electrosoft

I'm not doing backflips over its performance or the fact if you let it run full tilt it will heat up real quick to try to sustain 3.1ghz+ I do love the form factor though. Visions of SFF builds dance through my head. To me, that is its primary strength. It fails everywhere else but that compact, elegant design is awesome IMHO. 🙂

And yet we all bought the overpriced editions to get that little bit of ooomph!!! You too @Papusan...... 🤣 At a certain point, it isn't about cost. It is about getting a model you want based upon your criteria. FE = Suprim = Astral to me in regards to desire regardless of price.

Ditto, I plan on testing it on one of my several laptops to see what it can do along with this desktop I'm building out from spare parts to sell and clear space (12900k, 32GB DDR5, 500GB SSD, 3080) for testing.

Let me rephrase it. 🙂 Are prices now the same across the board with AIBs as they were at launch or did prices go up officially for AIB MSRP pricing too over the last few months like they did in the US?

The power with Nanogrease and laptops is the fact it is so thick and doesn't pump out. It is all I use unless I can correct the pairing pressure enough to use KPx. My vial will arrive tomorrow, so I'll see how thick it is.

Yeah, I ordered the one you linked the non 5 variant:

What testing methodology did you employ? What was it tested against? EDIT: $5.81 and free shipping on Amazon atm (Prime), so I went ahead and snagged a vial to try because....why not?

To give you an idea of drop ratios of 5090 vs 5080/9070xt, this is the recent snap shot from one of the stock trackers I follow for USA: The bulk of these drops are disproportionately skewed Amazon (like 90%) including both 5090 drops which were for a TUF for $2999.99 and an Astral for $3359.99.

Are 5090 prices fully back to MSRP? One thing I will say in the US is pre-built 5090 systems are deeply in stock now at Newegg and the one or two models Microcenter sells also routinely pop up with a few in stock across their stores. No longer lucrative to scalpers to yank the cards for resale.... Pretty much what @Papusan posted. The Tariffs and ever in flux economic status of the US right now has caused many companies to pause pre-orders or not ship stock while they try to figure out where this is going to end. Every country on that tariff list, even with the pause, is still subject to a minimum 10% tariff. China is still fully under the 145% tariff and they are not backing down so the US might as well settle in for a protracted economical war. Someone has to blink. At least China didn't retaliate past 125% basically saying at this point, "this is getting stupid." 🤣 Prices are going to go up because of the tariffs. A few estimates are looking at ~$4k/yr increase in cost per house hold on average (+/- 10%) due to this economic war. $4k isn't much to many of us, but for ~50% of the country that lives paycheck to paycheck? Of course a large chunk of that $4k per household indirectly goes right into the government's till via the tariff tax. For tech, one bright spot (thank you Apple and google) is that smart phones and computers are exempt from the 154% tariff but still subject to the original 20% tariff. For the time being, it makes most sense to just ship Nvidia cards everywhere else that are much more price stable than the US at the moment. I guess this is what it felt like to be in the EU all those years with your high priced tech. 🤣

STATE OF THE GPU MARKET ------------------------------------- Still waiting on Nvidia and their "big drops!" outside of 5070s, 5070tis and 5080's which have my stock watchers chiming so much I had to mute them. 9070xt's drop fairly regular too daily but sell out instantly. 5070's stay in stock for long stretches especially the stupidly priced models. For example, shipped and sold by Newegg Zotac 5070 for $949.99. 5070ti shipped and sold by Newegg for $1039 and $1099 both Asus models. 5080 "bundles" on Newegg only thing available atm for $1770 (MSI) and $1945 (ASUS) All 9070xt sold out at Newegg. Even that $6k Astral bundle that lasted 3 days eventually sold out. Haven't seen a sniff of the Newegg Shuffle recently. NO Nvidia VPA RTX 5090 drops since March 25th and almost two months since Best Buy (I think BB is DOA for 5090 Founders). Probably holding back while price adjustments will be coming in for the tariffs. I wouldn't be surprised to see 5080 FE jump to $1199.99 and 5090 FE jump to $2399.99. Watching my stock bots over the last week or two and you barely get any alarms for 5090s while when I check in the morning, the 9070xt is usually anywhere from 20-40 notifications but they always sell out indicating small batches and scalpers still on them. Best Buy had *1* drop in the last week and it was for a Gigabyte Waterforce 5090 that was gone before I could even add to basket. Last Newegg 5090 drop (non combo) was 3/20 for a TUF 5090 Last MSI Store 5090 drop (combo) was 3/29 Last Best Buy drop 5090 was 4/8 (Waterforce) Almost every 5090 drop when they do show up is usually Amazon I flat out don't trust Amazon and their constant dings and prices fluctuating all over the place. You follow them up and it is always some 3rd party seller most shady others names we know that are gouging like crazy (Platinum Micro and Hidevolution for starters). --- Shipped and sold by Amazon for Prime members but look at that price plus a two week+ lead time...

