*Official Benchmark Thread* - Post it here or it didn't happen :D

[Mr. Fox]

I'm going to have to take the position that if 4090 and beyond won't have working Windows 7 drivers I will not be looking at a GPU upgrade for a long time. At least not for my benching rig. I might get a 3090 to upgrade from my 2080 Ti someday. Maybe when I can get a nice used 3090 for $500-750. The notion of giving up Windows 7 permanently doesn't register anywhere on my radar at this time.

[jaybee83]

4 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

I'm going to have to take the position that if 4090 and beyond won't have working Windows 7 drivers I will not be looking at a GPU upgrade for a long time. At least not for my benching rig. I might get a 3090 to upgrade from my 2080 Ti someday. Maybe when I can get a nice used 3090 for $500-750. The notion of giving up Windows 7 permanently doesn't register anywhere on my radar at this time.

at that point i can see u jumping over to Linux = custom slim system without BS with current (maybe even open source?) drivers 🙂 

[Mr. Fox]

Just now, jaybee83 said:

at that point i can see u jumping over to Linux = custom slim system without BS with current (maybe even open source?) drivers 🙂 

Yup, I actually already did that. The only reason I waste any drive space on any version of Windows now is because I enjoy benching and using whatever OS works best. Apart from that hobby, Linux meets nearly all of my OS needs as well as Windows does, and better in some ways. For work, the only reason I need to use Windows is because I have to use PowerBI, and the alternatives to Micro$lop Office universally suck, especially Outlook. It has no acceptable substitute. Otherwise, LibreOffice Write and Calc are essentially adequate as replacements for Word and Excel. If I could bridge that gap, I would probably even seriously consider walking away from the benching hobby and find another form of entertainment. 

[johnksss]

30 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

Just to be clear, he is using a new version of TB that is not 100% working with DDR5 and the versions we have access to does not. I hope he has a version of TB for DDR5 that we will be able to get soon so we don't have to worry about this. Save a copy of the memory firmware and we're good for recovery if this is a common DDR5 issue once we have a DDR5-compatible version of TB.

 

I hope yours is not messed up, too. Given that one stick of the Corsair stopped booting, I am tempted to reset BIOS defaults and drop back down to A30 or A40. MSI can pretend the problem is somehow a failure on TeamGroup's product, but there is no way it was a coincidence. It might have been a one-off glitch that is rare, but the memory didn't decide to corrupt itself at exactly the moment I flashed A60, LOL.

No, memory is not corrupted and I did see where he said he was sort of working on the project due to them not giving him the documentation in a time manner. Hopefully he will find the time and energy to keep up the good work. This program is a really good tool to have in ones arsenal of programs to have.

[electrosoft]

50 minutes ago, jaybee83 said:

aaaah, see, THATS the info i had in my head, 4090Ti double perf of a 3090 non-Ti 🙂 heard it on MLID YT

 

as for waiting for the 4090 Ti....hmmm thats a tough one. its release date will highly depend on what RDNA3 brings to the table. if AMD is daring to equal the 4090's performance right away and also catches up in RT performance, then Nvidia will not wait long to release the full fat AD102 die, maybe even right away together with the 4090.

on the other hand, if the 4090 is safely holding the non-RT and RT perf crown then the green goblin can wait to maximize their profits (i.e. "mid cycle milking") AND have the winner halo product.

 

in the former scenario, ill wait for the 4090 Ti, in the latter ill just grab the 4090 or 7900XT, letting me enjoy the hardware for a full year before anything else comes out. otherwise, id let that "wait forever for the next best thing" death cycle get a hold of me haha!

 

 

 

Well, I think we chopped it up about this a little bit ago, but it comes down to where you place yourself in the upgrade cycle. 🙂

 

I'm just going to ride the end of each cycle from now on versus the beginning. Same window, same upgrade experienced just where you upgrade. I'll take the best of each generation is my new approach.

 

I seems you are opting to upgrade at the beginning of each new generation. That works too!

 

With the leaps and bounds they have made, I definitely have my eye on the 7000 series (both) from AMD too.

 

 

[Mr. Fox]

Looks like the internet gremilns found your router. 😉

56 minutes ago, electrosoft said:

 

 

Well, I think we chopped it up about this a little bit ago, but it comes down to where you place yourself in the upgrade cycle. 🙂

 

I'm just going to ride the end of each cycle from now on versus the beginning. Same window, same upgrade experienced just where you upgrade. I'll take the best of each generation is my new approach.

