*Official Benchmark Thread* - Post it here or it didn't happen :D

[ryan]

whew pretty cool that you guys have uses for your multiple laptops....pretty interesting read.....I personally might just buy a desktop and keep this laptop for a few years..I am thinking of buying a TCL 6 series 120hz 4k tv and  gettings a 4k series desktop as my main rig and when I want to sit on the couch use this

[Clamibot]

3 hours ago, ryan said:

whew pretty cool that you guys have uses for your multiple laptops....pretty interesting read.....I personally might just buy a desktop and keep this laptop for a few years..I am thinking of buying a TCL 6 series 120hz 4k tv and  gettings a 4k series desktop as my main rig and when I want to sit on the couch use this

 

Yep it's pretty awesome to be able to have one device purposed for a specific set of tasks. Usually we end up having multiple laptops because we keep our old ones for something else after replacing them with something newer.

 

It's always nice to have one device that does everything though. At some point you start getting clutter because of the sheer number of devices you amass over the years. I do prefer keeping my old machines though, because it means my newer stuff will last longer since it will get used less than it otherwise would.

 

Intelligent usage balancing across your devices does wonders for their lifespans. I'm always paranoid that something is going to break on me the next day.😆🤣😂

[electrosoft]

When you want to SLI some EVGA 3090ti's.....whew:

 

 

[Mr. Fox]

2 hours ago, electrosoft said:

When you want to SLI some EVGA 3090ti's.....whew:

 

 

Just happened to catch this before heading for bed. If that fella can afford $4500+ for two of those graphics cards and crazy expensive motherboard, certainly he can afford a better case to house them. Or, maybe he can't because he doesn't have any money left, LOL 

[Mr. Fox]

 

[electrosoft]

12900ks in stock at best buy:

 

https://www.bestbuy.com/site/intel-core-i9-12900ks-12th-generation-16-8p-8e-24-thread-2-5ghz-5-5-ghz-turbo-socket-lga1700-unlocked-desktop-processor/6501867.p?skuId=6501867

 

I'm not sure you're going to get magic but at least at the min you won't get a super dud compared to some of the absolute dog 12900k chips I've seen. I'm watching reviews now to get some early indicators but even the few 12900ks's that showed up on ocn weren't lighting the world on fire but apparently they need a BIOS update to adjust for their V/F curves so SP ratings aren't valid without it.

 

 

[electrosoft]

Monster binning spreadsheet including lots of 12900ks data:

 

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1RbxEuee-BphG3ukNNgwwl_uQ6PZwjXCQtg60m3ur4NU/edit#gid=413101295

 

One early calculation is a KS_SP == K_SP-10; but we'll see ( IE KS SP90 would equal K SP100) ..

 

Average P core = ~98

Min / Max SP = 84 /99

Min / Max P = 88 / 106

 

Unless you dial up your 12900k to ks specs it is hard to compare but as always I'd set baselines and start auto LLC3 and force 4.9 -> 5.5 (or till fail) all core and do some CB23 runs and see how much it pulls. You can glom all over SP ratings to a point, but the proof is in the pudding when you set hard numbers and put it under load and see what it is guzzling and how much heat it is putting out.

 

It will sort itself out over the next few weeks but early numbers are ho hum at best.

 

 

 

 

[Mr. Fox]

52 minutes ago, electrosoft said:

Monster binning spreadsheet including lots of 12900ks data:

 

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1RbxEuee-BphG3ukNNgwwl_uQ6PZwjXCQtg60m3ur4NU/edit#gid=413101295

 

One early calculation is a KS_SP == K_SP-10; but we'll see ( IE KS SP90 would equal K SP100) ..

 

Average P core = ~98

Min / Max SP = 84 /99

Min / Max P = 88 / 106

 

Unless you dial up your 12900k to ks specs it is hard to compare but as always I'd set baselines and start auto LLC3 and force 4.9 -> 5.5 (or till fail) all core and do some CB23 runs and see how much it pulls. You can glom all over SP ratings to a point, but the proof is in the pudding when you set hard numbers and put it under load and see what it is guzzling and how much heat it is putting out.

 

It will sort itself out over the next few weeks but early numbers are ho hum at best.

I did not really expect the KS to be a different product as much as a binned sample of an existing product. So, there is some basis for disappointment. However, taking the glass is half full view, buying a KS might be the best way to avoid being dealt a tragic ticket in the silicon lottery. That's not a bad thing per se, but paying $200 extra for something that isn't as good or better than a superior 12900K silicon sample is where the basis for disappointment comes in. It's more like damage control  or loss prevention than an upgrade. You have to decide whether it is better to roll the dice on a K and hope for a win, or pay extra for something that is, at least, pretty good... with potential to be better than pretty good. If the chips are now being culled in favor of KS branding, then the chances of winning with a K might be drying up as old stock gets sold and replaced with stock representing the culled chips that didn't make the KS cut.

