XPS 17 9720 (2022 model)

[TwistedAndy]

3 hours ago, astrohip said:

Thanks, nice write-up. I have the 9710 (i9-11900H, 4K display). The fan does seem to come on at some odd times, when I'm not doing anything stressing the system. But it's not loud enough to concern me or even look into. Love the display.

 

I don't really miss a USB A port, I've upgraded everything to C. Except... Logitech doesn't make their Unified Dongle available in anything but "A".😡🤬

 

 

 

I was thinking about purchasing 9710 last year, but decided to wait for the Alder Lake update. As for the USB A port, it was an issue for me because I have been used to my Logitech H800 headphones. They allow me to easily switch between my phone and laptop. Unfortunately, there's only the USB-A dongle.

 

I decided to purchase a new router and install Virtuehere. I had some concerns about the latency issues with audio transmission, but it appeared to work pretty smoothly.

 

Also, there was an issue with USB ports on WD19TB dock (they sometimes worked, sometimes - no). So I decided to connect my keyboard to that router as well 🙃

 

In terms of noise, I picked up the Core i9 options because of the undervolting support. It adds 10% performance and decrease the duration of active fan. Under sustained load I get nearly the same 38 dBA with or without undervolting.

 

2 hours ago, saturnotaku said:

I had an XPS 17 9700 and loved most everything about it. The only thing I didn't like was the lack of a high-refresh screen, which was a real problem when gaming especially because the display didn't support FreeSync even when running through the iGPU. I wouldn't even care about 165-240 Hz - just 90 would be enough for me to switch right back.

 

I'm working mostly on the external 35" 100Hz display and can't say I see a big difference in smoothness on my regular tasks. As for gaming, maybe there's some difference, but I would use the externals screen, mouse, and keyboard anyway.

[Frosty]

Quote

I decided to purchase a new router and install Virtuehere. I had some concerns about the latency issues with audio transmission, but it appeared to work pretty smoothly.

How does that work?  You plug the USB devices into the router instead and use Virtualhere to use them on your computer?  Which router lets you do that?

I've used VirtualHere with printers before but haven't thought about using it with other devices.

[TwistedAndy]

1 hour ago, Frosty said:

How does that work?  You plug the USB devices into the router instead and use Virtualhere to use them on your computer?  Which router lets you do that?

I've used VirtualHere with printers before but haven't thought about using it with other devices.

 

Yes, I plug USB devices directly to the router with the VirtualHere server running, then I launch the client on the laptop and connect those devices using the VirtualHere client. The systems sees those devices as directly connected.

 

It is not the fastest way to connect some devices, but it works great with mouses, keyboards, headsets, USB keys, cameras, etc.

 

I'm using the Asus RT-AX68U router with two USB ports. I decided to use the Wi-Fi 6 router because of better latency.

[Steerpike]

16 hours ago, TwistedAndy said:

...

- Noise. I've measured 38±1.5 dBA on the 40cm distance ...

 

- Performance. I get ~18200 after first round and ~14500 CB R23 MT score sustained with 45W CPU package power and slight UV (-0.115V/-0.050V).
 

Can you tell us how you are measuring sound levels? And how are the performance measures being made? And how are you undervolting? 

[TwistedAndy]

4 hours ago, Steerpike said:

Can you tell us how you are measuring sound levels? And how are the performance measures being made? And how are you undervolting? 

 

I'm using a special device to measure noise levels with ±1.5dBA accuracy. To keep the results consistent I measure them on the same distance (nearly 40-50 cm).

 

As for the performance results, here's a screenshot after the standard 10-minute CB R23 MT run with 45W power limit with -0.14V undervolting.

 

 

If we limit the number of runs to one, the results will be higher because of Turbo Boost:

 

 

All the results were collected with all my apps running and without additional system tuning.

 

As for the undervolting, there's a guide on that. XPS 17 9720 is using the following offsets:

 

CFG Lock:
setup_var CpuSetup 0x43 0x0

Overclocking Lock:
setup_var CpuSetup 0x10E 0x0

 

[astrohip]

How do I run Dell SupportAssist? Do I *need* to run Dell SupportAssist?

 

The other day, it started running on its own. I assume some scheduled event I wasn't aware of. I killed it, as it was interfering with something else I was doing, and made a note to run it later. Now I can't find any way to manually run it. I did find a file called SupportAssist.exe, which one would think was it, but it doesn't appear to do anything.

 

So how do I run it? And is it something one needs to run, or is it Dell BS?

 

Thanks.

[TwistedAndy]

I don't use SupportAssist or any other software from Dell. Usually, it's pretty buggy (especially Fusion Service)

[TwistedAndy]

It looks like Dell XPS 17 with 3060 has some kind of a MUX switch (technically, two MUX switches).

