*Official Benchmark Thread* - Post it here or it didn't happen :D

[Papusan]

2 hours ago, Raiderman said:

After doing some quick research, it seems the 7900x 12 core is benching higher than the 5950x 16 core?? Is this correct? Just did a quick versus search on user benchmark.

 

https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/AMD-Ryzen-9-7900X-vs-AMD-Ryzen-9-5950X/4132vs4086

Usebenchmark is trash. But yep, 7900x perform better than old gen Ryzen.

 

Rather use Cpu Monkey to fast compare performance bethween two SKUs. 

https://www.cpu-monkey.com/en/compare_cpu-amd_ryzen_9_7900x-vs-amd_ryzen_9_5950x

 

------------------------------------------------------------

 

KS could be  22% pricier (for 200MHz bump) than Core i9-13900K .

https://videocardz.com/newz/intel-core-i9-13900ks-6ghz-cpu-is-22-more-expensive-than-i9-13900k-according-to-canadian-retailer

 

-------------------------------------------------------------

 

And it could be that nvidia will try sell the 4080@12GB scam variant now branded "4070 Ti" for 1000$ in China. China have a lot of citizens so there is probably a lot stupids living there that will buy this cards from Ngreedia.
https://wccftech.com/nvidia-geforce-rtx-4070-ti-12-gb-graphics-card-rumored-to-cost-1000-us-in-china/

 

For US and and perhaps Europe...

If NVIDIA retails the $899 US pricing for the GeForce RTX 4070 Ti, it will have the same effect as the RTX 4080 has on the RTX 4090. The RTX 4070 Ti will make the RTX 4080 look good just like the RTX 4080 makes the RTX 4090 looks good. 

 

Aka Nvidia try push you to an higher tier SKU to keep up ASP (max profits). Lower sales means Nvidia need sell at higher ASP price point for the few cards sold.

 

If Nvidia want 899$ for the 4070Ti, this means an inflated price of 50% over 3070Ti. Nice done, Nvidia. 

[Etern4l]

1 hour ago, tps3443 said:

I have been tuning a little on my new 13900K. And it is something for sure! 

PS: CEN is messaging me again. (Not kidding)

(AUTO Voltage) (Auto LLC)
(P-Cores)
62,62,61,61,58,58,58,58
(E-Cores)
47,47,47,47,47,47,47,47
47,47,47,47,47,47,47,47
(Ring/Cache)
@5,100Mhz


 

 

Really nice. Looks like you're ready to attack those IndigoBench and Blender CPU scores :)
 

  

On 11/22/2022 at 9:57 PM, Etern4l said:

 

Planning to try that, I think I may have thermal headroom. For now just need to hold my horses and check if 55x is stable. Very happy with the repaste so far - clearly better than SYY. I couldn't get 55x stable before (with UV). Once everything tests out over the next few days, I will post separately to warn people against this pseudo-paste.

 

BTW With 61x P-Cores, how badly do you beat these Indigo Bench 4.4.15 and Blender 3.3.0 scores?

 

IndigoBench:

 

 

 

 

 

[Raiderman]

Well crap....Ive found the 7950 at AMD Direct, but its $574. Is it worth the extra 100 bones to get it, or should I just grab the 7900? I want to do some benching, but not sure which would be more future proof... I know, I hate being that guy that cant make up his mind, but it might be another 3 years before I do this again. Going to dual boot again, thanks to canonkong on winRaid forums. Windows 7 is just so damn nice.

 

 

[Mr. Fox]

17 minutes ago, Raiderman said:

Well crap....Ive found the 7950 at AMD Direct, but its $574. Is it worth the extra 100 bones to get it, or should I just grab the 7900? I want to do some benching, but not sure which would be more future proof... I know, I hate being that guy that cant make up his mind, but it might be another 3 years before I do this again. Going to dual boot again, thanks to canonkong on winRaid forums. Windows 7 is just so damn nice.

 

 

Spend the extra $100 if you are not planning an upgrade for a few years. If you divide the extra cost out over the time you plan to use it, the extra cost is minuscule, but the extra performance is beneficial. If you change your mind later it will cost you the full price of the better CPU instead of the small price difference today. Plus, if AMD's price drop is temporary you'll lose even more money buying the cheaper CPU.