[Papusan]

On 4/3/2022 at 7:08 PM, Mr. Fox said:

 

It's a hell of a note to pay extra for something that is supposed to be awesome only to find out you bought a fancy piece of dung. 

Fancy sell. Bling bling and exotic cooling is worthless if the cards get chips from the bottom barrel.

 

When AIO solution is wasted money for OC'ing.... Why offer good cooling on cards if they pair it with bad binned chips?

 

The biggest gimp on this card so far is the GDDR6X memory overclocking, which I was limited to pushing +1200MHz into it (22.8Gbps or so) compared to the MSI RTX 3090 Ti SUPRIM X which can easily have +1800MHz pumped into it pushing it past 24Gbps... incredible stuff. Not stable in every game at +1700-1800MHz, but for cypto mining it's absolutely rock solid. The ASUS... not so much.

 

ASUS ROG Strix fans will gush over this card, but with the OC dials turned up to 11... the water-cooled card isn't doing much to impress. If we saw the power limit pushing upwards of 600W, and the GPU clocks pushing 2250-2300MHz+ then that would be a different story for the AIO cooler.

 

ASUS ROG Strix LC GeForce RTX 3090 Ti: Overclocking (OC) tweaktown.com

 

 

[Papusan]

13 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

That's not a bad thing per se, but paying $200 extra from something that isn't as good or better than a superior 12900K silicon sample is where the basis for disappointment comes in.

Some places (etc Australia) they pay near 50% premium for the KS chips. 

[Mr. Fox]

9 minutes ago, Papusan said:

Fancy sell. Bling bling and exotic cooling is worthless if the cards get chips from the bottom barrel.

 

When AIO solution is wasted money for OC'ing.... Why offer good cooling on cards if they pair it with bad binned chips?

 

The biggest gimp on this card so far is the GDDR6X memory overclocking, which I was limited to pushing +1200MHz into it (22.8Gbps or so) compared to the MSI RTX 3090 Ti SUPRIM X which can easily have +1800MHz pumped into it pushing it past 24Gbps... incredible stuff. Not stable in every game at +1700-1800MHz, but for cypto mining it's absolutely rock solid. The ASUS... not so much.

 

ASUS ROG Strix fans will gush over this card, but with the OC dials turned up to 11... the water-cooled card isn't doing much to impress. If we saw the power limit pushing upwards of 600W, and the GPU clocks pushing 2250-2300MHz+ then that would be a different story for the AIO cooler.

 

ASUS ROG Strix LC GeForce RTX 3090 Ti: Overclocking (OC) tweaktown.com

With room temperature thermal throttling nonsense, none of it matters a lot unless you can stay well below ambient temperatures for overclocking. Having a GPU running cool isn't good enough to hold the clocks where you put them. It has to run freakishly cold, and an AIO is not going to do that for you unless you put the box outside during the winter and you live in a place like Norway or Alaska.

[electrosoft]

Snippet from Tom's review of the 12900ks:

 

"We tested the 12900KS's boosting, power and thermal characteristics extensively, finding that the chip easily and frequently boosts to 5.5 GHz. It also sustains up to a 5.2 GHz boost clock on all P-cores, though not under all conditions. The peak 305W of power consumption we recorded has an impact on thermals, which regularly stay at 100C under heavy multi-core loads."

 

305w @ 5.2 all core.... that puts their 12900ks right at my 12900k tested SP84 (P-Core = 94) which albeit was punching a bit above its weight.

 

Hardware Unboxed hit a similar wall thermal throttling at 102c running 5.2 all core pulling ~295w even using an MSI Core Liquid 360 AIO running CB23. CPU eventually backed off to 5ghz all core.

 

My 12900k SP91 maxes at 261w and topped out at 81c under load @ 5.2 all core fans on auto.

 

De8auer shows what a mixed bag the KS can be. Two of his three retail 12900ks chips couldn't do 5.3 all core no matter how much he realistically threw at them voltage wise. The SP97 is his binned 12900k he paid like 1400 Euro. The 12900k SP80 is a basic retail sample and it couldn't do 5.3 either. Between his 12900k binned and 12900ks that could do 5.3 all core also, the SP97 12900k was the better chip.

 

 

 

 

 

With the 4 12900k's I tested? 5.2 all core =

 

#1 Wouldn't even boot (SP81)

#2. Did 5.2 all core @ 297w/94 (SP82)

#3  Did 5.2 all core @ 261w /81c (SP91)

#4. Pulled 327w and thermal throttled

 

I guess at least you know with a 12900ks you're getting a chip guaranteed to do 5.2 all core but you may need beefy cooling and then some or you're going to throttle (See Hardware Unboxed above)

 

V/F curve from a 12900KS SP90 with updated 1403 BIOS:

 

 

1.364 @ 5.2....oy vey

[Papusan]

1 hour ago, Mr. Fox said:

With room temperature thermal throttling nonsense, none of it matters a lot unless you can stay well below ambient temperatures for overclocking. Having a GPU running cool isn't good enough to hold the clocks where you put them. It has to run freakishly cold, and an AIO is not going to do that for you unless you put the box outside during the winter and you live in a place like Norway or Alaska.

