Mr. Fox

There could be a plethora of reasons for that. I haven't noticed any marketing spam hitting my junk folders yet that relate to the new Titan. It is only an anecdotal observation, but it feels like speculation and excitement over unreleased products is also more muted than it used to be. The Titan is probably not going to be relevant to a lot of people. It also probably doesn't help matters that there have been a number of examples of overhyped and misrepresented new tech in the past year or two, where the end product didn't clear the bar that was set. Combine that with some of those same products having some unexpected design flaws, QC failures and engineering defects, along with abusive pricing that puts some things either out of reach, or beyond the point of acceptableness for some people. I know I have no interest in talking about, speculation or swapping assumptions about unreleased tech at this point. If find it pretty hard to get excited or want to talk about stuff that you may be fed a string of lies and overhyped half-truths about, might be broken on launch day, and might be priced beyond reasonableness. At a personal level, if it is not something I am planning to buy for myself, then new products of any kind (technology or otherwise) are not things that I am interested in looking at or talking about, just because I simply don't care about those products. That's why you almost never see me in a laptop thread unless someone tags me and expects a response. I just don't give a rat's butt about laptops, and I have no interest in looking at them or talking about them.

It is easier and faster to boil a small pot of water than it is a cauldron filled with water. That's why those little 12VHPWR connectors are so special. The other reason is because the Green Goblin says they are, and we all know that if NVIDIA says so it has to be true.

Newer is better newer. Every time!

What better way to sell your flagship that destroys every other option available by a huge margin--but, with a huge price tag attached to it--than to make all of the alternative options an undesirable, overpriced and lame Mickey Mouse excuse for an upgrade? That is a pretty decent game. I have played it and it's not bad. I am surprised to see it available for free on Epic. Thanks for the heads up. Anyone that doesn't have it should snag it while they can.

As I mentioned before, there is a huge disconnect in their understanding and thought process. They do not understand their target market and they have confused console jockeys with PC enthusiasts. The alternative is they don't care or they are targeting a compromised group of consumers rather than PC enthusiasts. Believing that GDDR6X doesn't offer a meaningful performance gain and that 90°C+ hotspot temperatures is OK paints a picture of a truly clueless and misinformed clown posse. They will remain in the shadow of NVIDIA forever unless these examples of poor judgment are mitigated.

It could be either one, but the outcome is the same either way. Not winning is not winning. Like RIcky Bobby's daddy always said... Well, 3x8-pin was enough for the 3090 KPE pulling over 750W through 3x8-pin. I do not believe the 12VHPWR connector was necessary and I do not consider it to be a real improvement. The one advantage that I see is that it is one cable versus three. But, for the same reason it is more fragile and prone to failure than the tried and true 8-pin cable. Pushing the same amount of power through a smaller connection and fewer wires, in a concentrated spot on the PCB, also makes is hotter. Nothing wrong with 700W. More power generally means more performance. When it consumes gobs of power, gets hot, but still doesn't deliver a commensurately high level of performance is where that becomes problematic. Having no idea about some things seems to be a trend for them.

While it sounds cynical on the surface, the fact of the matter is that has been the excuse/reason for too many years. Lots of near misses and always the same or similar explanation for it. Too hot, too much power/voltage needed, just need to work on better drivers, just need to work on better firmware, just need better support from partnering hardware vendors or game developers. I think they would if they knew how. I think the real problem is they don't know how to win, and don't hire people that know how to win. Part of the time is was lack of financial resources, but that's no longer an issue... so it leads me back to not knowing how, and not really understanding what some of their prospective customers would require as prerequistes for entertaining the idea of changing brands.

I am glad you liked the benchmark scores. I had fun for the first time in a while last night. No need to send money. I don't know if you are being silly or not, but you have demonstrated generosity more than once. That is a great character trait. If you buy the NUC I'll count that as payment for the benchmark scores, LOL. 🤣 Part of it is Intel and NVIDIA are very sore losers and exhaust financial resources on winning. That includes the people they hire, and what seems to be an indication of "winning is more important than how you play the game" mentality. The other part of it is AMD seems to lack experience and drive. They talk like they want to win, but are not willing to do what it takes to score. Using GDDR6 instead of GDDR6X is an example of that. Just that one change would go a long way in closing the performance gap between 7900 XTX and 4090. Using GDDR6 on their flagship GPU in 2023 is just lame. They've been playing in the console sandbox for too long. They're out of touch with PC gaming and overclocking enthusiasts. They hire people that aren't advocates for overclocking enthusiasts and don't really have a clue what is important to us. And, they may not care. Their drivers leave something to be desired.