 

I seems you are opting to upgrade at the beginning of each new generation. That works too!

 

With the leaps and bounds they have made, I definitely have my eye on the 7000 series (both) from AMD too.

 

 

 

53 minutes ago, electrosoft said:

 

 

 

Well, I think we chopped it up about this a little bit ago, but it comes down to where you place yourself in the upgrade cycle. 🙂

 

I'm just going to ride the end of each cycle from now on versus the beginning. Same window, same upgrade experienced just where you upgrade. I'll take the best of each generation is my new approach.

 

I seems you are most likely opting to upgrade at the beginning of each new generation. That works too!

 

With the leaps and bounds they have made, I definitely have my eye on the 7000 series (both) from AMD too.

 

I'm not doing backflips with Nvidia removing Win7 support from the 4000 series but I understand.

 

 

 

 

53 minutes ago, electrosoft said:

 

 

 

Well, I think we chopped it up about this a little bit ago, but it comes down to where you place yourself in the upgrade cycle. 🙂

 

I'm just going to ride the end of each cycle from now on versus the beginning. Same window, same upgrade experienced just where you upgrade. I'll take the best of each generation is my new approach.

 

I seems you are most likely opting to upgrade at the beginning of each new generation. That works too!

 

With the leaps and bounds they have made, I definitely have my eye on the 7000 series (both) from AMD too.

 

I'm not doing backflips with Nvidia removing Win7 support from the 4000 series but I understand.

 

 

 

 

[electrosoft]

12 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

Looks like the internet gremilns found your router. 😉

 

 

 

 

I went all Beetlejuice on that one! 🤪

[Clamibot]

5 hours ago, electrosoft said:

 

 

 

Well, I think we chopped it up about this a little bit ago, but it comes down to where you place yourself in the upgrade cycle. 🙂

 

I'm just going to ride the end of each cycle from now on versus the beginning. Same window, same upgrade experienced just where you upgrade. I'll take the best of each generation is my new approach.

 

I seems you are opting to upgrade at the beginning of each new generation. That works too!

 

With the leaps and bounds they have made, I definitely have my eye on the 7000 series (both) from AMD too.

 

 

 

I have adopted this approach. You can get hardware that's still really good for a very hefty discount, so you get much better value versus buying at the beginning of a generation.

 

I am very much looking forward to the day that integrated graphics becomes powerful enough for high framerate gaming at 1080p. These dGPU prices keep getting more ridiculous.

[jaybee83]

7 hours ago, Clamibot said:

 

I have adopted this approach. You can get hardware that's still really good for a very hefty discount, so you get much better value versus buying at the beginning of a generation.

 

I am very much looking forward to the day that integrated graphics becomes powerful enough for high framerate gaming at 1080p. These dGPU prices keep getting more ridiculous.

once ive scratched the itch after 2.5 years of planning, waiting, saving up and shaking my head (and fist) at the ridonkulous pandemic / mining prices, this approach at the end of a cycle certainly makes much more sense! so then maybe ill jump onto the 6090 Ti shortly before the 70 series comes out 😛 

[Papusan]

Intel: "Over 500 watts not on the map with Arc"

• Graphics card
• yesterday 19:31

Linus Tech Tips is visited by Intel representatives and the company's sharpest graphics card Arc A770, which is a central part of the long graphics card conversation.

 

Intel values efficiency above maximum performance. Overclocking and unlocked power budget must, however, be functions that come with Arc, LOOOL. 

Why not follow same pathern as they do for their power hogs of processors? Yep, Intel will try go for budget/ low end for mainstream gamers. There is nothing Nvidia and AMD should be afraid of from this mess of a grapics card collection forwards. What a downturn regarding increased competition in the graphics cards market. 

 

[Ashtrix]

2 hours ago, Papusan said:

Intel: "Over 500 watts not on the map with Arc"

• Graphics card
• yesterday 19:31

Linus Tech Tips is visited by Intel representatives and the company's sharpest graphics card Arc A770, which is a central part of the long graphics card conversation.

 

Intel values efficiency above maximum performance. Overclocking and unlocked power budget must, however, be functions that come with Arc, LOOOL. 

Why not follow same pathern as they do for their power hogs of processors? Yep, Intel will try go for budget/ low end for mainstream gamers. There is nothing Nvidia and AMD should be afraid of from this mess of a grapics card collection forwards. What a downturn regarding increased competition in the graphics cards market. 