The ASUS ROG Strix LC RTX 3090 Ti run sub 50C and still become beaten in OC by the 15 C hotter running air cooled MSI card.  Either a frog from Asus or Asus use worse binned chips  to compansate the increased costs for the more expensive AIO cooling solution. You should still be able for a decent vram oc even if you run above sub zero temps. But nothing really help if they cut cost. 

 

Or make trash... Intel NUC 12 Dragon Canyon with Intel Core i9-12900 in review
https://www.notebookcheck.com/Intel-NUC-12-Dragon-Canyon-mit-Intel-Core-i9-12900-im-Test.610236.0.html

 

Nevertheless, the compact design only offers limited space for appropriate cooling. With the unthrottled Intel Core i9-12900, this is very quickly at the limit under load, so that the temperature limit is reached again and again.

[Mr. Fox]

4 minutes ago, Papusan said:

The ASUS ROG Strix LC RTX 3090 T run sub 50C and still become beaten in OC by the 15 C hotter running air cooled MSI card.  Either a frog from Asus or Asus use worse binned chips  to compansate the increased costs for the more expensive AIO cooling solution. You should still be able for a decent vram oc even if you run above sub zero temps. But nothing really help if they cut cost.

It is true that better thermals won't do enough for lousy silicon samples. Like putting lipstick on a pig.

 

I wonder if the double-density GDDR6X chips are more resistant to overclocking due to their 100% increased capacity per IC? System memory works that way and doesn't overclock as well. Might be true for graphics memory as well.

[Mr. Fox]

1 hour ago, Papusan said:

Or make trash... Intel NUC 12 Dragon Canyon with Intel Core i9-12900 in review
https://www.notebookcheck.com/Intel-NUC-12-Dragon-Canyon-mit-Intel-Core-i9-12900-im-Test.610236.0.html

 

Nevertheless, the compact design only offers limited space for appropriate cooling. With the unthrottled Intel Core i9-12900, this is very quickly at the limit under load, so that the temperature limit is reached again and again.

A NUC is a dumber idea than a laptop in many ways. You get to enjoy all of the same functional (power and thermal) benefits limitations of a turdbook minus the portability offered by the built-in keyboard, pointing device and screen. 

[electrosoft]

My 12900k running in 12900ks mode. With the newest BIOS pulling ~250w max @ 5.2/4.0. Don't mind the temps. I've been under the weather the last few days and have my Sharper Image space heater on overdrive in here and the room at a toasty 85 versus my normal 68.

 

[johnksss]

7 hours ago, Papusan said:

Fancy sell. Bling bling and exotic cooling is worthless if the cards get chips from the bottom barrel.

 

When AIO solution is wasted money for OC'ing.... Why offer good cooling on cards if they pair it with bad binned chips?

 

The biggest gimp on this card so far is the GDDR6X memory overclocking, which I was limited to pushing +1200MHz into it (22.8Gbps or so) compared to the MSI RTX 3090 Ti SUPRIM X which can easily have +1800MHz pumped into it pushing it past 24Gbps... incredible stuff. Not stable in every game at +1700-1800MHz, but for cypto mining it's absolutely rock solid. The ASUS... not so much.

 

ASUS ROG Strix fans will gush over this card, but with the OC dials turned up to 11... the water-cooled card isn't doing much to impress. If we saw the power limit pushing upwards of 600W, and the GPU clocks pushing 2250-2300MHz+ then that would be a different story for the AIO cooler.

 

ASUS ROG Strix LC GeForce RTX 3090 Ti: Overclocking (OC) tweaktown.com

 

 

I can attest to this...My first card was a dude on memory over clocking and not that good on core with AIO and with water block. This current card on just AIO pretty much beat everyone of mine and just about every one else's records.

 

So yes, good binned card on AIO or even Air can run circles around well cooled bad binned cards.

[Mr. Fox]

19 minutes ago, johnksss said:

I can attest to this...My first card was a dude on memory over clocking and not that good on core with AIO and with water block. This current card on just AIO pretty much beat everyone of mine and just about every one else's records.

 

So yes, good binned card on AIO or even Air can run circles around well cooled bad binned cards.

