Clevo N960Kx (N960KR) Thread - BIOS Unlock, cooling mods, etc.

[kaz26]

Review of this machine:  I have owned this machine for about 4 months now and would like to give a brief review for prospective owners. My initial impressions were quite good for what it was (Probably a 9 or 9.5 out of 10), but that has faded over the course of ownership as problems have been found. 

Link to vBIOS that I use:
https://www.techpowerup.com/vgabios/232296/232296

 

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Unlocking BIOS:

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* * * * * * * * * * * * 

IMPORTANT NOTE: Messing with your BIOS can brick your system. DO NOT try this if you are not confident in what you are doing. Proceed at YOUR OWN RISK.

* * * * * * * * * * * * 

 

1. Create a backup copy of your BIOS. I did this using the Intel Flash Programming Tool (FPTW64.exe). This is a command line program and will need to be run in the command prompt. You can type CMD in the windows search, right click on Command Prompt and Run as Administrator. 

                 Command to create a copy of your BIOS:  FPTW64 -d backup.bin       (This creates a copy of your BIOS named backup.bin)

 

* The file will be located in the folder you type the command in. I do this in a new folder I create and put directly in the c drive. 

 

2. Use the Insyde H2O BIOS editor to modify a section of the BIOS so that the advance controls are made visible. The software I found from the YT video is H2OUVE.

                After you download and run the program, LOAD the BIOS image you created in step one, (backup.bin) and select the yellow Setup button on the left. Then export the file (Do this by Selecting "File", then select "export") and save the file to your desktop as BIOS.  This will create a text file of your BIOS that can be easily edited. 

      

3. Edit the BIOS text file.  Open the file and search the file for "Advance Chipset Control". (Open a search by hitting Ctrl + f).
            Once you get to the section that shows the advance chipset control, move the asterisk from Hide to Show and also move the term (Default). When you move the asterisk, leave a space where the asterisk used to be. Now save the file with the same name, (BIOS)
 

4. Convert the text BIOS file into a new Unlocked BIOS file. Go back to the Insyde H2O editor and Select "File" then "Import" the edited  BIOS file, After this, select "File" again, but this time select "save as" and title the file BIOS_UNLOCKED in a folder named BIOS, and put this folder directly into your C drive. 

 

5. Flash your BIOS with the new unlocked BIOS named BIOS_UNLOCKED.fd. Go back to the command prompt and type the following command:

                FPTW64.exe -bios -f BIOS_UNLOCKED.fd

 

* Select Y when needed and let it complete. Make sure your computer is plugged into the charger and do not turn off the machine at this time. 

 

6. After the process is complete, enter BIOS and hit F9. This will allow the Advance Controls to now be visible. And that's it!

 

- Commands for command prompt:

cd C:\BIOS
FPTW64 -d backup.bin                                            (to create a copy of the current BIOS and check the health of the system)
FPTW64.exe -bios -f BIOS_UNLOCKED.fd      (to flash the unlocked bios)
FPTW64 -greset                                                          (Properly complete the flash and reset the computer)

 

* * * Please give me feedback if you try this. 

 

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BIOS Settings:

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For using XMP profiles and overclocking RAM:

Set:

 * Realtime Memory Timing to Enabled

 * XMP profile 1

 * Realtime Memory Overclocking to Enabled

 

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Record of Hardware changes and cooling mods

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12/7 - Installed an Intel 11700 (non-K version) CPU that was throttling.

 

12/8 - BIOS was unlocked, and turbo settings were adjusted for max performance. XMP profile 1 was also used for the G.Skill 3000MHz RAM. I will upgrade the RAM in time, but I think it is fine for now. 
 

12/22 - Heatsinks were added to dissipate heat from PCH and CPU VRMs, this helped more than I thought it would. I also added a small one to the 970 evo plus ssd, though I don't believe it was really necessary. This alone is well worth the $8 I spent on them. I was only doing it to see if thermals were a problem and they definitely are. I'm starting to think this machine has alot of potential. 

 

12/23 - Installed the 11700K. I have not yet played with the BIOS settings, but windows was set to max performance. 

Initial impressions of the 11700K compared to the 11700 - It appears to be inhibited due to the lack of cooling ability and potentially power limits, though I have not yet adjusted anything in BIOS. 

