Ethical smartphones

[Ishayin]

Does anyone have any experience with any of these, or know of any similar options?

 

https://www.fairphone.com/
https://www.shiftphones.com/en/
https://www.pine64.org/
 

I thought it might be good to start a thread on this topic.. probably we could have a similar thread about laptops too come to think of it!

[Mr. Fox]

I don't have any experience with any of them, but I have some awareness of the Pine phone. Conceptually, the idea of having a phone that runs on Linux rather than Android or iOS is interesting to me and compelling on the basis that there is no underlying agenda.

[Reciever]

Last I saw fairphone didnt sell to the US, but maybe they are more flexible now, the new device looks pretty nice

[jaybee83]

On 5/8/2022 at 7:53 PM, Ishatix said:

Does anyone have any experience with any of these, or know of any similar options?

 

https://www.fairphone.com/
https://www.shiftphones.com/en/
https://www.pine64.org/
 

I thought it might be good to start a thread on this topic.. probably we could have a similar thread about laptops too come to think of it!

thx for bringing this (back) to my attention, i was actually aware of the fairphone previously but havent paid much attention to it. im currently looking for a new phone for my lady's bday, and i know she would be all over this (shes a "sustainability enthusiast" in her own words haha). although i must say im not convinced on pricing and clunkiness yet, hmmm....

[Ishayin]

On 6/9/2022 at 2:29 AM, Mr. Fox said:

I don't have any experience with any of them, but I have some awareness of the Pine phone. Conceptually, the idea of having a phone that runs on Linux rather than Android or iOS is interesting to me and compelling on the basis that there is no underlying agenda.

 

Definitely. Though I think an Android fully open source version / custom ROM free of any Google proprietary bits is pretty much equivalent in that regard? Though always good to have choice between some different projects. Murena sell "de-Googled" phones for example:
https://murena.com/smartphones/
https://murena.com/shop/

 

I have some other resources related to providing a Google-free Android experience. Maybe should start a separate thread on that subject...

 

9 hours ago, Reciever said:

Last I saw fairphone didnt sell to the US, but maybe they are more flexible now, the new device looks pretty nice

 

I think Teracube is an alternative option in the US, though not sure how great they look tbh:
https://myteracube.com/

 

Another project I forgot to mention in the original post is the Monocles phone, but not sure if that is still an active project:
https://monocles.wiki/index.php?title=Monocles_phone_x

 

 

3 hours ago, jaybee83 said:

thx for bringing this (back) to my attention, i was actually aware of the fairphone previously but havent paid much attention to it. im currently looking for a new phone for my lady's bday, and i know she would be all over this (shes a "sustainability enthusiast" in her own words haha). although i must say im not convinced on pricing and clunkiness yet, hmmm....

 

Yeah, it seems like you inevitably have to pay a premium to not be evil when it comes to tech unfortunately. And I figure it's still even better than any new option just to use older / second-hand phones and keep them working for longer. Though I suppose part of the whole idea around Fairphone and the like is that they are easier to maintain or upgrade, and should hoepfully therefore last you a longer time.

[Mr. Fox]

13 minutes ago, Ishatix said:

I think Teracube is an alternative option in the US, though not sure how great they look tbh:
https://myteracube.com/

The idea behind the project is great, but the specs are lackluster. The headphone jack, removable storage media and removable battery are certainly hardware features that are desirable. The rest is not much better than pre-paid burner phone rubbish. https://myteracube.com/pages/teracube-2e#tech-spec-secs

 

[Ishayin]

18 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

The idea behind the project is great, but the specs are lackluster. The headphone jack, removable storage media and removable battery are certainly hardware features that are desirable. The rest is not much better than pre-paid burner phone rubbish. https://myteracube.com/pages/teracube-2e#tech-spec-secs

 

 

Yeah, that was my impression too.

