*Official Benchmark Thread* - Post it here or it didn't happen :D

[1610ftw]

1 hour ago, Mr. Fox said:

Photos can be deceiving, but it looks very clean and new in the photos. Hopefully it is accurate. The seller is a middle-aged woman (her photo is on her profile) with lots of positive feedback. This is not the type of item she normally sells, so I am hoping this came from her own HTPC and the statement is accurate rather than something she bought cheap to resell and a sales pitch that she invented.

 

Middle aged woman? That is unusual for an HTPC!

But it could be something harmless and she is selling it for a friend of family.

[electrosoft]

5 hours ago, Talon said:

 

I ordered one for my 5090. Not taking any chances this gen. 

 

1 hour ago, jaybee83 said:

 

yup also got newer gen cables on my watchlist for my TX-1600 PSU.

 

currently prepping my ebay auction for the 4090, very curious to see how the 12-pin socket held up, havent really checked it recently.....what could go wrong running it with a 1kW vbios as daily amirite 😛 😄 

 

I'll end up with one eventually for my MSI 1300AI_SuperDuper_Terminator_Matrix edition (we all know the naming is headed that way), but I'll run the tentacles for a bit at first.

 

 

 

[Papusan]

8 hours ago, Talon said:

 

I ordered one for my 5090. Not taking any chances this gen. 

 

You never know when you will be next on the melting list. But some  of the AIB partners have done the same what Galax did 2 years ago for the HOF. Asus followed up with the Matrix later. A chip to stop the melting. This should be the minimum with the stupid tiny power connector for <nvidia graphics. This should be a  minimum for a card that cost +1000$

 

Maybe stupid. But it is what it is. Bling bling, and not cheap but choices here home is low for faster 48GB stics. I never opted for Intel's failure (Arrow Lake) so I invest in old Raptor Lake. Higher speed memory means people will buy it in the used market when I move on (when, I don't know). I can just turn the RGB to all white. I wanted 2 x 24 GB Teamgroup T-Force Xtreem 8200 but as usual these have never been a choice here home. I have the nickel plated EK-Quantum Velocity² so it will fit well with the sticks https://www.proshop.no/RAM/GSkill-Trident-Z5-Royal-DDR5-8400-48GB-CL40-Dual-Channel-2-pcs-Intel-XMP-Soelv-med-RGB/3275216

 

 

Edit. The forum speed sucks @Reciever

 

Btw. I hope Trump  have the balls to  stop Nvidia....

 

Nvidia and SIA fire back at US gov's new export restrictions on AI GPUs to China

https://www.tomshardware.com/tech-industry/artificial-intelligence/nvidia-and-sia-fire-back-at-u-s-govs-new-export-restrictions-on-ai-gpus-to-china

[Mr. Fox]

2 hours ago, Papusan said:

 

You never know when you will be next on the melting list. But some  of the AIB partners have done the same what Galax did 2 years ago for the HOP. Asus followed up with the Matrix later. A chip to stop the melting. This should be the minimum with the stupid tiny power connector for <nvidia graphics.

 

Maybe stupid. But it is what it is. Bling bling, and not cheap but choices here home is low for faster 48GB stics. I never opted for Intel's failure (Arrow Lake) so I invest in old Raptor Lake. Higher speed memory means people will buy it in the used market when I move on (when, I don't know). I can just turn the RGB to all white. I wanted 2 x 24 GB Teamgroup T-Force Xtreem 8200 but as usual these have never been a choice here home. I have the nickel plated EK-Quantum Velocity² so it would fit well.  https://www.proshop.no/RAM/GSkill-Trident-Z5-Royal-DDR5-8400-48GB-CL40-Dual-Channel-2-pcs-Intel-XMP-Soelv-med-RGB/3275216

 

 

Edit. The forum speed sucks @Reciever

 

Btw. I hope Trump  have the balls to  stop Nvidia....

 

Nvidia and SIA fire back at US gov's new export restrictions on AI GPUs to China

https://www.tomshardware.com/tech-industry/artificial-intelligence/nvidia-and-sia-fire-back-at-u-s-govs-new-export-restrictions-on-ai-gpus-to-china

I am sure he will unless American traitors take drastic measures to block him or interfere in some way. There are special interest groups here that try to interfere any time something right, awesome or good is planned just because their every waking thought is driven by an irrational unconditional hatred for him and anyone that likes him. Kind of like the insane resistance to having secure borders and making illegal entry and occupancy of this country extremely difficult and punishing those that do and get caught. Remember how many hated him because he had the gonads and gall to correctly identify COVID as the "China virus" (even though it was developed in China).