Congrats brother! I thought the same thing. 🤣

I don't think that's the win you think it is. 🤣 "Just grab a ~$575 after tax unicorn 5070FE and viola! Repairio Fixumdulus!!!" Kinda like Nvidia and the 5080 holding back so much clock and memory speed..... You can just SMELL that 5080 Super in 10 months! 🤣 Or Intel selling silicon with plenty in the tank for years just to bin it up in 6 months to offer a faster version for more money... Corporations just Corporating as expected.....

I figured for $1500, that would be an easy pick up for @VULC even with $200 S&H on top of it. Nah, 4090 is nowhere near "far superior." You can use that talk when comparing a 5090 to a 4090 but 4090 vs 5080? I'll pop my 5080 FE back in and overclock it seeing as an OC'd 4090 was only ~10fps faster than my stock 5080 in WoW both GPU capped at 99%. I can guarantee you the 4090 will only be 1-3fps ahead. Still, I'd take a 4090 over a 5080 everyday of the week if they were priced somewhat the same or the 4090 was only $200-300 more. $1500 vs $1000? Things start to get dicey.... $2100 (sell price of my 4090) vs $1000 (buy price of my 5080)? 5080 all day everyday.... In WoW, I don't know how far the 5090 could soar because it is CPU limited but even where it topped out my 9800X3D it was already up 35% over my 4090 OC vs OC with utilization at 80% vs 99% on the 4090. Depends on what you're seeking. Enthusiasts, OC'ers, blockers (unless they have no choice) and those who want the best air thermals won't touch the FE with a 10 foot pole. Me? Meh. I'm fine either direction. Many months ago, I said my picks were the FE, Suprim and Astral. That still remains in place. $599 is a perfectly valid price for the 9070xt especially in the current market conditions. I mean, if they want to drop it further, sure, but they don't need to.

Well at least I got the Zotac part right.... ....but damn. 😞 What did the staff say about 5090 inventory and drops? Definitely looks good! And it starts..... Yeah, AM5 chips are clustered within a range of 3-5 it seems which is very tight vs Intel which has a range sometimes of 10-15. I'd be curious for testing to see your chips on a 1dpc board. Like I found out before, even the dirt cheap Asrock 1dpc boards could hit 8000+ while my Carbon could not reliably.

Astral EK Waterblock looks saweet.... Yeah, that's never going to happen. There is this pipe dream that all this manufacturing is going to come back to the US and it's basically a non starter except in specific pockets to protect bigger critical industries from China (IE TSMC). Other manufacturing will continue to migrate to the Vietnams, Indias and Malaysias of the world and more. I expect any and all tariff issues there to clear up sooner than later because they all want to be the next China and setting the parameters for that begins with the tariffs. As for the rash of other tariffs unleashed en masse upon the world? Whew.... that is a mess. Unlike China which keeps the bulk of their manufacturing in country, the bulk of USA corporations have long abandoned the USA for access to cheap labor and lax rules but that centralized manufacturing has resulted in China and the USA becoming the largest economies in the world with every other country a very distant 3rd and lower. The easiest way to neuter China is to hit them in their production capacity which is exactly what is happening. The slow withdrawal from China has been happening since 2018 with the first round of tariffs against China and people often forget that when Biden was in office he not only left ALL those tariffs in place for a reason while offering incentives to move production out of China he raised some of them even more before leaving office. The writing has been on the wall for almost 7 years now regardless of Democrats or Republicans in office. It's just that the conflict has now gone from a 3 to a 10 real quick when a 5 or 6 would have sufficed to keep things moving properly and not cause as much disruption.

