Dell Pro Max 16/18 Plus (2025 model) pre-release discussion — MB16250, MB18250

[Easa]

Dump analyze as follows:

11: kd> !analyze -v
Loading Kernel Symbols
..

Press ctrl-c (cdb, kd, ntsd) or ctrl-break (windbg) to abort symbol loads that take too long.
Run !sym noisy before .reload to track down problems loading symbols.

.............................................................
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.......
Loading User Symbols

Loading unloaded module list
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*                                                                             *
*                        Bugcheck Analysis                                    *
*                                                                             *
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PAGE_FAULT_IN_NONPAGED_AREA (50)
Invalid system memory was referenced.  This cannot be protected by try-except.
Typically the address is just plain bad or it is pointing at freed memory.
Arguments:
Arg1: ffffe30be74da488, memory referenced.
Arg2: 0000000000000000, X64: bit 0 set if the fault was due to a not-present PTE.
	bit 1 is set if the fault was due to a write, clear if a read.
	bit 3 is set if the processor decided the fault was due to a corrupted PTE.
	bit 4 is set if the fault was due to attempted execute of a no-execute PTE.
	- ARM64: bit 1 is set if the fault was due to a write, clear if a read.
	bit 3 is set if the fault was due to attempted execute of a no-execute PTE.
Arg3: fffff805e7dab1de, If non-zero, the instruction address which referenced the bad memory
	address.
Arg4: 0000000000000002, (reserved)

Debugging Details:
------------------


KEY_VALUES_STRING: 1

    Key  : AV.Type
    Value: Read

    Key  : Analysis.CPU.mSec
    Value: 1687

    Key  : Analysis.Elapsed.mSec
    Value: 22547

    Key  : Analysis.IO.Other.Mb
    Value: 0

    Key  : Analysis.IO.Read.Mb
    Value: 1

    Key  : Analysis.IO.Write.Mb
    Value: 33

    Key  : Analysis.Init.CPU.mSec
    Value: 1140

    Key  : Analysis.Init.Elapsed.mSec
    Value: 28983

    Key  : Analysis.Memory.CommitPeak.Mb
    Value: 120

    Key  : Analysis.Version.DbgEng
    Value: 10.0.29457.1000

    Key  : Analysis.Version.Description
    Value: 10.2506.23.01 amd64fre

    Key  : Analysis.Version.Ext
    Value: 1.2506.23.1

    Key  : Bugcheck.Code.LegacyAPI
    Value: 0x50

    Key  : Bugcheck.Code.TargetModel
    Value: 0x50

    Key  : Dump.Attributes.AsUlong
    Value: 0x21808

    Key  : Dump.Attributes.DiagDataWrittenToHeader
    Value: 1

    Key  : Dump.Attributes.ErrorCode
    Value: 0x0

    Key  : Dump.Attributes.KernelGeneratedTriageDump
    Value: 1

    Key  : Dump.Attributes.LastLine
    Value: Dump completed successfully.

    Key  : Dump.Attributes.ProgressPercentage
    Value: 0

    Key  : Failure.Bucket
    Value: AV_R_(null)_nt!MiSystemFault

    Key  : Failure.Exception.IP.Address
    Value: 0xfffff805e7dab1de

    Key  : Failure.Exception.IP.Module
    Value: nt

    Key  : Failure.Exception.IP.Offset
    Value: 0x3ab1de

    Key  : Failure.Hash
    Value: {636dd506-1acb-bac0-a568-0355527c550f}

    Key  : Hypervisor.Enlightenments.ValueHex
    Value: 0x7417df84

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.AnyHypervisorPresent
    Value: 1

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.ApicEnlightened
    Value: 0

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.ApicVirtualizationAvailable
    Value: 1

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.AsyncMemoryHint
    Value: 0

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.CoreSchedulerRequested
    Value: 0

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.CpuManager
    Value: 1

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.DeprecateAutoEoi
    Value: 1