[Papusan]

2 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

I am sure he will unless American traitors take drastic measures to block him or interfere in some way. There are special interest groups here that try to interfere any time something right, awesome or good is planned just because their every waking thought is driven by an irrational unconditional hatred for him and anyone that likes him. Kind of like the insane resistance to having secure borders and making illegal entry and occupancy of this country extremely difficult and punishing those that do and get caught. Remember how many hated him because he had the gonads and gall to correctly identify COVID as the "China virus" (even though it was developed in China).

 

This is in fact great news. People buying less jokebooks is a good thing. And less e-waste. And I hope Microsoft see the paint on the wall. No one need more modern trash (to be able to  use win 11).

 

 

The problem? The U.S. doesn’t have a computer-manufacturing industry. Since it does not, retailers and consumers would be forced to pay the tariffs, regardless. The CTA estimates that U.S. consumers would instead curtail their spending dramatically, reducing laptop purchases by about 44 percent.

 

https://www.pcworld.com/article/2573327/tariffs-could-cause-tech-prices-to-skyrocket-cta-warns-again.html

[1610ftw]

5 hours ago, Papusan said:

 

This is in fact great news. People buying less jokebooks is a good thing. And less e-waste. And I hope Microsoft see the paint on the wall. No one need more modern trash (to be able to  use win 11).

 

 

The problem? The U.S. doesn’t have a computer-manufacturing industry. Since it does not, retailers and consumers would be forced to pay the tariffs, regardless. The CTA estimates that U.S. consumers would instead curtail their spending dramatically, reducing laptop purchases by about 44 percent.

 

https://www.pcworld.com/article/2573327/tariffs-could-cause-tech-prices-to-skyrocket-cta-warns-again.html

 

For socketed laptops they could make an exception and cut the tariffs in half (CPU AND GPU) 😄

[1610ftw]

17 hours ago, electrosoft said:

 

I like that it looks much thicker than most of the other bigger laptops too so hopefully better cooling along with a 400w PSU!

 

Asus gives you a *little* control over the UV in the BIOS on their gaming laptops. Nobody has approached MSI's level yet though outside of custom BIOSes. Hopefully Gigabyte or another steps up and even on a laptop chipset implements near desktop chipset controls like MSI.

 

 

 

The Gigabyte indeed looks quite thick for a device that is planned to come in at under 3kg - if it does that will probably mean that some corners have been cut or that they used a lot of plastic and/or magnesium. Time will tell and I am very tempted to get one for testing.

 

That being said I still hope that MSI will have the balls to go socketed again but from what I gather they fear the backlash of all the morons complaining about the laptops getting taller and a bit heavier because of it. As we are talking about maybe 4 mm height increase at most and considering that laptops can be wedge shaped i do not see much of an issue here so maybe they will come around for a kind of ultimate model in the future.

 

And of course the other hope is TongFang / Uniwill where @Prema continues to do great work for his partners but they better start offering a true 18" DTR chassis, especially now that they even have separate CPU and GPU boards that could be the beginning of something big if they play their cards right and it seems that this is also how they will acheive both AMD and Intel support in their new 16" top of the line chassis:

 

Sadly Tom from Schenker / XMG also writes this:

 

[Mr. Fox]

Smoke and mirrors... AI generated fake multi-frames is not "performance" LOL. It's a software snowjob. NVIDIA has never looked more sneaky and dishonest than they do now. They need to compare next gen to current gen with no frame generation, just bare metal without any stupid AI crap or silly software manipulation.

[electrosoft]

2 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

Smoke and mirrors... AI generated fake multi-frames is not "performance" LOL. It's a software snowjob. NVIDIA has never looked more sneaky and dishonest than they do now. They need to compare next gen to current gen with no frame generation, just bare metal without any stupid AI crap or silly software manipulation.

 

I'm on the fence about this.

 

If we look at it from a traditional raster perspective, then it is all software tomfoolery.

 

But if we look at tensor cores and AI it is another way to generate frames vs the traditional method and they meet somewhere in the middle to give an overall boost to performance.

 

The problem right now is the latency and image quality issues DLSS/FG presents that does admittedly keep improving each generation.

