*Official Benchmark Thread* - Post it here or it didn't happen :D

[jaybee83]

1 hour ago, jaybee83 said:

 

kool, thx for the headsup, havent seen the vid drop yet. btw his name is Ares, like the greek god of war. its actually a quite common name in greece / cyprus.

 

soooo, i was just installing Serious Sam 3 BFE Gold Edition (in the mood for some older, simpler shoot 'em up titles) and the setup had an inbuilt system requirements checker. it stated that all my components were up to snuff, EXCEPT the gpu *rofl*

 

 

lets hope the 5090 is good enough for it then 😄 

 

well ill be damned... manually maxed out all settings and its got my 4090 pegged at 100% flat on my max OC profile at roughly 3105 Mhz core. that results in 64 FPS LOL

[Mr. Fox]

5 hours ago, jaybee83 said:

 

well ill be damned... manually maxed out all settings and its got my 4090 pegged at 100% flat on my max OC profile at roughly 3105 Mhz core. that results in 64 FPS LOL

I played some Unreal Tournament last weekend and was very disappointed my framerate was capped at 1,000 FPS with maxed out settings.

[Mr. Fox]

12 hours ago, Papusan said:

 

Yup, Intel already feed Microsoft with Meteor + Lunar lake chips for their trashbooks. And these modern hybrid processors are the foundation for making Arrow Lake cpu's for desktops. So we are there already. And worse it will be. See the beauty below....

 

 

It is nice that the vast majority of people in the world are drinking the Winduhz 11 Kool-Aid. Oh, wait. They're not.

Desktop Windows Version Market Share Worldwide | Statcounter Global Stats

This graph shows the market share of desktop windows versions worldwide based on over 5 billion monthly page views.

 gs.statcounter.com

[tps3443]

I made a video of the process of re-pasting my Xeon w3175X CPU. It is quite tedious removing, cleaning, and re-installing this CPU. But, I followed the steps and it went perfectly smooth. I couldn’t find any info on this anywhere, so maybe it’ll help others as well. The old paste that was on it had moisture in it, that’s typical with water getting too cold and it ruins the ability of the paste. My temps dropped by 6C!!! 
 

https://youtu.be/zy2p3SoJOpc?si=2ydbx3vuW_CRK-oK

 

[Papusan]

On 10/22/2024 at 1:37 PM, Papusan said:

The good thing living in Norway. There is almost no options if you want PC components. You can order from another country but that will be away more expensive and the shipping time will be disgusting. MSI Z890 Unify-X... Not even listed. Asus Z890 Apex.... Most Asus boards listed included the Apex, but no prices and unknown delivery date. Maybe they don't know where to put the ROG Tax?  ASRock Z890 TAICHI OCF... Unknown delivery date... No listed two dimm Gigabyte board.  Yup, damn nice live up here in the cold North. 

 

 

 

The ROG tax is real and what a shame and greed. Asus Z890 Apex cost $968.73 USD here home. Yup, close to $1000. Hmm. That's damn stiff even with awful currency exchange to USD and incl tax (rotten NOK currency exange to USD). ASRock Z890 TAICHI OCF cost $735 and I don't like the lack of old fashion USB ports on the I/O shield. The MSI Z890 Unify-X is noware to see (same it was with the Z690) and I expect more expensive than the ASRock board. This will be difficult. Depends on the price differences. One thing for sure, it will be easier to sell the Apex in the used market here to re-cup some of the spent money (Easier to sell at  higher prices and more buyers are interested). 

 

Why only 5 USB ports ASSSRock? My old Asus Z890 have 8 of them. And Asus have also removed one and down to 7 for the new Z890 Apex. This trend reminds me all too much about Dell Alienware. This rub me the wrong way.

 

Z790 Apex Encore

 

 

And it seems everything need to be swapped out for new for every new gen hardware... Nice. Desktop hardware going the BGA route. Everything need to be changed.

 

Yeah. Z890 Apex and X670e Gene have larger gap between the DIMM slots, which cause incompatibility issue with existing RAM DD blocks.

So far only Safedisk and Audigy have the prototype of Supercool RAM DD block that is compatible with Z890 Apex and X670e Gene. Hopefully we will see it hits the market soon as well as new block from Iceman. That's epic fail if we need to buy new ddr5 coolers! And soon we have CAMM2.... Disgusting.