 

1/5/23 - Installed heat pipe (6.4mm x 3mm x  200mm) to CPU side. Adjusted settings in ThottleStop and was pleased with the results. 

Pictures where posted below. 

 

1/17/23 - Flashed vBIOS, Undervolted CPU, overclocked GPU, ran Tron script to de-bloat and clean up Windows background apps and scored 11,019 on Time Spy. I also moved the heatsinks around a little, opened up the vents on the bottom cover with a dremel. When things area finalized I will post more pics of it. 

 

2/9/23 - RAM upgrade attempt 1:  Mushkin Redline 64Gb 32GBx2 3200MHz CL16 1.35v using XMP1. This kit wouldn't run stable with XMP setting. 

 

2/12/23 - RAM upgrade attempt 2:  Kingston FURY 3200MHz 64Gb 32GBx2 3200MHz CL20 at 1.20v default. I have so far tried tighter timings and it is stable at CL18. 

 

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4/13/23 - Charging port replacement: The original charging port failed and was replaced with the original charging port. I did this repair myself, but would not recommend doing this without proper equipment and experience. It was not easy and making a mistake could permanently damage the board. If or when this new charging port also fails, I will replace it with something more robust, perhaps a Clevo 4-pin variety. 

 

Future plans:

   * Install heatpipe to the GPU side, maybe another one on the CPU as well.

   *  Find a more effective way of securing the cool end of the new heatpipe so that it dissipates heat faster. 

 

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The images posted are of UserBenchmark scores with the 11700 (non-K) and the 11700K, but again, I have not yet adjusted the BIOS, I will do that and try to max it out after I add the heatpipe. I will also add an image of the heatsinks and copper tape that I added to the bottom cover. I also added thermal pads that connect the copper tape to the heatpipes.  

The heatsink are "Geekworm Raspberry Pi Heatsink CPU Cooler 8PCS Copper Heatsinks"

One of my early benchmarks with 11700 (non-k)

 

The image below is the highest UserBenchmark achieved with 11700k

[kaz26]

 

These are more or less baseline becnhmarks to gauge future improvement, but they also show what's possible with a nearly stock system.

 

 

 

 

[nik musang]

The userbenchmark score for this machine is probably unachievable 😱. I just recently got mine from China and yesterday I swap the Celeron G9505 with an I9 11900 (es version codename: QVYE ). This CPU also consumes 125w and turbos on all cores up to 4.1 Ghz . But the problem is its hot like it gets to 100c  in 2 minutes. The RTX 3070 is also not doing well idles at 60 Celsius and maxed at 90c which by then it will already thermal throttled. Just now I had bought the materials that you mentioned above. Hopefully it can help lower the temps. Right now I'm planning on unlocking the Bios but the Chinese tutorial suggest me to downgrade back to 10.7.04 (I don't understand Chinese but it seemed that way). The bios version 10.7.03 stutters a lot for me right now im using 10.7.13. Any tips on this? BTW what do you think about using liquid metal on this machine?

[kaz26]

I added an additional heatpipe to the CPU heatsink. It was listed as 7mm x 3mm x 200mm (Uxcell brand), but the actual dimensions are 6.42mm x 2.95mm x 200mm. This flat sintered interior copper heatpipe was originally a 5mm diameter tube before it was flattened. I received it as a straight flat heatpipe (as shown in the photo below) and I bent it myself to match the application. I didn't do the best job, but this was only my second time bending a heatpipe and this was a more complex bend than the first one I did. 

In the photos, I show:
1.) What the original heatpipe looked like
2.) How I bent it into the shape I needed
3.) How I attached it with solder
4.) The heatsink installed with the additional heatpipe

5.) UserBenchmark score

6.) Past 5 Geekbench 5 scores (top 4 are with 11700k), top two are with new heatpipe.

7.) Shows temps, highlighting low temps in the low 30's celsius, and also CPU-z benchmark score. 

8.) Bearings that might have worked better than the one I used. I might try one of these next time I need to make a bend like that. 

