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electrosoft

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Everything posted by electrosoft

  1. electrosoft
    After binning, tweaking, some further heatsink mods and of course Prema it stays absolutely near quiet low fans unless under meaningful load then the fans finally come alive. Surfing and such it stays even and near silent. I will say binning some 10900k's made a marked difference in Vcore, pull and temps at stock and with the same uv applied (-90). This 12900k I have pulls less than all of those 10900k's at stock (208w) and with an undervolt it pulls ~162w on average running CB23. Compared to the worse 12900k I tested that would bork on any UV and needed ~252w to pass stock. When I was binning several 12900k's it stood out from the other ones quickly in its pull and temps. Good 12900k: Bad 12900k:
  2. electrosoft
    So glad Max @ Hardware Numb3rs is back in action. DDR4 vs DDR5 in WoW. He's going to test the 5800X3D next in WoW:
  3. electrosoft
    Wow, the package drop is insane with that temp difference. I didn't know it was that extreme. Amazing. The jump to 385w from 5.4 -> 5.5 was at 14c too? ~100c is where I end my playtime adventures but you're right.
  4. electrosoft
    Ended up selling the SP94 12900ks to my bud with the SP84 12900ks. I don't even know I didn't connect the dots but I mentioned to him earlier I was going to either return it or sell it amongst a close knit group of us and he immediately wanted it. Since I drove to PA to see him the other day, he hot tailed it down here to scoop up the SP94 and we returned his SP84 to the local Best Buy and grabbed lunch. The CS we know even smirked and said, "Returning it?" Me? "Nope, he's returning his!" 😆 Picked up an iPad Mini 6 for the wife while I was there to replace her aging iPad Mini 4 with only 16GB which had rendered it near unusable and slow as molasses but it gave her almost 5yrs of service. All is well that ends well.
  5. electrosoft
    In his own way, Jufes @ Frame Chasers is really growing on me.... It is the type of content I like to watch.
  6. electrosoft
    What does it pull @ 5.4? Trying to see when (or if) it falls off the rails. My 12900ks pulled ~334w And in the shocker of them all, got my SP91 12900k to run 5.4 all core and it pulled ~330w (!). Both thermal throttling of course.... 12900ks SP94 "falls of the rails" at 5.4 and is basically equal to my 12900k SP91 with regard to pull and temps. 12900ks had 4 cores throttling vs 2 on the 12900k but the 12900k kept touching the sun more frequent with those two cores though on those (hence the lower CB23). 12900k needed 1.465 under load vs the 12900k 1.421 (pure Auto) 12900ks: 12900k SP91:
  7. electrosoft
    Seeing as how they created their own, proprietary GPUs and have soldered on key components down to the wifi, this is not shocking at all. How hard is it to leave a Win10 Taskbar mode option? I greatly despise the new Taskbar.
  8. electrosoft
    I'm glad you took the plunge. I know the X170KM-G didn't really pan out like you expected. Looking forward to a complete breakdown and analysis. If it is using the Insyder BIOS (which looking at screen shots it does), then it should have access to at a minimum thermal manipulation (Uv, PL, etc...) and most likely underclocking. I would be curious to see how a k class chip works in there with XTU and TS vs the silicon level locked down 12900. I don't worry too much about gsync these days so that's no loss.
  9. electrosoft
    I'll gladly relieve you of your Asrock OC Formula 6900xt for it. 😁 This. Many 12900k/s chips that won't hit 5.4 or 5.5 suddenly hit them with a delid and/or a CL. Throw a chiller in there and temps and pull drop accordingly.
  10. electrosoft
    Exactly. It happens to be an exceptionally cooler running, less hungry 12900k that only >=5.2 does the 12900ks show why it is a good binned 12900ks. Still, too rich for my blood since I'll never delid or WC it this time around. So back it goes to Best Buy. If anyone is interested in it since it is a pretty decent SP94, my exact price paid was 831.66 ($779.99 + tax). So $855 shipped non-cc CONUS. I'll be returning it Monday if no one wants it. In other words, it's out of here Monday one way or the other.
  11. electrosoft
    Asus BIOS. Leave MCE enabled (Do not turn on AI OC BIOS control) Turn on AI Optimizations for P cores (E cores will auto enable) Go under TVB enable +1 (or +2 if your system can handle it) enable both other options save and restart.
  12. electrosoft
    Clock for clock, the SP91 12900k draws much less than the 12900ks at 4.9 and 5.0. 5.1 they're close. 5.2 is where the 12900ks pulls ahead and stays WAY ahead at 5.3. 12900k can boost to 5.5 on a few cores. 12900ks boosts to 5.7 on three cores. 12900k can do 5.3 all core but 5.4 is a bust. I'm going to go back in and push LLC7 just to see. 12900ks can do 5.4 all core and prolly 5.5 but the thermals. A delid and a CL would have it singing.
