PHVM_BR

3 hours ago, MyPC8MyBrain said:

como alguns de vocês sabem, tenho avaliado o 7770 como substituto do 7670,

Eu gosto do tamanho, ergonomia e fator de forma do 7770 sobre a proporção 16/10 do 7670 e construção estreita e atarracada. 100c, não é um bom começo, execute os benchmarks usuais com configurações padrão prontas para uso, escusado será dizer que eles não eram bons,

 

 

optou por otimizar o ambiente do sistema operacional removendo bloatware, interrompendo/desativando serviços etc.,

isso melhorou o desempenho do sistema até certo ponto, mas não o que eu esperava, ainda estava com um afogamento térmico ruim,

 

 

Decidi colar novamente a CPU e a GPU, depois disso baixei cerca de 15 a 20 graus de temperatura ociosa,

mas a limitação ainda era um problema, não importa o que eu fizesse, incluindo undervolting,

 

 

isso não era bom o suficiente, eu ainda estava obtendo um resultado relativamente ruim,

Decidi colar novamente com LM desta vez tanto na gpu quanto na cpu, e assim fiz,

depois que as temperaturas caíram aproximadamente 30c em relação às temperaturas ociosas iniciais,
eu finalmente estava em marcha lenta em temperaturas aceitáveis,

 

 

 

pesquisando mais, percebi o quão crítico é ter controle sobre o resfriamento para esses sistemas, mas não existe, não há como aumentar os controles do ventilador, os planos de energia existentes são projetados para CPUs de geração mais antiga e não podem acompanhar a explosão de energia , legal na bios e economia de energia no windows dá o melhor resultado quando se trata de tempo ocioso, é legal e a cpu é tão poderosa que mesmo em seu estado mais baixo pode lidar com cargas diárias decentes sem nem suar, o problema começa quando Eu quero usar o dGpu, todo o plano de energia bloqueia principalmente o poder da GPU, aceita ultra-desempenho no BIOS e o melhor desempenho no Windows permitirá liberar todo o potencial do dGpu, ou seja, quando o sistema está tendo dificuldade em lidar com o calor e é quase instantaneamente ,

 

 

para concluir, esses sistemas são realmente incríveis se você não incluir um dGpu na configuração dos sistemas, a CPU por si só pode ter um desempenho incrível. TS Author), apesar de alcançar alguns resultados respeitáveis, ainda era um afogamento térmico (embora raramente), mesmo com dGpu fora do mix,

 

  

 

Fiz um pequeno experimento onde desconectei o dGpu,

e com certeza o sistema funcionou perfeitamente e teve um desempenho incrivelmente bom com quase zero problemas térmicos, tenho mais um experimento para conduzir, mas tenho que esperar a chegada de um componente, estou curioso para ver se a mudança para a fonte de alimentação de 330 W resolverá ainda mais e impulsionar o sistema ainda mais,

 

 

 

 

Your CPU results are fantastic.

What's the sustained power during the 30 minute test?

I imagine the temperature stays at 100°C in this longer test, right?

As for the GPU, how many Watts does the 3080Ti consume, average and peak, during a graphics benchmark?

Anyway, I believe 11500 on Time Spy is a fair score for this GPU with ~130W... If you limit the CPU you can still increase the graphics score and consequently increase the overall score.

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Nvidia-RTX-A5500-debut-Dell-Precision-7670-Performance-workstation-review.671474.0.html

1 hour ago, MyPC8MyBrain said:

@PHVM_BR
the same 7670 I returned was resold within hours the day posted for $2100 (i paid well over twice that $4400),
at $2100 a 12950HX with 3080Ti and 4K Oled is not a bad deal, it wont perform to its full potential but at that price with its bundled hardware its not the worst deal out there,

I prefer to wait another generation, hoping for a more mature and better resolved project.

My disappointment is not only with the undersized cooling system, I also didn't like having to choose CAMM memory to get more than 64gb...

I believe that the next generation will reuse the current design, but with necessary refinements, in addition to the gains with Raptor Lake and RTX 4000...

I love the 7540, it has served me very well for the last 3 years, but I made a mistake in choosing the configuration.

