1610ftw

Unfortunately I strongly dislike colors that are not a neutral black / silver / grey base color and these are what - blueish / turquoise? And do they still have the rubber-finish on the palm rest? Also not a fan of the inverted mainboard design that makes maintenance a pita. Too bad Alienware has decided to go that way. With that being said I love that they don't give a shit and make these quite deep and heavy and also the cherry keyboard is great and of course the cooling.

Thanks, that third run looks rather pathetic! I imagine temperature differences would be a bit higher if it wasn't for thermal throttling but still not nearly as high as with mine. Clearly there is little to be gained from running the CPU at 145W. Probably closer to 120W are needed to avoid excessive thermal throttling.

The lower core temps seemed fine with one SSD and 4 memory sticks, but after your post I wanted to make sure and went down to two memory sticks in slot 2 and 3 - no change unfortunately. Only having three instead of four screws for the CPU part of the heatsink probably doesn't help. The heatsink is the same as the one in your pictures and here so that should be OK: https://www.techpowerup.com/review/schenker-key-18-pro-e25-3/5.html Waiting now to hear from the reseller. That Dell Pro Max 18 Plus (naming inspired by Apple?) looks nice and I would have considered it if they had regular memory - but then you probably would have avoided it so now I look forward to hear how you like yours. Did you order it with the 5090? Regarding gear2 and 4 I completely agree - it is a very unfortunate limitation and I would hope that somebody can come up with a way to make switching between the two options possible, at least when only using two memory sticks.

Thanks man, that is indeed disappointing. I had a 3060 in my X170KM that scored almost 10000 and that was a long time ago. Not what I would call progress! A QHD display and the 5060 are not a very good match when gaming, for QHD I would want the 5070 Ti for better memory, more CUDA cores and higher power limit. But let's see you beat this shameful display of core temperatures ranging from 68 to 100C, despite the fans running at maximum, would be cool if you could also post yours: Edit: No idea how to get the picture post directly, do I need an account with imgur? The other sites I am still posting on just let me attach pictures directly but here we obviously still have that limit and I do not want to erase what I already posted. Edit 2: Found this handy site that creates direct links for imgur: https://imgur-direct-links.vercel.app/

Yeah, I saw that at guru3D I believe and thought it was a great idea - I would still like my p-cores being listed one after the other and not with E-cores intermixed, it makes it much harder to check which is which when looking for temperature differences. In any case my unit seems to have an issue that is coming from the lower left "#2" corner as that is where the hottest P- and E-cores can be found and even P-cores #4 and #6 are still pretty hot. Yeah, my thoughts exactly, that can't be normal and indeed I was not sure which was which but now I remember: Your Alienware topped out below 70C and @win32asmguy tested the X580 with a max temperature that was in the 70s - certainly nothing dramatic while over here some cores are cooking. Hopefully something that can be fixed and not a seriously bent heat sink. I just want to be prepared and not complain about something that is inherent in these chips but from what I can see it is not normal.

So I got the Clevo X580 and connectivity is really disappointing as I ran out of USB-A with it very quickly, two USB-A imo is still a joke for a desktop replacement but hey we have two 2.5 Gbe RJ45 connectors... Also there is no fingerprint sensor which is really strange as Schenker even sells the X580 as a workstation. Other than that the case is not looking great but very stealthy with no pulsating lights or any crap like that although it overall feels less solid when picked up compared to my Raider 18. But I knew this before and the Clevo is the only 18" QHD game in town that is both relatively affordable and has at least three SSD slots which is a must for me. I am also rather pleased that I can still use Clevo Fan Control which is the kind of utility that I prefer to bloated control centers of various kinds. So I am now testing the CPU and it looks like to me that the temperature variations between cores stink - is this an Arrow Lake thing? Here is what I got from a cold start after a single CB R23 run, max CPU power according to HWiNFO is only 142W: CPU: 275HX temp range P-cores: 68 to 96C - 28C temperature differential! temp range E-cores: 78 to 98C - 20C temperature differential So in other words the cooling is pretty much crap both with regard to max power uptake and temperature differences between cores. A run with the Raider 18 HX with comparable power budget and the 14900HX resulted in ca. 20C lower temps and temperature differentials between 5C (E-cores) and 9C (P-cores) which is how it should be. Hopefully somebody like @win32asmguy or @electrosoft who have experience with this gen mobile chips can confirm that differentials like this are not normal for the 275HX as then I will have to haggle with my reseller about how to do a repaste. Also what is it with the P- and E-Cores being all mixed up in HWiNFO - Intel could not arrange these in P- and E-groups as before? It is no wonder they are going down when they cannot even get things like these right any more...