Yeah, that is extremely behind the 13th and 14th series in regards to clock frequency and seeing as WoW likes as much as it can get vs core count, a 14900KS with tuned 8000+ memory would really decimate it in performance especially with a 4090/5090. Same obviously goes for even a 285k and 9950X3D/9800X3D. --- @Papusan New GPU Tweak III with active warning alert for power. Works on the Astral 5090 and Matrix 4090. https://rog.asus.com/us/graphics-cards/graphics-cards/rog-astral/rog-astral-rtx5090-o32g-gaming/helpdesk_download/

How high can you clock it though? SP109 14900KS I was using (and now the wife is using) was clocking 5.9ghz all core in WoW and re-tuned on her Asus Strix Z690 D4 (my very first Z690 MB, the gift that keeps on giving) is clocking 6.2 on the newest BIOS in WoW and staying at or under 1.4v and ~70c on an EVGA CLC 280 w/ KPx and B-die sticks dialed in at CL15 4000 super tight across the board 2x16GB ( @Mr. Fox B-die sticks I bought several years ago that keep on giving) . WoW will gobble up every last bit of frequency and it loves tight timings. Only at >=5.7ghz and dialed in 8000 did my 13900KS SP113 almost catch up to my 7800X3D. 5.9ghz and 8200 dialed in on the 14900KS made a good attempt but couldn't hang with my 9800X3D for WoW. Before switching, the 14900KS at 59/45/45 8200 tuned had zero problems in my benchmarking spot capping out the 4090 overclocked to 3135mhz/+1500 memory. --- @Talon has his 285k dialed in and has had really good results. I think he has all three platforms now under his roof (9800X3D, 13/14th gen, Ultra 9) all tuned up w/ a 5090 to swap between them so he could give us a better overall appraisal for gaming between the three on the 5090 I can't really find any good results or tests for TWW and the 285k dialed in on the level we play and tests I know I personally run so it's frustrating. For a game still massively popular, it gets no love on YT for proper, controlled benchmarking. I could maybe try to snag a binned 285k (SP90+ would be nice) and a decent board but that is $1k right there and then you're gonna want to go with at least 8600+ memory and that's another $300+ so just like that $1300+ to play around. I'd actually go for 9000+ at this point In this video, tuned properly, it seems to be hanging with the 9800X3D at 4k with a slight lead on average, but that is with a 4090 and he is running 9000 rated DDR5 for $340. Look below to my response to @tps3443 about open box Apex boards and 9000 memory on Newegg. --- I personally would hold onto your 5090 because that price paid ($2500 all in) is really good especially now and then build out a better gaming rig around it, but with that being said having spent the last several days in WoW with my 9800X3D + 5090, those absolute frame tanks in ORBs and loaded Theatre events is a killer and I am unsure (along with the 5090 being an absolute powerhouse of a GPU) if it is the cache being exhausted, engine limitations, CPU limitations or a combination of all three but watching the fps drop to ~67 on the ORB in the Undermine and GPU utilization plummet to 22% is disheartening. Good thing is your exact model 5090 still command $3.4k+ on eBay w/ a new MSRP of $3059 so reselling it would be very easy and pocketing a bit of change or sell it to a board member at cost and pat yourself on the back. Ok, as long as you weren't gonna try to say your platform is the same as an AM5/14th gen tuned up for gaming. If you did, you get some of this: But in all seriousness, 285k or 9950X3D is your next, great frontier @tps3443 if you want to truly have a go at it with your 5090. I would be lying if I said it hasn't crossed my mind lately having exhausted AMD 7800X3D, 7950X3D and 9950X3D along with Intel 12900k, SP113 13900KS and SP109 14900KS. I get these itches I have to scratch.... Newegg has some open box z890 Apex MBs for a crazy price of $371! Toss in a pair of 9000 cudimms for $339 (or TG 8800) and then either pick up a new lottery pick 285k or look for a decent bin on the forums.... Yeah, I agree. It is going to be top dog for the next two years +. I bought my Liquid 4090 3 months in and rocked it for almost two years. I plan on doing the same with the Astral (or whatever I end up with in the next 30-60 days, but probably the Astral. Sweet sample, no coil whine, runs cool and quiet).