Yeah, the memory speed used by the GPU matters a ton. A whole lot more than system memory. 2667 versus 3200 would definitely be measurable. This is one of the reasons the flagship Radeon cards can't compete with flagship GeForce cards. AMD still use GDDR6 versus the far superior GDDR6X video memory. In some conditions the performance difference is tremendous. The slower speed and decreased bandwidth of GDDR6 can often present a remarkable performance bottleneck. Totally agree Brother @Rage Setand the comments right below that about Dunning-Kruger effect are also an accurate way of describing Mr. Pottymouth. While he often makes some good points that we agree with (sometimes merely stating what is obvious) he truly is a legend in his own mind. https://www.webmd.com/mental-health/dunning-kruger-effect-what-to-know I do not agree with Mr. Grumpy Canuck that Jay or Steve took the issues personally, unless we also believe that everyone (and there are way too many) that has had very bad experiences with ASUS products that are broken, including their trash software and sketchy firmware, are also taking their misery personally when they complain about it publicly. I think they deserve every ounce of hate and contempt leveled at them. They have become a legion of scumbags and a poster child for the worthlessness of the CCP. I mean, it is obvious to anyone paying attention that ASUS is in a state of decline and they have been for several years. Hopefully, they will turn it around and make a comeback. They used to be good, and they can return to being great if they care enough to make the effort. They have the skill, but it is questionable whether or not they have the will. The greedier they are, the harder it is to correct. With big companies like ASUS, it often takes very drastic measures and devastating financial consequences to get their attention, and if they don't act quickly in demonstrating remorse, decisively change their ways and make sure everyone can see and feel that change, their doom will be sealed.

You are sharing that 8GB with the graphics system and there is not much of it. It is also much slower than memory on a GPU. How does the memory clock speed compare to the scores that are twice what yours are?

I actually acquired some points, for myself and for the team. Nice. https://hwbot.org/submission/5275966_mr._fox_y_cruncher___pi_1b_core_i9_13900k_16sec_572ms https://hwbot.org/submission/5275967_mr._fox_y_cruncher___pi_2.5b_core_i9_13900k_46sec_860ms https://hwbot.org/submission/5275993_mr._fox_pyprime___2b_with_benchmate_ddr5_sdram_6sec_855ms

Maybe if they tie a steak around the 4070 the dogs would play with it.

The good news is, Intel Iris Xe graphics performance only needs to improve a little over 3200% to match 4090. 🤣

It's still sitting here waiting for you, bro. A little bit of dust won't hurt it.

I'm first to respond, LOL. How much are you paying? 😉 https://www.3dmark.com/fs/29840067

What you just described doesn't resemble anything I would call fun or enjoyable. When you have to go to that amount of trouble is where I lose interest. It doesn't seem overly problematic right now that the Asus firmware won't work and doesn't play nice with such an old video card that almost nobody wants to use anymore. But, where does that threshold occur? It could have been yesterday. At what point does support get broken, and how? And who gets to decide when? Then what did they change, and why was the change necessary? Who says so, what was the basis for it? What was the change that made it stop working? What value did that change add for customers? Who benefitted from it, and how? Those are the disturbing questions that nobody would like the answers to. When you find it difficult to recognize anything good to say about a company and how it operates, assuming the worst and a presumption of nefarious intent comes naturally.

No, I still have it. I am probably going to put the guts from my work computer inside of it and get rid of the 5000D Airflow case because I have always been annoyed at the fact that it is too small. I have not decided yet. When you offered it to me before I decided no because I did not believe it would fit, but I have always LOVED the EVGA DG cases. They are amazing. The real problem no matter what I use is the fact that my office too dad-gum small for two desktops, tow external radiators, a chiller, three desks and a triple monitor setup for my work PC and dual monitors for my benching rig. This is what I was concerned about some time ago. I love how gigantic the EVGA case is, and I love how massive the Level 20 XT case is that I was using before the EVGA case, but both make me feel almost claustrophobic. In fact, I was texting back and forth with Brother @tps3443 and texted him a phone video showing how cramped it is. Let me upload it and post it here in a bit. Edit... see the dilemma? (I normally kind of tidy things up for glam shots, but this is what the daily chaos looks like that makes me claustrophic, LOL.)