 

 

Intel ceded their ARC BS hype lol. Basically nothing but smoke. They do not have performance with Alchemist, some people think their next GPU arch something called Battlemage or whatever can compete. If they failed to get the Drivers and Low end there's no scope for this to fight at xx70 even. 4070 is going to be at 3080Ti level & Nvidia 5000, AMD 8000 will be even more fast with new ATX 3.0 16 pin dGPU connectors.

 

Their idea is to flood the market with BGA TRASH, BigLittle junk - Check, BGA Trash bundle with Intel Xe ARC - Check. Stamp some marketing nonsense stickers on the BGA book, fools will flock to buy it regardless.  I think they see more money this way rather than try and fight vs the established high performance dGPU market which is not BGA. Also even on BGA they will be  destroyed because Nvidia will stamp 3090 also on Mobile and performance will be worse than any desktop card with it's infinite throttling, Memory castration, Cuda castration, RT core castration lol.

[Papusan]

3 hours ago, Ashtrix said:

Their idea is to flood the market with BGA TRASH, BigLittle junk - Check, BGA Trash bundle with Intel Xe ARC

Yep, and former AMD engineer who jumped on Intel to be their GPU boss have failed total. And he is the specialist engineer on software for graphics cards. Can see this on how the drivers works 🙂 Can't see this mess is anything better than their old fashion iGPU's. I just can't understand why Intel want drag their reputation down the drain. This gen new graphics cards should have never ever been released this year (probably never). But I expect greed and looking for more profits is their main motivator for pushing out this Junk....

 

 

 

 

NEWS

 2022-07-20 12:04     

Intel Arc A380 discrete GPU reviews: “it’s like living in the middle of a minefield” videcardz.com

 

Igor's lab hit the nail on the head. Why can't reviewers give a product zero stars in reviews? But sadly, people will still buy it. And Intel is still a well known brand name, so..... There you have it.

Igor’sLAB

[Talon]

 

Given that this is the first real stab at Intel dGPU mainstream/consumer GPU, I will reserve judgement and give them time to wrinkle things out. Jumping to conclusions based on early Chinese GPU companies that can't even spell "Unknown" correctly isn't something I'm willing to do. I remember when DLSS first came out, it wasn't great, it was blurry and people generally shat all over it. Looking back, all those videos telling Nvidia to give up or move on are hilarious now. I watched a video recently with Tom and Gamers Nexus on Arc and Intel has some interesting ideas. 

 

I'm more excited about seeing Intel leaving voltage and power limits available for overclocking. Overclocking on Nvidia today sucks! No voltage control, no fun. Have you seen how much overclocking can do for these new Intel GPUs? It looks like fun to tune/push and it's not even out yet. I expect a lot of improvements from them over time. 

[jaybee83]

5 hours ago, Ashtrix said:

 

Intel ceded their ARC BS hype lol. Basically nothing but smoke. They do not have performance with Alchemist, some people think their next GPU arch something called Battlemage or whatever can compete. If they failed to get the Drivers and Low end there's no scope for this to fight at xx70 even. 4070 is going to be at 3080Ti level & Nvidia 5000, AMD 8000 will be even more fast with new ATX 3.0 16 pin dGPU connectors.

 

Their idea is to flood the market with BGA TRASH, BigLittle junk - Check, BGA Trash bundle with Intel Xe ARC - Check. Stamp some marketing nonsense stickers on the BGA book, fools will flock to buy it regardless.  I think they see more money this way rather than try and fight vs the established high performance dGPU market which is not BGA. Also even on BGA they will be  destroyed because Nvidia will stamp 3090 also on Mobile and performance will be worse than any desktop card with it's infinite throttling, Memory castration, Cuda castration, RT core castration lol.

gotta LOVE high quality rants like this hahaha 🤣

 

4 hours ago, Papusan said:

 

Igor’sLAB

wait wat....does it SERIOUSLY say "into the unknow" on the gpu box?!?!? LULZ 😅

 

1 hour ago, Talon said:

 

Given that this is the first real stab at Intel dGPU mainstream/consumer GPU, I will reserve judgement and give them time to wrinkle things out. Jumping to conclusions based on early Chinese GPU companies that can't even spell "Unknown" correctly isn't something I'm willing to do. I remember when DLSS first came out, it wasn't great, it was blurry and people generally shat all over it. Looking back, all those videos telling Nvidia to give up or move on are hilarious now. I watched a video recently with Tom and Gamers Nexus on Arc and Intel has some interesting ideas. 