It is a shame the 1070 did not work out, it would have made things a lot easier! My 8740W is with my youngest son right now and indeed the cooling is pretty bad, we have solved that for now with added cooling via external fan as otherwise temps ramp up too much and the external fan is also still pretty quiet. HP does not see to have planned this workstation with peak performance in mind. If you go ahead with some kind of modding for higher power uptake then I hope you are right that the chassis is as robust as you estimate! In any case it is a great combo - Dreamcolor 16:10, GTX980m and top of the line CPU!

Wow - way to go! What 980m did you get for it? If you can pull up to 213W from the wall I would strongly suggest to leave it at that. This is a very old chassis by now and it can get pretty hot in places so 213W is probably the absolute maximum that HP was comfortable with when the 8740W was new so why not leave it at that? Also this is probably an EC limit like MSI is using and very hard to get around and there would be the risk of bricking your beautiful machine.

Cool to hear you are having these two for testing! Currently waiting for my Clevo X580 as all high performance options have issues for me this year so I am going for something where I do not expect top notch but just OK performance and what is very important a QHD panel, 4 memory and 4 SSD slots 🙂 I would suggest to use Throttlestop power limits to even out power consumption in a comparison as for some reason MSI never sets meaningful power limits for its laptops and often goes up to 220W for the CPU alone that cannot be sustained in normal operation. Looking at the Raider and Alienware cooling solutions I would expect the Alienware to be able to pull anywhere from 15 to 30W more than the MSI at a given temp and noise level so a more meaningful comparison would probably be with the MSI being limited to somewhere between 150 and 170W via Throttlestop. As for fans I have never really used automatic fan curves on MSI as they are just very bad and that was starting with the GT72. These days I strongly suggest Feature Manager and a custom fan curve - that works really well and prevents the fans from being annoying all the time.

Biggest con for me is the UHD screen - I will not get a laptop with that kind of screen If I do not have to, QHD it is. I hope that this will not be the last Lenovo 18" model or that they maybe add a lower cost option of this one with a QHD screen.

I would like to see a less silly version of this with: 5070Ti QHD screen regular surfaces less obstrusive logo and light bar Other than that there is a lot to like with lots of firsts for Lenovo.

Wow - too bad! I think it would be better for the forum to keep the posts and replace the user name with deleted user or something like that.

Did you try limiting max power uptake? That could help with the 275HX. Hopefully undervolting will be available soon - the 13th and 14th gen needed it more but it should still save you up to 10% power on the CPU and either allow you to run cooler or with more performance. Agreed, also all his other posts are gone like in this thread. @Reciever can you elaborate on why we cannot see any of the posts of SACBomber any more? I would have thought that as soon as somebody posts here he would agree for his posts and threads to stay even when he leaves but apparently this isn't the case?

@grisevg I think you are referring to this: Looks like there are different versions of the QTJ1 with one significantly worse than the other but I guess it is hard to exactly know what one is getting as all of them are after market modifications. How is your turbo and non turbo clock speed and can you unlock it and get higher turbo clocks? If this is a 10980HK it should have no problem going up to 5.0 GHz all cores and 5.1 GHz single core although for your chassis something like 4.4 to 4.8 GHz all core sounds more reasonable. In any case if those were "real" 10980HK the memory speeds would be a lot higher so that points to these being engineering samples which should also show up in significantly lower turbo and base clock speeds.

