*Official Benchmark Thread* - Post it here or it didn't happen :D

[electrosoft]

Best Buy open box Gigabyte 4090 w/ GPU factory seal intact on card missing GPU core....

 

Same best buy who sold me a Nikon digital camera years ago with no camera in the box

Sold me a brand new factory sealed 7950X3D which just had a 7950X in the box

 

At this point, outside of factory sealed / new (and even then....), I would only buy from someone I know and trust or have all protection mechanisms in place, sheesh.

 

 

[cylix]

6 hours ago, electrosoft said:

 

I don't blame ya, but it looks like the 5090 might not hit till early next year. I know I have two people who saw some of my screen shots gaming on stock vBIOS hitting 3120 on stock cooling reach out and ask to let them know when I sell mine to keep them in mind as they would like to buy it so OC's do count for many.

 

I did contemplate selling mine for how much I paid for it and riding my 7900xtx to the 5090. I'd have to turn off RT in WoW though. 😞

 

*Shrug* As long as memory hit +1000 and clocks were 2900, I'd be ok with it but the extra goodness never hurts.

 

 

 

 

Wanted to sell mine aswell in that time didn't do it and I haven't checked  in ages the second hand market for 4090, just did it today and did the prices took a nose dive or are scams? I see a lot of 4090 around 1000-1200 euro..like 500 less like last time.. is the same in US? At these prices i will just keep it until 5090 or just skip a generation..

[Papusan]

19 hours ago, Papusan said:

 

The beauty is in the details. Intel need help. What a down turn for the blue. 

 

Now we see where the claimed power efficiency comes from. Yup, hybrid chips get an meaning. A hybrid in all ways. 

 

The announcement comes as Intel embarks on a vast restructuring in the wake of troubling financial results last quarter.

 

Out with the Intel node, in with TSMC.

Intel announces cancellation of 20A process node for Arrow Lake, goes with 'external nodes,' likely TSMC

 

 

 

18 hours ago, electrosoft said:

Good! TSMC is the market leader in node fabs. Let Intel continue to progress.....

 

Still a huge failure.

 

 

They saw an progress for 18A process node and hence scrapped A20. And this come now. There is simply no trust in Intel right now. This was in the card a long time. Intel never intended to use A20 in any of their new chips. And A18, that one will come for mobile junk in 2025. Remember the Rocket lake desktop chips.... They got the old 14nm node while the mobil chips went on 10NM. The history repeats itself once again. Intel is their own enemy. Or better say they have greedy shareholders that want to reduce the losses with every tool they have in their tool box.

Intel's poor stock performance could lead to its removal from the Dow Jones

The chipmaker can't seem to catch a break this year

 

 

And the race for offering maximum power efficiency will continue... Now we see Qualcomm will have a bite of the cake. And Intel and AMD need to offer same power efficiency and maximum performance will come second or last.

Qualcomm CEO: We will build circuits for desktop computers

If Cristiano Amon has his way, future Snapdragon chips will be in all kinds of personal computers, even powerful desktops.

[electrosoft]

10 hours ago, cylix said:

Wanted to sell mine aswell in that time didn't do it and I haven't checked  in ages the second hand market for 4090, just did it today and did the prices took a nose dive or are scams? I see a lot of 4090 around 1000-1200 euro..like 500 less like last time.. is the same in US? At these prices i will just keep it until 5090 or just skip a generation..

 

Maybe EU trends? In the US, models are still selling new and used prices are still good.

 

So many scammers out there it is hard to tell these days since 4090s still retail for a crapton relatively speaking especially better 3rd party models. Missing cores and memory or sometimes flat out fake PCBs, scary.

 

Looking at eBay for my model, they still sell relatively high. There is one person on there with low feedback who has sold two and has a third up that is screaming scam as they have no other sales in the last 6 months. eBay protection will help out the buyers if it is, but listings like that tend to go for lower than normal because buyers do not want the hassle. Probably if you check back in a month or two they will have been removed.

 

The Suprim X 4090 has the best PCB right under the HOF and even then silicon lottery comes into play as I've seen plenty pick up HOF and Suprim X and get absolute trash silicon and/or memory. I mentioned it before, but one of the two Suprim X's I had was terrible and I returned it. (~2900 max OC, +700 memory) vs my current one (+3120 OC, +1600 memory) both on stock vBIOS.

