*Official Benchmark Thread* - Post it here or it didn't happen :D

[Mr. Fox]

3 hours ago, Papusan said:

I thought the new driver could work for you in  for 3DMark but not for the gamers who try figuring out why their shiny Red cards bench3ed as garbage. Remember what not works for other may offer more for those that seeek awesome🙂

3 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

I suppose I could do a Macrium Reflect backup before testing the new driver. I need this to be reliable since it is my work PC. AMD software/drivers put deep hooks into the OS very much like the ASUS Armory Crate cancer feces. After using Revo and DDU I still found trash running in the background from AMD and using Autoruns to disable that made my OSes on the benching rig unbootable with BSOD. I had to restore old Macrium images from before installing the 6900 XT to get rid of the stuff. It really pissed me off, but thank God I had the Macrium images.

OK, so I made a Macrium image of my crash dummy OS installation so I can test the new driver without having to clean up a mess after the fact.

 

Speaking of "dummy" check out this idiot troll trying hard to derail my thread at OC.net. Too funny that there are still losers like this nitwit on that once great forum. It's becoming overrun by emotards like this fart, LOL.

https://www.overclock.net/threads/rtx-3090-k-ngp-n-hydro-copper-block.1805258/post-29168372

 

Here is an example of the bug I am trying to avoid. Maybe the new driver will fix it. Otherwise, I will keep using the driver from October 2021 that doesn't have the issue.

 

 

[Papusan]

44 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

OK, so I made a Macrium image of my crash dummy OS installation so I can test the new driver without having to clean up a mess after the fact.

 

Speaking of "dummy" check out this idiot troll trying hard to derail my thread at OC.net. Too funny that there are still losers like this nitwit on that once great forum. It's becoming overrun by emotards like this fart, LOL.

https://www.overclock.net/threads/rtx-3090-k-ngp-n-hydro-copper-block.1805258/post-29168372

 

Here is an example of the bug I am trying to avoid. Maybe the new driver will fix it. Otherwise, I will keep using the driver from October 2021 that doesn't have the issue.

 

 

Have you tested all drivers for RDNA2 before AMD released RDNA3 ? It seems AMD don't want fix problems for the older cards. All works is for 7000 series cards. I expect AMD only try make the games works properly with older cards with newer drivers. Bugs as you mention above is totally forgotten. 

 

This is the love AMD have given older cards the last months. Almost nothing! This is something you haven't seen from NVIDIA.

https://wccftech.com/amd-has-not-released-a-new-radeon-driver-for-rdna-2-radeon-rx-6000-gpus-in-2-months/

 

More from 3070 🙂

https://hwbot.org/submission/5243489_papusan_unigine_superposition___1080p_xtreme_geforce_rtx_3070_10554_points

 

https://hwbot.org/submission/5243496_papusan_unigine_superposition___8k_optimized_geforce_rtx_3070_5999_points

 

https://hwbot.org/submission/5243483_papusan_3dmark___port_royal_geforce_rtx_3070_9636_marks

[Mr. Fox]

8 minutes ago, Papusan said:

Have you tested all drivers for RDNA2 before AMD released RDNA3 ? It seems AMD don't want fix problems for the older cards. All works is for 7000 series cards. I expect AMD only try make the games works properly with older cards with newer drivers. Bugs as you mention above is totally forgotten. 

 

This is the love AMD have given older cards the last months. Almost nothing! This is something you haven't seen from NVIDIA.

https://wccftech.com/amd-has-not-released-a-new-radeon-driver-for-rdna-2-radeon-rx-6000-gpus-in-2-months/

AMD drivers have been a mess since AMD purchased ATi. For years... literally. This GPU is fun to overclock. It is also frustrating. But, it is not as locked down as modern NVIDIA cards. While it is a pain in the butt, I can do things with it using the MPT that I can't do on a stock NVIDIA GPU in terms of performance tweaks.