[cylix]

20 minutes ago, Raiderman said:

Well crap....Ive found the 7950 at AMD Direct, but its $574. Is it worth the extra 100 bones to get it, or should I just grab the 7900? I want to do some benching, but not sure which would be more future proof... I know, I hate being that guy that cant make up his mind, but it might be another 3 years before I do this again. Going to dual boot again, thanks to canonkong on winRaid forums. Windows 7 is just so damn nice.

 

 

Like Mr Fox said if you plan to keep the CPU for a long time get the 7950x. I went with the 7900x because i plan to get the x3d version wenn it comes out. Want Mainboard are you going to get?

[Raiderman]

26 minutes ago, cylix said:

Like Mr Fox said if you plan to keep the CPU for a long time get the 7950x. I went with the 7900x because i plan to get the x3d version wenn it comes out. Want Mainboard are you going to get?

Going to get the MSI B650 Mortar. X670 Board prices are stupid. It will be pretty much what canonkong on the WinRaid forums has tested for Windows 7. I can barely stomach Windows 10 LTSC 21H2, and will not install Windows 11 garbage. See screenshot above. Scratch that mortar board, its only a Micro atx, I will be getting the pro version

[Raiderman]

I thought this would be really cool. I have always wanted to do it so I ordered one.

 

 

[Reciever]

10 minutes ago, Raiderman said:

I thought this would be really cool. I have always wanted to do it so I ordered one.

 

 

link?

[Raiderman]

https://a.aliexpress.com/_mMn2JhS

[cylix]

1 hour ago, Raiderman said:

Going to get the MSI B650 Mortar. X670 Board prices are stupid. It will be pretty much what canonkong on the WinRaid forums has tested for Windows 7. I can barely stomach Windows 10 LTSC 21H2, and will not install Windows 11 garbage. See screenshot above. Scratch that mortar board, its only a Micro atx, I will be getting the pro version

Yeah x670 to expensive, i got the MSI MPG B650, good board and MSI are quick with the Bios Updates

[Raiderman]

15 minutes ago, cylix said:

Yeah x670 to expensive, i got the MSI MPG B650, good board and MSI are quick with the Bios Updates

Does your board have a csm option in the bios? It doesnt really matter, as I can install Windows 7 in pure UEFI, if I want. Just curious though.

[jaybee83]

On 11/25/2022 at 4:21 AM, Mr. Fox said:

It might be a good time for all of us to take a vacation from all things PC and give Intel, NVIDIA and AMD a massive profit time-out for a few years. I think most of us have what we need to get by for a few years. If one or more of them doesn't survive, then que sera sera. The alternative is, we continue getting screwed. I'd much rather turn the tables on them.

 

u kidding?! how am i gonna survive on this low-end hardware im currently sporting? 😂

 

On 11/25/2022 at 2:45 PM, Etern4l said:

In other news, AMD is opening a network of friendly kidney extraction clinics to help customers deal with the adoption cost of their latest EPYC 'Genoa' platform. 

 

Meanwhile "Black Friday" means "Blackout" for Nvidia. Only 3090Ti is released in small, AI-optimised batches. Even the 4080 cr@p sold out here. 

 

dude, seriously....who TF is buying those 4080s?!?!?! WHO? someone who can spend 1200+ on a GPU but aint willing to spend a bit more for a 4090? WHO DOES THAT?!?!?! please, anyone, enlighten me...

or, alternatively, wait a bit and go for a 7900XTX....seriously!

 

On 11/25/2022 at 6:13 PM, electrosoft said:

 

Problem is Nvidia really has no rivals in the GPU AI market space right now and their overall discrete (none of that Intel/AMD integrated malarkey) GPU market share still sits at ~80% overall. AMD actually made inroads last year when selection was poor but when the market returned to somewhat normal forces, that ~4% they gained (from 20% to 24%) rapidly dissolved back to 20%. Nvidia is the absolute, dominant force in the GPU market and Jensen knows it.

