M4800 Owner's Thread

[unnoticed]

More images:

Spoiler

Dell Precision M4800

Released Oct 2013
Max cpu:

i7-4940MX

Max ram:

32GB 1866 MHz

GPU options from factory:

NVIDIA Quadro K1100M (2 GB GDDR5)
K2100M (2 GB GDDR5)
AMD FirePro M5100 (2 GB GDDR5)

Review:
https://www.notebookcheck.net/Review-Dell-Precision-M4800-Notebook.104416.0.html

Owners manual:
https://www.dell.com/support/manuals/en-us/precision-m4800-workstation/precm4800om/before-working-inside-your-computer?guid=guid-0fc4c1f0-96c6-48ac-87b1-f0f2b822ab9c&lang=en-us

Dell Precision M4800 drivers:
https://www.dell.com/support/home/en-us/product-support/product/precision-m4800-workstation/drivers

Spare parts:
https://www.parts-people.com/index.php?action=category&id=142&subid=457

 

[Aaron44126]

Welcome.  Just adding links herehere:

• NBR "legacy" M4800 owner's thread https://www.nbrchive.net/forum.notebookreview.com/threads/m4800-owners-thread.736032/
• M4800 driver RSS feed

[jpsulisz]

My ThinkMods adapter actually doesn't fit my M4800, it fits the X220 fine. Talked to yttrium about it and it looks like the height of the adapters ranges from model to model, he recommended sanding it down slightly. He's made a really good product, I can't imagine someone else will produce another one like this at is not in any large demand, think John on NBR mentioned he would wait until a cheaper version came out.

Attached is a photo of the prototypes included in the kit I received, if anyone finds that interesting. More than happy to provide any information on the adapter

Also, RIP NBR 

(Copy N Paste from LaptopForum - doing this as right now there aren't many members on either forum)

[Sandy Bridge]

I have a ThinkMod adapter on order, but wasn't one of the early ones so I'm a ways down on the list.  Planning to use it in my Inspiron.  I'll try to remember to post a review here when it arrives, whenever that is.  Although my 1520 is old enough that it probably will be limited to about 220 MBps; still faster than its HDD but the M4800 may be capable of faster depending on its PCIe setup.

I agree that it's unlikely there's going to be a cheap mass market one; if there was enough demand for that it would have been around years ago.

The parts are made in China and assembled in New York, so it's not entirely true that they aren't being made in China.  Pandemic shipping between iterations of the product was part of the reason for the delays, although I'm sure like many projects the "it always takes 3 times as long as you expect" rule was part of it too.

Overall I'm amazed that this is coming together at all.  $40 is still fairly cheap IMO, and if you consider that he might sell 1000, and has been working on it for a couple years at least, and the manufacturing isn't free... it's not exactly a way to get rich.  It's definitely in the realm of "a lot of the cost is going to cover the engineering expenses rather than parts".

[M4980]

Installed the Taobao version of the ExpressCard to NVMe adapter in my M4800 with a 512GB Samsung PM991 SSD, works great and hotswaps fine too. Not going to try booting from it but I assume it cannot do that? If I test it, I will post the verdict.

Next plan is to modify the Dell ExpressCard dummy to accept the PCB, this'll make it much easier to remove and also look seamless

[Aaron44126]

10 minutes ago, M4980 said:

Not going to try booting from it but I assume it cannot do that? If I test it, I will post the verdict.

I rather doubt that you will be able to boot from it directly.  The BIOS won't know to look there for a bootable drive.  Chainloading might work though.  (UEFI boot loader installed on a SATA drive, but OS installed on the NVMe drive.)

[M4980]

Hello guys 😄

Does anyone know anything about the Quadro T1000 upgrade not working with the QHD+ display? I saw it discussed on 51nb briefly.

I tested out the LG 156QHG display from the 1440p Alienware M15 R6/X15 R1, the connectors matched (pitch and pin wise) but I got a black screen, no boot, fans spinning for 5 seconds. The T1000 QHD+ bug could explain why I guess.

Either that or display is incompatible for some unknown reason

[unnoticed]

On 5/15/2022 at 11:41 PM, M4980 said:

Hello guys 😄

Does anyone know anything about the Quadro T1000 upgrade not working with the QHD+ display? I saw it discussed on 51nb briefly.

I tested out the LG 156QHG display from the 1440p Alienware M15 R6/X15 R1, the connectors matched (pitch and pin wise) but I got a black screen, no boot, fans spinning for 5 seconds. The T1000 QHD+ bug could explain why I guess.

