the time. Adobe's customers are mostly creative, but inside we're mostly engineers who use Linux and support open software. (The PDF standard was opened and Flex from the start).

 

But it just doesn't make businesses since. First, "Linux" is not just one OS, its many. Adding Linux support would be a huge -HUGE- engineering effort. And how many people would even buy it?

 

To get an idea about how big an effort it would be, let's talk about testing. Just testing. Are you familiar with testing matrices? Thats when you get all the locals supported (eng, French, German, Japanese, Italian, ...) along one side. Then the operating systems (OSX, win 8, win 7, vista, XP) on another side. Then version on the other (stand alone, with creative suite, standard, pro, etc). Then the install path along another (clean install, update from last release, update from older release update from prev release with a different locale, etc).

 

If you try to image that matrix, you'll notice there are more than 2 sides and a lot of frickin squares inside. If you add one more "row" say Ubuntu support as an OS, you add A LOT of tests. Enough that you need to hire new full time quality engineers. (Besides the regular engineers to add support in the first place).

 

Does Adobe *have* to do all those tests? Yeah, pretty much. To not include different language support or to release a less-than-polished final product would hurt their brand more than just not supporting Linux.

 

And remember, thats all assuming just one Linux flavor, say Ubuntu support. Would the BSD people still complain? Yes. Would Adobe sell enough Ubuntu versions to pay for all that additional engineering staff? Thats not my field, but I think probably not. They have *really* smart people who make those calculations and predictions. And thats why they don't support it.

 

Again, I don't represent Abobe. This is just my impression of why, mostly based on hearsay from when I was there.

 

Sort of a circular conundrum.  For the businesses that create these big applications to consider making a Linux version, they have to perceive that the user base is there so that there actually is a return on investment.  There aren't enough Linux users out there to buy a Linux version of Adobe CS and justify the cost of building it — which in some ways would be more complicated than building the Windows/macOS versions because of the variety of Linux distros/configurations out there.  Oh, and the circular part is that the reason that there aren't enough Linux users is largely because such applications have not been built for Linux.

[i.bakar]

i get your point i really do.. it seams like who come first the chicken or the egg.. if the majority of people started to use Linux , big companies like Autodesk or Adobe will have n o choice but to give them what they need ,, BUT in order for the majority to use Linux , the software they use must be supported which will go back to the beginning of the cycle again... 

 

it seams like this process can only work at the dawn of the technology and who took the initiative. this of course keeping the side all the exclusivity deals between those companies and microsoft or macOS ... 

 

however as we know macOS is built on the same kernel as Linux which can make the job a lot easier. 

 

 

[Etern4l]

MacOS doesn't use, or is even based on Linux kernel. Its kernel is called XNU, and is based on Mach kernel used in Jobs' NeXT computers, with some stuff from BSD incorporated later on. 

[i.bakar]

 

Just now, Etern4l said:

MacOS doesn't use, or is even based on Linux kernel. Its kernel is called XNU, and is based on Mach kernel used in Jobs' NeXT computers, with some stuff from BSD incorporated later on. 

 

sorry i should of used the correct words.. i meant unix kernel ...  macOS after year 2000 started using the unix kernel which linux is based on 

[Aaron44126]

40 minutes ago, i.bakar said:

which linux is based on 

 

Not really.  Linux was built from scratch with the intention providing a (mostly) UNIX-compatible user experience, but it was not directly derived from UNIX.  I'm not sure if there is direct lineage between UNIX and XNU/Darwin (foundation of macOS), but macOS has received official "UNIX-compatible" certification since OS X 10.5.

 

Practically speaking, they are certainly a lot closer to each other (functionally) than Windows is to either, and you can run a lot of Linux tooling on macOS without too much hassle.  (Projects like MacPorts and Homebrew make it especially easy to get up and running with some things.)  ...It doesn't especially help with the reverse, porting Mac apps to Linux.  Most macOS GUI applications use Apple-specific UI frameworks and system libraries that don't exist on Linux.  There is a fun project called Darling which aims to allow Mac apps to run on Linux (sort of like Wine allows running Windows apps).  It's not progressing especially fast, but it is still in active development and apparently they can run "simple" GUI macOS apps now.

  

1 hour ago, i.bakar said:

it seams like this process can only work at the dawn of the technology and who took the initiative. this of course keeping the side all the exclusivity deals between those companies and microsoft or macOS ...

 

I'm not aware of big software vendors (talking like Adobe, AutoDesk, Oracle, Corel, etc.) having "exclusivity deals" with either Microsoft or Apple, do you have any sources on this?

 

Anyway you are right, it is very hard for another platform to get started up once the existing ones become entrenched.  The same thing doomed Microsoft's phone OS efforts after the smartphone market got into high gear with the iPhone and Android phones.  Microsoft tried really hard, but no matter what they did, no one would make apps for it because there were no users, and no users wanted to use it because there were no apps.

[Etern4l]

Microsoft Phone? What an unflattering comparison lol MS Phone is dead and buried, whereas Linux completely rules the server side and is extremely competitive as a workstation in certain domains. 

[i.bakar]

Quote

Not really.  Linux was built from scratch with the intention providing a (mostly) UNIX-compatible user experience, but it was not directly derived from UNIX.  I'm not sure if there is direct lineage between UNIX and XNU/Darwin (foundation of macOS), but macOS has received official "UNIX-compatible" certification since OS X 10.5.

 

it seems like a complicated process. but there was a time at year 2000 when developers in apple used the open source code from Unix and BSDs.

check this article .  brief history of Linux and UNIX its a good read.

 

https://frontpagelinux.com/articles/guide-through-history-of-unix-linux-everything-you-need-to-know/

 

 

 

 

Quote

I'm not aware of big software vendors (talking like Adobe, AutoDesk, Oracle, Corel, etc.) having "exclusivity deals" with either Microsoft or Apple, do you have any sources on this?

 

no i have no source of information rather then the news of both .. for instance :

 

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/industry/microsoft-adobe-enterprise-partnership

 

https://www.adobe.com/documentcloud/integrations/microsoft.html

 

i know that doesn't mean much on the surface. and in it's self does not mean anything.

 

in all cases 

[Aaron44126]

17 hours ago, Etern4l said:

Microsoft Phone? What an unflattering comparison lol MS Phone is dead and buried, whereas Linux completely rules the server side and is extremely competitive as a workstation in certain domains. 

 

Ha, I was just trying to draw a connection with the "chicken and the egg" app problem, which despite Linux's obvious success in the server and workstation space is still keeping many "regular people" from using it as a desktop OS.

 

7 hours ago, i.bakar said:

no i have no source of information rather then the news of both

 

Does it follow that because Microsoft and Adobe have a "partnership" to improve the experience of using their products together, that Adobe is not allowed to release software on Linux, if they want to?  (It's clearly not stopping them from releasing their software for Apple products...)

[Etern4l]

Those new to Windows on Linux will probably appreciate Lutris. CB32 was click and play. Gaming-oriented there are ready to use presets for apps as well, e.g. 

 

https://lutris.net/games?q=photoshop

 

Thanks to @Mr. Fox for the tip.