Pic # 2 The crude device I used to bend the heatpipe could definitely be improved. The idea here is that you want to make sure the radius of the bend is no less than three times the width of the flattened pipe. For a 6.42mm heatpipe, that means the radius of the round object it is bent around should be greater than 19.42mm in order to not compromise its capacity to transfer heat from one side to the other. The way these heatpipes work is through the use of conductive material in combination with evaporative cooling. I will attach additional links for those who wish to learn more about the specifics of how this works. One thing that I did not show here is the template I made for the bend. I mapped out the shape I needed and bent the pipe until is matched the template. Once it was close, I then test fit the heatpipe to the heatsink and made very minor bends by hand to get it just right.

 

     * Edit:  Improvements I could have made: Larger diameter bearing. Possibly one with a groove. I added a pic of something that might work better. 
                 Also, I did kink the heatpipe a little when I made the z-axis bend. If there is any advice on how to do this better, I would like to hear it. 

Pic #3 The fan on this heatsink is not easily separated from the rest of the heatsink (cooling system). The top metal sheet that goes over the fan is either soldered or glued to the fins. In order to protect it from heat, I used heavy duty foil over the fan, loosely to give an air cushion, and then I used a 1mm thick sheet of copper to dissipate heat, but also to distribute the clamping pressure on the existing heatpipes to keep them from separating from the heat. I used 247 low temp (137C) liquid solder and heated it with the combination of a Harbor Freight heatgun and a hot air rework station tool. To ensure that the heatpipes were not getting overheated, I used an IR thermometer to constantly check the temps in the areas around the heated area. I first put the solder down and heated it until it turned shiny. Then I reduced the heat by pulling it further away and added the heatpipe by applying pressure to it and securing it with a metal clamp, and then removed the heat until it cooled. This method worked very well. 

Pic #4 I have not yet secured the cool end to the top of the fan permanently, but I plan to use the thermal glue made by Tech Ingredients. In the meantime I simply used thermal grease between the fan and heatpipe and also added copper tape to the bottom cover to help dissipate the heat. I am very pleased with the results and consider this mod a success. 

If there are benchmark scores that you would like to see, just let me know and I will run them. I do still plan on making more cooling mods. I think I am nearly done with the CPU side so future mods will probably be done to the GPU side. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[kaz26]

@nik musang 

 

The scores I posted are absolutely achievable with the i9 11900. The $8 set of heatsinks and copper tape made a surprising difference to the thermal capacity and the BIOS unlock is fairly simple. I will update the original post with a step-by-step later. That way you can use the 1.07.13 BIOS that came with it. I have been looking for an updated BIOS and even reached out to Clevo, but did not receive a reply from them. 1.07.13 is probably the most up-to-date BIOS and it works fine so probably doesn't need to be updated further. 

As far as liquid metal, I don't feel it is necessary. Lately I have been using phobya nano grease. I switched to that from Thermal Grizzly because of the squeeze out that was happening with a lapped heatsink I was using. I think it was Papusan who recommended that. Keep in mind that was two years ago. It worked so I stuck with it since. On this laptop in particular, the heatsink makes very good contact with the CPU and transfers heat very well. The weak point in the cooling system is in transferring the heat out of the system. This is why I added the heatpipe.  

Edit:
Another thing I want to mention as a possible alternative to thermal grease is Indium foil. I have heard good things about it. I might try it on this machine. 

[kaz26]

I just did a little tweaking using ThrottleStop and BIOS settings. And got a better benchmark score on UserBenchmarks. I also took a legit full screenshot showing the time and date with CPU-Z and GPU-Z open. 

[electrosoft]

Give it a Timespy and Cinebench R23 run and see how it stacks up.

 

 

[kaz26]

I've been experiencing random high temperatures and thermal throttling as a result and need to figure that out before continuing with this. I might need to resolder or apply more solder to the additional heatpipe. I am also considering another heatpipe on the CPU side before moving on to the GPU side. If anyone has advice on settings for the 11700k in BIOS or through other system management software, please let me know. 

[kaz26]

I did a few different benchmarks and posted the results below. This is with stock settings. I will later try to optimize the system by undervolting and such to see if I can get some improvement. If anyone has helpful advice on what settings I should use, I will appreciate it very much. I might look through the X170KM-G thread to see what everyone there is doing. 
When I looked at the comparison between the time spy scores of my Clevo N960Kx to the Clevo X170KM-g, I realize I still have some work to do, but this is still pretty good considering this laptop only cost me $1,100. I will run these scores again later after I do some further tuning. 

