*Official Benchmark Thread* - Post it here or it didn't happen :D

[electrosoft]

7 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

MSI, in typical MSI fashion, has dropped the ball on their BIOS development. They mysteriously omitted the AMD CBS menus and sub-menus, so there are lots of tweaks that were not accessible with the stock BIOS. It has taken a couple of days worth of mods and testing to get them added back. So, basically restoring expected function and features. It's really ridiculous that it was not present because it is an AMD firmware default menu option AFAIK.

 

Couple this with how they behaved with the 5090 Lightning BIOS and insisting that Techpowerup take it down from their GPU BIOS database makes it hard to respect their brand in my mind. The MSI brand is all about show, not go.

 

There was a recent article on this that got little attention. I tried to contact @flashhez and @chew and got no response, but Svet (the MSI Forum guy) came to the rescue. The world needs more people like Svet and Prema.

 

Enthusiasts have unlocked hidden overclocking menus on the MSI B850MPOWER motherboard

 

 

Have the best, easily unlock enabled laptop bios this side of Prema, but purposely lock down the bios on the MSI B850M POWER?? 

 

Look how long it took Asus to let the XOC run free (ish) and then we have the Lightning situation. I get the position of both that in the wrong hands both can drastically increase the chances of wrecking cards but still....

 

I still prefer Asus BIOS over MSI. EVGA > ASUS > MSI.

 

Still prefer MSI over Asus as a company....

 

Big ups to @svet!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Mr. Fox]

7 hours ago, electrosoft said:

 

Have the best, easily unlock enabled laptop bios this side of Prema, but purposely lock down the bios on the MSI B850M POWER?? 

 

Look how long it took Asus to let the XOC run free (ish) and then we have the Lightning situation. I get the position of both that in the wrong hands both can drastically increase the chances of wrecking cards but still....

 

I still prefer Asus BIOS over MSI. EVGA > ASUS > MSI.

 

Still prefer MSI over Asus as a company....

 

Big ups to @svet!

Agree with every statement you made. MSI > ASUS as a company, but MSI < ASUS for firmware and overclock focus. EVGA had them all beat, but now they are irrelevant. 

 

What is so stupid is MSI marketed this motherboard as being targeted for overclocking, especially memory overclocking, then they do something extra stupid and gimp the firmware options related to memory overclocking. What the heck? Nuts.

 

Conceptually same as the Lightning. "Hey guys, here is this extremely expensive GPU designed for extreme overclocking. You won't find out you're getting screwed until you buy it. Core is not binned, and no... no XOC BIOS for you. Only our chosen few. Hurry... buy it... quantities are limited." Screw 'em. Scammer losers.

 

And, now there is this... the good old days are gone for PC enthusiasts. At least until the AI bubble burst and they find out they actually DO need us. Right now we're getting shafted left and right. Gee, thanks Lisa Su. Witch.

 

 

Speaking of AI... LFG...

 

[Mr. Fox]

I wonder how many people are going to send me a PM asking for this? 

 

https://www.overclock.net/posts/29569587/ 

---

I decided not to sell the Strix and 4090 to pay for the new SFF build. No interest on Facepoot Marketplace, just lots of stupid emojis because it was out of nearly everyone's league that  trolls there. I gave the entire system to one of my sons that is an avid gamer, took his system that I built a couple of years ago and gave it to my daughter. She developed an addiction to Baldur's Gat 3 and played almost 600 hours in the past 90 days using a system I gave her with an X79 mobo and CPU and RX 580. So both got an upgrade. The system I took from my son and gave to my daughter has a B650 AORUS Elite AX, 7700X CPU and RTX 3060 12GB. So, both of them ended up with nice upgrades.

 

This was the ExtremeHardware review video on the system (case and AIO) I build a couple of years ago that I gave to my daughter today. After cleaning it up, repasting, fresh install of Windoze and adding an extra 2TB NVMe for her Steam library it looks and runs like new. Both kids were thrilled. (They're middle-aged adults but still my "kids" and always will be.)

 

 

[Mr. Fox]

11 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

I wonder how many people are going to send me a PM asking for this? 

 

https://www.overclock.net/posts/29569587/ 

Several already, LOL... I added a post to explain the process.