 

I'm more excited about seeing Intel leaving voltage and power limits available for overclocking. Overclocking on Nvidia today sucks! No voltage control, no fun. Have you seen how much overclocking can do for these new Intel GPUs? It looks like fun to tune/push and it's not even out yet. I expect a lot of improvements from them over time. 

word! i mean....cmon guys, did anyone seriously expect Intel's very first (not counting Larrabee) foray into dGPU land to be perfect? give them 2-3 gens and then we'll see whats up.

I for one am cheering for them to succeed, the more players in the game the better for the consumer 🙂 

[electrosoft]

1 hour ago, Talon said:

 

Given that this is the first real stab at Intel dGPU mainstream/consumer GPU, I will reserve judgement and give them time to wrinkle things out. Jumping to conclusions based on early Chinese GPU companies that can't even spell "Unknown" correctly isn't something I'm willing to do. I remember when DLSS first came out, it wasn't great, it was blurry and people generally shat all over it. Looking back, all those videos telling Nvidia to give up or move on are hilarious now. I watched a video recently with Tom and Gamers Nexus on Arc and Intel has some interesting ideas. 

 

I'm more excited about seeing Intel leaving voltage and power limits available for overclocking. Overclocking on Nvidia today sucks! No voltage control, no fun. Have you seen how much overclocking can do for these new Intel GPUs? It looks like fun to tune/push and it's not even out yet. I expect a lot of improvements from them over time. 

 

Ditto. This is their first, real, foray into desktop level graphics. I fully expect a lot of growing pains and curves. The volume sales are always in the low to low-med end anyhow. Now by next gen if they're still lagging? Well......

 

 

[Mr. Fox]

Easy heat sink removal... ignore part 1 video. Such a funny maniacal laugh. I have been doing it the hard way. This should also require less cleanup effort.

[Talon]

After building a few rigs recently, I have come to the conclusion that I have far too much spare hardware sitting around. I am wondering when the wife is going to question why I need 3 computers AND a BGA laptop. 😛

[Mr. Fox]

4 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

Easy heat sink removal... ignore part 1 video. Such a funny maniacal laugh. I have been doing it the hard way. This should also require less cleanup effort.

Wow, that worked flawlessly. I put my memory sticks in laquer thinner standing on the connector edge in a shallow plastic container so that the specification label (the one that has "warranty void if removed" on it, LOL) was not submerged or damaged by the solvent. I made the thinner deep enough to reach all of the the adhesives though not deep enough to reach that label. Within about 5 minutes I was able to easily separate the heat sink from the modules. I did it gently so that the original adhesive remained on the heat sinks and slowly peeled away from the PCB.

 

After letting them dry, I put waxed paper on the adhesives and pads so that if I ever need to RMA the modules I can reinstall the stock heat sinks and there will be no visible evidence of removal or modification. All of the factory adhesives and thermal pads are exactly where they belong on the heat sinks.

Now I have the water cooling jackets back on them again and they are much, much cooler, even without the water block. Temps dropped from ~51°C to ~42°C in the TM5 1usmus_v3 test. This is enough improvement to mean the difference between zero errors and failing the stress test and instability due to high memory temps running identical memory overclock settings. 

 

[Mr. Fox]

1 hour ago, Mr. Fox said:

Now I have the water cooling jackets back on them again and they are much, much cooler, even without the water block. Temps dropped from ~51°C to ~42°C in the TM5 1usmus_v3 test. This is enough improvement to mean the difference between zero errors and failing the stress test and instability due to high memory temps running identical memory overclock settings. 

 

Setting the water block on top with no thermal pad (direct metal-to-metal contact) dropped the temps yet another 3°~4°C instantly. 

[jaybee83]

11 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

Easy heat sink removal... ignore part 1 video. Such a funny maniacal laugh. I have been doing it the hard way. This should also require less cleanup effort.

or you can do it with LN2 😄

 

 

 

[Mr. Fox]

1 hour ago, jaybee83 said:

or you can do it with LN2 😄

 

 

 

I said to ignore part 1. Maybe you should go watch part 1. Luumi does not demonstrate it as GamersNexus did, but he talks about that process sometimes damaging the modules. It might be more fun to do it that way though.

 

The way I have always done it works and causes no damage to the memory but it ruins the original adhesives and pads in the process. If you need to sell or RMA the memory and any point that part is less than ideal because it makes putting them back together more difficult and costs something more than zero.

[Papusan]

2 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

I said to ignore part 1. Maybe you should go watch part 1. Luumi does not demonstrate it as GamersNexus did, but he talks about that process sometimes damaging the modules. It might be more fun to do it that way though.

