electrosoft

Dagger to the heart....

Nice! I'm digging the all red .sig too! "All Hail AMD!" style 🙂

This echoes my existence almost exactly. My younger brother started playing EQ back in the day and I invited him to come out and stay with me for a few weeks so him along with my other younger brother and a friend could attend DC Con (ID Quake convention back in the day) and the first thing he did when he got here was ask where he could set up and jack in with his desktop to "camp a rare" and I just shrugged and hooked him up to my ISDN and he played all day, evening and when I went to bed and woke up he was still playing. I was amazed a game could hold someone's attention for that long and how was that possible. He played EQ everyday all day and cleared my fridge of all its pent up hot and lean pockets. 🙂 Even in my early days of WoW I could never play that long but I found out I could pull 8-10hr sessions which I never thought possible before. Programming? Yes. Gaming? No but it was an eye opener. I made (and continue to have) numerous friendships from online guilds (WoW) and clans (Quake) over the years. Ditto on the bi-racial issue(s) too. I'm 50% african 50% European (40% UK)...textbook. PSO, VF and Shenmue along with Working Designs games slated for release were the primary reasons I picked up a Dreamcast back in the day. I love the idea that your addiction would derive primarily from achieving maximum value from your paid subscription. 🙂 I played PSO primarily on the Dreamcast but never tried the PC version. My original love derived from the Genesis versions (I and II) and I definitely feel you on the identity crisis. Kids can be incredibly cruel. WoW started off much more like EQ in terms of complexity and difficulty but over the years they've definitely dumbed down a lot of mechanics and made playing/questing much easier plus back in the day day no add-ons. It was much more hardcore. I try to tell my wife and daughter (who also plays) about how much harder it was "back in my day" (usually seated on a porch somewhere waving my fist at imaginary kids on my lawn). I never, EVER allowed myself to pay more than the cost of the game and subscription (if it had one). Even to this day, I will never, ever pay extra for anything. When I see family, friends and guildies forking over REAL money for P2W or useless skins/accessories I just shake my head, remount my imaginary porch and start to regale them yet again.... Rules for newer versions: Does your current system have problems that this new version will address? Read the change log notes..is there an unknown issue you were unaware of that needs to be addressed? If the answer is no to both, skip it and continue using your system. If it will address an issue, is the issue critical of nature that is in a "nothing to lose" configuration? If no, wait at least a few weeks till others test it / shake out any potential issues. I never, ever rush to install updates / newer versions of anything.

I used to play hardcore 8-10hrs a day back at launch for WoW (I got by on 3-4hrs of sleep some nights), but over time and years I've pulled back from hardcore raiding and I am a full on casual now and enjoy the journey. I play a couple of hours most days. On the days I have time, I'll throw in a 3 or 4hr session but nothing like I used to be. If I know I want to play both, I'll purposely play one 1-2hrs and the other 1-2hrs. Diablo IV drops this summer to boot and I'm all about that too....ugh. My wife on the other hand has been playing a little over 2yrs of WoW now and she can still fully pull 4-6hr sessions with ease. She asks me why I don't play like that anymore and I just tell her I've been playing for 18yrs now. I've found my groove. Fallout 76 on the other hand is "new" to me and I could easily get sucked in for 4-6hrs quickly as everything is still so fresh and newish. I went through a phase where I played EQII pretty hardcore too for about a year too. I'll stop and take breaks for new games I want to play that have fixed end points (CP2077, Deux Ex series, etc...).

@Papusan Go big or go home bro! 🙂

The mobile variant of the 3060 truly was the closest approximation to the desktop version. 3070 dropped off noticeably and the 3080 was just a joke in comparison. 3060 is a good 1080p GPU. Must be a solid gaming experience for you.

The XFX 7900XTX is a tank and a good sample. No coil whine, stays cool under load and the aesthetics are fantastic but in the end the 4090 is an (expensive) AMD slayer. I've thought about holding onto the XFX 7900XTX just to see how drivers progress and potentially build out an all X3D rig but I'm sure common sense will kick in especially if I switch to X3D on my primary if it proves to be the superior gaming CPU. Once I do a clean install I'll get in there and see where it goes GPU and VRAM wise. Hitting up to 2835 and never dropping below 2820 in TS runs is a good start at stock.

4090 is a certified WoW/FO76 beast. Fallout 76 after an hour...I have my display capped to 140fps (144hz display) and average fps? 140fps ~66% GPU utilization....Fallout 76 is a wrap. Can't get any better performance than this at 5120x1440 for my 144hz display WoW Dragon flight FP runs RT on ...CPU bound but still averaging 133fps RT on / 141fps RT off. This will only get worst end game as CPU utilization skyrockets with PvP/PvE. With the 13900ks or a 7800X3D I'm thinking that's a wrap too for my display and gaming or "tough" it out for the fall RPL refresh aka last of the socket 1700. In both scenarios with the 7900XTX I was pegged to 100% GPU usage with much lower fps. (1-9% faster than the Strix 3080 10GB for WoW, ~30% faster in FO76).