 

Pricing aside, they have and continue to make the outright superior product while AMD continues to make inroads but if leaked benchmarks are to be believed, the 7900XTX *is* going to crush the 4080 but when the dust clears the 4090 is still the top dog just like the 3090ti was vs the 6950xt; but it's looking like even though the 7900xtx will trade blows with the 4090 in pockets, the 4090 may have an overall bigger lead this time around vs the 7900xtx on raster and RT than the 3090ti vs 6950xt.

 

Price:Performance is clearly going to be AMD unless Nvidia goes for the kill and adjusts the 4080 down to $899 and introduces a 4080ti $1199 7900xtx slayer.

 

 

 

would be such a sick joke if all Ngreedia did was rebadge the fake 4080 and keep their crazy pricing. 

 

On 11/25/2022 at 6:58 PM, Etern4l said:

 

My impression is that AMD is lacking mostly on the software side, and that gap is closing somewhat. Similar on the CPU side, maybe less of a gap in practice, but it's still there. 

 

They need to be doing more hardcore work! 😉

 

i see what u did there Mr. Musk 😄 

 

On 11/25/2022 at 7:05 PM, Mr. Fox said:

I did that and found the overall experience regrettable. Cinebench scores were nice, but that is probably the only kind thing I can find to say about my misguided endeavor. It was probably the worst waste of money on an upgrade that proved to be a downgrade that I have ever experienced.

  

Apart from my magnetic attraction to mediocre silicon quality, (seldom lucky, unfortunately,) I am very happy with the experience I have had with 10900K, 12900K/KS and 13900K. These are excellent processors, but I still feel like I am getting screwed because of the stupid Atom core crap. Even though performance is stellar, it would be better if they ditched the chintzy E-core crap and made them all P-cores. 

 

I think the issue with NVIDIA is that they are an inherently dishonest company that values profit more than doing the right thing, and the issue with AMD is ignorance from the leadership level down. They are essentially posers in the enthusiast space, kind of like the McDonald's of the technology realm.

 

yeah the thing with those Atom cores... looking at silicon area, one cluster of four takes up as much space as a single P core. with E cores at roughly 65%+ performance of P cores, each P core u substitue for one E core cluster would result in 4*65% = 260% vs. 100% multi core performance, so basically ure losing almost two thirds! with the 13900K at 8P and 16E this would result in a CPU with 12P Cores at roughly 65% of total multi core performance. that would only be on par with a 12900K or less, meaning they would lose baaaaad against AMD. 

 

On 11/25/2022 at 8:03 PM, electrosoft said:

As for Nvidia, it is rare to find a corporation that properly tempers capitalism with consumerism. It is just a matter of how much askew they operate. Nvidia unabashedly pushes profiteering knowing they are sitting on the dominant product. Their time will eventually come.

 

best thing for us to happen would be Nvidia and AMD being on par and going at each other's throats just like Intel and AMD are currently doing in CPU space!

 

8 hours ago, Raiderman said:

Well fak.....I had the damn 7950x and a b650 board in my cart at the egg....$499 for the 7950x, $269 for the b650. Woke up this morning with my credit card in hand, and all gone.... I am crying 😂

 

Opinions please:

1. Wait for it to come back in stock because DDR 5 is that much better? (I really dont know)

2. Go with the previous gen 5950x

3. Stick with what you have for now (3900x)

4 Get the 7900x 12 core, its far better than your 3900x. ( again I dont know)

 

get the 7950X and listen to a totally unbiased 7950X owner 😉 

 

8 hours ago, Etern4l said:

 

Seems like budget is a consideration. Why AMD then? Intel is supposed to be better value this time around (in addition to be being better overall, arguably).

 

platform longevity.

also, value proposition depends on how high the stack ure looking. at the very top, barely any difference. if u go midtier i.e. 13600K or 7600X/7700X then RPL does have a better value. but all that has changed now with the adjusted holiday pricing. lets see if AMD keeps those prices around, id wager they wouldnt pull back anytime soon 🙂 

 

27 minutes ago, Raiderman said:

https://a.aliexpress.com/_mMn2JhS

 

funny to see ready-made options for such displays! and for so cheap! i wonder what the quality will be like...im still planning to do a custom one with a 10 inch display, should be fun!