 

*IF* Nvidia (and AMD and Intel) get to a point they can use upscaling and fg integrated with traditional raster and present an image quality and and latency on par with just traditional rendering techniques, that would sufficiently move the industry forward.

 

For someone like you @Mr. Fox and anyone who benchmarks (present company included), that has to translate into standardized benchmarking and universal measurements where the hybrid approach becomes as ubiquitous as raster is today.

 

Unfortunately that day is still far off. 😞

 

----

 

But I do agree Nvidia, AMD and Intel need to present every scenario. I have no problems promoting DLSS and FG, but they also need to be truthful in pure raster performance. I remember the 4090 raster performance being bandied about because it was a significant uplift over the 3090. I guess because whispers keep pointing to a more "modest" uplift this cycle over the 4090 with the 5090 it isn't as front and center.

 

As you trickle down the stack it looks like it is going to be even worse and maybe even a modest 10-15% for let's say the 5070 over the 4070 Super.

 

It also makes sense why pricing stayed the same or even went down especially with the 9070xt reportedly on the heels of a 7900xtx but some pricing says it might come in at $600. That will definitely keep Nvidia honest in the mid market while AMD and Intel keep Nvidia honest in the entry market.

 

Unfortunately they have absolutely no answer for the 5080 and especially the 5090 which even with a ~30% uplift just extends the Nvidia's lead even moreso.

 

[Etern4l]

16 hours ago, Papusan said:

Btw. I hope Trump  have the balls to  stop Nvidia....

 

Sure, that's why he tried to stop the TikTok ban. Look at his "efficiency advisor" and what his stance and dealings around that are. Believe it or not but it's actually all about money for the billionaires.

[tps3443]

On 1/10/2025 at 9:15 AM, Mr. Fox said:

I have never been interested in Founders Edition GPUs. I have always viewed them as a last resort option. I don't like how they look or how they are made. The way this new multi-piece 5090 FE is made I would only own one if I got it for free. That looks like an absolute abortion and I wouldn't touch it with a 10-foot pole. I think it takes the cake as the dumbest design I have ever seen. Designed by idiots, and I'd feel like an idiot buying one.

Stupidity is why we can't have nice things. PC builds like this are disgusting. Depending on what kind of mood I am in, just looking at pictures can trigger a negative response. It shows how shallow and hollow things have become. I can't relate to the notion that anyone would actually think something like that looks nice and can't think of anything nice to say about it. Juvenile crap.

I had no idea that case was that big. It will be really nice when it is done. Is there any electrolysis between copper and stainless? That would be the only concern to consider about mixing the radiator material types. I am not sure if stainless radiators dissipate the heat the same, better or worse than copper. To be honest, I didn't know stainless was even an option. I have never heard of one until just now. I have only seen copper, brass and aluminum and I try to stay as far away from aluminum as possible. Is the whole thing stainless steel or only the outer frame for aesthetics?

 

I don't understand why distro plates are so darned expensive. All of them are. Even the least expensive off-brand Chinese distro plates are way too expensive. I think most of them are very nice and look good, but I've never owned one because I have always viewed them too expensive for something primarily for aesthetics. In a smaller case with space for pumps and reservoirs being limited I can see where having one might be necessary in lieu of an AIO due to not having adequate space for pump(s) and reservoirs. Singularity makes some truly amazing things. Some of the nicest-looking things, in fact. But I will likely never own any of their products because I am not willing to pay the high-premium prices they charge for something only because I think that it looks nice.

 

It’s a big case at almost 67 pounds. I think It’s from all of the metal with no plastic anywhere in sight. Even the HDD racks are all steel. 
 

I’m trying to get a discount code from Singularity to save some money. But yeah distros are a bit expensive. But so are most pumps+reservoirs anyways. 
 

These custom case distros from Singularity are made by hand and use real flat custom gaskets and not O-Rings, nice tool steel stainless hardware and engineering to be case specific. The one I want has mounting for dual D5’s for $260.00-$280 which isn’t too bad at all. It’s a reservoir, and distro, and a pump all in one. But some are ridiculous. EKWB makes a Distro for my Lian Li V3000+ Plus and it’s only single D5 distro and it’s $589.99. This pricing is pure ridiculous lol. I think a distro for a case shouldn’t exceed the MSRP of the case it goes in lol. 