Sorry, somehow did not see this post. Looks like yours did not have PTM7950 then! Haha, taking off the heatsink can be bad as you have to not only take off the screws for CPU and GPU but also for the fans 🙂 Have you tried to play around with the Clevo Control Center fan settings? Usually you can use it to tame the fans to a degree although you have to keep an eye on temps. I usually like to have a curve that keeps noise in check up to ca. 80C on the CPU and 70C on the GPU but with a unified heat sink is it more difficult to allow the CPU to get hotter than the GPU, especially when both are under load.

Did you get the X580? Looks like the SACbomber account is gone - that is unusual!

Cannot currently be undervolted but from what I have gathered undervolting would not help you that much. In the thread about the new MSI Titan @SACbomber reported between -30 and -50mV which is pretty low so you would get much less of a performance bump via undervolting compared to last gen CPUs that for me were all undervolting in excess of -100mV.

The SSDs will heat up the motherboard to some degree and I have long wondered how much of an issue that would be. MSI and Clevo used to have their own self contained area with an array of up to 3 NVME SSDs some time ago but since then I have only seen the provision for cooling pads that connect to the mainboard. Does that mean it is safe? I would be a little bit sceptical if we are talking about writing terabytes to an SSD regularly but for everyday use it is probably fine. As a rule of thumb I try to avoid temperatures above 75C when transferring big amounts of data while shooting for regular temps in the low 60s or preferably less - quite high but such can be the realities in laptops. You can get HD Sentinel to check temps for yourself in the task bar and other parameters, too. It also warns you of possible failures. I have used the family license for years and highly recommend it, a test version is provided for free: Hard Disk Sentinel - HDD health and temperature monitoring

Yes, saw that too, pathetic. The pictures also tell the story of a rather bad Tongfang imitation with a cheap looking case. Severe lack of judgement on behalf of Medion coupled with a price that does not at all reflect the subpar performance.

Well, this has hundreds of posts, got a link?

Which main thread are you talking about?

I do not think that I misunderstood. My point was that in stock condition and as intended the x170 is the better laptop due to a number of factors with one very important one being the demise of SLI. Can the P870 be made better with a lot of effort and specialized knowledge? Clearly it can but that does not negate my point about the X170 being a better overall laptop in stock condition. As the P870 already has a thread where this is discussed I suggest we take this discussion there as I think that what you are doing with the P870 chassis is pretty cool.

That has some crazy potential with a 980W power supply and water cooling but it has to have a bigger screen and a proper keyboard. No idea who gave input on this but with a QHD+ 18" and a proper full keyboard with numpad it would be a much more tempting option. I can understand that they may want to have a mousepad in there and possibly it is difficult to place it in front of the keyboard or it would increase height but in my opinion that is not necessary for what is really a mobile desktop. When you always need a power outlet you should also be able to bring a mouse even if the trackpad cannot be moved down in front of the keyboard. Oh and I wonder about their battery option - would be nice to at least have some one or two hours of battery life and it would probably help with sales.

It is very impressive that for high performance laptops Uniwill / Tongfang are leading the way in several areas: modularity cooling bios customizeability thanks to working with Prema Intel and AMD option for the CPU To be fair to Clevo they are not exceptionally bad with regard to modularity but they have fallen in line with everybody else and they are still not back at the top when it comes to cooling capacity. Luckily the combination of improved cooling over last gen and a CPU that needs less power will give a lot better results but the 330W power supply already shows that they are not that serious about performance.

Not sure what the argument is here. Clearly an desktop GPU board would only fit in the P870 but for using it as is the X170 is a better laptop because the added capability of the P870 to use a second GPU is not of much use any more and does not outweigh the keyboard, sound and lesser CPU cooling. In any case what is holding the P870 back the most is by now the CPU unless maybe you manage to put a 5080 in there for 4K gaming where frame rates will be affected the least.