4 controversial laptop trends that should never have made it mainstream

[Mr. Fox]

1 hour ago, Clamibot said:

Clevo made the NH55JNNQ, which is a 15 inch laptop with an LGA socket for 12th gen Intel desktop CPUs. The GPU is BGA, but at least the CPU is a socketed desktop CPU. The Clevo X270 should've at least had an LGA socket for desktop CPUs as well.

 

If the X270 truly is what this video shows, then Asus's ROG Strix Scar 17 SE is a better offering. That laptop is full BGA as well, but has a monster unified vapor chamber heatsink, and the CPU is a desktop CPU, just adapted to a BGA socket.

 

Perhaps Clevo will come out with another offering that is a 17 inch laptop with an LGA socket for a future Intel desktop CPU. It's hard to believe they'd abandon true DTRs completely since that has been their specialty for decades now.

 

If Clevo truly has abandoned true DTRs, then I guess it's back to mainstream brands then. Sigh...

You forgot to use quotation marks around the word better in reference to the Asus turdbook. Which one is more desirable among chlamydia, gonorrhea, and syphilis? One can be worse than the other, but who wants one of them?

 

The BGA GPU in the NH55JNNQ was a test and the buyers of it failed. "A little bit of leaven leavens the entire loaf." 

 

Why would anyone embrace filth on the basis that it is less filthy? Is rape an acceptable alternative to murder? Do we truly believe she "really secretly wanted it" even though the act was against her will?

 

This trend will continue because stupid people are unaware of their own stupidity and because the feckless allow it even though they know it is unacceptable.

 

Sometimes having nothing is the only good solution. 

[Reciever]

I can accept bga cpu in certain circumstances, from my perch they don't tend to fail. Gpu? I'm quite hesitant. 

 

Although I doubt we will have attractive products for a while since covid delays are still being echoed amongst many other economic issues. 

 

Which is a shame because it should be the time where the c level executive get out of the way of engineering, put forth some really amazing products to force open people's pocket books. That would let them ride that wave of good will into a stabilized economy and truly reap the benefits. I'm probably too naive. 

[Mr. Fox]

5 hours ago, Reciever said:

I can accept bga cpu in certain circumstances, from my perch they don't tend to fail. Gpu? I'm quite hesitant. 

 

Although I doubt we will have attractive products for a while since covid delays are still being echoed amongst many other economic issues. 

 

Which is a shame because it should be the time where the c level executive get out of the way of engineering, put forth some really amazing products to force open people's pocket books. That would let them ride that wave of good will into a stabilized economy and truly reap the benefits. I'm probably too naive. 

The manufacturers know this. By making the graphics card BGA they guarantee themselves a short product life and a repeat sale potential because the graphic chip will either fail or rapidly become too anemic to satisfy the poor sucker that bought it.

 

Financial success is unlikely until we replace the people currently holding positions of political power and authority with new people holding views that are diametrically opposed to those currently in power. When the expressed and obvious agenda is to punish success, destroy wealth, confiscate security and eliminate freedom, things are going to stay really effed up for all of us.

[Papusan]

16 hours ago, Papusan said:

Look at this. The the successor to the Clevo's High performance laptop. The replacement for the LGA / MXM monster Clevo X170 and previous Clevo P870xx series.. Say hello to Clevo X270. Is this a bad Joke or a bad dream? 

Yep,a smart move from Clevo... Comments are turned off.

 

15 hours ago, solidus1983 said:

@Papusan @Mr. Fox @Prema @jc_denton@electrosoft 

 

Like WTH, X270 is just a turbook, clevo has really F'd up here, I also voted too on youtube.

Ah well guess the X170 series was the last true DTR.

 

Pap what did i tell you about giving companies Idea's (I am talking about the MSI Laptop post!!)

 

This whole aiming for Thin and Light crap needs to stop.

They don't need help with ideas how to destroy own products. They just follow the trend. Max profits and how to make the products so bad that they know same fools will come back and buy a new machine the yeaar after. 

 

See. Now 5 up-votes of near 460 views.  @Mr. Fox Aka there is still a few stupids out there. 

[Papusan]

23 hours ago, electrosoft said:

 

WTH.............

 

That is an insult to the Xx70 line if that is their successor.....

 

 

At least its branded as a Desktop Replacement. And you get a large trackpad

 

The information in the XMG roadmap that this is a "desktop replacement" also fits the Clevo X270's equipment, because the device relies on a 17.3-inch screen and a 99 Wh battery.