 

But I also think even *bad* silicon is still a killer card at stock. I just happened to have bought my current one from Newegg and then Best Buy had them in stock so I picked one up to see if I could potentially get a better bin and it was total trash from that perspective and monster coil whine. I couldn't wait to hop in my car and return that thing.

 

If EU pricing is truly that bad (make sure to check local used markets and other used selling sites to get an idea), I could see holding onto it till the 6090. It is a monster of a card.

 

I'm still on the fence about selling now or just waiting till the 5090 and selling then. I don't like to be without a good GPU especially with WoW Xpac here and it just flat out plays better on Nvidia. I mean, if someone comes along and slaps down $1900 for it, I'd have to consider it but it is not only a fantastic specimen it has low to no coil whine to the point I run my case fully open now and use speakers instead of headphones.

 

You could always list it for what you want for it and see if it moves. If it doesn't, no harm; no foul.

 

7 hours ago, Papusan said:

 

 

Still a huge failure.

 

 

Oh absolutely. I didn't mean to imply this is a win for Intel, but sometimes fighting an uphill battle on ice is a futile endeavor. Instead of forcing a subpar node down our throats, they just contract out to TSMC for a better process.

 

If everything goes well, I wouldn't be surprised if they continue to use TSMC more and more in the future while they continue to get their act together. Everyone else is using TSMC and it shows in their advancements. Nvidia did Samsung with Ampere and came scurrying back rather quickly to TSMC.

 

 

 

 

[electrosoft]

13 hours ago, tps3443 said:

Yeah my 3090 Kingpin Hydro Copper overclocked like a MAD MAN! This 4090 Gaming OC does good on ram OC. I have had it set at +1600 on the GDDR6X and that's a 100% reliable OC for it.  But the core,  lolz even just +135 can crash sometimes with auto fan. I usually run +125 on the core which will give me 2,895-2910. 

I did the math, and I determined with a water block, and with a chiller, my GPU would probably run about 30c-32c like my 3090KP did. But, even with those CRAZY low temps, I would only gain +6.2 steps on the Nvidia boosting algorithm. So with the card at 35c or less, with my current 2910Mhz it would run 3,000Mhz exactly. That's pretty sad! That is a guaranteed locked in 3.0Ghz no more no less. Unless the core had something magical happen with the temps being really low, like if its below 50c or if its below 40c maybe it miraculously changes its behavior and its happy with 3,100Mhz or something like that lol. But, Its not exactly guaranteed. The only thing that is, is the 3,000Mhz at due to the low 35c load temps which is pretty terrible for any 4090 lol. 

Your card at 35c would probably run 3.2Ghz+ 🤣

 

You might be right @tps3443!

 

I normally don't run OC'd, but I wanted to collect some data for my ongoing comparisons between the 7950X3D/14900KS/7900XTX (ugh long story)/4090.

 

This was me out in Hallowfall today on a stock OC, stock vBIOS , stock cooling ..... 🤣 Looked up and noticed it was hitting 3135mhz! Still stock thermal paste from purchase too back in Jan 2023 no less!

 

 

 

[tps3443]

1 minute ago, electrosoft said:

 

You might be right @tps3443!

 

I normally don't run OC'd, but I wanted to collect some data for my ongoing comparisons between the 7950X3D/14900KS/7900XTX (ugh long story)/4090.

 

This was me out in Hallowfall today on a stock OC, stock vBIOS , stock cooling ..... 🤣 Looked up and noticed it was hitting 3135mhz! Still stock thermal paste from purchase too back in Jan 2023 no less!

 

 

 

Let’s trade 4090’s, and I’ll send some cash too lol. 😆 (Being serious 😄) 

[Papusan]

LOOL

 

Windows 11 sucks. And even worse with AMD. Just do an new clean install with your AMD platform and you get different results vs your first OS install. And it goes on as a real install lottery.