On 1/10/2025 at 2:50 PM, Talon said:

 

I ordered one for my 5090. Not taking any chances this gen. 

 

So all 5090’s require 2x Gen5 PCIe cables? Do you think I will have a chance of getting a 5090 on launch day if I’m ordering online? I know you typically always get items on launch day. But I’m pretty terrible with this stuff. 

[Mr. Fox]

Well, the Gene is arriving later than expected. The shipper must have gone on vacation a few days because it stopped moving for 4 days once it reached the US. Now it is expected this coming Friday instead of Monday. ☹️ I hope I love the Gene. Looking to grab the X870E Apex when it becomes available, but hoping the Gene will make me happy in the meanwhile.
 

I went ahead and started the return/refund process for the X870E Carbon. Nice motherboard other than being 4-DIMM (big strike against it) but very mediocre firmware support. If I were a typical gamer type I'm sure I would love it to death, but being more into overclocking it leaves a lot to be desired. MSI doesn't seem to pursue my niche as hard as some of their competitors do. They still need to fix the bugs in their firmware though. Every update seems to help one thing but throws something else off a bit. Running the latest beta BIOS fixed the broken Per CCD overclocking option, but on this new BIOS I have weird random glitches like both of the onboard NICs not being detected and once in a while when I boot everything is larger size like CSM mode is enabled even though it is not. Both of those glitches go away with a reboot, but putting up with nonsense like that is for the birds.

 

Edit: Oh, a third glitch I just remembered that it does is the screen image in the BIOS randomly is the wrong size (not full screen) with fuzzy text and missing UEFI wallpaper. It generally coincides with everything being larger on the screen during POST like CSM is enabled even when it is not. Rebooting almost always straightens it out on the first try, but it is still inexcusable. MSI has released a ton of BIOS updates since I purchased this. It seems like their firmware team doesn't really know what they're doing. I've heard AMD firmware is easier to screw up than Intel because of all the extra crap AMD requires them to include in the BIOS. Whether true or not I don't know. Just wondering if that is part of why they (MSI) keep missing the mark.

 

[jaybee83]

1 hour ago, tps3443 said:

So all 5090’s require 2x Gen5 PCIe cables? Do you think I will have a chance of getting a 5090 on launch day if I’m ordering online? I know you typically always get items on launch day. But I’m pretty terrible with this stuff. 

so far, all 5090 models including the FE only have one power connector, unfortunately...

 

getting a 5090 on launch day will require, as usual, a bit of luck and some elbow grease. best to take at least a half day off to do some thorough gpu hunting, whether it be in person or online 😄

[tps3443]

24 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

Well, the Gene is arriving later than expected. The shipper must have gone on vacation a few days because it stopped moving for 4 days once it reached the US. Now it is expected this coming Friday instead of Monday. ☹️ I hope I love the Gene. Looking to grab the X870E Apex when it becomes available, but hoping the Gene will make me happy in the meanwhile.
 

I went ahead and started the return/refund process for the X870E Carbon. Nice motherboard other than being 4-DIMM (big strike against it) but very mediocre firmware support. If I were a typical gamer type I'm sure I would love it to death, but being more into overclocking it leaves a lot to be desired. MSI doesn't seem to pursue my niche as hard as some of their competitors do. They still need to fix the bugs in their firmware though. Every update seems to help one thing but throws something else off a bit. Running the latest beta BIOS fixed the broken Per CCD overclocking option, but on this new BIOS I have weird random glitches like both of the onboard NICs not being detected and once in a while when I boot everything is larger size like CSM mode is enabled even though it is not. Both of those glitches go away with a reboot, but putting up with nonsense like that is for the birds.

 

Edit: Oh, a third glitch I just remembered that it does is the screen image in the BIOS randomly is the wrong size (not full screen) with fuzzy text and missing UEFI wallpaper. It generally coincides with everything being larger on the screen during POST like CSM is enable even when it is not. Rebooting almost always straightens it out on the first try, but it is still inexcusable. MSI has released a ton of BIOS updates since I purchased this. It seems like their firmware team doesn't really know what they're doing. I've heard AMD firmware is easier to screw up than Intel because of all the extra crap AMD requires them to include in the BIOS. Whether true or not I don't know. Just wondering if that is part of why they (MSI) keep missing the mark.