 

It's not anywhere near the quality (hardware or driver) or overall performance as a competing GeForce card, but there is some merit to having some fun with it versus accepting the cookie cutter crippled product that NVIDIA represents today. Unless I use LN2 (which I am not going to do) I am not going to gain any benching points using the 3090. It has taken me as far as it is going to, but it is a MUCH better product with superior drivers. If I had to choose between Red and Green, the Green card would win without question.

 

What would be really awesome is if we could tweak the performance of a 4090 in ways that I can tweak the 6900 XT. It is sad that we can't.

[tps3443]

I’m really missing the MSI Unify-X… I may go back. I’m not really loving this bios, like at all. 

[Mr. Fox]

1 hour ago, tps3443 said:

I’m really missing the MSI Unify-X… I may go back. I’m not really loving this bios, like at all. 

I had a hunch you would end up feeling that way. I used to love ASUS firmware, but they have made such a mess of so many things it's not even funny. They've screwed up their firmware, too. There are a few conflicting settings (especially true with AMD firmware) and a level of weirdness they never had in the past. I really do not like the ROG BIOS at all on the Strix Z690 and it's basically the same menus and features as the Apex with a few minor exceptions. The MSI and EVGA firmware are both very straightforward and do not have obscure settings. ASUS also fails to provide an option for disabling the Intel ME, which really sucks. 

5 hours ago, Papusan said:

I thought the new driver could work for you in  for 3DMark but not for the gamers who try figuring out why their shiny Red cards bench3ed as garbage. Remember what not works for other may offer more for those that seeek awesome🙂

I am not sure what some users are finding wrong with 3DMark. Seems fine to me. In fact, my GPU score in Time Spy is greater than ever. Overclocked, the GPU is still pulling lot of power, showing 750W+ from the wall per my Kill-A-Watt meter. Hotspot temperature is still being (mis)reported over 100°C (which I believe is wrong since the GPU core max is below 70°C). Everything with 3DMark seems normal or better. I still need to check to see if the text rendering in Micro$lop Office is fixed, worse or the same.

 

https://www.3dmark.com/compare/spy/37359899/spy/36646744

See Graphics scores. New driver is on the left. (Ignore Physics score as the benchmark on the right is 6.0GHz and the one on the left from just now is 5.7GHz.)

I just do not see any way that the hotspot temp can actually be what is reported. The delta from other related temperatures is too great for that to be accurate.

[Papusan]

Nvidia’s next goal is fully enabled path-tracing and fake frame feature v4. When current gen cards is more than fast enough for years forwards, they need find other ways to push you over on next gen graphics cards. And the game developers will be paid well to help make games harder to run. What a monkey business. 
 

 

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/rtx-4090-16fps-cyberpunk-2077-overdrive
 

RTX 4090 Gets Just 16 FPS in Cyberpunk 2077 RT Overdrive Preview

 

 

[Etern4l]

42 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

I had a hunch you would end up feeling that way. I used to love ASUS firmware, but they have made such a mess of so many things it's not even funny. They've screwed up their firmware, too. There are a few conflicting settings (especially true with AMD firmware) and a level of weirdness they never had in the past. I really do not like the ROG BIOS at all on the Strix Z690 and it's basically the same menus and features as the Apex with a few minor exceptions. The MSI and EVGA firmware are both very straightforward and do not have obscure settings. ASUS also fails to provide an option for disabling the Intel ME, which really sucks. 

I am not sure what some users are finding wrong with 3DMark. Seems fine to me. In fact, my GPU score in Time Spy is greater than ever. Overclocked, the GPU is still pulling lot of power, showing 750W+ from the wall per my Kill-A-Watt meter. Hotspot temperature is still being (mis)reported over 100°C (which I believe is wrong since the GPU core max is below 70°C). Everything with 3DMark seems normal or better. I still need to check to see if the text rendering in Micro$lop Office is fixed, worse or the same.