 

Windows 11 23H2 Sucks! Zen 5 KB5041587 Patch Testing + Windows 10 Comparison

 

Hmmmm... I can feel something coming up from my stomach. What can it be bro @Mr. Fox?🤔

[ryan]

lol @Papusan you got that right...its so bad im experimenting with chrome os on one of my laptops. I honestly loath windows 11 im looking for alternatives, linux seems like a high learning curve, i had to use the odd sudo command in ubuntu to get chrome intalled...i think its doable. its just compatability linux is alot better at gaming and benching now but its not as good as windows 10/11 would have to use photon.

 

crossing fingers for windows 12/7.1

 

and thats actually a good idea trading cards. he would benefit from cash you from overclocking, and when you both sell your up a bit..I wouldn't expect a huge difference in games but with starwars outlaws around 60fps it might bring up the 1 percent lows

[cylix]

17 minutes ago, ryan said:

lol @Papusan you got that right...its so bad im experimenting with chrome os on one of my laptops. I honestly loath windows 11 im looking for alternatives, linux seems like a high learning curve, i had to use the odd sudo command in ubuntu to get chrome intalled...i think its doable. its just compatability linux is alot better at gaming and benching now but its not as good as windows 10/11 would have to use photon.

 

crossing fingers for windows 12/7.1

 

and thats actually a good idea trading cards. he would benefit from cash you from overclocking, and when you both sell your up a bit..I wouldn't expect a huge difference in games but with starwars outlaws around 60fps it might bring up the 1 percent lows

Install ZorinOs or Linux Mint and you will be amazed from Linux Easymode (Windows style)😁 I have on my Work laptop ZorinOS 17 Pro installed, its like 40 dollars, just to reward the devs for a great job. This is the best Ubuntu Distro if you need a Windows or MacOS GUI. It installed all the laptops drivers without a problem! Heck even windowa sometimes doesnt install some toouchpads drivers and so on. 

ZorinOS is really great!

 

https://zorin.com/os/

 

 

I will install it in the near future on my Desktop aswell just to see how it is for gaming and other power hungry software.

[ryan]

ill test it out on my vivobook...just had issues dual booting linux in the past...just going to look up a youtube tut. thanks. I heard of zorin, people are raving about it. heres to a new OS

[Papusan]

24 minutes ago, cylix said:

ZorinOS is really great!

 

https://zorin.com/os/

 

Sadly, you can't use it for hwbot. We are stuck with unstable inconsistent trash from Redmond. 

[cylix]

50 minutes ago, ryan said:

ill test it out on my vivobook...just had issues dual booting linux in the past...just going to look up a youtube tut. thanks. I heard of zorin, people are raving about it. heres to a new OS

I also have it as dual boot with win 11 on my yoga pro..no problems whatsoever. Just use the instructions on their website how to install it together with w11. It will be flawless.

[ryan]

I actually bench more than I game. I dont think linux is good for benching. not on my computer a terrible amount, recently just for AI checking it out. otherwise its my 3d tablet im on really no need for anything else..

 

I would like to add I don't have the proper hardware for competitve benching, i mean my omens 3060 is the 115w version and unless im against other 115w benchers its pointless, i have the TDP modded and the highest ive seen is 9900 and considering the hardware I got it to where I want it. when I had the pred by acer with the 4080 it was power throttling and it was either the highest cpu or highest gpu score but not both. hardware plays a big role in the benching game. kinda like saying your a f1 driver and you show up to the races with a toyota corolla

[electrosoft]

3 hours ago, tps3443 said:

Let’s trade 4090’s, and I’ll send some cash too lol. 😆 (Being serious 😄) 

 

Ugh, I'm not a huge fan of Gigabyte lol. The coil whine on their models is well known.  It would have to be a major chunk of cash.  You would probably be better served selling yours and buying mine for retail pricing and guaranteeing a monster bin bro. 🤣

 

3 hours ago, Papusan said:

LOOL

 

Windows 11 sucks. And even worse with AMD. Just do an new clean install with your AMD platform and you get different results vs your first OS install. 

 

Windows 11 23H2 Sucks! Zen 5 KB5041587 Patch Testing + Windows 10 Comparison

 

Hmmmm... I can feel something coming up from my stomach. What can it be bro @Mr. Fox?🤔

 

I must admit, I've never run W10 on my 7000 series AMD platforms. I might have to give it a clean install or dual boot just to see.