[Mr. Fox]

31 minutes ago, jaybee83 said:

dude, seriously....who TF is buying those 4080s?!?!?! WHO? someone who can spend 1200+ on a GPU but aint willing to spend a bit more for a 4090? WHO DOES THAT?!?!?! please, anyone, enlighten me...

or, alternatively, wait a bit and go for a 7900XTX....seriously!

Lot of stupid people out there. Too many, actually. Idiocy has flourished over the past few years and become a force to be reckoned with. It may soon be illegal to be normal, express dissent with stupidity or demonstrate common sense in public. And, if you teach your kids what's right and what's wrong, it is domestic terrorism.

31 minutes ago, jaybee83 said:

platform longevity.

Maybe. Probably so. Some Threadripper owners were not so lucky, and I recall at lot of AM4 owners being livid about AM5, in spite of the obvious improvement in the design of everything about it, including the socket itself. Unfortunately, PC tech is frequently a monkey-see, monkey-do realm, especially when it comes to schemes and scams that increase revenue. The more progress (and money) AMD makes, the less likely they will be to do what is right for their customers. Only time will tell.

[Raiderman]

22 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

 

Maybe. Probably so. Some Threadripper owners were not so lucky, and I recall at lot of AM4 owners being livid about AM5, in spite of the obvious improvement in the design of everything about it, including the socket itself.

AM4 had basically 5 cpu generations. Those that complain about that need to switch to Intel, where every refresh is a socket change.

[Etern4l]

Just now, Raiderman said:

AM4 had basically 5 cpu generations. Those that complain about that need to switch to Intel, where every refresh is a socket change.

 

Come on, be fair. We've had good 2 gens on LGA1700. Yay! ;)

[Mr. Fox]

41 minutes ago, Raiderman said:

AM4 had basically 5 cpu generations. Those that complain about that need to switch to Intel, where every refresh is a socket change.

 

40 minutes ago, Etern4l said:

 

Come on, be fair. We've had good 2 gens on LGA1700. Yay! 😉

I guess the degree to which it matters really depends on what you find the most value in. AM4 kept the same socket for a long time, and so did AM3, but those that kept the same motherboard didn't get the full benefit of generational architectural changes by remaining on an old chipset. That is great for everyone that found value in that. Those that wanted to enjoy the emerging technology to its fullest were in no better place than the typical 2-generation socket pattern Intel owners enjoy. For the most part, the only people complaining about Intel only using a socket for 2 generations are AMD owners. Most folks that prefer Intel have nothing to complain about and don't.

[Clamibot]

17 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

 

I guess the degree to which it matters really depends on what you find the most value in. AM4 kept the same socket for a long time, and so did AM3, but those that kept the same motherboard didn't get the full benefit of generational architectural changes by remaining on an old chipset. That is great for everyone that found value in that. Those that wanted to enjoy the emerging technology to its fullest were in no better place than the typical 2-generation socket pattern Intel owners enjoy. For the most part, the only people complaining about Intel only using a socket for 2 generations are AMD owners. Most folks that prefer Intel have nothing to complain about and don't.

 

To add onto this, the problem with the platform longevity argument on the AMD side is that it's not really a benefit to most people, myself included. I usually only upgrade my CPU once every 6-7 years (with some exceptions, but very rare), and I'd imagine the average consumer can go 8, 9, maybe even 10 years without a CPU upgrade.

 

After more than 5 years, you'll need a new motherboard anyway since the socket that was used by both Intel and AMD will have changed by then. In order to fully take advantage of the platform longevity, you have to be the type of user who upgrades their CPU every year.

 

I know we have quite a lot of people like that on this forum, we're enthusiasts lol. I like the idea of platform longevity, but I'm just saying it's not relevant for most people. Also, we as enthusiasts would usually try to go for the motherboard with the most up to date chipset anyway so we can get the best features and overclocking abilities.

[Mr. Fox]

29 minutes ago, Clamibot said:

 

To add onto this, the problem with the platform longevity argument on the AMD side is that it's not really a benefit to most people, myself included. I usually only upgrade my CPU once every 6-7 years (with some exceptions, but very rare), and I'd imagine the average consumer can go 8, 9, maybe even 10 years without a CPU upgrade.