 

I've made a new thread for Google-free Android here now:
https://notebooktalk.net/topic/500-google-free-android/

 

The first ever thread in that sub-forum, my 69th post, and the 500th thread in the forum... 😄

 

EDIT: How do you have 699 posts already!!? ❤️

[Mr. Fox]

4 minutes ago, Ishatix said:

EDIT: How do you have 699 posts already!!? ❤️

I guess I am the keyboard-jockey equivalent of a blabber-mouth. 😉 

[Reciever]

On 6/10/2022 at 9:31 AM, Mr. Fox said:

I guess I am the keyboard-jockey equivalent of a blabber-mouth. 😉 

It's a tough job but someone's gotta do it. 

[Katja]

Wonder how much it is to ship a Pinephone here to Spain. I don't use my phone much other than YT and some messaging, so Linux on a phone becomes more and more appealing by the day.

[Ishayin]

On 6/19/2022 at 1:52 PM, Katja said:

Wonder how much it is to ship a Pinephone here to Spain. I don't use my phone much other than YT and some messaging, so Linux on a phone becomes more and more appealing by the day.

 

Yeah, same here. I don't even have my phone switched on at the moment. I use Signal these days to stay in contact with people and just use the desktop app for that mainly.

 

I'm still a little confused as to what the draw is of having a Linux phone over simply a Google-free Android and/or custom ROM. Is it for more control and configurability? Or is there certain Linux software that would be useful to run on it?

[jaybee83]

25 minutes ago, Ishatix said:

 

Yeah, same here. I don't even have my phone switched on at the moment. I use Signal these days to stay in contact with people and just use the desktop app for that mainly.

 

I'm still a little confused as to what the draw is of having a Linux phone over simply a Google-free Android and/or custom ROM. Is it for more control and configurability? Or is there certain Linux software that would be useful to run on it?

i can imagine a potential lure would be more control over privacy, more flexibility on customizations and a truly open system.

[Ishayin]

20 hours ago, jaybee83 said:

i can imagine a potential lure would be more control over privacy, more flexibility on customizations and a truly open system.

Thanks, and yes, I've been having a quick look into it more now, and that does seem to be the important parameters. There's a few other points mentioned here:
https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/things-consider-linux-smartphone-os/

I hadn't considered the idea of a dual boot phone before which seems like an interesting approach. You could keep your daily driver OS more open source and private (e.g. Linux), while having a more "standard" Android OS just for running say Google Maps. I anticipate potential problems keeping communications synced between the two, but I think it can work OK with the right choice of messaging app. It might be simpler though just to have two different phones (like I have separate ones for comms and GPS navigation respectively).

 

There's really quite a spectrum of different options built upon the Linux kernel, with the main split between the Linux or Android operating environment built on top of that, and then further splits between more open source Android, or more Google and proprietary software Android. There's a nice little introduction to Linux phones in this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GSudn0qB6u0

It's coming from a less technical younger person's point of view, but not a bad overview all the same. I agree that choice of applications is probably the biggest issue, though I don't agree that there no motivation to develop open-source alternatives (the reality of what we have today clearly demonstrates otherwise).

 

One important issue that doesn't seem to get much attention when considering alternatives is that any solution that requires rooting your phone can immediately make it incompatible with banking apps in particular. I don't like to do banking on my phone anyway, but an increasing number of banks are starting to make apps mandatory for login (there's a deeper issue here about non-technical corporate boardrooms making decisions about what hardware and software we can use). I wonder how compatibility is here with some of the purchased as new solutions. Presumably it is still an issue with the more Linux environment based ones.

 

 

I also came across this table comparing a few different Linux phones:
https://liliputing.com/phones

[K4sum1]

It think it would be cheaper and better to get a used flagship and unlock the bootloader. Even if you want something high end, phone efficiency is plateauing, so you wouldn't miss much getting a used SD855 phone.

 

When the used flagship breaks, carefully replace the stuffs in it. If you can work on laptops and not break stuff, you can work on a phone too.