Yeah, that HEDT has its merits, but driving a 5090 and for WoW is not it. If WoW is choking out a tuned 9800X3D, there's no way Sapphire Rapids can compete. All my testing shows the 5090 is just a beast and if you play at QHD you're really limiting the 5090 as it truly is a 4k card that separates from the pack at 4k. At QHD is gets mired down in the same bottlenecks the 4090 suffered but even moreso. If you really want it to shine you have two options to at least do that 5090 some justice: Build out a 9800X3D/9950X3D (tuned) Build out a 14900KS w/ 8200+ DDR5 tuned<---required. I wish I had the resources to properly test a 285k tuned but I am now seriously over tapped and scrambling to get my tech budget out of the deep red. How does the card clock at stock? OC? Coil Whine? temps? I know you got in early and paid a decent price for it total w/ tax? Well, with the tariffs, AIBs really have no choice but to raise prices as they're not in the market of losing money. What will happen if the tariffs continue as such (China isn't backing down) is AIBs will slow or stop orders as demand will drop with even higher pricing and they will focus on the sectors that can swallow the cost increases for profitability. You will continue to have a smaller section of consumers that WILL pay $3-4k for 5090s as they trickle in. Nvidia has no problems not producing 5090s as the AI market is still in full demand. This is one time they simply don't care enough and will just go where the $$$ is. Even now, 5090s in the US are still painfully trickling in and yes, while I made fun of that $6k combo package on Newegg lasting three days, eventually they sold out. Those +24 Astrals will eventually move or be re-allocated elsewhere when buyers realize prices aren't coming down and probably will eventually go up. As they see prices continue to rise they are stuck between a rock and a hard place. They have two options....skip this gen or suck it up and buy one. Depends on what you want. For example, @Mr. Fox wouldn't touch an FE with a 10 foot pole. It is good for what it is and based on cost, I would pick one up maybe, but in terms of cooling, OC and capability? Meh. I love LOVE the aesthetics though but the more I use this Astral? It's pricey but I like the extras across the board. Bang:Buck though the 5090 FE is a gem as long as there is no coil whine or electronic noise. Those fans spinning up drive me a bit bonkers though. You can't copium your way out of running a much weaker platform that isn't doing the 5090 proper justice @tps3443!! Don't delude yourself!! 🤣

PNY prices on walmart (shipped and sold by walmart.com) just jumped drastically too. Epic-X OC is now $3599.99 from ~$2999.99. Zero recent updates on any VPA 5090 FEs going out and BB hasn't had 5090 FEs since about a week or so after VPA started via Nvidia. 5080s continue to rain down every day tripping stock watcher alarms all the time. 5090's go quiet for days on end and then a trickle comes out and then it goes quiet again. China is not backing down (I never expected them too), and with threats of even higher tariffs in play things are going to get real messy real quick.

MSI raised their prices but $~3500 for a gaming trio? CDW has deep roots into the supply chain and this is a pre-order that clearly isn't going to be honored considering they haven't even gotten a card yet. MSI last raised the price to $3049.99, but if this is CDW getting wind of further price hikes with the new tariffs kicking in sooner than later, that is bad news.....

In an odd moment of uniqueness, everyone in this thread who has a 5090 has a different model lol. Listed in order of acquisition: @Talon = TUF OC 5090 @tps3443 = 5090 FE @Papusan = Astral 5090 LC @electrosoft = Astral 5090 Air @jaybee83 = Suprim 5090 Did I miss anybody? Maybe @johnksss will roll up with a Zotac....

I'm seeing 21-27w.....