Zero regrets picking up this 4090. WoW is now as it should be and I'll be on the hunt for a CPU upgrade now to try and keep up with it. I know when I get to end game my 12900k is just going to choke hard even at 5120x1440. I can just imagine @Papusan at 1440p it will always be ready and willing for a CPU upgrade for quite a few generations to take advantage of it when you get your Asus. Gigabyte 4090 back in stock at da Egg.... It is also their #1 Seller https://www.newegg.com/gigabyte-geforce-rtx-4090-gv-n4090gaming-oc-24gd/p/N82E16814932550?Item=N82E16814932550&Description=4090&cm_re=4090-_-14-932-550-_-Product&quicklink=true

Yes it can be used stand alone. The idea is when you're at home or near your res/pump you can just quickly connect and get better performance / less noise.

Yeah I looked and went, "Ummm?" You can keep the mouse pad MSI. Give me the screws. 🙂 No way I'm going with the turbo jets lol but I will investigate Push/Pull and/or another set of fans down the line. Running more tests now but definitely CPU bound. Raster is barely outperforming RT. I'm going to give it a clean install just like I gave the 7900XTX a clean install of its own just to make sure. I'll also check to see if OpenRGB supports the Strix and Suprim instead of loading their bloatware since both are rainbow/pulsing by default atm. 🤮

Spent a few hours and installed new contact frame, cleaning the dust and gunk out and yanking some fans and popping in the Suprim X. While doing that I moved my 2x16gb DDR4 sticks over to the Strix Z590-E with the golden 10900k (in there while my X170SM-G is being repaired) to see how far they would go over there with 1.5v and they topped out at 4300mhz. They would boot at 4400 but while TM5 passed Windows Memory Diagnostics did not. 4300mhz was rock solid in both. I plan on verifying this just setting my Z690-A into G2 and running the same settings at 4300 to remove the CPU IMC from the equation and see if the motherboard can hit that same 4300 (or higher) while I contemplate a 7800X3D or 13900KS (see WoW update below). I have a GPU to EVGA 4xPCIe cable on order so I'll be able to get rid of that tentacle sooner than later. First impressions of the Suprim X Liquid: Beautiful card well built Fans are crazy quiet under load but I could up their fan speed if I wanted to bring temps down under 60. Mild coil whine >200fps when running TS (This is with the case totally exposed with front, back and side panels all removed) No coil whine in WoW (Display capped at 144hz) (Same as above) Coil whine on this card vs bud's Suprim X 4090 Air cooled model is like night and day capped at 144hz (thank goodness!) Stock clocks are at ~2820mhz in TS and WoW. 4 screws for 8 holes? Mmmmkay. Pump is dead silent...I was expecting EVGA level pump action noise. Pleasant surprise. Stock Timespy run out of the box: As for WoW..... I have some tweaking and other things to do but.... Well, it's official.... total stock 12900k and I'm CPU bound at 5120x1440. First time ever I've seen the CPU pegged to 100% routinely ever and this CPU has seen the KPE 3090, KPE 3090ti, Strix 3080, XFX 7900XTX and never even kissed 70%. With RT on, as soon as I'm up around 125fps+ the CPU is bouncing off of 100%. I've never seen the CPU % light up red before. I'm not even to raids or PvP yet which are CPU heavy on their own especially with spell effects. Right now I'm looking at ~130fps w/ RT on vs ~70fps 3080 vs 76fps 7900XTX but I'll do some runs to get an average. I did not bank on being CPU bound at close to 4k.

I'd posit that if you have even 12th gen, 13th gen is nearly a non-starter unless you really need multi threaded. When I am shopping for...well...anything, I always keep the mindset of the upsell, what do I need and in the end for profit entities are here exactly for that...maximum profit at all costs. Intel is no more your friend than AMD, Nvidia, Google or Apple. Their objective is to make money. The curse of the 12900ks strikes again just hotter and heavier this time around.....

In Intel's defense these are just on average better binned 13900k chips and everyone knows it. There are chances a 13900k will be better or close enough as is but if you're looking for a better chance at a binned specimen out of the box this is the premium you pay. When I binned some 12900k chips and settled on my SP91 I ended up picking up a 12900ks that was a SP94 and while it was overall a better chip they both ran into thermal walls at 5.4 on my AIO and I ended up selling it to my bud versus return it. It wasn't worth the premium to me and it overall provided my setup x1 bin overall. But if you're looking for the "best of the best," a few 13900ks chips will rise to the top when all is said and done that will end up trumping the "best of the best" 13900k chips too unless you end up with a few choice samples (or examples) from the likes of Sugi and company that always end up with the dream chips. I skipped 13900k. I'm contemplating a 13900ks but I feel I might skip that too. We'll see.