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.DynamicCpuDisabled
    Value: 1

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.Epf
    Value: 0

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.ExtendedProcessorMasks
    Value: 1

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.HardwareMbecAvailable
    Value: 1

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.MaxBankNumber
    Value: 0

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.MemoryZeroingControl
    Value: 1

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.NoExtendedRangeFlush
    Value: 0

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.NoNonArchCoreSharing
    Value: 1

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.Phase0InitDone
    Value: 1

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.PowerSchedulerQos
    Value: 0

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.RootScheduler
    Value: 0

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.SynicAvailable
    Value: 1

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.UseQpcBias
    Value: 0

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.Value
    Value: 55447806

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.ValueHex
    Value: 0x34e10fe

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.VpAssistPage
    Value: 1

    Key  : Hypervisor.Flags.VsmAvailable
    Value: 1

    Key  : Hypervisor.RootFlags.AccessStats
    Value: 1

    Key  : Hypervisor.RootFlags.CrashdumpEnlightened
    Value: 1

    Key  : Hypervisor.RootFlags.CreateVirtualProcessor
    Value: 1

    Key  : Hypervisor.RootFlags.DisableHyperthreading
    Value: 0

    Key  : Hypervisor.RootFlags.HostTimelineSync
    Value: 1

    Key  : Hypervisor.RootFlags.HypervisorDebuggingEnabled
    Value: 0

    Key  : Hypervisor.RootFlags.IsHyperV
    Value: 1

    Key  : Hypervisor.RootFlags.LivedumpEnlightened
    Value: 1

    Key  : Hypervisor.RootFlags.MapDeviceInterrupt
    Value: 1

    Key  : Hypervisor.RootFlags.MceEnlightened
    Value: 1

    Key  : Hypervisor.RootFlags.Nested
    Value: 0

    Key  : Hypervisor.RootFlags.StartLogicalProcessor
    Value: 1

    Key  : Hypervisor.RootFlags.Value
    Value: 1015

    Key  : Hypervisor.RootFlags.ValueHex
    Value: 0x3f7

    Key  : WER.System.BIOSRevision
    Value: 2.1.0.0


BUGCHECK_CODE:  50

BUGCHECK_P1: ffffe30be74da488

BUGCHECK_P2: 0

BUGCHECK_P3: fffff805e7dab1de

BUGCHECK_P4: 2

FILE_IN_CAB:  120225-23750-01.dmp

TAG_NOT_DEFINED_202b:  *** Unknown TAG in analysis list 202b


DUMP_FILE_ATTRIBUTES: 0x21808
  Kernel Generated Triage Dump

FAULTING_THREAD:  ffffe309dedee400

READ_ADDRESS: fffff805e89c44c0: Unable to get MiVisibleState
Unable to get NonPagedPoolStart
Unable to get NonPagedPoolEnd
Unable to get PagedPoolStart
Unable to get PagedPoolEnd
unable to get nt!MmSpecialPagesInUse
 ffffe30be74da488 

MM_INTERNAL_CODE:  2

BLACKBOXBSD: 1 (!blackboxbsd)


BLACKBOXNTFS: 1 (!blackboxntfs)


BLACKBOXPNP: 1 (!blackboxpnp)


BLACKBOXWINLOGON: 1 (!blackboxwinlogon)