 

Clevo unveils gaming laptop with Intel Arc A770M, liquid metal and mini-LED display notebookcheck.com

 

And Tom said a long time a go that we won't see a LGA/MXM machine from Clevo.

 

 

The controversial trend about laptops is here to stay. New Hw but same old sins. Nothing seems to will change in the laptop industry. All you can do, is sit down and see that everything goes from worse to worse. As  "one-way ticket to Hell". 

 

 

MSI Katana GF66 test: New hardware but old problem areas

 

MSI's laptop also seems to continue to have problems with the cooling. The TGP and TDP are reduced so drastically, that although the benchmarks in various games still result in more than 100 frames per second, at the same time many other laptops with supposedly weaker hardware are able to achieve similar results. Even the highest performance mode or even setting the fan speed control to a constant 100% won't help here. Even if it is at a high level, the gaming laptop quickly runs out of steam.

 

 

 

 

[JeanLegi]

On 6/1/2022 at 9:21 PM, Papusan said:

 Stupidity is today's normal 😟

Time to watch Idiocracy again.

 

But i'm with you gents and that is the reason why i go back to Desktop PC..

[Papusan]

17 minutes ago, JeanLegi said:

Time to watch Idiocracy again.

 

But i'm with you gents and that is the reason why i go back to Desktop PC..

Some think the OEMs still make and deliver proper DTR laptops. They are all gone and Dead! All you get is thin an slim. Aka Apple designed laptops with Windows as OS.

 

The sad truth. The tech reviewers don't know what they talk about. Enthusiasts laptop, LOOL

 

CLEVO Teases Its Next-Gen X270 Enthusiast Laptop With Intel’s Flagship Arc A770M 16 GB Discrete Graphics

[aldarxt]

I must disagree with gone and dead. The best laptops ever made were made in the last ten years and they are still cranking, mxm & pga upgradeable and still upgradeable and still on ebay at all different prices, availability and delivered to your door. I can buy a RTX A4000 and put it in any of the mxm laptops and it will run more games than I can download. Granted they are not desktops but that is like comparing street rods to formula 1 race cars. Different purpose. The manufacturers saw what they did and realized there was no need to continue with upgradeable laptops because we still have and use and upgrade them. So they made throwaway laptops for the masses to make discusting amounts of $$$ and build up e-waste. I dont need a new laptop its no fun, no challenge. I want to keep my old machines tuned up, upgraded as to its capability, and running as smooth as possible. I dont need the highest benchmark on the web But the BEST it can do and when it aint I can give it a check-up, its more of a hobby or a sport but NOT a competitive sport although that can occur and its hard to resist.

I see so much potential for these old laptops and so does some Big Industry Players because I can buy their old mxm cards and be happy with that. They are still using mxm laptops says something about this Tech. And I am hopeful they continue to need this type of Tech eventually new manfacture may come about. Right now Eurocom seems to be the last holdout, but if I buy one it should last at least 10 years and I should be Happy with that!

[1610ftw]

First post on new forum after seeing the X170 "successor" .

 

So I have been looking for something new with a big screen, substantial cooling and power and the capability to take my 4 x 32 RAM sticks. Instead I first read about MSI selling a slimmed down all BGA jokebook as a successor for the mighty titan that only used to be half turdbook before. Reading further I find out that Dell is doing even more proprietary crap with their workstations, HP and Lenovo sizing down to 16" and now Clevo selling out completely. 

 

When the trend for slim bezels took hold I was really thinking that somebody could take a form factor that we were used to from 17.3" and big bezels and take it to high refresh QHD or QHD+ 19 or even 19.5" screens depending on the screen aspect ratio. Add some nice cooling, LGA and MXM and a nice keyboard with a normal layout, the ability to take a number of drives and RAM for high end DTR duties and proper non-gimped keyboard and we would have a great enthusiast solution..

 

Instead we get NONE of that and what is worse is that almost nobody seems to care...

[1610ftw]

By the way, power consumption of the much thicker predecessor of the GT77 from notebookcheck:

https://www.notebookcheck.net/MSI-GT76-Titan-DT-10SGS-Laptop-Review-Late-Game-Exotic-Gear.496571.0.html

 

 

Of course these days with hardware that does not need that much less we are down to one 330W power brick and a puny combined power envelope of 250W for both CPU and GPU.