  13. electrosoft
    Uninstalled the 12900ks SP94 and boxed it back up. My frugality has kicked in hardcore. Popped the 12900k SP91 back in under 1403. Letting Asus AI Optimizations do its thing with the SP91 12900k (I giggled at the reported 75% overclock):
  14. electrosoft
    My systems in their standard setup when working on them (open and ready). Left my old faithful Corsair Carbide Air 540 that is used as my "open bench" test rig. Right now it has an Asus Z590-A Prime using to test and bin 10900k's for the X170SM-G and some 11900k's when they sporadically come my way. To the right is the Phanteks Enthroo Pro II housing an Asus Z690 Strix D4 w/ 12900ks (most likely going to go frugal and switchback to my 12900k), Strix 3080 and stretching 2x8GB G.Skill sticks to 4266 G1 atm fishing for errors.
  15. electrosoft
    Much better than m SP81 and SP82 I had and the SP82 was actually a decent CPU. Once you get in there and do some auto stock runs at 4.9 -> 5.x (wherever it craps out), it will let you know what you're working with pull and temps wise. Could be a decent chip with a good IMC.
  16. electrosoft
    Congrats on the purchase and I am VERY interested in your results and assessment especially CPU thermal characteristics and PL along with a touch of CCC, XTU or TS to see how much it can be tamed and get a look around that BIOS.
  17. electrosoft
    ~10% drop in temps (73->66) = 7c drop. Fans are running slightly less. Maybe that little bit of headroom will let you push a higher OC than before for some benchmarks. See where it separates itself from old numbers >5.2 all core.
  18. electrosoft
    Considering the X170 is running dual 280w PSUs I'm inclined to agree its PL won't be as robust as previous DTRs. Binning definitely can play a major role in laptop thermals. I can't imagine sticking a poorly binned 12900k that not only pulls 240w+ at stock but is leaky to boot especially when you're working with the thermal and power limitations of the X15 versus the robust expectations of a desktop. I'm running a Silicon Lottery 10900k in my X170SM-G at the moment and under the same conditions it is pulling ~20w less than even the original binned ZtecPC 10900k and about 13 degrees cooler plus the ZtecPC 10900k is delidded and I'm running the SL 10900k as is. Delidded with a good Rockitcool or BartX (preferred) IHS I could bring that down even more. Being able to park the E-cores is a step in the right direction. I know Dsanke was able to partially unlock the stock Insyder BIOS for the X170 series. While it isn't anywhere near full tilt Prema on the X170SM-G it definitely gave you more options and control. I'm just really curious because my 12900k (sitting in a box atm while I run a 12900ks through the mill) is an exceptionally cool running 12900k. When i tested it against the other 3 12900k's I tried and saw the temps and pull my first thought was, "Pity Clevo isn't offering a 12th gen laptop. This would be perfect." With the wide variance of temps and pull of the 12900k, which is on par with the 11900k variance, binning a chip for use in this would be a high priority. I checked RJ and nothing but I didn't message them either to see if they're going to carry it as a barebones. I'm not sure if XMG is going to carry it? It is in many ways. But in the right hands the BIOS can most likely at least be unlocked a bit. If Prema was so inclined he could get in there and really fine tune it since it uses the Insyder or we could get a Dsanke partial unlock. I'm not sure what they can do about the lack of mxm given the current state of mxm. I'm curious what model of 3070ti this is since that timespy GPU score is sub 2080 Super stock. It almost feels like a hybrid model of a true DTR and a T&L but outside of the soldered GPU everything else looks like classic Clevo.
  19. electrosoft
    Yikes. Well, let's see how it pans out under real testing both bins and the IMC. I had an SP82 that was performing above an SP89 with a better IMC and clocks. What are the P and E cores and V/F curve?
  20. electrosoft
    The only knock on the AC LF II is the auto pump control that scales automatically depending on load. I wish they had separated the pump for its own header to leave it running at max if so desired. Of course the upside is one header controls everything. You might be like me and at the point of starting to slowly shift mentally to a custom loop. I don't ever see myself going full Mora, DD, chiller, etc... but a custom loop does provide much higher flow rates and bigger and better blocks for even better cooling. As for the case, I use a Phanteks Enthroo Pro 2 and the Corsair 7000D has 13lbs extra on it (yikes). Size wise they're about the same. I'm a gym rat too but I can imagine that 7000D loaded up and moving it around won't be fun. I'm a big proponent of if you're not happy return it. I'm not going to limp along with something that isn't providing the paid value for my uses and send it back from whence it came.