Either that or display is incompatible for some unknown reason

I could be wrong but wasn't it because you need optimus to work to get any display output?
The M4800 only support up to 1080p on the internal gma, if you install a QHD panel the internal gma is permanently disabled and run only off the discrete graphics

[Aaron44126]

1 hour ago, unnoticed said:

I could be wrong but wasn't it because you need optimus to work to get any display output?
The M4800 only support up to 1080p on the internal gma, if you install a QHD panel the internal gma is permanently disabled and run only off the discrete graphics

 

New NVIDIA GPUs support only eDP, so if you have an LVDS panel, you do need Optimus to get any display output.

...However, QHD+ should be eDP, you couldn't run that off of LVDS.  But, it's possible that the T1000 doesn't like the eDP setup in the M4800.

 

@Trov got T2000 working but did mention that he is using Optimus.

[unnoticed]

18 hours ago, Aaron44126 said:

 

New NVIDIA GPUs support only eDP, so if you have an LVDS panel, you do need Optimus to get any display output.

...However, QHD+ should be eDP, you couldn't run that off of LVDS.  But, it's possible that the T1000 doesn't like the eDP setup in the M4800.

 

@Trov got T2000 working but did mention that he is using Optimus.

oh yes, that too

[M4980]

Probably gonna get a 1080p display instead, looking for something 400+ nits ideally.

Came across the Innolux N156HCE-GN1 from ThinkPad P53/P1/P15/T15g/X1E which is a 60Hz, 500 nits, 30-pin eDP panel. Technically compatible, anyone tried it with the M4800? If not, which display upgrades have been confirmed on the M4800? I'm aware that some people use the B156HAN04.2 120Hz display.

 

EDIT: Looks like NV156FHM-N4J might be the move. 500 nits 144Hz matte G-Sync panel. Might try it out soon. Anyone already tried it?

[M4980]

So, the NV156FHM-N4J display would require 10.75 Gbps bandwidth, which the Intel HD 4600 is theoretically capable of via eDP  (it's actually capable of up to 4K@60Hz as per Intel's specification).

 

But my confusion stands as to why the QHD+ panel requires the discrete graphics mode - see those in this Dell forum discussion.

 

How far does this limit go? Am I able to install a 1080p 144Hz panel? Does anyone here have the resources required to find out?

My assumption right now is that I will need to stick to 30-pin eDP displays.

 

EDIT: I am now fully read up on the matter, I just didn't read hard enough b4

 

Conclusion: under the assumption that newer MXM GPUs such as the RTX A2000 will also be unable to work in discrete mode on this laptop, resulting in 40-pin displays being incompatible, a docking-connector hijacking eDP board similar to those used in old ThinkPads should be created, I am going to look into it.

 

As the M4800 has such huge bezels, I'm inclined to believe that the LP170WQ1-SPA1 17.0" 16:10 2560x1600 display would fit inside the M4800's lid after relocating the antennae, removing the webcam, shortening the hinges, and removing obstructions. The result would be funny to say the least

[M4980]

Got the Anshu 180w GaN + SiC charging adapter for my M4800.  It's much smaller and lighter than the original Dell 180w adapter and seems to be working well so far.

 

 

I've also switched the thermal paste in the laptop to the best option available right now, the Honeywell PTM 7950 thermal pad (non-conductive phase changing material). This also seems to be like a huge success (temps are far lower) and is supposed to last years without any degradation. The only downside to this is that it is quite awkward to install, however there is also a paste version which is probably far easier, possibly at the expense of some additional gains.

 

 

Both of these items are only available from China on Aliexpress/Ebuy7 - I got mine from Ebuy7 as it was significantly cheaper. Took 12 days to arrive.

 

Anshu 180W:

Ebuy7 listing (option is "light green" for the 180w Dell-tipped version)

Aliexpress listing

 

Honeywell PTM 7950:

Ebuy7 listing

Aliexpress listing

 

[Tenoroon]

30 minutes ago, M4980 said:

Got the Anshu 180w GaN + SiC charging adapter for my M4800.  It's much smaller and lighter than the original Dell 180w adapter and seems to be working well so far.

 

 

I've also switched the thermal paste in the laptop to the best option available right now, the Honeywell PTM 7950 thermal pad (non-conductive phase changing material). This also seems to be like a huge success (temps are far lower) and is supposed to last years without any degradation. The only downside to this is that it is quite awkward to install, however there is also a paste version which is probably far easier, possibly at the expense of some additional gains.

 

 

Both of these items are only available from China on Aliexpress/Ebuy7 - I got mine from Ebuy7 as it was significantly cheaper. Took 12 days to arrive.

 

Anshu 180W:

Ebuy7 listing (option is "light green" for the 180w Dell-tipped version)

Aliexpress listing

 

Honeywell PTM 7950:

Ebuy7 listing

Aliexpress listing

 

Be careful if the pad isnt touching some of the CPU, if it doesn't, you risk killing prematurely killing the chip.