[KING19]

On 6/3/2022 at 7:24 PM, Papusan said:

Some think the OEMs still make and deliver proper DTR laptops. They are all gone and Dead! All you get is thin an slim. Aka Apple designed laptops with Windows as OS.

 

The sad truth. The tech reviewers don't know what they talk about. Enthusiasts laptop, LOOL

 

CLEVO Teases Its Next-Gen X270 Enthusiast Laptop With Intel’s Flagship Arc A770M 16 GB Discrete Graphics

 

Haha.

 

What makes it worse is that the Intel Arc A770M is weaker than an RTX 3070 which makes it a mid range GPU technically. Also Intel's GPU drivers are pretty bad so it'll affect performance more.

 

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Intel-Arc-A770M-GPU-Benchmarks-and-Specs.613274.0.html

 

https://www.notebookcheck.net/First-Intel-CPU-GPU-Gaming-laptop-Clevo-X270-notebook-with-Intel-Arc-A770M-GPU-breaks-cover.624990.0.html

[Papusan]

30 minutes ago, KING19 said:

 

Haha.

 

What makes it worse is that the Intel Arc A770M is weaker than an RTX 3070 which makes it a mid range GPU technically. Also Intel's GPU drivers are pretty bad so it'll affect performance more.

 

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Intel-Arc-A770M-GPU-Benchmarks-and-Specs.613274.0.html

 

https://www.notebookcheck.net/First-Intel-CPU-GPU-Gaming-laptop-Clevo-X270-notebook-with-Intel-Arc-A770M-GPU-breaks-cover.624990.0.html

They have probably done a great deal with Intel. What people get doesn't matter. As I said... You get an large trackpad. + some RGB. Maybe thats enough for the gamer kids🤔 

[Tenoroon]

49 minutes ago, Papusan said:

They have probably done a great deal with Intel. What people get doesn't matter. As I said... You get an large trackpad. + some RGB. Maybe thats enough for the gamer kids🤔 

I don't know the whole story, but Intel pours quite a bit of money into keeping the smaller laptop manufacturers afloat. I watched a podcast a while ago with someone who worked for a Clevo reseller a long time ago and he mentioned how tightly nit all of the resellers and Clevo were with Intel. That's probably why the X270 is using an ARC GPU, and also probably why there hasn't been a Clevo product with an AMD CPU or GPU. I think Tongfang laptops are a bit different though as many of them seem to use AMD chips.

[1610ftw]

Nothing wrong with a laptop with Intel CPU and GPU as long as the CPU is LGA and the GPU of the MXM variety with an alternative Nvidia solution ready to be deployed for those who want it.

 

This is what the new X series was all about for me and now this. Nvidia is also at least partly to blame with their apparent refusal to offer a proper MXM form factor version of their latest top of the line card - hard to put one of those in there when it is not available anymore. Let's hope they will make a return to MXM with the 40x0 cards.

 

 

[Aaron44126]

2 hours ago, 1610ftw said:

Nvidia is also at least partly to blame with their apparent refusal to offer a proper MXM form factor version of their latest top of the line card

 

NVIDIA doesn't manufacture MXM cards...  That is on laptop OEMs.

 

MXM 3.0b isn't well suited for modern high-end GPUs — the power and physical space requirements are too great, which is why you see contorted versions of it (in the odd case a system has a swappable GPU at all).  It's also getting worse with each generation as NVIDIA cranks the power limit up.  Someone would have to design an upgrade/replacement to the "standard" and get the greater industry onboard with it...  Seems unlikely because its not really in the OEMs' interest to do this.

[aldarxt]

What about these co.s Aetina, Adlink, Cincoze, PNY, Wolf all seem to manufacture MXM cards

https://www.aetina.com/products-detail.php?i=427

https://www.adlinktech.com/Products/SearchResult.aspx?lang=en&SiteID=16041112321545803&key=EGX-MXM-RTX5000

https://www.pny.com/Quadro-RTX-5000-MXM

https://wolfadvancedtechnology.com/products/mxm/wmxm-p5200-vo

https://www.cincoze.com/goods.php?cid=66

 

And I think this DTR Idea is a pipe dream, its like comparing 4x4 monster trucks to motorcycles, Its a different Sport, maybe a different application. The industry is chopping this tech up to make money, not to suit up everyones personal want's. So it puts more pressure on the smaller niche communities. The status quo is not where we will find solutions, it might just be in the salvage yard, but these co.s give me hope cause they are making mxm cards for important industries, military, medical, gaming of some kind and others