 

I have CSM enabled on my Dominus. I wish I didn’t have to have it on. The post screen is ugly, and much longer load times. But, if I disable CSM and run regular UEFI, my Bluetooth does not work in Windows 11. I really need Bluetooth because I own some Bose QC45’s, and also use a wireless mouse and Xbox controller sometimes. Or quick file transfers, and enabling hotspot and things like that are useful. 

 

21 minutes ago, jaybee83 said:

so far, all 5090 models including the FE only have one power connector, unfortunately...

 

getting a 5090 on launch day will require, as usual, a bit of luck and some elbow grease. best to take at least a half day off to do some thorough gpu hunting, whether it be in person or online 😄

I’m thinking about getting one! But now I’m seeing their real performance gains seem not so amazing. I guess it’s like 20% in rasterization, and sometimes as low as 8% depending how high the 4090 power level and clocks are. Of course the best feature set will be DLSS 4.0, double frame gen and things like that. I know these features are gonna be good! And they will allow the 5090 to be a BRUTE in 4K/120HZ gaming. But my 4090 is already amazing. I’m really torn. I’ll probably get one. And if I don’t absolutely LOVE it, I will just return it. 
 

I never had any issues with a single PCIe Gen 5 cable even with 675 watts rolling. But I am using a good quality Gen 5 PSU. This amazes me, because we could never do this in the past with our 8 pin PCIe power supplies. I know if I ran a RTX 3090 FE, and I plugged in one single PCIe 8 pin, and then plugged both of those 8 pins in to it the 350 watt RTX3099 this system would power off using a completely stock 3090 with 350w TGP, or reboot due to load. We would have to plug in (2) 8 pins in separate ports on the PSU, and run separate 8 pins to the 3090 for reliable gaming. 

[jaybee83]

8 minutes ago, tps3443 said:

I have CSM enabled on my Dominus. I wish I didn’t have to have it on. The post screen is ugly, and much longer load times. But, if I disable CSM and run regular UEFI, my Bluetooth does not work in Windows 11. I really need Bluetooth because I own some Bose QC45’s, and also use a wireless mouse and Xbox controller sometimes. Or quick file transfers, and enabling hotspot and things like that are useful. 

 

I’m thinking about getting one! But now I’m seeing their real performance gains seem not so amazing. I guess it’s like 20% in rasterization, and sometimes as low as 8% depending how high the 4090 power level and clocks are. Of course the best feature set will be DLSS 4.0, double frame gen and things like that. I know these features are gonna be good! And they will allow the 5090 to be a BRUTE in 4K/120HZ gaming. But my 4090 is already amazing. I’m really torn. I’ll probably get one. And if I don’t absolutely LOVE it, I will just return it. 
 

I never had any issues with a single PCIe Gen 5 cable even with 675 watts rolling. But I am using a good quality Gen 5 PSU. This amazes me, because we could never do this in the past with our 8 pin PCIe power supplies. I know if I ran a RTX 3090 FE, and I plugged in one single PCIe 8 pin, and then plugged both of those 8 pins in to it the 350 watt RTX3099 this system would power off using a completely stock 3090 with 350w TGP, or reboot due to load. We would have to plug in (2) 8 pins in separate ports on the PSU, and run separate 8 pins to the 3090 for reliable gaming. 

 

yeah, just based on RT / CUDA cores, max. theoretical jump would be +33%. the rest will depend on the memory speed sensitivity of the respective software (5090 at +78% bandwidth vs. 4090) and the overclocking capabilities of the 5090. im hoping that the stock clocks do not point towards less maximum clocks, but rather the physical restraints of the dual slot FE design. Heres to hoping that we can use the humongous third party coolers for better clocks! 🙂 

[tps3443]

1 hour ago, jaybee83 said:

 

yeah, just based on RT / CUDA cores, max. theoretical jump would be +33%. the rest will depend on the memory speed sensitivity of the respective software (5090 at +78% bandwidth vs. 4090) and the overclocking capabilities of the 5090. im hoping that the stock clocks do not point towards less maximum clocks, but rather the physical restraints of the dual slot FE design. Heres to hoping that we can use the humongous third party coolers for better clocks! 🙂 

I hope it’s a good launch with inventory available. The strix models will probably be $2,500 or $2,700 with tax no doubt lol. I think this is where the $3K predictions come from. 

 

 

Are you going to buy an FE model? I think I’d like a Strix OC model or something really good. I’ve learned my lesson with buying one just to get one due to availability and pricing. I really want to be one and done!! 