[Mr. Fox]

2 hours ago, Papusan said:

 

The ROG tax is real and what a shame and greed. Asus Z890 Apex cost $968.73 USD here home. Yup, close to $1000. Hmm. That's damn stiff even with awful currency exchange to USD and incl tax (rotten NOK currency exange to USD). ASRock Z890 TAICHI OCF cost $735 and I don't like the lack of old fashion USB ports on the I/O shield. The MSI Z890 Unify-X is noware to see (same it was with the Z690) and I expect more expensive than the ASRock board. This will be difficult. Depends on the price differences. One thing for sure, it will be easier to sell the Apex in the used market here to re-cup some of the spent money (Easier to sell at  higher prices and more buyers are interested). 

 

Why only 5 USB ports ASSSRock? My old Asus Z890 have 8 of them. And Asus have also removed one and down to 7 for the new Z890 Apex. This trend reminds me all too much about Dell Alienware. This rub me the wrong way.

 

Z790 Apex Encore

 

 

And it seems everything need to be swapped out for new for every new gen hardware... Nice. Desktop hardware going the BGA route. Everything need to be changed.

 

Yeah. Z890 Apex and X670e Gene have larger gap between the DIMM slots, which cause incompatibility issue with existing RAM DD blocks.

So far only Safedisk and Audigy have the prototype of Supercool RAM DD block that is compatible with Z890 Apex and X670e Gene. Hopefully we will see it hits the market soon as well as new block from Iceman. That's epic fail if we need to buy new ddr5 coolers! And soon we have CAMM2.... Disgusting.

The performance PC space really is a great big bucket of dung at this point. Lots and lots of reasons to be very unhappy about almost everything and furious about a few things. I do not find any nice things to say, only contemptuous thoughts reflecting malice and wishes of great misfortune upon all of the companies involved at the core components level. 

[Papusan]

1 hour ago, Mr. Fox said:

The performance PC space really is a great big bucket of dung at this point. Lots and lots of reasons to be very unhappy about almost everything and furious about a few things. I do not find any nice things to say, only contemptuous thoughts reflecting malice and wishes of great misfortune upon all of the companies involved at the core components level. 

 

Not an official review under NDA so see it as it is... Real Jokebooks.

 

 

[cylix]

Soo it's a Flop..like expected..sad days.

https://youtu.be/3n537Z7pJug

 

https://youtu.be/XXLY8kEdR1c

 

In cyberpunk  it's get destroyed..20% slower then 14900k..ouch

[Papusan]

 

All is about the E-cores. Even the SP ranking in Asus boards show it very well. With almost no OC headroom for the Big cores I can imagine there is not much that will be gained for gaming.

 

 

P oc margin is very small. Even maintaining all P 5.7 may be hard for many 285K.
E oc margin is big. Even 5.4+ on good cooling and silicon quality is possible.

 

And here is from @Falkentyne Intel forgot to make good P-cores.

 

@sugi0lover has a very good chip on the IA cores, but his memory controller seems to be lacking. He can actually do 5.8 ghz on a good day.

My chip may be made for going cold. I can't even do 5.6 ghz on my P cores even with 1.425v set + LLC6 in power gate mode, I can barely keep stockfish stable without the room being very cold.
5.5 ghz requires 1.30v set + LLC6 (about 1.19v load, so I can try to target that in DLVR mode).

 

Edit. My take on this.... https://www.overclock.net/posts/29381710/

 

 

And.... Disgusting! Is this a Joke or reality? Can't see 1. April on the calendar. We are still in Oct 2024.

 

On 10/23/2024 at 12:54 AM, Papusan said:

 

If Intel go with Arrow Lake Refresh they need to add more cores (bigger compute tile because they are already on 3nm) and at same time push higher clock speed as for 12th to 13th gen. A usual 4% bump in clock speed as in the old days won't do anything for the gaming performance. 

 

Either 2 extra P-cores (10+16), 8+24 or 10+24 and higher clock speed. Pick your poison for next gen on same socket. But we need much faster P-cores if better gaming performance is the goal. Or add 3D v-cashe in the bottom of the compute tile. The hybrid mess is real. Not much better than the glued mess from AMD. 