[Hertzian56]

I had an aetina 970m in my m6700 for a while worked fine and was well made, someone had lots of them in stock on ebay for a few months and had them decently priced. I doubt aetina would sell them to individuals or your typical retailer, they probably sell in bulk only to the tech fields they mention. Probably at very high prices too. Probably find the odd one on ebay though. It's good they give a detail drawing so you can compare hole placement etc

[KING19]

9 hours ago, 1610ftw said:

Nothing wrong with a laptop with Intel CPU and GPU as long as the CPU is LGA and the GPU of the MXM variety with an alternative Nvidia solution ready to be deployed for those who want it.

 

This is what the new X series was all about for me and now this. Nvidia is also at least partly to blame with their apparent refusal to offer a proper MXM form factor version of their latest top of the line card - hard to put one of those in there when it is not available anymore. Let's hope they will make a return to MXM with the 40x0 cards.

 

 

 

Sadly the era of MXM is dead and i wish it wasnt the case, Even if they bring it back it going to cost way more than its worth. If you think the prices for desktop GPUs are bad the pricing for MXM cards are going to be double or even triple the cost depending how long inflation will last. 

 

Anyways imma leave this here. 

 

 

Dynamic boost ruins it.

[aldarxt]

3 hours ago, Hertzian56 said:

I had an aetina 970m in my m6700 for a while worked fine and was well made, someone had lots of them in stock on ebay for a few months and had them decently priced. I doubt aetina would sell them to individuals or your typical retailer, they probably sell in bulk only to the tech fields they mention. Probably at very high prices too. Probably find the odd one on ebay though. It's good they give a detail drawing so you can compare hole placement etc

Aetina doesn't sell to the public. But like you did I got a quadro P4000 on ebay for $280 few months ago and also see P5000 and RTX 5000 an HP, DDAY3493 on this forum put in his Alienware 18 and when the industry finishes using theirs they will be on ebay.

 I dont know where all this is going but I love that I can upgrade these laptops and am not saying not to buy a skinny to take Mountain climbing with you but my MXM is staying home on the DESK!!!

[Hertzian56]

I'd be curious to see in the future if Aetina etc continue trying to make MXM or if it's going to have to morph into very custom stuff per each industrial application. I think somewhere last year I was going through the Aetina site and they were the same cards then as now, there's been no newer generation cards past what they have now. Is Eurocom offering any 3xxx series MXM at all?

[aldarxt]

13 hours ago, Hertzian56 said:

I'd be curious to see in the future if Aetina etc continue trying to make MXM or if it's going to have to morph into very custom stuff per each industrial application. I think somewhere last year I was going through the Aetina site and they were the same cards then as now, there's been no newer generation cards past what they have now. Is Eurocom offering any 3xxx series MXM at all?

The EUROCOM Raptor X15 comes with RTX 3070 TI with a starting price of  $1999, but thats the base and any upgrade would kick that price into orbit. I don't think it's mxm and wonder how the upgrade option works. The upgrade option page allows to order RTX 3070 Ti and charges $1249 but can't figure out what I would get in the mail

[Reciever]

13 minutes ago, aldarxt said:

The EUROCOM Raptor X15 comes with RTX 3070 TI with a starting price of  $1999, but thats the base and any upgrade would kick that price into orbit. I don't think it's mxm and wonder how the upgrade option works. The upgrade option page allows to order RTX 3070 Ti and charges $1249 but can't figure out what I would get in the mail

Eurocom is traditionally extremely high priced and also likes to steal from Prema as well as use its market (us) as guinea pigs to which they would then start offering products for after

[win32asmguy]

1 hour ago, aldarxt said:

The EUROCOM Raptor X15 comes with RTX 3070 TI with a starting price of  $1999, but thats the base and any upgrade would kick that price into orbit. I don't think it's mxm and wonder how the upgrade option works. The upgrade option page allows to order RTX 3070 Ti and charges $1249 but can't figure out what I would get in the mail

The upgrade price is the cost of a complete NH55JNNQ system board with the BGA 3070Ti.

[Tenoroon]

I'm not going to continue with this argument, but this is the mindset of a majority of people...
(Talking about the GT77 Titan)

[1610ftw]

5 minutes ago, Tenoroon said:

I'm not going to continue with this argument, but this is the mindset of a majority of people...
(Talking about the GT77 Titan)

Can't see pics...