 

Ideally it’s going in my Lian Li V3000+ Plus, on air possibly on water and staying. 

[electrosoft]

Finally had time today to get the 9800X3D + x870e Crosshair Hero (or as @jaybee83 would call it "The Peasant Edition"  🤣) up and running in the test case.

 

Unlike before, the A-die 2x32GB G.Skill sticks booted no problem even on the 303 BIOS (launch BIOS). Updated to 706 (below in the pic).

 

One problem is it takes four and a half minutes to post and eventually start booting off the SSD. I actually timed it because it takes forever every time even at stock JEDEC. I swapped in a pair of Crucial 6400 sticks and the posted within 30 seconds. I even went in and set them to EXPO II as a quick test and again....30 seconds.  Never had these types of issues with the G.skill sticks on my x670e Carbon like I have across now 3 Asus boards (B650, x670e, x870e) with 9800X3D but at least they post but I'm not going to fight with them. I'll just stick with the Crucial 6400 sticks for now while I get everything up and running for testing and tune them first along with the controller and go from there.

 

SP112 but it makes no difference with the 9800X3D really.  I have yet to see a 9800X3D that can't hit 5450+. SP113 I returned because of the bad memory controller hit it no problem while limping along at 5200 on the M-die 2x16GB memory for stability an unable to go over 2000 fclk. It comes down to the memory controller. That's all I care about. If it's decent, I'll keep it and cancel my Amazon order which is due in 10 days. If not, I'll roll the dice.

 

As much as I like the Lian Li for testing, the AM4/5 mounting system is atrocious. Instead of a real mounting system like on Intel or even many other vendors that have you remove the AM4/5 stock clamps, they use a terrible side clamping mount for the stock brackets all AM4/5 motherboards ship with and tension screws to lock it into place.

 

 

 

 

 

[Papusan]

 

 

The HOF is probably dead because of the U:S AI war with China. We all will be stuck with what the different AIB partners offer of silicon lottery and firmware....

Is this the end of the GALAX HOF series?

[electrosoft]

Kudos to Asus for moving away from trying to auto install ArmoryCrate and now offering to install Asus DriverHub which is really just a service link to a webpage that makes installing and updating drivers very straight forward and easy without all the added bloat of ArmoryCrate if you go that route.

 

Usually I just manually install the drivers to avoid AC, but I gave this a whirl (since this is just a test/tuning install that will eventually be nuked) and found their new approach actually acceptable. Now all they need to do is allow rudimentary RGB controls in the BIOS.....

 

 

[Raiderman]

6 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

Well, the Gene is arriving later than expected. The shipper must have gone on vacation a few days because it stopped moving for 4 days once it reached the US. Now it is expected this coming Friday instead of Monday. ☹️ I hope I love the Gene. Looking to grab the X870E Apex when it becomes available, but hoping the Gene will make me happy in the meanwhile.
 

I went ahead and started the return/refund process for the X870E Carbon. Nice motherboard other than being 4-DIMM (big strike against it) but very mediocre firmware support. If I were a typical gamer type I'm sure I would love it to death, but being more into overclocking it leaves a lot to be desired. MSI doesn't seem to pursue my niche as hard as some of their competitors do. They still need to fix the bugs in their firmware though. Every update seems to help one thing but throws something else off a bit. Running the latest beta BIOS fixed the broken Per CCD overclocking option, but on this new BIOS I have weird random glitches like both of the onboard NICs not being detected and once in a while when I boot everything is larger size like CSM mode is enabled even though it is not. Both of those glitches go away with a reboot, but putting up with nonsense like that is for the birds.

 

Edit: Oh, a third glitch I just remembered that it does is the screen image in the BIOS randomly is the wrong size (not full screen) with fuzzy text and missing UEFI wallpaper. It generally coincides with everything being larger on the screen during POST like CSM is enable even when it is not. Rebooting almost always straightens it out on the first try, but it is still inexcusable. MSI has released a ton of BIOS updates since I purchased this. It seems like their firmware team doesn't really know what they're doing. I've heard AMD firmware is easier to screw up than Intel because of all the extra crap AMD requires them to include in the BIOS. Whether true or not I don't know. Just wondering if that is part of why they (MSI) keep missing the mark.