CUSTOMER_CRASH_COUNT:  1

PROCESS_NAME:  System

STACK_TEXT:  
ffffe181`053a7e58 fffff805`e7dd1a0c     : 00000000`00000050 ffffe30b`e74da488 00000000`00000000 ffffe181`053a80c0 : nt!KeBugCheckEx
ffffe181`053a7e60 fffff805`e7c40510     : 00000000`0000000c ffff8000`00000000 ffffe30b`e74da488 0000007f`fffffff8 : nt!MiSystemFault+0x7a0
ffffe181`053a7f50 fffff805`e80addcb     : 00000000`00000000 00000000`00000a00 00000000`00000022 fffff805`7ab86538 : nt!MmAccessFault+0x630
ffffe181`053a80c0 fffff805`e7dab1de     : fffff805`e7da9a8e 00000000`00000000 ffffcf80`1828c4a0 ffffe30a`010115b0 : nt!KiPageFault+0x38b
ffffe181`053a8258 fffff805`e7da9a8e     : 00000000`00000000 ffffcf80`1828c4a0 ffffe30a`010115b0 fffff805`e7c10ce0 : nt!IoGetRelatedDeviceObject+0x5e
ffffe181`053a8260 fffff805`e7d1f0ee     : 00000000`00000004 ffffe181`053a8560 ffffe30a`00582780 ffffe181`053a8560 : nt!MiIssueAsynchronousFlush+0xa2
ffffe181`053a82d0 fffff805`e7d82db9     : 00000000`00000000 ffffe30a`00848690 ffffe181`053a8560 ffffe181`053a8890 : nt!MiFlushSection+0x6ce
ffffe181`053a84e0 fffff805`e7d82348     : ffffe181`053a86e0 ffffe181`053a86e0 00000000`00001000 00000000`00000000 : nt!MmFlushSection+0x1f9
ffffe181`053a85a0 fffff805`e7d87a6a     : ffffe309`dc5667a0 ffffe309`e75c8850 ffffe181`053a8790 ffffe181`053a8890 : nt!CcFlushCacheOneRange+0x338
ffffe181`053a8690 fffff805`e7d87d06     : ffffe309`e75c8850 ffffe309`e74e9818 00000000`00000000 ffffe309`e74e96e0 : nt!CcWriteBehindAsync+0xde
ffffe181`053a8800 fffff805`e7ed8ae3     : ffffe181`00000000 ffffe309`e74e9818 ffffe309`dc5667a0 ffffe309`e74e96e0 : nt!CcAsyncLazywriteWorker+0x19e
ffffe181`053a88f0 fffff805`e7cdb8ac     : ffffe309`dedee400 ffffe181`053a8a50 ffffe309`dc702ae0 fffff805`e7ed8a70 : nt!CcAsyncLazywriteWorkerThread+0x73
ffffe181`053a8950 fffff805`e7e815ea     : ffffe309`dedee400 ffffe309`dedee400 fffff805`e7cdb2c0 ffffe309`dc702ae0 : nt!ExpWorkerThread+0x5ec
ffffe181`053a8b30 fffff805`e809fd74     : ffff9080`1c79f180 ffffe309`dedee400 fffff805`e7e81590 ac45188d`0b7b00d2 : nt!PspSystemThreadStartup+0x5a
ffffe181`053a8b80 00000000`00000000     : ffffe181`053a9000 ffffe181`053a2000 00000000`00000000 00000000`00000000 : nt!KiStartSystemThread+0x34


SYMBOL_NAME:  nt!MiSystemFault+7a0

MODULE_NAME: nt

IMAGE_VERSION:  10.0.26100.7171

STACK_COMMAND: .process /r /p 0xffffe309dc4eb040; .thread 0xffffe309dedee400 ; kb

IMAGE_NAME:  ntkrnlmp.exe

BUCKET_ID_FUNC_OFFSET:  7a0

FAILURE_BUCKET_ID:  AV_R_(null)_nt!MiSystemFault

OSPLATFORM_TYPE:  x64

OSNAME:  Windows 10

FAILURE_ID_HASH:  {636dd506-1acb-bac0-a568-0355527c550f}

Followup:     MachineOwner
---------

 

 

[Linux]

I am really glad, that i don't this big laptops anymore. My current 16" with a RTX4060 will suit me for at least the next 7-8 years. And i got it from the Lenovo outlet as new for 1000€. It has no flaws or drawbacks whatsoever.