The really sinful part of it is there shoud be NO SUCH THING as a crappy binned FTW3, K|NGP|N, HOF or any other special built product designed for overclocking. It's either a horrible mistake that the manufacturer should feel morally obligated to correct for free, or it is a dishonest business practice. You don't charge anyone top dollar for a crème de la crème product, give them a piece of dung, and then expect them to just suck it up and hope for better luck next time unless you are a dishonest company that isn't shy about screwing their customers. They should be more carefully screening quality and chasing down any that accidentally slipped through their QC and offering to refund or replace it with a product that meets an extremely high standard that matches the extremely high price tag.

[johnksss]

New personal best.... My replacement Unify-X board should be here sometime tomorrow.

https://www.3dmark.com/3dm/73969331

 

[Mr. Fox]

2 hours ago, johnksss said:

New personal best.... My replacement Unify-X board should be here sometime tomorrow.

https://www.3dmark.com/3dm/73969331

 

That is a really nice score, Brother @johnksss. Can you post a screenshot of what settings you are applying with the Classified tool? I'd like to see if my GPU is even capable of running those clocks. I serious doubt that it will.

[Mr. Fox]

As annoying as this fella can be sometimes, this is pretty interesting. It's unfortunate that there are no high-end DDR4 Z690 motherboards for sale. I'm confident it will improve in time as the new memory technology matures, but at the moment DDR5 certainly seems like snake oil. (And, then we will all be stuck with crappy old DDR5 poorly performing "beta" memory modules nobody wants that cost us three times more than DDR4, LOL.)

 

It kind of reminds me of the old AMD CPUs that would overclock insanely high long before 5.0GHz became very ordinary, but they still ran like dog poop compared to an Intel CPU.

 

 

[electrosoft]

I don't know what the problem is with B die sticks atm, but I can't get the 4x8 or 2x16's to post past 3600 no matter what I do on the D4. I even moved my 12900k over to the little build I have with an ASrock B660M Pro RS and 12100f and tested the sticks there (those VRMs were howling with that 12900k in there 😄)

 

B-Die:

 

2x8 will do 4000 on the D4. 4x8 and 2x16 stuck at 3600 even with sloppy timings won't even make it past post .

2x8 won't do XMP on the B660M (4000).

4x8 and 2x16 won't even do 3600 on the B660M

 

Klevv (SK Hynix):

 

I dust off the Klevv 2x16 (SK Hynix) 3600 18-22-22 sticks, peel off the heatsink covers, slap on the heatsink covers from the 2x16GB, direct a fan on them and prepare to sacrifice them to the gods to see if the problems are universal. 1.7v later....

 

2x16GB klevv scaled right up to 4000 XMP timings on the B660M but would crash under stress tests and Aida64. 3900 passed fine.

 

2x16 klevv scaled right up to 4000 XMP timings on the D4 and passed stress and AIDA64.....

 

Of course all those B die sticks run like butter on the Z590 boards I have...of course.

 

Trying to decide if I want to get an MSI Edge as it has the best DDR4 support out there apparently or go with another set of sticks...

 

 

 

 

 

[electrosoft]

4 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

As annoying as this fella can be sometimes, this is pretty interesting. It's unfortunate that there are no high-end DDR4 Z690 motherboards for sale. I'm confident it will improve in time as the new memory technology matures, but at the moment DDR5 certainly seems like snake oil. (And, then we will all be stuck with crappy old DDR5 poorly performing "beta" memory modules nobody wants that cost us three times more than DDR4, LOL.)

 

It kind of reminds me of the old AMD CPUs that would overclock insanely high long before 5.0GHz became very ordinary, but they still ran like dog poop compared to an Intel CPU.

 

 

 

I've grown to like his channel now......

 

Basically for DDR4 it really does come down to ther D4 and Edge. Nothing else is close.

 

 

[Papusan]

I have put together the old with the i7-3770K again. Stole some fans from that build for the new so I had to see what I could find in the drawer/closets. A nice thick fat 38/40mm baby from around 2008 (Sunon KDE1212PMS3-6A). Also re-used the weaker fans from the Artic 420 AIO. The older parts is made the old fashion way for longeivity so it went right into the old machine🙂 Yep, if you looking arround home, a lot old stuff will always pop up if you have the habit save on old stuff. Got it up and running again

 

 

The cabling ain't important on this old machine. Just popped in some old parts and here we go🙃And there is no window in this chassis so.......

 

 

[Papusan]

https://hwbot.org/submission/4968550_papusan_cinebench___r20_core_i7_3770k_2035_cb?recalculate=true

 

https://hwbot.org/submission/4968548_papusan_cinebench___r15_core_i7_3770k_961_cb?recalculate=true

 

https://hwbot.org/submission/4968546_papusan_cinebench___r11.5_core_i7_3770k_10.53_cb

 

https://hwbot.org/submission/4968540_papusan_cinebench___2003_core_i7_3770k_4613_cb?recalculate=true