EVGA E1 Frame + Suprim X Liquid + Z690 Dark + Asus AIO They should have slapped in a new EVGA CLC 360 and 3D printed an EVGA emblem to go over the "SUPRIM" to really bring it home for EVGA. I like how they replaced the MSI fans with Noctua's too.

Yeah they lasted a good 3hrs overall which is definitely a good sign. Suprim Liquid X drifted in and out of stock a few times too. Do you have a particular model that catches your fancy? lol, at least I said I wouldn't be making any decisions till February 2023 so I'm eating just a touch of crow's meat. 🙂

It was my original top choice along with the 4090 FE from launch. I also like(d) the Neptune 4090 but that isn't available here and would have to be imported for an arm and a leg. I had several opportunities to pick up various 4090 models in late December/Early Jan but most of them I didn't want (see below). I'm not the type to grab whatever is available. I'll wait for what I want and only direct from resellers/makers (No scalpers). lol, as we're finding out it is NOTHING like the Cryptodemic times of 2021-2022. If it were, all those 7900xt's and 4080s would be gone and stay gone and 4090's /7900xtx's wouldn't be coming into stock and actually sticking around for more than 5 seconds. Yeah, the Gigabyte was never on my Radar. I've had quite a few chances to grab one over the last month but zero desire. Zotacs were available too but again no desire. For me, it was always the MSI Suprim X Liquid, 4090FE and if price was no object an Asus 4090 Strix. I might have bit on an air cooled Suprim too if that was all that was there too.

We're getting to that point. Gigabyte 4090 in stock for over 2hrs and counting at Newegg: https://www.newegg.com/gigabyte-geforce-rtx-4090-gv-n4090gaming-oc-24gd/p/N82E16814932550?Item=N82E16814932550 All you had to do was just wait less than 3 months to get MSRP.....

I'd expect a 13980HX + 4090 model to cost close to or over 4k.

lol, I had no choice but to go with a bigger case when I got my original KPE 3090 back in Jan 2021. Thing was too big to fit in my Corsair 540. 🙂 My AC LF II 420 is on the recall list. I just haven't gotten around to getting in there and swapping it out to send in. I get that itch to see and test myself and sometimes I just end up ordering the item myself to see first hand and use it in my environment. I'm seeing insane frame drops in the actual Dragon Isles with RT on vs off. Literally halved from ~140 (frame capped) down to ~73 in some areas with the 7900xtx as Dragon Isles uses much more RT than the last Xpac and it shows when enabled/disabled. The 3080 10GB would sit at ~100fps then drop down to ~70fps. I haven't even gotten to level 70 and raid content where reports say the uplifted RT hits even harder. I'm not seeing a scenario where the 7900xtx is going to be be WoW Dragonflight card especially when the 3080 10GB is on par fps wise with RT enabled. AMD will most likely go through an Intel level driver uplift later when the Newest driver before the last specifically addressed World of Warcraft and the performance uplift was substantial even with RT enabled. It turned the A380 into a full 1080p proper card and the A770 into a full on proper 1440p card. Unlike Shadowlands, when you toggle RT off and on you can immediately see the difference in the environment now not just pockets here and there and spell effects when casting. My MSI Suprim X Liquid 4090 will be here tomorrow. I plan on tearing down the entire case, putting the contact frame finally on my Strix Z690, give it a righteous cleaning and probably swap in my EVGA CLC 360 so I can send back the AF LC II for a new swap. I plan on doing some CPU utilization testing next with fixed clocks from 4.8 -> 5.3 with my 12900k to see if the uplift is meaningful with the 4090 at 4k and warrants considering a 13900KS. They can let them trickle all they want and create a false sense of scarcity. Eventually buyers will buy when ready and the trick is to just not buy from Scalpers and you will eventually get your card. It was the same process as during the Cryptodemic but not nearly as painful as there is an exhaustion point for high levels of demand this time around along with other factors. If someone has the means and wants a card NOW and wants to pay inflated scalper prices that's their choice (and throwing away extra money to a scalper), but patience will get you your card at MSRP and depending on make/model maybe even below MSRP (See: 7900XT). Nice! I'm sure @Rage Set will give it a whirl too. 🙂