 

Exactly how I've felt about my X670 Carbon. Buggy as he'll, and there is always something wrong. I've never been happy with it.

[tps3443]

Man! I’d love a 5090 with a factory installed waterblock!!!! 😱😱😱 I hope they’re not some crazy price. $2299 would be very reasonable. 😬 Hopefully not something dumb like $2,599 or $2750 🫠 I’m already nuts for considering this. 

 

 

[electrosoft]

7 hours ago, jaybee83 said:

so far, all 5090 models including the FE only have one power connector, unfortunately...

 

getting a 5090 on launch day will require, as usual, a bit of luck and some elbow grease. best to take at least a half day off to do some thorough gpu hunting, whether it be in person or online 😄

 

Yep, they release them in waves especially on BB so you might as well settle in for at least 3-5 hrs.

 

2 hours ago, Raiderman said:

Exactly how I've felt about my X670 Carbon. Buggy as he'll, and there is always something wrong. I've never been happy with it.

 

I really had no problems with my x670e Carbon except the 60 second post. It did everything I asked of it and supported those A-die 2x32GB better than all three Asus boards I tried. I did have to RMA my original open box though when it completely died on me.

 

Are you going to switch boards to a different make or ride out the Carbon?

 

1 hour ago, tps3443 said:

Man! I’d love a 5090 with a factory installed waterblock!!!! 😱😱😱 I hope they’re not some crazy price. $2299 would be very reasonable. 😬 Hopefully not something dumb like $2,599 or $2750 🫠 I’m already nuts for considering this. 

 

 

 

I just look at the 4090 market with a base price of $1600 and shift everything up by $400. If a card was $2000 (like a Strix), a similar card will be $2400 minimum. Suprim Liquid was $1730, so I'm expecting at least $2130 and wouldn't be surprised to see it at $2199.99.

 

The wild card is the new top dog Astral cards from Asus. I expect them to be $2599.99. Toss in sales tax and that is  ~2775.00. Even a $1999.99 card like the FE is going to be ~2132.49 after tax. For these outlandish prices, if I go 5090, I won't settle for a model I do not want and just pick up because that's all that is available. It will be an FE, Suprim or if I'm feeling incredibly stupid an Asus Astral.

[Mr. Fox]

10 hours ago, tps3443 said:

Man! I’d love a 5090 with a factory installed waterblock!!!! 😱😱😱 I hope they’re not some crazy price. $2299 would be very reasonable. 😬 Hopefully not something dumb like $2,599 or $2750 🫠 I’m already nuts for considering this. 

Reasonable compared to what? Compared to how bad they could screw us if they decided to? There is absolutely nothing reasonable about $2000+ for a GPU. Period. It's retarded. We're getting effed over because they know they can. We are partly to blame because we've continued allowing juvenile passions to drive poor judgment as consumers. The days where we could identify value and reasonableness are pretty much gone. I do not believe it will ever be good again. We should expect that getting screwed over real bad is normal, and ASUS and NVIDIA are our biggest abusers. You have to decide how much abuse you are willing to tolerate to own what you want.  Lay down, apply Lidocaine liberally, followed by a water soluble lubricant. If you lay on your back and pull your knees to your chest it will be less painful. No, it is not a sign they love you.

13 hours ago, Papusan said:

The HOF is probably dead because of the U:S AI war with China. We all will be stuck with what the different AIB partners offer of silicon lottery and firmware....

Is this the end of the GALAX HOF series?

That would definitely be a first-world problem. The Galax HOF may as well not even exist for me because it's not available. Their market is limited. Acquiring one is not only difficult if you live in the US, but also so absurdly expensive that it makes no sense to even try. The differences that make it better are not consistent with the price and it comes at too high of a cost to be worthwhile. 

 

It's unfortunate that we had a 4-year setback with Sleepy Joe and Kameltoe. If we (the US and our allies) do not act swiftly to put China in their place and strip them of their ability to be finanicially sound and a nation of relevance in the world they hate so much we can count on a post-modern holocaust replay. China's intentions for the rest of the world are dark and nefarious. The CCP's  extreme wickedness starts at home and is evident by how they (mis)treat their own. We need to make the most important things on Xi Jinping's mind having electricity and running water, worry about how he is going to avoid starving to death and how to evade assassination. 