 

The way I have always done it works and causes no damage to the memory but it ruins the original adhesives and pads in the process. If you need to sell or RMA the memory and any point that part is less than ideal because it makes putting them back together more difficult and costs something more than zero.

Yep, and with new platform and DDR5 there is a bigger chance you have to RMA your ram sticks. 

[Tenoroon]

I've been toying around with the HM55 board some more, and I keep hitting dead ends.

I was looking into which PLL chip I have to see if any program can alter the speed of the exact chip, and I found out that the PLL chip I have isn't on any programs I could find. However, it is very similar to some PLLs found in setFSB, so I tried adjusting said PLLs, but I either get a freeze, crash, or buggy screen.

I made a post on the WinRaid forums last night asking if it would be possible to add in settings to adjust voltages and BCLK, and the only response I have received is someone telling me to open the BIOS rom and see if I can adjust or find settings that can change BCLK and voltages. I have already done this, and while the BIOS does show BCLK speed, I cannot adjust it in the BIOS, and Access/Use line of the software I use to view the rom shows that the BCLK speed entry has different values than the rest of the adjustable settings. (I'm not very good at explaining this lol, I apologize if it is confusing. My post better explains it here.)

Surely there is a way to modify the BIOS in order to adjust the BCLK. It's not like the chipset or CPU is holding anything back, as various other HM55 boards have been able to adjust the BCLK. I also wonder if some of the problem has to do with the PLL chip this board has, and if thats the case, then I would for sure not be able to adjust anything.

I guess I just need to be patient about this situation and see if anyone who has lots of experience with BIOS modification can give me some input. 

[Mr. Fox]

26 minutes ago, Tenoroon said:

I've been toying around with the HM55 board some more, and I keep hitting dead ends.

I was looking into which PLL chip I have to see if any program can alter the speed of the exact chip, and I found out that the PLL chip I have isn't on any programs I could find. However, it is very similar to some PLLs found in setFSB, so I tried adjusting said PLLs, but I either get a freeze, crash, or buggy screen.

I made a post on the WinRaid forums last night asking if it would be possible to add in settings to adjust voltages and BCLK, and the only response I have received is someone telling me to open the BIOS rom and see if I can adjust or find settings that can change BCLK and voltages. I have already done this, and while the BIOS does show BCLK speed, I cannot adjust it in the BIOS, and Access/Use line of the software I use to view the rom shows that the BCLK speed entry has different values than the rest of the adjustable settings. (I'm not very good at explaining this lol, I apologize if it is confusing. My post better explains it here.)

Surely there is a way to modify the BIOS in order to adjust the BCLK. It's not like the chipset or CPU is holding anything back, as various other HM55 boards have been able to adjust the BCLK. I also wonder if some of the problem has to do with the PLL chip this board has, and if thats the case, then I would for sure not be able to adjust anything.

I guess I just need to be patient about this situation and see if anyone who has lots of experience with BIOS modification can give me some input. 

Chances are high that the hardware is OK and the problems revolve around a firmware dumpster fire covered in feces. The best hardware in the world is as worthless as the tits on a boar if the firmware is junk.

 

You are not going to win any races in a Top Fuel dragster with a malfunctioning transmission no matter how much horsepower it has.

[electrosoft]

Apparently the KPE 3090ti was a very limited run of ~500 cards. Vince said supply line issues were a major problem. Makes sense why they sold out in less than 10 days.

 

Makes sense now why brand new KPE 3090's have shown up (and continue to show up) on eBay (KPE 3090 just finished its 1.5yr run and is finally gone from EVGA website) but zero KPE 3090ti's.

 

Before the install Sunday. I ended up replacing the 2x new style EVGA fans with 6x AC P12 TSE temps went from ~51.5c to 47.5c with the P12s ambient temp ~70c. GPU idle temps ~23.5-24.0c.

 

I do like the look and style of the minimal RGB EVGA fans though. I may switch back in the future for aesthetics.

 

Same conditions and run on my returned FTW3 3090ti ~65c.

 

Playing WoW, fans stay at lowest setting. With the FTW3 3090ti they spun up nice and audible.

 

P2 1600w smelled like dead fish for a day or so fresh out of the box. Not pleasant.

 

Thing is built like a tank with solid metal shroud. I hope EVGA continues this build quality of the FTW3 and KPE 3090ti for the 4000 series.

 

@Mr. Fox as predicted the Mrs. absconded with my Strix 3080 🤨