 

But this die structure smells more babies. Exactly same as going from 12th to 13th gen.  More P-cores just use too much power. So Intel's magic will be more of the same power efficient E-cores and hope higher clock speed bump for the remaining 8 P-cores give a small boost in gaming. 

 

 

4% better score than 14700K. Fantastic improvement over previous gen. Almost as in the old days going from 6700K to 7700K🤢

 

Or +37.500 at 212w

 

Can quote myself. No in hell an Arrow Lake Refresh will see the lights. Intel need to come up with something different. This isn't good enough. Maybe good enough for office machines but not for gamers or perfomance enhusiasts.

[cylix]

Tragic, a lot of instability still, its like a beta launch. Didnt expect this from intel.

 

 

[Mr. Fox]

It seems like new product releases challenged Intel as much as it did AMD this time around. These guys need to stop counting on fanboys that believe newer is always better. While the compute performance of the 285K is truly amazing, it is underwhelming and underbuilt at everything else. It's 8 threads short of a full load and the 25% reduction in thread count makes it a failure on face value. All it does is highlight how much was given up by giving up 8 threads for no valid reason and begs the question of how much better it might have been had they not lowered the bar so dramatically on thread count. Accordingly, it should have been priced at 25% less.

[Papusan]

28 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

It seems like new product releases challenged Intel as much as it did AMD this time around. These guys need to stop counting on fanboys that believe newer is always better. While the compute performance of the 285K is truly amazing, it is underwhelming and underbuilt at everything else. It's 8 threads short of a full load and the 25% reduction in thread count makes it a failure on face value. All it does is highlight how much was given up by giving up 8 threads for no valid reason and begs the question of how much better it might have been had they not lowered the bar so dramatically on thread count. Accordingly, it should have been priced at 25% less.

 

I expect we had seen 285K chips eat 400W with HT. So the power efficiency they have talked so much about would go down the drain. Reason for removing HT is for the mobile junk. And we all know Intel will use same mess for coming gaming Jokebooks. And not so sure TSMC silicon can handle 400W long-term. 

[Mr. Fox]

16 minutes ago, Papusan said:

 

I expect we had seen 285K chips eat 400W with HT. So the power efficiency they have talked so much about would go down the drain. Reason for removing HT is for the mobile junk. And we all know Intel will use same mess for coming gaming Jokebooks. And not so sure TSMC silicon can handle 400W long-term. 

That is what I would expect, and it would not be a concern. I already see that and it is not a concern. What does concern me is Intel, AMD and YouTube reviewers burning calories on something that should not matter to any of them. Intel should let turdbooks be turdbooks. We expect them all to suck, and they do.

[Meaker]

53 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

It seems like new product releases challenged Intel as much as it did AMD this time around. These guys need to stop counting on fanboys that believe newer is always better. While the compute performance of the 285K is truly amazing, it is underwhelming and underbuilt at everything else. It's 8 threads short of a full load and the 25% reduction in thread count makes it a failure on face value. All it does is highlight how much was given up by giving up 8 threads for no valid reason and begs the question of how much better it might have been had they not lowered the bar so dramatically on thread count. Accordingly, it should have been priced at 25% less.

 

I mean it makes it cheaper to produce cutting out HT so all the reason for Intel, just not for the end user. A bit like some of the tech being tested here. I can see it all helping a lot in the future but it's an odd balance for now, but you have to do the switch over at some point.

[tps3443]

3175X using CPU-Z Benchmark. Thing is a beast for sure. 

[Papusan]

14 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

That is what I would expect, and it would not be a concern. I already see that and it is not a concern. What does concern me is Intel, AMD and YouTube reviewers burning calories on something that should not matter to any of them. Intel should let turdbooks be turdbooks. We expect them all to suck, and they do.

 

What rub me in the face is this.... The website is called Overclocking.com and this is final conclution on Arrow lake...

 

In conclusion, Intel has made the best choice of all by prioritizing improving the power consumption of its processors to the detriment of a significant increase in performance.

 

https://en.overclocking.com/review-intel-core-ultra-9-285k-and-ultra-5-245k/13/#:~:text=In conclusion%2C Intel has made the best choice of all by prioritizing improving the power consumption of its processors to the detriment of a significant increase in performance.