 

https://www.3dmark.com/compare/spy/37359899/spy/36646744

See Graphics scores. New driver is on the left. (Ignore Physics score as the benchmark on the right is 6.0GHz and the one on the left from just now is 5.7GHz.)

I just do not see any way that the hotspot temp can actually be what is reported. The delta from other related temperatures is too great for that to be accurate.

 

Intel ME is an interesting topic, thanks for pointing out. Apparently difficult to disable, but possible. Dell sells laptops with IME disabled to the government:

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_Management_Engine

[Mr. Fox]

46 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

I still need to check to see if the text rendering in Micro$lop Office is fixed, worse or the same.

OMG, the text rendering problem... it's worse that ever now, LOL. Going back to the 2021 driver. It is even happening in Chrome a little bit now and it only used to happen in Micro$lop Office applications before. In Chrome (posting this information) the missing characters only lag for maybe half a second, so it is only a little bit problematic. At least I can tell what I am typing, but in Office... yeah, worse now than what I show in the above video.

  

1 minute ago, Etern4l said:

 

Intel ME is an interesting topic, thanks for pointing out. Apparently difficult to disable, but possible. Dell sells laptops with IME disabled to the government:

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_Management_Engine

Yeah, it is an awesome feature in EVGA BIOS. It should be expected as a basic feature on all enthusiast motherboards. It is inexcusable that a ROG mobo doesn't have the option. It is as easy as selecting "disabled" on the menu for it, and rebooting with the EVGA BIOS. You can get ASUS BIOS mods with the ME removed physically. I think ASUS telemetry and spyware would be broken with it disabled and we know they need that telemetry cancer to survive.

 

Not only is it a security risk for anyone that cares (I don't) it impairs performance. With Intel ME disabled I almost never see Intel Watchdog Timer error when I am overclocking to the edge of functionality. The Intel ME "manages" some things that I do not want anyone to manage but me. My hardware components do not need to "talk" to one another and I think things work better when they can't.

 

Prema BIOS also had the option to disable Intel ME on the X170.

[Etern4l]

Have people ever ordered stuff from Corsair directly? Any experiences to share? 

[Rage Set]

8 minutes ago, Etern4l said:

Have people ever ordered stuff from Corsair directly? Any experiences to share? 

 

I've ordered some DDR5 sticks from them, when they were hard to get. Shipped directly from China, much quicker than I expected. No complaints. 

[Rage Set]

Hmmmmmm. Long story, short. Don't buy the 7950X3D nor 7900X3D (should be obvious). Also, don't buy the 7800X3D if you need to do other things besides gaming.

 

AMD really handicapped this CPU to ensure the 7950X3D/7900X3D were not too far behind and yet the 7800X3D made those CPUs and others obsolete. This is such a confusing launch of CPUs.

 

 

 

[Etern4l]

22 minutes ago, Rage Set said:

 

I've ordered some DDR5 sticks from them, when they were hard to get. Shipped directly from China, much quicker than I expected. No complaints. 

 

Thank you, cool. Do you remember roughly how long the delivery took? Would you have to return back to China if need be? Presumably not...

[ryan]

7 hours ago, Papusan said:

 

RTX 4090 Gets Just 16 FPS in Cyberpunk 2077 RT Overdrive Preview

 I just saw that on my news feed, thought it was just garbage news/headline but yes it's true the game is in some serious need of optimisation as it doesn't even look good, looks like half life two with polish

 

picture of the new president of the world

 

I hate to say it but at the very least the face textures look better on half life 2 but I guess everything else is looking dated this side of it's water. but still it came out in 2004 its over 19 years old.

 

now take a game from 1985 and compare it to half life 2, see my point. somethings not right

[Rage Set]

40 minutes ago, Etern4l said:

 

Thank you, cool. Do you remember roughly how long the delivery took? Would you have to return back to China if need be? Presumably not...