I guess it comes down to perspective as the market will ultimately determine how much any given product is. The price hikes are insane from start. Throw in demand, price increases, AIB greed, external market forces now in play along with AI demand now pulling at both the 4090 and 5090 market and...well....here we are. I really think AMD is making a lot of inroads against Nvidia in the gamer/home market that Nvidia will regret later. The lower and mid has always been the biggest slice of the pie and AMD already owns the PS and Xbox along with steam decks. They keep pecking away until they break through. None of us thought AMD would dominate CPU sales but a few slips from Intel along with bad press and disgruntled users and here we are. Thinking back, it all started with them extending Skylake++++ from 6th->10th then landing the dud 11th (personally, I liked my Frankencpu). That really started to turn the tide for AMD on many smaller levels especially with the 5800X3D. 12th was Intel's welcome back party vanquishing the 5800X3D, then Intel snatched back AVX512, then we were right back to the furnaces aka 13th-14th along with all their problems while AMD brought out AM5 and more X3D loving and better overall power draw then Intel dropped the quasi-dud 285k (aka tinkerer's delight) and now you have AMD basically dominating CPU sales everywhere. The same can happen to Nvidia and mindshare / marketshare can slowly but surely shift. 5000 series is leaving many consumers disgruntled and the market Nvidia ignores or takes for granted today will turn their backs on them when they need them the most tomorrow. With that being said, in the here and now the 5090 is the king just further extending its lead even more so over AMD and the 9070xt to mind boggling levels in some cases. My wife was right. You can't take it with you and I'm not going to spend two+ years looking forlornly through the sears roebuck glass window while the kids inside frolic happily amongst the toys when I can fully afford every toy in the store. I'm going to take my lumps, sell off some other toys to establish tech budget parity and just enjoy it for a few years like I did with my MSI liquid 4090 and then sell it off when the 6090 drops and hopefully AMD will have the jump like they did with the 5700xt -> 6900xtx with the 9070xt -> ???? and maybe that will be the first true sign of Nvidia's slow fall. I absolutely love the 5090/5080 FE design. I love everything about it from the aesthetics to packing that much punch in a two slot design. Astral 5090 absolutely dwarfs my 5080 FE. --- I commented on that several messages back about how outside of the gross mark ups on GPUs followed by motherboards having really gone up in price over the last several generations, everything else is about par for the course and priced reasonable. I remember when some were saying SSD prices were going to go through the roof last year and they went nowhere. DDR5 prices have fallen quite nicely. We may look back at this exchange and sadly laugh in a few months, but for now yeah. --- I commented on MSI's prices a bit ago too when the new pricing went up on Microcenter's website. Ventus for $3k MSRP? You coulda at least bought me dinner first.... 🤮 LOL, that's hilarious. 🤣 And yeah, for this price it needs to shine my shoes and clean my car..... I still have almost two months to return it to BB. If an FE or unicorn Gigabyte/PNY $2200 5090 pops up, I will snag it and if it does an ok job return the Astral (or resell it if the market implodes in the next month wit tariffs and/or more AIB greed) I'm just glad to see pre-builts and ludicrous combo deals ($6k lolz) no longer are being botted and the GPUs sold for ridiculous amounts.

The 5080 only 5fps behind the 4090 is also decent too, but yeah, the 5090 has humbled my 9800X3D for both WoW and FO76.... The price though. It was the discussion over dinner tonight with me going on and on about the price , product cycles and Nvidia and the market in general with the Mrs and she casually takes a bite of a pita and says, "didn't you just blow 2x that on our vacation with our daughter in February? Do you REALLY want to spend two years+ complaining about the price knowing it will most likely go up or do you want to enjoy that time with this computer part you clearly want to keep? You said it is flawless basically and a good 'clocker' or whatever the hell that means. Keep the damn thing. It's not like we can take it with us." Perspective. 🤑 (Personally, I think she was indirectly saying "stop bitchin' about it.") 🤣 Exactly. With the prices and poor performance uplift overall for 5000 series notebooks for what I would need to 'upgrade' I'm locked in for a few years now unless some crazy deal comes along or I get sent a unit which never happens with 18" variants. --- Well, it was one of my three selections (FE, Suprim, Astral aka small, medium, large) and the fact it has basically no coil whine, 4th fan noise is such a nothing burger it isn't even funny and clocks nicely (plus aesthetics) along with tariffs getting ready to go into overdrive sooner than later, might as well settle in for the long haul. I just keep the basic OC on it (no +PL or +voltage, just the limited sliders in GT3 default settings) and it sits at 67c, 73c mem @ 3127mhz and fans never go above 50% with this chonker of a cooler on it. It smokes my 4090. Not as bad as my 4090 smoked my 3090, but it definitely smokes it. One thing I do like is the 5080 fans would spin up from time to time even on the desktop due to the FE design. Astral basically has a NASA approved 500lb deep space heatsink on it so it sits at idle outside of everything but real, meaningful loads. If you've ever seen Transformers the first movie (non animated), if the all spark was to zap this thing and bring it to life, it could take down megatron and optimus prime together at the same time. The card is just ginormous. --- I figure the reduction in cost due to efficiencies and reduced power draw of your CPU and GPU would easily be negated by the cost of running the chiller itself. I remember seeing a few of your older videos with the chiller running and hearing it and thinking, "that would go right out the door or at least to another room with all that noise." 🙂