 

After more than 5 years, you'll need a new motherboard anyway since the socket that was used by both Intel and AMD will have changed by then. In order to fully take advantage of the platform longevity, you have to be the type of user who upgrades their CPU every year.

 

I know we have quite a lot of people like that on this forum, we're enthusiasts lol. I like the idea of platform longevity, but I'm just saying it's not relevant for most people. Also, we as enthusiasts would usually try to go for the motherboard with the most up to date chipset anyway so we can get the best features and overclocking abilities.

It has been a selling point for the underdog, but you're correct. It is kind of a gimmick. As AMD grows toward achieving parity with Intel, I expect that to become a thing of the past. They can't compete on performance without competing on the financial side. It takes money, and that model is a money-loser for AMD and for motherboard manufacturers. Without support from motherboard manufacturers (as we have all seen, they treat AMD less favorably) they will have difficulty gaining parity on performance or financial strength.

[Reciever]

1 hour ago, Mr. Fox said:

It has been a selling point for the underdog, but you're correct. It is kind of a gimmick. As AMD grows toward achieving parity with Intel, I expect that to become a thing of the past. They can't compete on performance without competing on the financial side. It takes money, and that model is a money-loser for AMD and for motherboard manufacturers. Without support from motherboard manufacturers (as we have all seen, they treat AMD less favorably) they will have difficulty gaining parity on performance or financial strength.

You and your deals in the marketplace are the single greatest detriment to the AM* socket life span. 

 

I explicitly purchased x570 around the time it dropped IIRC coupled with the phasing out of stock 2700x with the explicit intention of grabbing what ever king chip AMD released for the AM4 socket on its way out. 

 

I still have intention to do that, but I would be lying if I didnt say I could just use the 10850K @ 5.2 that I had purchased from you earlier this year lol

[Ashtrix]

Modern AMD is not underdog anymore. Intel is getting rammed by AMD on Datacenter and Client both. ARM and AMD both are chewing them away

 

 

And overall x86 share was 10% in 2018 for AMD, and 2022 30%, this can happen only because the company is offering a ton of value + performance and it's growing as we speak.

 

Intel CEO also had a statement recently that he said "AMD in rearview mirror" with ADL launch got shattered as he had to backtrack and nuked Optane, the one technology which Intel totally pushed to limits. Optane was TOP NOTCH. Extreme performance, Extraordinary endurance but ultimately couldn't achieve what it was made for and the beancounters axed it from orbit. Shame now we get trash QLC junk. They will axe even more businesses. 

 

Quote

"We do expect that overall our data center business grows every year as we go forward. From where we are, as we said, Q2, Q3 [is] the bottom. But we believe that we're still losing share at least through next year," Gelsinger said.

 

 

 

 

The 96C Genoa EPYC is a literal piledriver (pun intended) through Intel Xeon SPR which is MIA right now. Also looking at AVX512 on Zen 4, Intel's AVX Clock offset is also outdated by a huge margin, there's no AVX offset or Thermal meltdown like Intel parts.

 

Look at the TCO graph here. Total annhilation. They are also ready with Bergamo that will destroy ARM parts in Core density, Intel has no answer to AMD nor ARM. Which is why Intel CEO is saying they will lose more marketshare.

 

 

I do not like Intel for what they have been doing, 2 chipsets for 2 CPUs on same Socket per 2 year and then hamfisting and purposeful sabotage of LGA1200 with BS negative regression on Core Count, MT performance, Efficiency, IMC on all things Rocket Lake. No they do not get a pass. LGA1700 is also half cooked, purchase Z690 Maximus Extreme and need to buy $6 part to get the CPU and PCB bend-issue fixed and get it proper torque specced so that it will last well I do intend to mention that because everything is a torque spec when it comes to mechanics imo. Not acceptable when the product costs over $800 and they did not bother to even try to fix for 700 series either. 

 

As for AMD's performance, the Ryzen 5000 IMC and whole DRAM shenanigans with USB issue and IOD nonsense blew a hole hard with the instability & bonus if you touch the tweaking even worse, run at 3200MHz or 3600MHz + PBO2 stock perfect out of box super performance.