  21. electrosoft
    Awesome! Good luck!
  22. electrosoft
    This. Tweezers and jeweler's glasses did it for me along with a pair of the wife's cosmetic small scissors.
  23. electrosoft
    I hope 90w PL1 isn't the max as that is basically a mobile level PL. I can't see that being the max or even close for a desktop chip which even spec'd from Intel is 125w which is rarely adhered to. All previous Clevo Intel DTRs of the last 6 generations (6th -> 11th) had much much higher PLs ranging from 150w up to 200w. If you're looking to bin you will need a 12900 / 12900k(f) that doesn't so much overclock well put happens to have fantastic stock pull and thermals and can take a good UV. I've binned 4 12900k chips and the stock pull running CB23 as a baseline has ranged from 241w down to 208w right out of the box. Applying undervolts and/or reducing LLC had the 208w chip drawing down to 150w up to 162w (depending on heat) under load. Even my new SP94 12900ks can't get close to that bottoming out at ~173w set to 4.9/3.9 like a 12900k. I usually qualify chips on a desktop board (Asus normally) that lets me differentiate between which chips work best at stock and can run full tilt under simulated conditions. It's the same approach I took to hunt down good candidate 11900k and 10900k to work in the X170KM and X170SM so they wouldn't throttle and handle full runs. Let's say the BIOS is locked down. You put a better chip in there it will draw less by default. If XTU (or TS) works, you can then lower than even more with a UV. I would love to know the BIOS options. Coming from Eurocom (and hopefully who else offers it), I'd like to see some CPU control. Disabling e-cores would be great. We don't know how much XTU comes into play (or CCC) to apply an undervolt too. It is using the Insyde BIOS the same as the X170 series so it must likely can be unlocked to a degree. Looking at those benchmarks, especially Timespy, that system is scoring lower than my X170SM-G both in GPU and CPU multi and of course looking at the CB23 score that single thread score is righteous and multi is better. It looks to ship with a single 230w PSU so that is troubling as it touts supporting up to the 12900k. We definitely need more real world testing and info to see what it can and can not do and how its power distribution works in CPU only, GPU only and combination scenarios.
  24. electrosoft
    Last run before switching back to my SP91 12900k for some comparative tests. 12900ks SP94 can definitely do 5.4 all core but it will need a delid and better cooling to really make it shine as I'm thermal throttling on my 420mm AIO. Wish it was winter right now. A delid at the minimum will get it doing 5.4 all core on the 420mm AIO easy. Better cooling will just kick it up a notch to maybe 5.5. Core #1 is clearly the monster of the group.
  25. electrosoft
    Run versus pass real sustained stress tests are two different things. The rigor and qualifications Intel expects for 5.2 all core is much more rigorous than a lot of our "soft stable" settings we accept. That article was very much on point especially here: "Is the Core i9-12900KS ‘just’ a machine-binned 12900K? Yes, and in my opinion, it doesn't need to be anything else. Let me show you what a good chunk of them can do on standard water cooling and follow that up with multiple world records and gold trophies with liquid nitrogen cooling, no big deal." Tighter tolerances, expectations and performance. That is what you're paying for. Even a poorly binned 12900KS will still run 5.2 all core....hot and heavy sure but it will do it; just like the 12900k will follow the same track except 300mhz slower. I've just been running mine with AI OC enabled while I put it through its single core and WoW paces and seeing it handle 5.7ghz in wow on 2-3 cores no problem even raiding for hours on end which hits the CPU the hardest in WoW, temps sitting in the 60s after hours of play tickles my fancy. My SP91 12900k couldn't do it. Not even close. Watching it hit 2200+ single core in CB23 really shows you the architectural gap between it and 11th and especially 10th gen. Still, I can be frugal at heart so I am going to swap back in the 12900k SP91 later this week to see if the 12900ks is really worth the $831.66 it cost. My return window is till May 30th so it isn't like I don't have time. 🙂 One thing this 12900ks can't do is touch my SP91 at 4.9 settings. I can dial it down to ~174w CB23 well above the sub 160w the SP91 draws but I'll need to retest it with 1403. Agreed. this is what a delidded and relidded 10900k looks like with a BartX after I did it a few days ago with the nickel coated BartX. I do love the look of his IHS's. Temps are fantastic. For reference 12900ks SP94 letting Asus control the entire CPU narrative (for better or worse) AI Optimized, MCE Enabled, No AI BIOS control w/ +2 TVB enabled:
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