 

 

[Mr. Fox]

3 minutes ago, Papusan said:

 

What rub me in the face is this.... The website is called Overclocking.com and this is final conclution on Arrow lake...

 

In conclusion, Intel has made the best choice of all by prioritizing improving the power consumption of its processors to the detriment of a significant increase in performance.

 

https://en.overclocking.com/review-intel-core-ultra-9-285k-and-ultra-5-245k/13/#:~:text=In conclusion%2C Intel has made the best choice of all by prioritizing improving the power consumption of its processors to the detriment of a significant increase in performance.

 

 

We still need a vomiting emoji for the rep button, exactly for times like this.

 

[Meaker]

With the digital VRM bypass that DB was talking about there are some interesting tweaks to be made for high thread count workloads, benchmarking and overclocking.

 

Oh also I have moved over to the B650E-I motherboard and am running PBO with a -25 curve offset now.

[Papusan]

39 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

We still need a vomiting emoji for the rep button, exactly for times like this.

 

 

New is always better. @ryan Higher numbers doesn't always mean better. I'm sure the LN2 overclockers will keep their "free" 13th and 14th gen processors. High mem latency just kill the fun in SuperPi.  

 

 

 

28 minutes ago, Meaker said:

With the digital VRM bypass that DB was talking about there are some interesting tweaks to be made for high thread count workloads, benchmarking and overclocking.

 

Oh also I have moved over to the B650E-I motherboard and am running PBO with a -25 curve offset now.

 

But it won't make magic in games. 

 

48 minutes ago, Meaker said:

I mean it makes it cheaper to produce cutting out HT so all the reason for Intel, just not for the end user.

 

Lower sales du less than expected (gaming) performance will hamper the sales. The reason we now will see AMD will boost their sales to gamer boys. Lower sales will also lower the profits. And Intel really need it now to please angry shareholders. And they failed doing that with Core Ultra. 

 

They have now the golden chance to continue produce 14th gen chips. They have still the workers and fabs to do so. Because TSMC make the parts for Lunar and Arrow Lake. Just put the right price-tag for the 14th gen chips.

[Talon]

21 minutes ago, Papusan said:

 

New is always better. @ryan Higher numbers doesn't always mean better. I'm sure the LN2 overclockers will keep their "free" 13th and 14th gen processors. High mem latency just kill the fun in SuperPi.  

 

 

 

 

But it won't make magic in games. 

 

 

Lower sales du less than expected (gaming) performance will hamper the sales. The reason we now will see AMD will boost their sales to gamer boys. Lower sales will also lower the profits. And Intel really need it now to please angry shareholders. And they failed doing that with Core Ultra. 

 

They have now the golden chance to continue produce 14th gen chips. They have still the workers and fabs to do so. Because TSMC make the parts for Lunar and Arrow Lake. Just put the right price-tag for the 14th gen chips.

The reviews went about as I expected. The latency at stock is just not it. And I fully expect some windows OS scheduling issues that may eventually get ironed out. 

[Mr. Fox]

Change purely for the sake of change is beneath stupidity. It wasn't broke, but they "fixed it" and now it's broken. Predictable. New is always better newer. Innovation without results is worthless. If the results targeted are not the results that consumers purchasing your products want, that reflects ignorance of your target market. Disregarding what your target market wants is arrogance. If we wanted stupidity, worthless innovation, arrogance and ignorance we could buy Apple products.

 

But hey, those shiny piano black G.SKILL memory sticks with no RGB rainbow puke sure do look nice. Shiny doesn't fix hiney.

[Papusan]

1 hour ago, Talon said:

The reviews went about as I expected. The latency at stock is just not it. And I fully expect some windows OS scheduling issues that may eventually get ironed out. 

 

Yup. Could you please run CBR-20 and CBR-23 with only the P-cores enabled in bios? Also see if you can run same benchmarks again but with oc'd P-cores (no babies). Thanks 

 

I'm quite sure 8 P-cores benchmarks is dead now on hwbot. This because Intel have put all the eggs into the E-cores, to not look stupid in multi threaded performance with no HT on the real cores.