 

--------------------------------

 

Last, but not least, WoW and the new Xpac are crashing again like crazy on AMD GPUs.....

 

I went back to my other system to collect some data and run some new tests on the Xpac and it was crashing and locking up like it was 3 months ago with the 7900XTX. New Xpac? No problem, update drivers. Nope, all those nifty crashing issues are back with a vengeance.

 

I was so busy playing on my main rig that just works that I hadn't used my other rig since Xpac launch.....ugh.

 

 

 

 

[Mr. Fox]

23 hours ago, ryan said:

ill test it out on my vivobook...just had issues dual booting linux in the past...just going to look up a youtube tut. thanks. I heard of zorin, people are raving about it. heres to a new OS

22 hours ago, Papusan said:

 

Sadly, you can't use it for hwbot. We are stuck with unstable inconsistent trash from Redmond. 

22 hours ago, cylix said:

I also have it as dual boot with win 11 on my yoga pro..no problems whatsoever. Just use the instructions on their website how to install it together with w11. It will be flawless.

Zorin is probably the best out-of-the-box Linux experience for anyone that is new to Linux. It just works and it is really nice. Not the best for customization compared to some others, but definitely an ideal place to get wet behind the ears. Another good option, not quite as easy for a newbie, is to install Pop!_OS then install Mint desktop environment. I have been disconnected enough that trying to make something special of the HWBOT experience feels like an exercise in futility. I haven't stopped liking it, but it has begun to feel like the cost and effort to make any progress on ranking isn't worth it. The "reward" has always been a psychological one, but it is more difficult to find gratification than it used to be. Having to enable ECC for 4090 is probably where the slow descent became a nosedive for me.

20 hours ago, ryan said:

I actually bench more than I game. I dont think linux is good for benching. not on my computer a terrible amount, recently just for AI checking it out. otherwise its my 3d tablet im on really no need for anything else..

 

I would like to add I don't have the proper hardware for competitve benching, i mean my omens 3060 is the 115w version and unless im against other 115w benchers its pointless, i have the TDP modded and the highest ive seen is 9900 and considering the hardware I got it to where I want it. when I had the pred by acer with the 4080 it was power throttling and it was either the highest cpu or highest gpu score but not both. hardware plays a big role in the benching game. kinda like saying your a f1 driver and you show up to the races with a toyota corolla

Linux is fine for benching, but most of the Windows benchmark tools we are used to playing with and like the most either do not function on Linux, or they require a lot of tinkering. In-game benchmarks work fine if the game works, and it will more often than not. Tons of Windows games run perfectly on Linux using Steam Proton or Lutris. You can also run Cinebench on Lutris. But, 3DMark benchmarks are a no-go, and HWBOT doesn't accept submissions for Windows benchmarks run on Linux. Sadly, they do not support any Linux benchmarks, which seems like a farce since they do have a leaderboard for Android smartphones and tablet. The idea of benching a smartphone or tablet seems absurd. Like benching  on Windows with everything stock. Why even bother? Nonsense.

[ryan]

yeah I am broke at the moment but as soon as i get some money im getting zorin, could actually be fun learning linux. and the reward? maybe even playing crysis on linux. im on assault right now(fav level) and I think much like electrosoft and wow ill be playing it for years to come.

 

all we really need is say a windows 7 refresh and thats it everyone wins. why the hell not, wish someone would start a petition or something, like if a million or so people clammered together we could see windows 7.1 or something millions of people still view linux and windows 7 as the best OS, really sad that I put chrome on my vivobook and even sadder its functionality is better than that of windows 11.

[cylix]

1 hour ago, ryan said:

yeah I am broke at the moment but as soon as i get some money im getting zorin, could actually be fun learning linux. and the reward? maybe even playing crysis on linux. im on assault right now(fav level) and I think much like electrosoft and wow ill be playing it for years to come.

 

all we really need is say a windows 7 refresh and thats it everyone wins. why the hell not, wish someone would start a petition or something, like if a million or so people clammered together we could see windows 7.1 or something millions of people still view linux and windows 7 as the best OS, really sad that I put chrome on my vivobook and even sadder its functionality is better than that of windows 11.