Point are points, and if you beat a lot of somebody elses' 6870 scores with it that's what matters most. And, that you have fun doing it. It's really too bad that heat doesn't make computer parts run faster and overclock better like cold does. I'd put my computers out in the Phoenix sun, rev 'em up and set the world on fire if that were true, LOL.

Now, more than ever before, it is important to not allow any firmware updates. There's no security risk or vulnerability severe enough to justify ruining the performance of your hardware and there's no bottom to how low they will go on gimping crap under false pretenses. I think treating OS updates the same way is equally wise, but you can always restore a Macrium image or nuke and reinstall the OS if you don't like the outcome. You know there's going to be lots of dumb dumbs that freak out about vulnerabilities and plenty of people that believe the fairy tale that newer is always better. Unless the update makes it run faster or fixes something that they screwed up real bad on the previous firmware there's no point in being a guinea pig. Let the stupid people do that for you. Watch and wait and make an informed decision to reject or accept the update. Best approach is to have open eyes and a closed mind when it comes to updates. Skepticism and doubt is strongly advised. ASUS is making autonomy and end-user control very difficult with firmware, so the only safe solution with their products is to simply refuse to update the firmware if your system is functioning correctly and you want it to continue to function correctly. While it is a fairly common malpractice on turdbooks, to the best of my knowledge, ASUS is the only company blocking firmware downgrades on their enthusiast motherboards. So, I determined that having my PC components inside of a box didn't accomplish what I expected it to in terms of dust control. That being the case, I have gone back to the glorious convenience of using an open bench. I am glad I did not sell it already. Sometimes convenience trumps everything else. For me it usually does.

If they are from ASUS they do. If it's not the hardware, then it is the software. Any way you slice it, they are a sucky company that sells products that suck in at least one (generally more than one) way. LOL, some of you will probably remember me saying this when I had a 10900K just die for no reason. Well, the title of Roman's latest video is almost a direct quote from comments I made, and for exactly the same reason I made them. Being deliberately dishonest is the only path to a satisfactory outcome dealing with CPU and motherboard manufacturers.

6800 benchable, 6400 stable. Basically, the Apex only netted me 400 MT/s which was a miniscule improvement and a waste of time and money. The difference between 6400 and 6800 isn't anything great enough to be excited about. Considering it is a four slot motherboard that's actually more impressive than the Apex. I wasn't able to run M-Die stable above 6800 in any system. It's just weird that both of the ASUS motherboards max out to roughly the same clock speed whether using M- or A-die. It is as if they are unable to benefit from A-die because the limits are the same. M-die can run tighter timings than A-die, but M-die needs more voltage. A - all S - solutions U - unequivocally S - suck

I have not experienced any audio issues for a couple of years at least. I don't know anything about PipeWire. Never heard of it before. The last time I had audio issues was on X299. Everything worked fine but the onboard Realtek audio only functioned in 2-channel stereo. The additional channels we're not even detected on my 5.1 audio setup. It was obviously a driver issue, and it never got fixed. I moved on and now X299 is a thing of the past. One of the many things that makes Linux better than Windows, at least historically, is the minimal change and an "if it ain't broke don't fix it" approach to things. It kind of pisses me off that they've made a change for the sake of change, switching from Pulse to PipeWire. There's no reason to change so they shouldn't unless there is one. Change should only occur as a matter of necessity, not stupidity, boredom or curiosity.

DDR5 thermals are also a problem on desktops. At high clock speeds, requiring high voltage to function, so was DDR4, but DDR5 took that to a higher level. When temps breach 45-50°C is where a stable memory overclock becomes unstable. Naked DDR4 and DDR5 are pretty easy to cool with a fan blowing on the chips, but the heating blankets they facetiously refer to as "heatsinks" hurt more than they help. I am water cooling my memory now. That works great. If I detach the water block and have no fan blowing on the memory and start a memory stress/stability test everything is as smooth as silk until it reaches that temperature range, then the errors begin to appear. A few a first, but more as the temperature increases. Hynix A-die generally uses less voltage and runs a few degrees cooler than M-die, but A-die can't handle some of the timings being as tight as M-die allows. What makes A-die good is the higher clock speed makes up for the looser timings and higher latency.

So, I just bought a decent SP-rating 13900KS from a person on OC.net. Thanks @tps3443for calling my attention to it. I will be selling the Strix Z690-E and 13900KF and 32GB of Hynix M-die DDR5. If anyone is interested and wants first crack at the parts, drop me a PM. I will put them in the Marketplace unless someone snags it via PM.

A greedy joke. Those greedy jokers! 😆