[jaybee83]

2 hours ago, K4sum1 said:

It think it would be cheaper and better to get a used flagship and unlock the bootloader. Even if you want something high end, phone efficiency is plateauing, so you wouldn't miss much getting a used SD855 phone.

 

When the used flagship breaks, carefully replace the stuffs in it. If you can work on laptops and not break stuff, you can work on a phone too.

what keeps me away from buying used phones is the battery. id have to research first how good the support for that particular phone model is by third party shops able to replace the battery first before making such a decision.

[K4sum1]

Just now, jaybee83 said:

what keeps me away from buying used phones is the battery. id have to research first how good the support for that particular phone model is by third party shops able to replace the battery first before making such a decision.

Hmm, yeah. I usually just buy the cheapest new battery. I don't like old OEM batteries as they bloat up real quick.

[luisxd]

Why get a $800usd smartphone for privacy when you could just get a $30usd prepaid phone without Android/iOS which is better in terms of privacy thatn those overpriced "privacy focused" devices without apps.

[jaybee83]

23 minutes ago, luisxd said:

Why get a $800usd smartphone for privacy when you could just get a $30usd prepaid phone without Android/iOS which is better in terms of privacy thatn those overpriced "privacy focused" devices without apps.

beCUZ mez wants everything! 😛 just like the sheeple want sub 1 inch GAMING laptops with ALL the powahs and ALL the batteryz 😄 

[luisxd]

2 hours ago, jaybee83 said:

beCUZ mez wants everything! 😛 just like the sheeple want sub 1 inch GAMING laptops with ALL the powahs and ALL the batteryz 😄 

The Librem 5 actually looks interesting, with a better price it could be an Android killer. I'd get it for sure, but not for privacy :P

[Ishayin]

PINE64 EU web store is now live

 

https://fosstodon.org/@pine64eu/108588077782291211

 

https://pine64eu.com/

[Papusan]

The old fantastic Nokia 8210 is back. People do you remember this one? I had two of them. 

 

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Nokia-8210-is-back-in-2022-with-4G-LTE-and-microSD-card-support.634286.0.html

 

[ColtC7]

I own a Pinephone(2GB model) with Mobian, while in concept it's cool, in practice it wasn't that cool, as app support is still a bit abysmal(Even with Waydroid, which I couldn't even get working) as most apps either wont run at all, or are not optimized for phone screens. I just use a Galaxy Note 8 in it's place.

[Ishayin]

On 8/23/2022 at 7:20 PM, ColtC7 said:

I own a Pinephone(2GB model) with Mobian, while in concept it's cool, in practice it wasn't that cool, as app support is still a bit abysmal(Even with Waydroid, which I couldn't even get working) as most apps either wont run at all, or are not optimized for phone screens. I just use a Galaxy Note 8 in it's place.

 

Yeah, I have heard from others that it's really more orientated towards being a second device that devs can start using as a platform to do more work towards pushing mobile Linux forwards, and not so great as your main daily driver.

[Ishayin]

The first new phone that has looked interesting to me in years, and due to start shipping next month:

https://volla.online/en/index.html
https://volla.online/en/volla-phone-x23/

 

The additional button for launching apps (e.g. while you're wearing gloves), and easily replaceable battery are key features for me. Though I haven't seen any reviews yet. Would be very interested to see what its camera is like.

 

I'm not planning to buy a new phone any time soon as have a stock of my current favourite (S7 Active), but if you all go out and buy this, then maybe there will be some going second hand that I can grab next decade 

[K4sum1]

I want a modern phone mostly because optimization sucks in modern apps, not even games. Maybe I'll get a cheap 845 phone to see how it compares to the 835 or go full out 8G2. The Volla phone is interesting, but the notch kills it for me. It also has a Helio G99 which is kinda mid and prone to overheating. I think it will be a big issue in a rugged phone like that covered by insulating rubber and plastic.