I opted for i7-9750H to reduce costs and only 6 cores are weighing on my activities. If I had opted for i9-9880H I believe I could have kept it for another 2 or 3 years...

I planned to buy a 7670 to replace my Precision 7540 this holiday season. I gave up....

So I researched about P16 and Fury 16 G9...

I'll wait another year!

Parece que o TGP no Fury 16 G9 permanecerá muito limitado como nas gerações anteriores.

Além disso, a potência a longo prazo é baixa para aproveitar o potencial dos processadores HX. Cinebench R23 = 18680:

laptopmedia.com/processor/intel-core-i7-12800hx/

https://laptopmedia.com/review/hp-zbook-fury-16-g9/#gpu-options

On 6/30/2022 at 8:10 PM, PHVM_BR said:

I contacted support and they don't know if it's a lock done on purpose by Dell, if it's a problem or something else.

They simply claim that Dell cannot guarantee the performance of third-party products.

Luckily I have a P2723QE monitor with USB-C Hub with 90W Power Delivery. I'm on a business trip and as soon as I get back to the office I'm going to test it on a fully Dell system.

At most I have faulty Tunderbolt ports and I will get a 7670 in return...

Thank you very much for your attention Aaron44126!

I tested the 7540 connected via Thunderbolt port to the dell P2723QE monitor with PD of 90W and it works!

I believe Dell has blocked the PD of the 7540's USB-C ports for use with 3rd party chargers...

On 8/13/2022 at 9:58 PM, zhongze12345 said:

A technician replaced the heatsink and fan assembly about a month ago, and I just noticed that they bent the heatsink in the process. I'm positive that the damage was caused by the technician as it would be impossible for the heatsink to bend like that without the bottom cover showing any damage.

 

I was wondering whether the bent fins would affect performance to see whether I should get a replacement heatsink.

 

Also does anyone know whether Dell will send over just the part without the technician? I was planning on repasting with NT-H2, so I might as well install the heatsink myself.

 

I repasted with NT-H2 and my Precision 7540 had fantastic thermal gains....for about 3 weeks.

NT-H2 is not very viscous and with constant use at high performance has a tendency to drain into laptops.

The heatsink pressure is much lower than on desktops and the probability of the pump-out effect occurring is very high.

Originally, without undervolt, in multicore CBR23 the i7-9750H hit 100°C at 90W with 3.6/3.7GHz on all cores. With Noctua it dropped to ~94°C at 90W with 3.8/3.9GHz, without thermal throttling. After 15/20 days the performance degraded at 75W at ~94°C.

I currently use Thermalright TFX and the performance remains the same after 2 months, almost equal to noctua for the first few days.

This is CPU related. For GPU Noctua works very well due to lower temperatures.

No flow occurred and performance didn't degrade.

1 hour ago, win32asmguy said:

It can burst as high as 157W but is still thermally limited. Sustained it can only maintain 85W. There is 12C core temperature deltas so a repaste could help.

 

The A4500 should be 115W with 15W of dynamic boost.

This is exactly what is to be expected for the Precision 7770. 157W starting and 85W sustained.

I intend to change my Precision by the end of this year and I liked the P16. My preference would be for the 7670, but this CAMM module and in the future only 2 SODIMM modules, will probably make me go to the competition.

4 hours ago, win32asmguy said:

Yeah, maybe the coupon I used was not meant to be applied to that model. Its odd because the similar configured 7670 on the Dell US site is about 2000usd more expensive.

 

My own testing.

Very good!

For this score the P16 must have ~110W sustained on the CBR23?

What is the TGP of the A4500? 115+15W?

Are the temps good? 

2 hours ago, win32asmguy said:

The Thinkpad P16 can reach 22,700 in Cinebench R23 with the 12900HX. The RTX A4500 is about 10%-15% slower in Timespy (~9700 Graphics Score) vs ~11,000 for the Precision 7770 3080Ti. It is also significantly less expensive as the config was 3200usd (including 2x32GB memory, 1TB SSD, 4k IPS) with a coupon. It sounds like the fan behavior may also be better, as there is no on/off cycle issues. It is easily just as quiet as the Dell 7560/7760. There is only two storage slots, but I guess those 8TB drives would work so you could atleast get 16TB in it which is not bad.

where is the information from?