Images in order:

1.) Time Spy score: 10,220 overall, graphics score: 9,990, CPU score: 11755

2.) Geekbench 5: single-core 1,743, multi-core 10,136

3.) Passmark: CPU 25,133, 3D score 19,277

4.) Userbenchmarks: Gaming 133%, Desktop 110%, Workstation 132%

5.) Cinebench R23: Single-core: 1,558, multi-core: 12,914

6.) Showing idle temps 31-33C

 

 

 

 

 

 

[kaz26]

I have a feeling I won't be able to improve the benchmarks much more than this with the 230W power supply that came with this laptop. The Clevo X170KM-G comes with a 280W power supply, but owners have upgraded that to 330W or higher. 

[srs2236]

The X170KM-G comes with two 280W power supplies with total of 560W power.

 

Nice job though!

[kaz26]

Wow, I didn't realize...  I guess that makes sense. When I run my setup through a power supply calculator it says to use a 550-600w power supply. I am running on less than half the power of the X170KM-G right now. Next on the list after thermal mods should be a larger power supply, atleast if my system can make use of it. I'm not even sure my motherboard will allow more power than I'm currently providing. 

I have a 330W power supply I can use, but I don't want to cut my stock wiring, so I need to find a jack that can handle the high current without frying. The size is 5.5mm OD, 2.5mm ID. 

 

[kaz26]

New and improved benchmark scores!

 

1.) Time Spy score of 11,019
2.) UserbenchMarks:  141%  110%  141%

3.) Geekbench 5: GPU Compute Scores Top 3 are newest

4.) Geekbench 5: CPU scores, top 2 are more relevant

 

One thing to note is that I was getting very close to 11,000 on several runs, but decided to push the GPU just a llittle more and that got me over 11,000. The thermals on the GPU side actually aren't that bad stock. It's the processor that's putting out so much heat and probably needs one more heat pipe. Although I feel it's possible to push this a bit more and get higher benchmarks, I am please with the results so far. From here I might so a little more on the cooling system, but probably won't push the system this hard with benchmarks moving forward. This laptop has been a pleasant surprise to be honest. 

 

To cleanup backgrounds apps and such, I used Tron script. For undervolting the CPU I used Throttlestop and for overclocking the GPU I used NVIDIA Inspector. I first used MSI Afterburner, but I got much better results using Inspector. I'm not sure why this is the situation, it just is. Maybe someone will be able to shed more light on the reason for this. The reason I ran Tron script was because I was getting random spikes in CPU usage and resulting temps and couldn't figure out what was causing it. Tron fixed the problem and might have even helped me get a better benchmark score. 

 

 

 

 

[nguyentu98lt]

Nice cool and modding,can you share your bios unlock,thank you.

[MiRaGe]

Hi, in what way was nVidia Inspectir better than MSi Afterburner?

You achieved better clocks with the first one or?

[kaz26]

@MiRaGe
To be honest, I do not understand why my laptop performed better with nvidia inspector, all I can say is that I tried MSI Afterburner first and then tried Inspector and for reason unknown to me, the benchmarks were consistently higher with the same clock settings that I used with Afterburner. It is entirely possible that I did something wrong when using Afterburner, and if anyone thinks they might have an answer to this, I would like to hear it because I am curious as well. 

With that said, I was running +220 Clock and +600 Memory when I achieved the most recent benchmark scores (11,019 Time Spy and such). My GPU temps were low with these settings, but when I made them higher the system became unstable. I might try again later with a higher memory clock. During that run, I also undervolted the CPU slightly to keep the temps under 90C. These numbers will vary on everyone's machine, so it's probably pointless to even say the voltage I'm running. What I can say is that I reduced it in increments of only 10mV while running CPU-z benchmark to see where it would perform best. At a certain point of adjusting both the core and cache voltages I found that I was able to achieve a multi-core score of 6,300 in CPU-z, then I ran Geekbench to see if my score improved and it had, so then I focused on the GPU. On the CPU I am also running the cores at 48 across the board for the turbo ratio limits in ThrottleStop. To optimize further I will also later increase these individually on the cores that are running cooler. Where I have it set now, I get 10.2k every run without other apps open. Also, my CPU runs best when the core is undervolted slightly more than the cache voltage, but again, this may be different on your machine and you just have to try it out. 