 

This device uses two discrete (!) Thunderbolt 4 controllers (JHL8540) and allows to switch the external display directly to the nVidia GPU. Unfortunately, you need to enter BIOS for that.

 

The other fun fact. Each of those controllers consumes nearly 3-3.5W in the active state. It's very important to enable the power saving option for them in the Device Manager. The Intel's TB4 driver is pretty buggy at the moment and floods the Event Manager with RTD3 events, but it really helps saving power.

[TwistedAndy]

In the recent BIOS updates Dell decided to completely lock the CPU (12900HK) while keep advertising this option as unlocked. Now there's no option to undervolt 12900HK even after applying adjustments to BIOS options. Additionally, Dell reduced the CPU performance. That's called scam. I don't think, I will buy Dell next time.

 

More details here: Dell False Advertising.

[SvenC]

Did you try to reset the BIOS to factory defaults?

 

That helped a few Precision 7xxx owners (me included) to get back undervolting after a BIOS update disabled it.

 

Seems we need a signed contract with Dell "If my machine breaks due to my undervolting activity I take all the blame." Still hard to judge when an error occurs, how much was it caused by undervolting and which settings were active when something broke.

 

I hope Dell adresses this issue in an open and honest way. The current situation is not fair!

[SvenC]

Just read your post here that undervolting is blocked by an Intel microcode update. Hmm, that somehow destroys the selling point of the HK CPUs.

[TwistedAndy]

5 hours ago, SvenC said:

Did you try to reset the BIOS to factory defaults?

 

Yes, obviously. The problem is that the negative voltage offsets are not applied at all, even if you specify them directly in EFI. In this case, those offsets should be applied regardless the operating system, VBS, and without XTU/TS. But they are not.

 

It looks like embedded controller or some parts of the main firmware just ignore or block those offsets.

 

1 hour ago, SvenC said:

Hmm, that somehow destroys the selling point of the HK CPUs.

 

Yes, correct. Customers have paid for an additional feature and now it is completely locked.

 

I think, my next device will be from XMG, who not only encourage undervolting even on restricted CPUs (H-series), but cover this type of tuning under a warranty.

[astrohip]

On 1/14/2023 at 3:36 AM, TwistedAndy said:

In the recent BIOS updates Dell decided to completely lock the CPU (12900HK) while keep advertising this option as unlocked. Now there's no option to undervolt 12900HK even after applying adjustments to BIOS options. Additionally, Dell reduced the CPU performance. That's called scam. I don't think, I will buy Dell next time.

 

More details here: Dell False Advertising.

 

I wonder if that's behind some of the sluggishness I'm seeing. Two rando examples:

 

I load Quicken daily, and I have a huge file (just shy of 200MB). It started taking slightly longer to load a couple weeks ago, not terrible, but enough to notice.

 

Starting MS Word used to take 2-3 secs to load, very quick. Now it's a couple seconds longer.

 

I wondered why everyday programs were taking longer, then I see your post, and wonder if they're related?

[SvenC]

16 hours ago, astrohip said:

 

I wonder if that's behind some of the sluggishness I'm seeing. Two rando examples:

 

I load Quicken daily, and I have a huge file (just shy of 200MB). It started taking slightly longer to load a couple weeks ago, not terrible, but enough to notice.

 

Starting MS Word used to take 2-3 secs to load, very quick. Now it's a couple seconds longer.

 

I wondered why everyday programs were taking longer, then I see your post, and wonder if they're related?

What does Task Manager show? Are your CPU cores throttled?

[astrohip]

7 hours ago, SvenC said:

What does Task Manager show? Are your CPU cores throttled?

How do I tell? I'm looking at TM now, but not sure where it would show me.

[SvenC]

You should see a GHz value in TM for CPU when you look at the performance values. If you run a more intensive task, how high does the GHz value of the CPU go?

 

Does it get close to the max speed of your CPU?

If it stays below 2Ghz and you are not in battery save mode that could indicate your CPU is power throttled.

Mine is at 1,36 because the system is not doing much.

 

[astrohip]

Thanks for the detailed reply. My CPU is listed as base speed 2.50GHz. It's an i9-11900H.

 

When I run something full throttle (ex: FlacSquisher), it jumps to 100%, but the speed shows 3.35 or so. Even higher than 2.50? Not sure why.

 

Thanks.

[Aaron44126]

41 minutes ago, astrohip said:

When I run something full throttle (ex: FlacSquisher), it jumps to 100%, but the speed shows 3.35 or so. Even higher than 2.50? Not sure why.

 

This is normal.  These days, CPUs turbo boost way higher than the base speed.  Basically, automatic overclocking as long as thermal and power constraints are met.  The base speed is basically the absolute minimum speed that you should be able to maintain (under load) if your cooling system is working properly.

 

i9-11900H can turbo boost up to 4.9 GHz.  Most systems will level off above the base speed but well below the max turbo speed, which can only be maintained for a short time.