 

https://www.overclock.net/posts/29569667/

[Mr. Fox]

 

[Mr. Fox]

So, now the trolls come out of the woodwork. Entitlement is a serious problem. That's one reason why @Prema changed his approach. Good guys are always hated, LOL.

 

https://www.overclock.net/posts/29569920/

 

[electrosoft]

On 3/13/2026 at 9:51 PM, Mr. Fox said:

Agree with every statement you made. MSI > ASUS as a company, but MSI < ASUS for firmware and overclock focus. EVGA had them all beat, but now they are irrelevant. 

 

What is so stupid is MSI marketed this motherboard as being targeted for overclocking, especially memory overclocking, then they do something extra stupid and gimp the firmware options related to memory overclocking. What the heck? Nuts.

 

Conceptually same as the Lightning. "Hey guys, here is this extremely expensive GPU designed for extreme overclocking. You won't find out you're getting screwed until you buy it. Core is not binned, and no... no XOC BIOS for you. Only our chosen few. Hurry... buy it... quantities are limited." Screw 'em. Scammer losers.

 

And, now there is this... the good old days are gone for PC enthusiasts. At least until the AI bubble burst and they find out they actually DO need us. Right now we're getting shafted left and right. Gee, thanks Lisa Su. Witch.

 

 

Speaking of AI... LFG...

 

 

Speaking of EVGA, I just started the RMA process on my P2 1600w. I noticed EVGA no longer carries Platinum or higher rated 1600w PSUs so we'll see how that goes.....

 

--

 

For the prices being charged for specialty 5090s, they need to be binned, unlocked and offer the owner unfettered access to all the top end BIOS variants and be able to cross flash everything under the sun.

 

5090 market is in shambles atm and prices returning to $3k+ for even budget priced models. Zotac Solid is the cheapest 5090 available on pcpartpicker and it is ~$3800.....insane.

 

I think you and I took the right approach and waited for prices to get somewhat sane before picking up our 5090s. I came to my senses with that Astral 5090 and returned it on day 59 of a 60 day return window and just rode that 9070xt till a good 5090 deal came along. Best decision I ever made. I'll never gravitate towards the top end of the 090 series ever again. I'm loathe to think of the pricing of the 6090 whenever that drops....

 

--

 

I finally got a chance to watch the GN report on AMD and no surprise there just massive disappointment as always. Jensen laid the groundwork and AMD hopped right in schmoozing the administration full tilt.

 

AMD really committed to schmoozing with the Biden administration and went full tilt with the trump administration. The current administration is, ah, much more open to increased "collabs" with big corporations and, um, "maximizing" their interfacing via Super PACs and other donations (Ballroom aisle one)......when we saw all the tech CEOs and high rollers sitting front and center at the inauguration, we knew what was coming.

 

Unadulterated greed and an administration that is extra sensitive to pocket lining has relegated the common citizen even further down the food chain. 

 

I still want AMD to succeed because they are the GPU underdog and if only to counter Nvidia just as they did to Intel to keep both in check.

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

9070xt vs 7900xtx with the newest drivers....

 

7900xtx is still a beast and unless you want better RT and access to the newest technologies, zero reason to upgrade and you get an extra 8GB on top of it to boot with the 7900xtx:

 

 

The only meaningful overall upgrade from a 7900xtx is a 5080 or 5090 IMHO:

 

 

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8 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

So, now the trolls come out of the woodwork. Entitlement is a serious problem. That's one reason why @Prema changed his approach. Good guys are always hated, LOL.

 

https://www.overclock.net/posts/29569920/

 

 

The entitlement is insane.

 

"Why can't I have it for free?"

"It's stupid to charge for some stupid mod"

 

@Prema did the right thing and only works with those he trusts along with an OEM.

 

I know you're like me and every time I was given access to custom work, mods or files with a clear directive from the creator to not share them, I never shared them period. Most times, I never even mentioned it in forums and still don't because you're always going to have someone message you asking for it, pleading for it and getting mad when you say no. I just opt to keep that to myself and quietly work with it on my own.

 

One reason why in the 5090 forums last year watching people begging then getting mad wanting those who had the XOC to break their NDAs or promises and share them was nails on a chalkboard to me. Yes, I wanted the BIOS but I also understood why I did not have access to them and they were basically going after and blaming the wrong people.