You can get zorin Core version for free, like everything Linux it's free, the pro version is just to support  the devs and get some productivity tools bundle like Libre office, and Adobe alternatives and so on, and 4 new dektop themes and customizations Uis. You can always upgrade to pro when you want and also you can install all the programs from the store application if you need GUI or have some fun and learn some Linux and install then in Terminal with sudo apt and so on.

[Rage Set]

https://www.reuters.com/technology/qualcomm-has-explored-acquiring-pieces-intel-chip-design-business-sources-say-2024-09-06/

 

I've been saying, without fanboyism tones or malice, but Intel as we knew it... Is going to disappear. It's mostly self inflicted.

 

Other companies are circling Intel like hungry sharks. AMD fanboys are lavishing in all of this news but AMD isn't as bulletproof as they think they are.

[Talon]

On 9/5/2024 at 5:50 AM, Papusan said:

 

 

Still a huge failure.

 

 

They saw an progress for 18A process node and hence scrapped A20. And this come now. There is simply no trust in Intel right now. This was in the card a long time. Intel never intended to use A20 in any of their new chips. And A18, that one will come for mobile junk in 2025. Remember the Rocket lake desktop chips.... They got the old 14nm node while the mobil chips went on 10NM. The history repeats itself once again. Intel is their own enemy. Or better say they have greedy shareholders that want to reduce the losses with every tool they have in their tool box.

Intel's poor stock performance could lead to its removal from the Dow Jones

The chipmaker can't seem to catch a break this year

 

 

And the race for offering maximum power efficiency will continue... Now we see Qualcomm will have a bite of the cake. And Intel and AMD need to offer same power efficiency and maximum performance will come second or last.

Qualcomm CEO: We will build circuits for desktop computers

If Cristiano Amon has his way, future Snapdragon chips will be in all kinds of personal computers, even powerful desktops.

 

I think Intel is going to end up going the way of AMD. They're going to be forced to sell their fabs. Taiwan is giving TSMC huge government subsidies, far bigger than the US CHIPS Act that has to my knowledge delivered $0 to Intel thus far. Apparently Intel is asking for the money as they are building fabs, but the government isn't releasing it. 

 

In the end, I think Intel will sell their fabs to TSMC or other company. Intel and AMD will be using TSMC for their chips, and just imagine what CPUs will cost us then. But I guess that is what people want, everything I read is negative Intel, and almost cheerleading for their demise. I wonder how they're going to feel when their CPU is 2 or 3x more expensive than it is today. 

[Talon]

2 hours ago, Rage Set said:

https://www.reuters.com/technology/qualcomm-has-explored-acquiring-pieces-intel-chip-design-business-sources-say-2024-09-06/

 

I've been saying, without fanboyism tones or malice, but Intel as we knew it... Is going to disappear. It's mostly self inflicted.

 

Other companies are circling Intel like hungry sharks. AMD fanboys are lavishing in all of this news but AMD isn't as bulletproof as they think they are.

 

Intel is not going to sell their most profitable sector of their company. Qualcomm doesn't have the money to buy it anyways. Intel will sell off their fabs or other sectors long before they sold client CPU. But I do agree Intel will change, I think ultimately they will end up fabless just like AMD and Nvidia. Once that happens, the floodgates will open and silicon prices are going to skyrocket. Samsung, and GF won't be offering leading edge nodes. TSMC will be able to set whatever market price they want. 

[tps3443]

Well, it has been a fantastic run with Intel making their own chips in house. I guess everything comes to an end. It was awesome having gobs of inventory at launch, chips that never sell out. 😁

[Mr. Fox]

Well, maybe now we can all save our money and go find something else to enjoy. I'm not particularly interested in giving AMD another opportunity to earn my business. In spite of the inital excitement and anticipation, it has always ended up proving to be a huge, hype-driven waste of my time and money that required too many compromises to be happy. Lowering the bar to find contentment isn't an acceptable option to me.

 

Given my recent discovery of how extremely usable and performant the X79 Rampage IV Gene and Xeon CPU has remained in spite of its antiquity, I think my three Z790 machines might end up meeting my computing needs for a long time to come. If I'm not chasing numbers, there's little or no sound logic to be found in wasting money on a hardware upgrade.