 

Btw. Long time since I have seen no one sub benchmarks on hwbot with an brand new platform. That tells you something.

[tps3443]

32 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

Change purely for the sake of change is beneath stupidity. It wasn't broke, but they "fixed it" and now it's broken. Predictable. New is always better newer. Innovation without results is worthless. If the results targeted are not the results that consumers purchasing your products want, that reflects ignorance of your target market. Disregarding what your target market wants is arrogance. If we wanted stupidity, worthless innovation, arrogance and ignorance we could buy Apple products.

 

But hey, those shiny piano black G.SKILL memory sticks with no RGB rainbow puke sure do look nice. Shiny doesn't fix hiney.

I know what looks really nice, my black/blue G.Skill Bdie dual rank sticks that aren’t RGB. And they are mere DDR4 sticks 🥳
 

Another thing that made no sense was apparently the Super Cool DDR5 block doesn’t even fit this new Z890 system. Thats just insane to me for some reason. I just can’t understand it. I’m okay with change so long as it’s for the better. But I guess in this case, the new Intel system was literally changed just for change. 
 

Newer is definitely not always better. Now back to some tuning on the X599 platform

[electrosoft]

Looking at Sugi's numbers, 285k is hitting 50k in CB23 already basically out of the block with some tweaks. Delidded but not even on DD yet and using a Mora 420 not even a chiller. Not to shabby! That single core score is pretty beastly too!

 

 

Unfortunately it's gaming prowess is going to be a game to game thing and things are not looking good atm overall.

 

For me, I think I'm going to sit back a smidge (same as I did for 13th and 14th) and watch and wait before I do anything.....why?

 

I spent a week+ swapping back and forth between my 7950X3D rig and 14900KS rig playing a crap ton of WoW and the 14900KS @ 5.9 all core, 8200 tuned w/ APO was just superior in every way especially with the lows and smooth game play. Any and all occasional chunk I would hit (I'll begrudgingly admit it might be a bit of "dip") with the 7950X3D was just gone with the end game 14900KS setup. Having logged 30hrs+ on each setup running the same raids/questing/PvP, the 14900KS once tuned across the board is the superior answer.

 

I would swap my 4090 back and forth with a clean install of 24H2 running the same raids and TWW outdoor content and the fluidity and game play was just superior on the 14900KS. That is why I sold off the 7950X3D and X670E Carbon. I can't envision the 9800X3D or 9950X3D providing this as smooth of a gaming experience in WoW but I'm always open to change. 🙂

 

I am to a point now, playing WoW, where I say back last night and just went, "I don't see why I need a 5090 or a CPU upgrade," and that has never happened in tandem. If I do buy a 5090, it is just pure leisurely fun.

 

After I finish selling off the rest of some of this gear (we're in the homestretch!), if I pick up a 285 setup, again, it will be for pure tweaking and optimizing fun. If somehow it can bring the pain for WoW,  I would as mentioned before just swap it into the wife's system and run the 285 as my main.

 

2 hours ago, Talon said:

The reviews went about as I expected. The latency at stock is just not it. And I fully expect some windows OS scheduling issues that may eventually get ironed out. 

 

I agree. Seeing Sugi's numbers this early on with what is a good CPU (His SP=91, for example Debauer was using an SP=75), I think this is going to be a tweakers paradise chip especially with DLVR disabled and switching more to a normal approach for overclocking. Memory is coming out of the gate hitting nicely too. It is Rocketlake 2.0 in what I feel is an ok way.

 

 

 

[Papusan]

17 minutes ago, electrosoft said:

I agree. Seeing Sugi's numbers this early on with what is a good CPU (His SP=91, for example Debauer was using an SP=75), I think this is going to be a tweakers paradise chip especially with DLVR disabled and switching more to a normal approach for overclocking. Memory is coming out of the gate hitting nicely too. It is Rocketlake 2.0 in what I feel is an ok way.

 

And @Falkentyne's "fantastic" chips is SP93 (P: SP95 - E: SP 103). He can barely do an 2% overclock on the P-cores. Sugi's is P88 and E109. So high SP can offer trash bin. A real lottery and all weight is now put on the baby cores. An 9% IPC increase for the P-cores and a loss of +23% with HT just killed 8 core benching on the bot. Nice.