 

The thing is with modern processors esp since couple of years, the CPUs are clocked to max out of box, Intel and AMD both. PBO2, TVB what not. So there's a little incentive to spend on Intel processors every damn year. Which is why AMD is still outselling all CPUs on Amazon with AM4 only. The saturation is too high and AMD had to cut AM5 prices. 

 

 

Newegg has Intel more but Amazon volume is definitely far far greater than any e-commerce front. Still look at the AM4 and there's no sign of the dead LGA1200, btw Intel still selling 10900K, 11900K usually they do not, but at BestBuy I see them. Milking 14nm+++ to death I guess lol.

 

 

I think AMD Ryzen 7000 is a superior product for many users except to those who tweak, I like to tweak and control and maintain a stable solid clock and not rely on boosting which is why I bought 10th CML only and not AMD. I would buy dead end only because it's mature and cheaper. But to many it is not the case, because AM4 paints the story clearly how AMD's x86 share is just increasing on all fronts. Many like to get a long supported platform. Also since it's a desktop that's what makes sense invest in one thing and run it for 6 years upgrade your rig not to just dump it and buy another one for those few % points in games or workflow, this is why even Consoles outsell PC because 8-10 years of life. (Which is why PC optimization is gutter trash. God of War 2018 ran on x86 Jaguar junk that gets destroyed by Core 2 Quad Q6600, but on PC it demands a super powerful x86 CPU likes of 10C20T+ why ? Publishers do not care much on PC as Console is mass market high volume, high margins)

 

Also with modern chips - 12th and 13th gen push the Thermal limits to max, with i9 you need an AIO or it won't cut. The heat density is massive. And Intel clocked them to limits out of box look at 13th gen binning literally all are top end silicon 5.8GHz boost 10nm++ at low voltages barely any junk exist, Intel added a bunch of E cores to reach AMD parity in MT and blow a ton of power on top. But in gaming  just look at the CPU graphs and tell me how much 12th vs 13th improve at best same for ST performance growth it's literally single digit % growth and the Socket is now dead, the LGA1700 while AM5 LGA1718 gets Zen 5 in 2024 and 5X3D refresh in 2025 which will destroy any 13th gen CPU without a shadow of doubt, that is a win for consumer no matter how you see.

 

Ultimately that makes the AMD chip more valuable product as the overtime Consumer choice is existing unlike damn chipset every year, and finally to round off they fixed the IOD crapping out and even  better significantly lower voltage than Ryzen 5000, they ran at 1.4v stock X3D ran at 1.3v the modern Ryzen 7000 runs at mere 1.1-1.2v at 5.8GHz boost with all 16C32T core at 5.5GHz temp target 95C 24.7 plus the IF is not linked to MemoryClock and Uclock anymore. It's like Intel Ring independent of the IMC+Memory clock. Meaning no more I/O nonsense relationship. Plus own memory profile standard like XMP, EXPO is there. Also finally their boards are also super high quality now, unlike the X470 era. X670 are just extremely overbuilt like all the high end Z690/790 with tons of VRM components.

 

Oh AMD will release a chipset for sure with Zen 5 as the current X670 is limited by PCIe4.0x4 link speed even though the CPU is capable of 5.0 maybe the cost of redrivers and PCIe5.0 adoption is "Absolute Zero" no SSDs, no GPUs nothing exist, even Enterprise barely started it's just wasted so they will upgrade it to PCIe5.0 in 2024 but it's like X470 vs X570 and not like LGA1200 vs LGA1700.

[Papusan]

2 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

It has been a selling point for the underdog, but you're correct. It is kind of a gimmick. As AMD grows toward achieving parity with Intel, I expect that to become a thing of the past.

Thing of the past? Maybe you remember the upgrade fiasco with AMDs Ryzen 3000 series chips? Going from X and the next year's XT was nothing to write home about. Then AMD jumped over and keept 5000 series two years before they swapped socket. The only minor upgrade was a 8 cores chips who got the X3D upgrade for the 5000 series processors. And we may see similar for 7000 series. X3D as the only upgrade. For gamers. AMD ain't much better option than Intel if we talk about longeivity/upgrade paths. 