Revisiting this, the 5090 is end game for WoW for now. It literally lives or dies on the strength of the CPU and even at 4k with as basic of an OC as you can get (GPU Tweak 3 is capped on GPU and Mem sliders vs MSI AB + zero PL/Voltage adjustments in play), hitting 3127mhz and removing all player data at 4k Ultra RT max and I'm sitting at 78-82% utilization. I spent a few hours flying all over the place looking for any spot I could find to put more of a burden on the GPU and basically that spot in Hallowfall is the best spot I could find. I'll keep looking though. So what this means is that without player data hitting the CPU, the 9800X3D can only push the soft OC (aka, something I would run everyday no problem vs bench settings in AB) 5090 to ~80% Utilization on average. Throw in player data, and it is all downhill from there down to moments even hitting 22% with all the FX and player data but just by the nature of the power of the 5090 it still gives overall better fps than the 4090 but only marginally so due to diminishing returns while still overall being wasted because it's just too darn powerful. Now it becomes a race to optimize lows as much as possible and looking at some data, that will be retesting highly tuned 2000/6000 vs 2200/6400 vs 2000/8000 and seeing what produces the best lows. According to HW unboxed testing 6000 vs 8000, while the avg are about the same overall, 8000 appears to have much better lows overall and seeing as what I'm driving now are a set of TG 8200 sticks tuned at 2200/6400......you can see where this is going. 🤣 If there was a CPU that could keep up with the 5090, I suspect in WoW, based upon 80% utilization at ~170fps, we would probably see 200+ fps if properly fed = ~50%+ faster than the 4090 considering the 4090 capped out at ~135fps with 99% utilization in the same setting. 5090 is a power hungry, expensive absolute monster for WoW.... ....FO76 not so much because again X3D was already tapped even with a 4090 but the mild gains from going from the 7800X3D -> 9800X3D are appreciated and it already ran nicely. Wait, so 3 cases, 2 (soon three) AMD MBs, but only two 9950x's on hand? Hmmm.... Either one MB goes bye bye or another AMD chip will have to join the fold. While I continue to evaluate it (heh), I am slowly putting into place the pieces to sell off another large swath of hardware to compensate: NH55 3070ti w/ 12900k golden boy + 32GB Kingston + 1TB (on the forums soon and fleabay) 5080 FE (This will go on eBay for ~$1500) 3080 Strix ($500 on eBay or $400 here) Darkrock Gigabyte build w/ Z690 + 12900k + 32GB 6400 DDR5 + 850w PSU + 1tb SSD (TBD) 2x32GB 6000 DDR5 kit (TBD) 2x24GB 6400 DDR5 kit (TBD) and a few other pieces. I have several 4050/3050 based laptops gathering space. If not, I can't keep both my MSI laptop AND the 5090 and after seeing how X3D and 4090/5090 are made for each other..... After seeing these results: The only logical upgrade from my MSI Raider 18 w/ 7950HX3D + 4090 is a 9950HX3D + 5090 laptop and that is $5k for marginal gains so no thank you.