[M4980]

1 hour ago, Tenoroon said:

Be careful if the pad isnt touching some of the CPU, if it doesn't, you risk killing prematurely killing the chip.

 

Oh dang, that's not good. I might need to redo the CPU and GPU dies then... It was super tricky to install so I missed the edges/corners on both, exactly as shown in my picture. 

[Tenoroon]

43 minutes ago, M4980 said:

 

Oh dang, that's not good. I might need to redo the CPU and GPU dies then... It was super tricky to install so I missed the edges/corners on both, exactly as shown in my picture. 

Yeah, usually the edges of CPUs and GPUs are the memory controller. If that goes out on say, your GPU, you will have core level artifacting that cannot be fixed unless you replace the core (which usually isn't done due to the cost, difficulty, and time)

[Aaron44126]

1 hour ago, M4980 said:

 

Oh dang, that's not good. I might need to redo the CPU and GPU dies then... It was super tricky to install so I missed the edges/corners on both, exactly as shown in my picture. 

1 hour ago, Tenoroon said:

Yeah, usually the edges of CPUs and GPUs are the memory controller. If that goes out on say, your GPU, you will have core level artifacting that cannot be fixed unless you replace the core (which usually isn't done due to the cost, difficulty, and time)

 

Haswell CPU layout is like this.  Memory controller is on the edge on one side.  There are CPU cores bordering the opposite edge.

 

(Not sure "which end is which" compared to your CPU photo above.)

 

 

 

CPUs do not heat up uniformly.  The CPU cores will be where the bulk of the heat comes from.  It "might" be OK to leave certain areas uncovered but you'd want to have a pretty good idea of why that's OK.  I wouldn't chance it.  Best to make sure the whole thing is covered with some sort of thermal transfer material so that the heat can spread evenly over the top as best it can.

 

(GPUs heat up much more uniformly if only because most of the die space is taken up by "cloned" GPU core blocks that operate in parallel.)

[Tenoroon]

7 minutes ago, Aaron44126 said:

 

Haswell CPU layout is like this.  (Not sure "which end is which" compared to your CPU photo above.)  Memory controller is on the edge on one side.  There are CPU cores bordering the opposite edge.

 

 

 

CPUs do not heat up uniformly.  The CPU cores will be where the bulk of the heat comes from.  It "might" be OK to leave certain areas uncovered but you'd want to have a pretty good idea of why that's OK.  I wouldn't chance it.  Best to make sure the whole thing is covered with some sort of thermal transfer material so that the heat can spread evenly over the top as best it can.

Yeah, I just realized I could have worded it better. The edges of ALL GPUs are mostly the memory controller, while the memory controller on CPUs tends to be in a line on the edge.

Here's a die layout of a GM204 die:


This is also why it is advised not to use LM on GPUs. LM doesn't ooze out towards the edges like thermal paste does, meaning if you don't completely cover the core in LM, chances are you will be seeing memory problems down the road.

I also think the memory controller on the Haswell die is facing away from the caps on the substrate. I might be wrong though. It's still good practice to try to cover the entire die when using a thermal pad or LM, and in the case of thermal pads, its alright if some of the pad hangs off the edges.

 

 

[M4980]

1 hour ago, Tenoroon said:

Yeah, I just realized I could have worded it better. The edges of ALL GPUs are mostly the memory controller, while the memory controller on CPUs tends to be in a line on the edge.

Here's a die layout of a GM204 die:


This is also why it is advised not to use LM on GPUs. LM doesn't ooze out towards the edges like thermal paste does, meaning if you don't completely cover the core in LM, chances are you will be seeing memory problems down the road.

I also think the memory controller on the Haswell die is facing away from the caps on the substrate. I might be wrong though. It's still good practice to try to cover the entire die when using a thermal pad or LM, and in the case of thermal pads, its alright if some of the pad hangs off the edges.

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Aaron44126 said:

 

Haswell CPU layout is like this.  Memory controller is on the edge on one side.  There are CPU cores bordering the opposite edge.

 

(Not sure "which end is which" compared to your CPU photo above.)

 

 

 

CPUs do not heat up uniformly.  The CPU cores will be where the bulk of the heat comes from.  It "might" be OK to leave certain areas uncovered but you'd want to have a pretty good idea of why that's OK.  I wouldn't chance it.  Best to make sure the whole thing is covered with some sort of thermal transfer material so that the heat can spread evenly over the top as best it can.

 

(GPUs heat up much more uniformly if only because most of the die space is taken up by "cloned" GPU core blocks that operate in parallel.)