 

Those that can't grasp the AMD truth need to go into thing of the past, LOOL

2 hours ago, Clamibot said:

To add onto this, the problem with the platform longevity argument on the AMD side is that it's not really a benefit to most people,

[Mr. Fox]

11 minutes ago, Papusan said:

Thing of the past? Maybe you remember the upgrade fiasco with AMDs Ryzen 3000 series chips? Going from X and the next year's XT was nothing to write home about. Then AMD jumped over and keept 5000 series two years before they swapped socket. The only minor upgrade was a 8 cores who got the X3D upgrade for the 5000 series processors. And we may see similar for 7000 series. X3D as the only upgrade. For gamers. AMD ain't much better option than Intel if we talk about longeivity/upgrade paths.

Yup, exactly. And, their X3D "upgrade" CPU was castrated. Nice upgrade joke. Cookie-cutter garbage for the gamer kiddos. Everyone gets a trophy for participating. One size fits all. Yay. Utterly worthless for anyone interested in overclocking. 

[Papusan]

2 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

Yup, exactly. And, their X3D "upgrade" CPU was castrated. Nice upgrade joke. Cookie-cutter garbage for the gamer kiddos. Everyone gets a trophy for participating. Yay. Utterly worthless for anyone interested in overclocking. 

LOOL. Did they all get the same?😄

[Mr. Fox]

3 hours ago, Papusan said:

LOOL. Did they all get the same?😄

 

“And no one puts new wine into old wineskins. If he does, the wine will burst the skins—and the wine is destroyed, and so are the skins. But new wine is for fresh wineskins.”

- Saint Mark, the Evangelist

But, hey... it fits the 4-year old socket. Must be good to go.
Some features are not working, but that's OK. I saved money.

---

Meanwhile, back at the ranch, I decided to play with the Sabrent M-die some more.

Not my best, but still very good.

[Etern4l]

5 hours ago, Ashtrix said:

Modern AMD is not underdog anymore. Intel is getting rammed by AMD on Datacenter and Client both. ARM and AMD both are chewing them away

 

 

And overall x86 share was 10% in 2018 for AMD, and 2022 30%, this can happen only because the company is offering a ton of value + performance and it's growing as we speak.

 

Intel CEO also had a statement recently that he said "AMD in rearview mirror" with ADL launch got shattered as he had to backtrack and nuked Optane, the one technology which Intel totally pushed to limits. Optane was TOP NOTCH. Extreme performance, Extraordinary endurance but ultimately couldn't achieve what it was made for and the beancounters axed it from orbit. Shame now we get trash QLC junk. They will axe even more businesses. 

 

 

The 96C Genoa EPYC is a literal piledriver (pun intended) through Intel Xeon SPR which is MIA right now. Also looking at AVX512 on Zen 4, Intel's AVX Clock offset is also outdated by a huge margin, there's no AVX offset or Thermal meltdown like Intel parts.

 

Look at the TCO graph here. Total annhilation. They are also ready with Bergamo that will destroy ARM parts in Core density, Intel has no answer to AMD nor ARM. Which is why Intel CEO is saying they will lose more marketshare.

 

 

I do not like Intel for what they have been doing, 2 chipsets for 2 CPUs on same Socket per 2 year and then hamfisting and purposeful sabotage of LGA1200 with BS negative regression on Core Count, MT performance, Efficiency, IMC on all things Rocket Lake. No they do not get a pass. LGA1700 is also half cooked, purchase Z690 Maximus Extreme and need to buy $6 part to get the CPU and PCB bend-issue fixed and get it proper torque specced so that it will last well I do intend to mention that because everything is a torque spec when it comes to mechanics imo. Not acceptable when the product costs over $800 and they did not bother to even try to fix for 700 series either. 

 

As for AMD's performance, the Ryzen 5000 IMC and whole DRAM shenanigans with USB issue and IOD nonsense blew a hole hard with the instability & bonus if you touch the tweaking even worse, run at 3200MHz or 3600MHz + PBO2 stock perfect out of box super performance.

 

The thing is with modern processors esp since couple of years, the CPUs are clocked to max out of box, Intel and AMD both. PBO2, TVB what not. So there's a little incentive to spend on Intel processors every damn year. Which is why AMD is still outselling all CPUs on Amazon with AM4 only. The saturation is too high and AMD had to cut AM5 prices. 