45 minutes ago, TheQuentincc said:

What a shame, even my 7550 can substain 100W load on the CPU (it has been repasted)... at least since you have a 12950HX so you can undervolt it if needed.

My advise when applying LM on a laptop : make a huge thermal paste barrier all around the CPU (on the sort of metal ring around the CPU/die), and don't forget the usual Kapton to protect the contact near the CPU die.

 

@Ionising_Radiation on his cinebench screenshot you can see it's thermal throttling on hwinfo

How many Watts sustained in factory default?

My 7540 sustains up to 90W with Thermalright TFX (undervolt off) at ~93°C and ambient at ~21°C. New and with original thermal paste it was 75W at the same temperatures...

Aaron's unit certainly has a problem. His Cinebench score is lower than a Precision 3571 with (6+8)c/20t.

1 hour ago, 1610ftw said:

 

Você pode querer abrir um caso com a Dell e perguntar por que os números baixos de CPU e GPU.

 

Aqui está uma análise de um Alienware X17 com a mesma GPU e CPU menor alcançando resultados mais altos:

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Alienware-x17-R2-laptop-review-Peak-175-W-GeForce-RTX-3080-Ti-performance.617938.0.html#toc-3

 

CR23 mais de 50% maior com este com o equivalente 12900HX:

https://www.notebookcheck.net/MSI-Raider-GE77-HX-12UHS-in-review-4K-gaming-notebook-with-top-performance.634343.0.html

 

Eu acho que ambos os laptops pesam menos que o 7770, então não é como se fosse fino e leve comparado a eles.

 

Não custa nada fazer isso enquanto você espera - deixe-os fazer o trabalho por enquanto.

It is not expected to reach the performance of X17, GE67/77, etc...these are gaming machines focused on high performance.

This 7770 is expected to deliver consistent good performance, a more reliable machine. Precision has always prized stability, reliability with good performance.

I'm convinced that Aaron's unit has a problem because at multicore full load his CPU can't even reach the value of PL1. The expected would be to reach something between 115 and 157W (PL2) - depending on the cooling capacity - for a few seconds before throttling and staying at 85W (PL1) with a temperature below 100°C.

Aaron44126, 

the multicore full load performance has already shown, it would be interesting to check the maximum capacity of the system when CPU and GPU are demanded to the maximum.

If possible I suggest following Jarrod and simultaneously running cpu stress test on Aida64 and Heaven.

Check temps/clocks/power of both.

Thanks!

34 minutes ago, yslalan said:

O fraco desempenho térmico não é mostrado apenas na unidade de Aaron. Um unboxing anterior do 7770 de um fórum chinês, Chiphell.com também reflete um desempenho de refrigeração ruim. ~6300 desempenho multi-core em CPU-z com um i7-12850HX instalado e cerca de 5000 pontos de GPU em TIME SPY com A3000 instalado. O A3000 instalado no Precision5760 pode atingir cerca de 8500 níveis. O desempenho é limitado devido ao limite térmico, pois o hotspot da GPU atingiu mais de 80 graus Celsius. O TGP está ativamente limitado a 55 watts simultaneamente.

Eu estou supondo que o novo design do dissipador de calor não se encaixa nesses chips de ponta, e colar novamente a pasta térmica não fará uma grande mudança. btw, PTM7950sp é uma boa escolha para dissipador de calor de laptop.

Espero que a Dell possa aplicar o dissipador de calor da câmara de vapor como a série 5000 fez na próxima geração do MWS da série 7000…

I saw this review...but I don't even consider the possibility of the gpu being limited to 55W when in full load simultaneously with the CPU. It's certainly a bug to be fixed with an update. His at least has a sustained power of 85W with the i9 in multicore full load.

Impossible for dell to have done all this internal update to get these results.

I have a Precision 7540 and I get 75W sustained on the CPU (i7-9750H) and 60W on the GPU (T2000) running Prime95 and Furmark simultaneously.