Yeah, they offered K5 Pro and it was on there but once it started to fail and I got in there and took a look it was a weird stiffened like mess with oils clearly separating. I re-iterated when they do the GPU replacement to please use standard thermal pads. I hope they clean it up off the VRMs too and everywhere else because it is not pretty. I spent a lot of time when I got it tracking down tons of errant liquid metal from their initial sale setup that had gotten loose. When Terreos (I was going to tag him but it seems he deleted his account here) sent it in for a repair they switched to stock thermal paste but left K5 as the thermal solution everywhere. I have no experience with K5 Pro except in this scenario but after seeing its instability and the way it pumps out and moves too much, I would not recommend it as a thermal solution except for places where normal thermal pads would not work. As for DDR4 SODIMMS, Across numerous brands and modules, Vmem 1.35 + 22-22-22 or 20-20-20 and stock terts have yet to fail me for initial testing thank goodness. Nope, I tested them extensively because I really wanted the 2x16GB kit to win but it didn't in game both highs and .01 and 1 % lows. These Corsair sticks I was able to dial in primary and secondary timings B-die style on desktops which was nice. Ballistix sticks are still really nice though. Once I get time to dig back into my X170KM-G and unlock the BIOS to the point of XMP timings access I plan on retesting the Corsair sticks in there along with the Corsair 2x32GB 3200 sticks in there now which are also Samsung modules. I thought it was 4x16GB but it is 2x32GB instead.

I used to have both the 2x8 and 2x16 version of those Ballistix sticks but I ended up sticking with 2x8GB from the Corsair kit since they could handle extreme primary and secondary tuning the Ballistix sticks could not and produced better benchmarks and fps even in single rank formation but if I didn't have the Corsair sticks I would have definitely stuck with those. If your machine has XMP access, the Ballistix sticks are a worthy set (2x16GB).

It is nearly impossible to get humans to not be greedy when that is how we've been programmed to be for quite some time especially in this capitalistic existence we currently inhabit. As for 4090's.... With the way cards are trickling in today, best bet is to refresh a 4090 focused page and move fast. If you're focused on a particular brand, just select those specifically. I know I picked MSI and Asus as there were no other makers I would contemplate to keep the list short and sweet but if you're open to any brand, your options do open up. https://www.newegg.com/p/pl?N=4841 100007709&d=rtx+4090&isdeptsrh=1&Order=1

I will say Scalpers aren't as all over them as much as during launch and real buyers are getting in on the action. Unlike before where they lasted a few seconds they now last minutes.... .....progress. 🙂

You and I have long known that diminishing returns is the name of the game for top end hardware but still went for it anyhow. The problem now is the top end hardware is insanely expensive and there is a clear and present danger of AMD and Nvidia trying to shift up the MSRP on the lower tiers. Even motherboard prices have exploded in the last 3-4 years in the mid tier range along with top end prices going through the roof. With so many motherboard makers I do wish everything would shift back down at least a bit. I remember thinking $500 was outlandish for a motherboard but clearly I was conservative in my estimations a few years back as prices have continued to track up and even now EVGA's top end boards are $800. With so many makers and variety all centered around the same chipset though you get some breathing room. Whether it is a $250 or $1000 board, it is still using Z790/X670E and many boards overclock just as well or close enough to the top end that outside of exotic cooling, it will be your chip that reaches its limits not the motherboard (See Gigabyte $250-300 X670E / MSI Z790 Pro boards which rock for OC). GPUs? Unfortunately Nvidia simply controls the narrative and even AIBs are in a bind pricing and custom design wise there is only so much they can do because Nvidia is a control freak. Toss in insane pricing and here we are. The biggest disappointment to me still is AMD. Always the perpetual underdog and pricing king keeping Intel and Nvidia somewhat honest. The first moment they bring to market real competitive products they promptly mark their pricing upwards too both CPU and GPU to try to extract maximum value versus lower profit margins and go for real marketshare gains. They then basically stretch the truth in their marketing too on top of it. I guess they figure if Nvidia and Intel can do it why can't they? It's amazing to think we're quickly approaching the one year anniversary of these forums. I am so glad and thankful they exist and work so well and took up the mantle of the old NBR forums quite nicely. It is still a pleasant surprise when you see old NBR members discover these forums and announce their arrival. We still have a few mom and pop shops holding on. Our biggest one tried to branch off into business sales and support and sacrificed their "mom and pop" audience and closed up shop a few years ago. Problem is I've found personally is that by the time a customer/client gets to me it is out of general disgust from having tried to get their PC fixed by Best Buy / Staples and then not having it done properly if at all along with the costs. Word of mouth usually leads them to my inbox. I also do a lot of builds and support for family, friends and guildies. It's very small and moreso because I enjoy it not for profitability nor would I ever want to open up a storefront for the extra overhead and responsibility. Zotac 4090 in stock at Newegg as I finish this up: ZOTAC AMP Extreme AIRO GeForce RTX 4090 Video Card ZT-D40900B-10P - Newegg.com