 

There probably hasn't been a better opportunity for Winduhz zombie users to divert their calorie burning efforts to becoming dangerously self-sufficient and effective Linux Power-User nerds.

[electrosoft]

5 hours ago, Rage Set said:

https://www.reuters.com/technology/qualcomm-has-explored-acquiring-pieces-intel-chip-design-business-sources-say-2024-09-06/

 

I've been saying, without fanboyism tones or malice, but Intel as we knew it... Is going to disappear. It's mostly self inflicted.

 

Other companies are circling Intel like hungry sharks. AMD fanboys are lavishing in all of this news but AMD isn't as bulletproof as they think they are.

 

Intel has been trying to innovate their way out of the x86 CISC albatross for years and branch into different RISC CPU architectures, but the blessing and the curse of x86 has been its longevity and legacy.

 

While Intel has tried (and failed) to break free into more modern architectures for decades, other companies have taken ARM to the next level and have now caught (and in some cases surpassed) Intel while consuming a fraction of the power.

 

AMD is somewhere in the middle. Still using x86 but having long abandoned their fabs and going with TSMC, they get a bit of their cake and can eat it too but I agree they are not safe either.

 

Apple is brimming on a perfect 3 for 3 now abandoning a stagnant architecture (x68, PPC, Intel) to keep innovating and pressing forward. I've lived through all three transitions with Mac hardware. I still never thought I'd see the day Apple had their own, in house processors yet here we are.....

 

I agree Intel is going to have to change to survive.

 

3 hours ago, Talon said:

 

I think Intel is going to end up going the way of AMD. They're going to be forced to sell their fabs. Taiwan is giving TSMC huge government subsidies, far bigger than the US CHIPS Act that has to my knowledge delivered $0 to Intel thus far. Apparently Intel is asking for the money as they are building fabs, but the government isn't releasing it. 

 

In the end, I think Intel will sell their fabs to TSMC or other company. Intel and AMD will be using TSMC for their chips, and just imagine what CPUs will cost us then. But I guess that is what people want, everything I read is negative Intel, and almost cheerleading for their demise. I wonder how they're going to feel when their CPU is 2 or 3x more expensive than it is today. 

 

This.

 

Intel can still innovate and we've seen what they can do but their fabs are now a burden and holding them back. Either they figure out a way to get on TSMC's level sooner or later, or they just sell off their fabs and get in line with just about everybody else.

 

I'm not adverse to the government subsidizing Intel on the same level to keep us competitive and not be so beholden to another country. It also keeps another player on the field to keep pricing honest.

 

The spectre of China also continues to loom large over Taiwan and TSMC too hence trying to set up fabs here and potentially elsewhere.

 

 

 

[ryan]

5 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

dangerously self-sufficient and effective Linux Power-User nerds

sounds rad, danger is my middle name! #killing spree

 

yes im downloading zorin yet again this time im going to check it out, how do i take a screenshot in linux

[Clamibot]

 

So it appears if you just lock all your cores to the same frequency, 13th and 14th gen CPUs from Intel should not experience the degradation issue we've all been hearing about. Makes sense since you won't be supplying higher voltages to any cores than necessary.

 

I've never understood single core boost vs all core speeds. With every CPU I've ever owned, I always lock all the cores to the same speed (usually the single core boost speed so all cores operate at that frequency if I'm gaming or working, or at around 2.5-3.5 GHz on battery power). I don't know why anyone wouldn't want to run their CPU this way as you can't truly get max performance unless all cores are running at their maximum frequency. Not only that, having a big rift in clock speed seems like it would cause problems as you'd end up frying certain cores with a much higher voltage than necessary for the speed they're running at. Do newer chips have the ability to supply a per core voltage independent of all others? I'm pretty sure they all still get supplied the same voltage, which is going to be dependent on the highest frequency core.

 

All the CPUs I've had can run their single core boost speed across all cores at once. Is that uncommon, and thus the reason single core boost exists? To increase performance in lightly threaded workloads on chips that can't handle running that speed on all cores at once? A little disclosure, I don't usually run benchmarks but rather game on that all core frequency across all cores, or run in game benchmarks. Maybe that affects my perceived results?