[tps3443]

1 hour ago, Mr. Fox said:

Reasonable compared to what? Compared to how bad they could screw us if they decided to? There is absolutely nothing reasonable about $2000+ for a GPU. Period. It's retarded. We're getting effed over because they know they can. We are partly to blame because we've continued allowing juvenile passions to drive poor judgment as consumers. The days where we could identify value and reasonableness are pretty much gone. I do not believe it will ever be good again. We should expect that getting screwed over real bad is normal, and ASUS and NVIDIA are our biggest abusers. You have to decide how much abuse you are willing to tolerate to own what you want.  Lay down, apply Lidocaine liberally, followed by a water soluble lubricant. If you lay on your back and pull your knees to your chest it will be less painful. No, it is not a sign they love you.

Well, I’m just hoping we can find some sort of pre-waterblocked 5090 that is not much more than $2K. The problem is AIB’s are wanting to overcharge. If the premium 4080 Super is $999.00, then the crappiest and cheapest AIB’s are starting their price at $1,050.
 

The 5090 FE has gone fully moduler, the GPU boards can be quickly repaired from the looks of it. It almost looks like the GPU+GDDR7 are sitting on a standalone master board. And if someone broke the PCIe slot or crushes the whole thing it would be a really cheap fix. Unless I’m mistaken here. 
 

Other AIB’s may not have gone that route. So the FE does seem to be some interesting engineering. While AIB’s are still going to cost more than the 5090FE models.

 

 

[Mr. Fox]

14 hours ago, Raiderman said:

Exactly how I've felt about my X670 Carbon. Buggy as he'll, and there is always something wrong. I've never been happy with it.

One of the most positive things I can find to say about the X870E Carbon is that it doesn't suck as bad as the X870E Taichi. It's certainly not the worst motherboard I have ever owned. I haven't had MSI motherboards kill multiple CPUs (so far) like ASUS. But, it feels like their efforts are kind of half-assed  and it seems pretty evident that their firmware team doesn't know what they are doing.

  

2 hours ago, tps3443 said:

Well, I’m just hoping we can find some sort of pre-waterblocked 5090 that is not much more than $2K. The problem is AIB’s are wanting to overcharge. If the premium 4080 Super is $999.00, then the crappiest and cheapest AIB’s are starting their price at $1,050.
 

The 5090 FE has gone fully moduler, the GPU boards can be quickly repaired from the looks of it. It almost looks like the GPU+GDDR7 are sitting on a standalone master board. And if someone broke the PCIe slot or crushes the whole thing it would be a really cheap fix. Unless I’m mistaken here. 
 

Other AIB’s may not have gone that route. So the FE does seem to be some interesting engineering. While AIB’s are still going to cost more than the 5090FE models.

Other than the HydroCopper, I don't really care for how most factory waterblocks are made or how they look. Most are very garish and tacky-looking. I'd rather go with aftermarket personally. Having the stock air cooler will make the card easier to sell when you are done with it. Waterblocked GPUs are hard to sell because the market/interest level in water cooling is low and a general lack of technical knowledge and skill among most gamers.

 

The design of the 5090 FE is unacceptable and I hope the AIBs refuse to follow that model. I would avoid buying a piece of crap made like the 5090 FE.  Don't hold your breath about repairs. Being modular doesn't mean any of us would be able to buy any of the parts. All it would do it help the Green Gobin cut down on RMA/warranty repair costs and further maximize their bottom line. They wouldn't be repairing anything, just swapping out any small parts if they fail. We can be confident that NVIDIA is doing only what best serves the interest of NVIDIA, not what is best for the dumb-dumbs that buy their goofy video cards and not because it is a smart idea for end users. First it was the 12VHPWR abortion, now a modular GPU nightmare. 

16 hours ago, Papusan said:

That video from Steve is one of his best parodies of how obnoxious, absurd and deliberately misleading the tech industry has become. His use of sarcasm was masterful if not tongue-in-cheek. The reason all of the marketing mumbo-jumbo and lies are so effective is becase so many of the people buying the products are Kool-Aid drinkers that are about as dumb as a box of rocks.

 

If PNY gives Vince as much latitude and autonomy to do things right that EVGA did, PNY K|INGP|N cards might end up being the only option worth buying. Quite a paradigm shift and potentially a path to market domination for PNY.

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Totally absurd design...

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Very sad to see such devastating losses. Nice job to all of the woke CA "leaders" that made this tragedy possible. Their DEI focus and defunding efforts made all the difference.