 

 

Newegg has Intel more but Amazon volume is definitely far far greater than any e-commerce front. Still look at the AM4 and there's no sign of the dead LGA1200, btw Intel still selling 10900K, 11900K usually they do not, but at BestBuy I see them. Milking 14nm+++ to death I guess lol.

 

 

I think AMD Ryzen 7000 is a superior product for many users except to those who tweak, I like to tweak and control and maintain a stable solid clock and not rely on boosting which is why I bought 10th CML only and not AMD. I would buy dead end only because it's mature and cheaper. But to many it is not the case, because AM4 paints the story clearly how AMD's x86 share is just increasing on all fronts. Many like to get a long supported platform. Also since it's a desktop that's what makes sense invest in one thing and run it for 6 years upgrade your rig not to just dump it and buy another one for those few % points in games or workflow, this is why even Consoles outsell PC because 8-10 years of life. (Which is why PC optimization is gutter trash. God of War 2018 ran on x86 Jaguar junk that gets destroyed by Core 2 Quad Q6600, but on PC it demands a super powerful x86 CPU likes of 10C20T+ why ? Publishers do not care much on PC as Console is mass market high volume, high margins)

 

Also with modern chips - 12th and 13th gen push the Thermal limits to max, with i9 you need an AIO or it won't cut. The heat density is massive. And Intel clocked them to limits out of box look at 13th gen binning literally all are top end silicon 5.8GHz boost 10nm++ at low voltages barely any junk exist, Intel added a bunch of E cores to reach AMD parity in MT and blow a ton of power on top. But in gaming  just look at the CPU graphs and tell me how much 12th vs 13th improve at best same for ST performance growth it's literally single digit % growth and the Socket is now dead, the LGA1700 while AM5 LGA1718 gets Zen 5 in 2024 and 5X3D refresh in 2025 which will destroy any 13th gen CPU without a shadow of doubt, that is a win for consumer no matter how you see.

 

Ultimately that makes the AMD chip more valuable product as the overtime Consumer choice is existing unlike damn chipset every year, and finally to round off they fixed the IOD crapping out and even  better significantly lower voltage than Ryzen 5000, they ran at 1.4v stock X3D ran at 1.3v the modern Ryzen 7000 runs at mere 1.1-1.2v at 5.8GHz boost with all 16C32T core at 5.5GHz temp target 95C 24.7 plus the IF is not linked to MemoryClock and Uclock anymore. It's like Intel Ring independent of the IMC+Memory clock. Meaning no more I/O nonsense relationship. Plus own memory profile standard like XMP, EXPO is there. Also finally their boards are also super high quality now, unlike the X470 era. X670 are just extremely overbuilt like all the high end Z690/790 with tons of VRM components.

 

Oh AMD will release a chipset for sure with Zen 5 as the current X670 is limited by PCIe4.0x4 link speed even though the CPU is capable of 5.0 maybe the cost of redrivers and PCIe5.0 adoption is "Absolute Zero" no SSDs, no GPUs nothing exist, even Enterprise barely started it's just wasted so they will upgrade it to PCIe5.0 in 2024 but it's like X470 vs X570 and not like LGA1200 vs LGA1700.

 

"Look at the TCO graph here. Total annhilation."

 

My preference would be to do my own calculations rather than rely on AMD marketing to do the thinking for me. Have we seen the actual vendor pricing for this versus Sapphire Rapids yet? What about in-depth benchmark results? I'm not saying AMD's assertions are wrong, we just don't really know (presumably). And again, the value proposition may well vary depending on the use case. 

 

"I think AMD Ryzen 7000 is a superior product for many users except to those who tweak"

 

I am not sure this has much to do with tweaking, frankly unless you have a ton of time and won big in the silicon lottery, the benefits are not as great as they used do be (except for the unrelated memory overclocking) - look at the minor gains at the end of the day: 43000 vs 41000 in Cinebench 23 which likely wouldn't be stable under extended heavy load anyway.

 

As explained earlier, Intel has significant advantages on scientific computing side. Sure, if you are running something like a web server, AMD looks like a strong option to consider.

 

I just I remembered one more reason why I didn't go with AMD: the lack of Thunderbolt. That's it, if you need it, then AMD is not really an option.