 

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MSI x870E Unify Max is looking very tasty.......

 

 

 

Also MSI......raising prices and cutting back on lower end SKUs to compensate for supply shortages

 

AKA the double Whammy....

 

https://videocardz.com/newz/msi-says-nvidia-is-supplying-about-20-fewer-gpus-than-the-market-needs

 

"To protect margins, MSI plans to cut back on lower-end models and move more resources toward higher-end products. Money UDN says low-end models previously made up about 30% of the mix, and MSI now wants to focus more on mid-range and higher-tier products, with RTX 5060 and RTX 5070 class systems..."

 

 

[Reciever]

11 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

So, now the trolls come out of the woodwork. Entitlement is a serious problem. That's one reason why @Prema changed his approach. Good guys are always hated, LOL.

 

https://www.overclock.net/posts/29569920/

 

 

25 bucks is honestly not much at all, especially these days. Perhaps I would be more inclined to pay that given I know some of your history and how high of standard you set for whats acceptable, let alone whats considered useful for benching. If you decide to give it away for free or charge w/e price you want that choice is ultimately yours. 

Anyone who skoffs at that can honestly kick rocks. In fact it pisses me off at how lax the moderation is over there as discussing pricing openly was always against their TOS unless they changed it. 

The whole thing reminds me of the type of person who would spend 5 grand on a pc only to re-use some long retired ratted out power strip and complain about it catching fire.

 

Honestly dont regret no longer surfing those forums.

[Mr. Fox]

 

[electrosoft]

13 hours ago, Reciever said:

 

25 bucks is honestly not much at all, especially these days. Perhaps I would be more inclined to pay that given I know some of your history and how high of standard you set for whats acceptable, let alone whats considered useful for benching. If you decide to give it away for free or charge w/e price you want that choice is ultimately yours. 

Anyone who skoffs at that can honestly kick rocks. In fact it pisses me off at how lax the moderation is over there as discussing pricing openly was always against their TOS unless they changed it. 

The whole thing reminds me of the type of person who would spend 5 grand on a pc only to re-use some long retired ratted out power strip and complain about it catching fire.

 

Honestly dont regret no longer surfing those forums.

 

It's crazy how instead of quietly opting not to pay the entitlement and indignation that someone would exercise their right to charge for their work.

 

I surf more than post on most forums these days. I do keep plenty of popcorn on hand though for the routine flame wars that break out.....

 

5 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

 

 

I'm on the fence with AI supporting technologies.

 

If we can get FG latency down to non FG levels (IE, allow acknowledged user interrupts on generated frames), I'm ok with it but till then for many games it is a non starter.

 

If DLSS advances sufficiently enough to be indistinguishable from traditional hardware rendered frames and the end user experience is identical, that's a win for performance because we've shifted a large portion of the rendering burden onto another another technology that provides an overall better gaming experience.

 

My problem with DLSS5 is going to be it isn't trying to match the original rendered images. Instead, it is going all Instagram / Snapchat filters on everything and actually changes drastically what the original source looked like and that doesn't work for me.

 

On the other hand, devs may embrace DLSS5 and design their original textures with DLSS5 in their workflow to determine their desired final product. I'm ok with this and I think this is what the future holds. Using AI to assist in your image/texture generation both source/static and realtime / ingame.

 

I think many are up in arms right now because of the drastic "glow up" it is giving pre-existing games to the point it drastically changes the original.....like many do online applying insane filters to their pictures that are painfully obvious to everyone with a modicum of a critical eye. I know I've grown tired of family and friends routinely slapping filters on their social media pictures. I never use them. It's not real life and when you happen to run into those same family and friends out and about they look NOTHING like their online pictures.

 

Until then? I'll stick with traditional rendering unless the performance is so low that it is counter enjoyable and then I would entertain it.

 

Remember first gen RT was laughed at....it is now standard and AMD and Intel followed suit

First gen DLSS was laughed at....it is now standard  and AMD and Intel followed suit

First gen FG was laughed at.....it is rapidly becoming a standard option  and AMD and Intel following suit

 

Nvidia owns 94% of the discrete GPU market.... they're clearly onto something or at least something consumers prefer.

 

Not now, but I expect DLSS5 to be a major workflow tool for future dev work....

 

Is that a good or bad thing? Time will tell....