[Easa]

Yesterday I was watching some movies during the night time, powered down the machine at around 11PM. Apparently, the machine powered on itself sometime after the shutdown, perhaps due to Updates.. Today morning I have powered it on to 0% battery status. Each day with this machine is wonderful.

 

Already speaking with Dell about the possible solutions to all of my problems.

 

On the other hand, the desktop Arrow Lake systems have been stellar so far, 100% stability and reliability even on systems with 256GB of RAM, four sticks running XMP settings.

 

 

[yslalan]

It seems that Lenovo already has the 64GB CSoDIMM modules available in their configuration.

But they are not yet in the retail market?

[Easa]

Its starting to feel like a diary of mine...

 

...but today the audio device spontaneously failed and the system had to be restarted for it to work again.

 

 

Pro Max Plus 18 surely is full of surprises.

[SvenC]

Is that the Dell installed Windows or did you do a clean install from a standard Windows install image?

 

Could be that Dell preinstalled cares about clean Event Viewers - maybe not 😉

Could be that a clean Windows install by yourself and Windows Update for "standard" drivers and only then install missing Dell drivers might keep Event Viewer less red.

I stopped caring because some finger print, smart card and Office errors are always there which could be influenced by company policies and a non native Windows virus scanner. As long as my PMP18 works I stopped caring about Application and System event log errors - I tried before and just wasted time.

Just my two cents 😉

[Easa]

I have nuked the original Dell Windows quite early - it was behaving even worse than a clean install. The total system power was spiking very high even during the idle usage, and the battery life was just poor, plus there were other issues. The clean install solved some of them.

I would also like to stop caring, if the device would at least work normally. Most of the time it does, but I just cannot tolerate an unreliable device for this kind of money. It has to be 100% stable.

 

 

[SvenC]

Absolutely agree!

 

Hard to tell if my system with iGPU only causes less stress and systems with dGPU add complexity and sometimes two much load.

 

If you have Dell support you might want to go the "swap some components way" until it behaves or argue for a system swap as early as possible. (I did not follow if you reported your Dell support conditions already). That machine is too professional and expensive and should not cause any kind of work hassle.

[MyPC8MyBrain]

6 hours ago, Easa said:

I have nuked the original Dell Windows quite early

are you running Win11 Enterprise LTSC?

[Easa]

Nope, its a standard Windows 11 Pro 25H2 with some basic group policies added 

[MyPC8MyBrain]

id recommend Enterprise LTSC over Pro,
its faster and de bloated for corporate environments out of the box.

[SvenC]

On 12/6/2025 at 2:08 AM, MyPC8MyBrain said:

id recommend Enterprise LTSC over Pro,
its faster and de bloated for corporate environments out of the box.

How is the Enterprise LTSC version faster as 11 Pro (or other Enterprise flavours) ?

 

Is there any bloatware on the none LTSC version which we cannot uninstall (either through settings UI or PowerShell cmdlets)?

 

To my understanding any LTSC version (...24H2, 25H2...) does only receive security fixes. So, I believe that I could miss performance improvement updates on any current LTSC version, compared to Windows 11 Enterprise Insiders (Beta or Release Preview channels) which sometimes get performance improvements. Like kernel improvements to get SSD speeds up again, better battery performance due to some ACPI enhancements, faster Windows Update installs and/or less reboots and so on.

 

I believe I would have to wait for 26H2 to get those performance feature improvements - is that a false expectation?

 

If I uninstalled bloatware once, I'd expect Windows Update to not install that again with any future update package (if it does I'd just uninstall it again).

[Aaron44126]

I have a link in my signature to an article about the pros and cons of using LTSC. I personally prefer LTSC as well (…for the one Windows system that I have left that I actually use…). not only is it a more “decorated” base install… I *like* the idea of security updates only — you don’t have to worry about Microsoft shoving stuff down that you have to figure out how to disable or get rid of, and you can *decide* when you are ready to upgrade to the next version. As for “performance improvements”, I don’t see that as much of a concern. Windows is already about as refined as it can be in that area, and I see GPU drivers as the main place where that is in flux, and of course you can still install current GPU drivers on the LTSC version.