17 hours ago, Aaron44126 said:

1. Thanks for the feedback.  I will say, from my perspective, I've never been one worry that much about eeking out every last bit of performance from a system; I just need it to work for what I need it to do.  So, I'm not anywhere near a point where I am "dissatisfied" with the 7770 and it is not in danger of being returned (as long as the display issue gets sorted).  It is of course leaps and bounds better than my M6700, and even if these Cinebench scores are "low", they top what can be achieved on the prior-gen 11th gen Precision 7760 by a fair margin (as I understand it, 12500-ish before getting into tweaks).

 

My "requirements" for a new laptop are basically thus:

• Alder Lake HX (for hybrid architecture) + high-end NVIDIA dGPU
• 128GB RAM
• Four NVMe slots
• 17-inch display panel strongly preferred

...There are remarkably few systems out there that hit all of these marks; I'm only aware of two, this one and MSI GT77.  I'd prefer to stay with Dell, I have a long history with them and I know what to expect in terms of support (...and GT77's keyboard layout is even worse than 7770's).  Four NVMe slots in particular seems to be hard to come by in the current generation models.  If there are other systems out there that run Alder Lake HX better but don't hit my other bullet points, then I'm not interested in them...  I'll happily trade a bit of performance for the extra storage capacity.

 

That said, I certainly don't want to be leaving performance on the table and if there is something "wrong" here then I would want to address it.  So, what I want to do now is basically wait until some more users have 7770's and we can see if they experience the same thing as me.  If not, I'll take steps to get mine fixed.  If so, then we're looking at something more systemic and maybe an issue with the thermal design.  (...I'll also take a look at benchmark results from other Alder Lake HX models, which some of you guys are probably more aware of than me, just to see if maybe we aren't setting expectations a bit too high.)

It's not a matter of squeezing the most out of the hardware, looking for every point in benchmarks, but the performance of your 7770 in both CPU and GPU is below acceptable.

If this is the standard the new 7770 represents a downgrade in cooling capacity compared to the 7740/7750/7760.

On the CBR23 the score, sustained power and temperatures are horrible. A performance level close to that achieved by the GT77 was never expected, but an acceptable performance for this precision would be able to maintain the 85W of the PL1 without thermal throttling reaching 17500-18000 on the CBR23.

On Time Spy its CPU score is super low, at the level of an average i7-11800H. The 3080Ti is also low, with a maximum TGP of 150W its score should be ~12000.

My guess is your unit has a problem with either misapplying thermal paste or poor contact heatsink...

Otherwise, why a high-end i9 HX + high end dGPU if the system can't extract minimally decent performance for the hardware?

23 hours ago, Aaron44126 said:

I tried something similar with my Precision 7530 and a USB-C MacBook Pro charger (85W?).  It threw an error in the tray complaining about the power adapter and wouldn't charge or even power the system.  I've never heard of anyone having a good experience with these systems and USB-C PD (unless using a Dell dock).

 

If you want a smaller power adapter, you can look at the GaN chargers being offered with newer Alienware and Precision 7X70 systems.  They should be compatible with older Precision models.  (Probably not that cheap to pick up standalone, though...)  I can't find 180W offered yet but it should show up on the Precision 7670 "parts and upgrades" page shortly after those systems launch.

I contacted support and they don't know if it's a lock done on purpose by Dell, if it's a problem or something else.

They simply claim that Dell cannot guarantee the performance of third-party products.

Luckily I have a P2723QE monitor with USB-C Hub with 90W Power Delivery. I'm on a business trip and as soon as I get back to the office I'm going to test it on a fully Dell system.

At most I have faulty Tunderbolt ports and I will get a 7670 in return...

Thank you very much for your attention Aaron44126!

Hey guys, I bought a 100W USB-C GaN charger with the intention of using it in my Precision 7540 when I'm out of the office, obviously for lighter tasks...I've tried everything and I can't charge the laptop through the Thunderbolt ports. Windows informs that the system is not being charged and in another message it informs that a charger of at least 90W is necessary for this to work. Well, I've already tested this GaN on two Inspirons and it worked perfectly delivering all the machines' performance. Are the Precision 7540's Thunderbolt ports limited for charging via third-party chargers? I have a problem? I often use both USB-C ports with flash drives, external hard drives, smartphones, etc... Sorry for my english, it's not my native language.