 

@nguyentu98lt
I am hesitant to share the BIOS here because I don't want anyone blaming me for their bricked laptop, but I do plan on posting a step-by-step of how I did it. 

[razor0601]

I bought also an N960KR but with 3060 95w TGP. Is it possible to unlock or to flash a VBios to get the 130w working?

[kaz26]

@razor0601

I'm not sure about a 130w vBIOS for the 3060. What are your temps like when you use it in gaming/working/benchmarking? If you want to try and squeeze more power out of it you could first try using NVIDIA Inspector to overclock it. If it's similar to the 3070, you could start with +150MHz base, and +300MHz memory. Just watch the temps with CPUID HWmonitor or HWinfo. Another program that can monitor what's happening is AIDA64. 

Have you flashed a vBIOS before?  Just be careful if you don't know how to solder and lack ICSP abilities. 

[razor0601]

So first of all my Clevo arrived. It’s an N960KP. KR is with your 3070. And my 3060 has a TGP of 105W. Is think the temps are pretty fine. Max temp in Superposition is 72 Degrees Celcius. On techpowerup there are various Clevo  VBios‘s but most of them are 115w. One is with 140w. But never heard of a 3060 with 140w. The highest official was 130w. 
 

I have flashed VBios and also Bios many times with tools and also with programmer. Desoldering and soldering is also no problem. But not with this new Clevo. Then my warranty is void.

[kaz26]

I'm curious what it says for max power in NVIDIA control panel > System Settings (Bottom left corner).  

I was curious about your experience level because you could try experimenting with cross flashing the ASUS vBIOS, but it might not go well. In the past when things have gone south, I used a SOIC test clip and external programmer to flash the BIOS. The alternative to that is to desolder the CMOS chip and solder a new one on. I have never desoldered a CMOS, but I did have to solder one on when I used an HP version P4200 Quadro in my Clevo P750DM-G. It was pretty simple actually, I used kapton tape around the area to protect it. 

Before flashing the vBIOS though, you might want to simply try overclocking it to see what it can handle. Have you done any benchmarks yet?

[razor0601]

I think your 140w is the most possible TGP for a 3070. 

I don’t want to desolder the VBios Chip because of the warranty. So that’s the reason I want to know if someone already did the VBios flash via NVFlash or CH341 programmer for the 3060. 

 

i have done the superposition benchmark. See my pic.

[kaz26]

From what I have seen, that's not bad for a notebook RTX 3060. Have you tried overclocking yet?  

[razor0601]

Not yet. I will try it tomorrow. What is your score in Superposition Extreme FullHD?

[razor0601]

I’d did a little bit of OC. First run is with +150 Core, +300 Mem, second one is +200 and +400

[kaz26]

That's looking pretty good!  Have you looked at how much power the GPU is drawing during those runs? 
I'm curious what it will be with +200 core, +600 mem. Mine was more stable and ran faster with three times the memory than core being added. I haven't done the Superposition benchmark, but I might try it later today. I will post it here when I do. I recently had a mishap with new RAM I tried installing. 

I was maxing out my 32GB RAM with the 3D design work I do. This machine only has two RAM slots, so I bought a 32GBx2 kit. I found a Mushkin Redline 64GB (32GBx2) kit that seemed to suit my needs and the price was right ($171 after tax): 
                                          3200MHz (PC4-25600) CL-16  Model # MRA4S320GJJM32GX2

I installed it and set XMP to profile 1, and it booted fine at 3200MHz CL16. I had some design work to do so I got right into it and it crashed 2 minutes in. I rebooted and tried it again, and it crashed again, this time corrupting a windows file (It was repair by running SFC /SCANNOW in command prompt). At that point I was over it. I might open a new thread to see if maybe there are some BIOS settings that will allow this RAM to run on my machine with these timings, otherwise I will return it and get something else. 

Once I get my RAM situation sorted, I will run new benchmarks and post them. I am currently running my G.Skill at its max speed of 3000MHz, so it might show some improvements once sorted with 3200MHz or higher if possible. The challenge is really the price. I don't want to keep the cost of this RAM under $200.