 

Now as for the issues that @Easa is experiencing here, I don’t think that it would make that much of a difference if he was using LTSC or not. This seems like deeper platform-level stuff.

[MyPC8MyBrain]

5 hours ago, SvenC said:

How is the Enterprise LTSC version faster as 11 Pro (or other Enterprise flavours) ?

You’re mixing up three different things

1. Edition stability (Enterprise vs Pro)

2. Servicing model (LTSC vs yearly/H2 releases)

3. Update channels (GA vs Insider builds)

These behave differently and shouldn’t be compared as if they were the same.

 

Enterprise > Pro because of stability, update discipline, and no consumer experiments.
LTSC > Enterprise because it freezes features and gives you the most stable and predictable platform Microsoft makes.
You are not missing essential performance fixes on LTSC. The only things you “miss” are UI changes and consumer features.

If you want maximum consistency, low background churn, and a workstation OS that never changes under you, LTSC is the correct branch.

 

[SvenC]

24 minutes ago, MyPC8MyBrain said:

You’re mixing up three different things

1. Edition stability (Enterprise vs Pro)

2. Servicing model (LTSC vs yearly/H2 releases)

3. Update channels (GA vs Insider builds)

These behave differently and shouldn’t be compared as if they were the same.

 

Enterprise > Pro because of stability, update discipline, and no consumer experiments.
LTSC > Enterprise because it freezes features and gives you the most stable and predictable platform Microsoft makes.
You are not missing essential performance fixes on LTSC. The only things you “miss” are UI changes and consumer features.

If you want maximum consistency, low background churn, and a workstation OS that never changes under you, LTSC is the correct branch.

 

Understood. Thank you for the clarification! 

[Easa]

Honestly, I have no experiences with running daily LTSC edition of Windows, except on vending machines, terminals etc. 

 

My installation has been optimized & stripped of unnecessary crap afterwards (WinUtil + Group Policies + StartAllBack), of course it cannot be compared to a LTSC, but I am satisfied with the thing as it is. TBH, the only serious bug that I have encountered with the recent 25H2 so far, is the certain update switching drive letters between C and D and corrupting the bootloader in the process. Observed on multiple computers during the last month.

 

I understand the benefits of LTSC, but I am fine with normal Pro version. Once the hardware runs properly, the software I can live with. For example, the desktop machine in my signature has the same OS with exactly same mods / adjustments, and its running like a dream. 

[MyPC8MyBrain]

29 minutes ago, Easa said:

My installation has been optimized & stripped of unnecessary crap

how many processes are running in the background when idle after reboot?
(my guess is you are still at least x2 if not x3 higher from the count my task manager shows below; idle after reboot.)

 

[SvenC]

20 hours ago, Aaron44126 said:

As for “performance improvements”, I don’t see that as much of a concern. Windows is already about as refined as it can be in that area, and I see GPU drivers as the main place where that is in flux, and of course you can still install current GPU drivers on the LTSC version.

I read about less SSD performance and less battery time somewhere and could measure that back in the days when I switched from Win 10 to 11 - first with dual boot to go back to 10 in case of issues and I checked SSD speeds of my data drive  (m.2 NVMe - lower numbers with 11, same hardware, only 10 and 11 on two other drives. Shorter battery time on Win 11.

 

From then on I read about some perf updates which came with "feature updates" and from time to time Win 11 seems to get faster drive speeds and more battery time than in the beginning of Win 11. Biggest SSD slow down is our company policy which forces another virus scanner on our systems so real time scanning slows down and DevDrive cannot use async file scanning...

 

I understand your point of stability of features and behaviour and the choice when to upgrade to next H1 or H2 to avoid surprises after a forced Windows Update 😉