 

Very informative! Thanks guys, it's not something I considered before really. This could possibly explain the sudden death of my PGA i7-4980HQ tbh, it has all of the symptoms of a dead CPU memory controller, and I previously ran LM for almost a year without re-applying it. Perhaps moving it into my M4800 was the final nail in the coffin.

The more you know!

 

For future readers considering the Honeywell pad - make sure you cut a piece slightly larger than the die to account for almost inevitable creases as you apply it 😛

[un3nabled]

To me Haswell seems like an interesting generation. Is it the first Intel mobile generation to use a Fully Integrated Voltage Regulator (FIVR)? Subsequent generations didn't seem to use this technology anymore. I wonder if it contributed to extra heat generated? It does seem to correlate to the M4800 motherboard having a simpler CPU VRM design compared to the M4700.

2013 - ASUS ROG: Introduction To Fully Integrated Voltage Regulators (FIVR) On Maximus VI
(pdf) FIVR – Fully Integrated Voltage Regulators on 4th Generation Intel® Core™ SoCs

[Hyper]

I gave my M4800 some love with a 512GB mSATA boot SSD, 4TB SATA 2.5" SSD and a fresh install of Windows 11 instead of Windows 7.

BIOS + MBR + Windows 7 Pro x64 to UEFI + GPT + Windows 11. I'm happy to report that Windows 11 works fine on this system. You need to use the system requirements check bypass in order to install the OS.

 

I used mostly the Windows 10 x64 drivers from Dell except for the AMD FirePro M5100. Here I got the drivers directly from AMD.
Issues I had was a BSOD with the Intel Rapid Storage driver installed. I uninstalled the driver and used the Windows-provided storage driver instead. And when I disabled switchable graphics in the BIOS I got a black screen in Windows. So switchable graphics needs to stay enabled.

 

With this the system works very nicely and stable.

[Kitje]

My M4800 is still going well, albeit soon I have to consider sourcing a replacement keyboard and a new CPU fan. Only because, if the current KB decides to shed the keys or the fan decides to buzz and unable to resolve it.

 

The 120HZ panel is still doing well too, along with the WX 4150. It was very stressful getting the machine together though. And it was because I encountered hurdles with the motherboard and panel and lid AND the bezel. The only thing not changed is the base unit chassis and the heatsinks, the keyboard and its keyboard bezel.

 

At the moment I've run into an issue where the pointing stick is just gone, not even device manager is picking it up so I'm gonna investigate that. Already reseated the keyboard but I don't know if I'm missing a ribbon cable on it or something.

 

Update: I ordered a backlit spare for the machine to keep aside until I need it. I'm still unsure if this is the only known machine with a 120Hz panel as I don't know if anyone else has installed anything higher than 60hz in these machines (they need eDP.)

 

The other issue here is that since I've been more bored I started gaming on it, and now if I game on it I'd rather use a proper gaming laptop for the purpose. That, and parts grow scarce as the machine grows old. When the time comes I'm installing Windows 7 Professional on it, with a video editor that's also capable running on 7. The same will happen to the Zbook 15.

[Kitje]

Well, the new KB arrived albeit one minor snag... One corner was bent where the Esc key is. But the backlight works as well as the keys. Bit of a bummer, oh well.

 

Now I have faced an issue where the trackstick hasn't been picked up by the BIOS, as nothing is responding other than the touchpad... Welp.

 

EDIT:

 

I found out the cause... One of the pads on the touchpad ribbon cable was folded. But why? Why not add a second ZIF connector on the board for the touchstick? What the Hell, Dell? So I unfolded it as best I could and its' working again. But I still am considering to source a replacement sometime...

A better clarification is that the touchpad has a pin, just one pin for the touchstick but it's still a strange way, considering its not using the pins that connect the keyboard.

[Kitje]

So, I wasn't sure where else to get a new cable. I looked into AliExpress and saw this.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005003087841893.html

 

8-pin  at 15cm. Not sure what the pitch is (I assume its the width of each pin) but from the looks of it,  it's what I may be looking for. I may order a pack just to be sure I don't get something dodgy within the package. If all goes well then I could recommend this to anyone who is looking for a new flex for the touchpad since these can be brittle after replacing the top assembly if you miss out something.

 

Not too expensive either, and even if it means waiting for a few weeks it's worth the wait.

[Kitje]

I only just noticed in GPU-Z the Radeon Pro WX4150 is showing up as x8 PCIe for the bus interface? Is that normal?

 

Seems that GPU runs at that instead according to Techpowerup but surely that's false? AMD says it's x16 so I have no idea what's happening here and I don't know what's true. I might try clean the contacts and reseat the thing a little later to see any changes.