 

From the date of purchase to delivery, I think it was like 10 business days. Seven of those days were shipping. Now I didn't know it was shipping from China, but it still got here pretty quick. 

 

Returns are based in your country and I am sure they have service centers in the UK.

[Rage Set]

Just now, ryan said:

 I just saw that on my news feed, thought it was just garbage news/headline but yes it's true the game is in some serious need of optimisation as it doesn't even look good, looks like half life two with polish

 

It is full path tracing....bro, the optimizations will come as new generations of cards. And I mean, generations of cards to enjoy full path tracing at 60fps.

[ryan]

oic i havent looked into it quite yet just having my morning coffee

[Etern4l]

50 minutes ago, Rage Set said:

 

From the date of purchase to delivery, I think it was like 10 business days. Seven of those days were shipping. Now I didn't know it was shipping from China, but it still got here pretty quick. 

 

Returns are based in your country and I am sure they have service centers in the UK.

 

You know what, I will just wait for these to show up on Amazon. Just went through a mini-hell with a large PC/component reseller. Memory was showing up as "in stock" for next day delivery. They changed the order to "dispatched" but carrier tracking showed they didn't actually deliver the item to the carrier. They were asking me to wait 3-5 days for an investigation to complete, as they are checking CCTV etc. lol.  Possibly just stalling until resupplies arrive, which I would have probably been OK with, had they just said so. They were refusing to refund for a while, then eventually agreed to it, minus shipping fees.... A seedy shop, in retrospect I've had issues with every second order with them, won't be returning unless there is no other choice.

There have been reports in the press about expensive Amazon deliveries showing up as a box of bricks etc. I'd rather take my chances with that, at least I know Amazon support would sort it out in 5 minutes. Rant over. 

[tps3443]

I’m just struggling to get any CPU Overclock stable on this Apex motherboard at all. I can get them Cinebench stable, but that’s not exactly what I’m after. I’m trying to play a game (The Last of Us) PC release, and it does this shader compiling in first launch that uses tons of power on the cpu 300+ watts, and if it’s not stable it crashes. I’m limited to about DDR5 7400 on the memory. I did manage to get inside windows at 7800 (That was very very difficult to do) But definitely not stable. I can actually run my Unify-X at DDR5 8000 and game lol.  Or shader compile (The last of Us at 6.1Ghz with my Unify-X
 

I feel like the board is just crap… I like the OC of the EVGA and MSI bios. 
 

Set Pcore, set Ecore, set ring. Disable load line or set some heavy duty LLC!  Enter cpu voltage and go! 
 

Im gonna keep messing with it, but I’m leaning towards selling it or use as SP work

horse only, but it struggles to even do that right lol, probably going back to my MSI Unify-X. I hate the Apex…Wow, glad I got that off my chest. The Unity-X is a stability BEAST! This thing? 🤞🤣
 

 

[electrosoft]

10 hours ago, tps3443 said:

I’m really missing the MSI Unify-X… I may go back. I’m not really loving this bios, like at all. 

 

The MSI boards (and even laptops) had my favorite BIOS right after EVGA.

 

My ranking of favorite BIOS:

 

#1. EVGA

#2. MSI

#3. Asus

#4. Asrock

#5. Gigabyte

 

2 hours ago, Etern4l said:

 

Thank you, cool. Do you remember roughly how long the delivery took? Would you have to return back to China if need be? Presumably not...

 

When I ordered a few sets of memory from Corsair one shipped right from China and another from USA. When I had to return/RMA a set, it was USA based.

 

1 hour ago, ryan said:

 I just saw that on my news feed, thought it was just garbage news/headline but yes it's true the game is in some serious need of optimisation as it doesn't even look good, looks like half life two with polish

 

picture of the new president of the world

 

I hate to say it but at the very least the face textures look better on half life 2 but I guess everything else is looking dated this side of it's water. but still it came out in 2004 its over 19 years old.

 

now take a game from 1985 and compare it to half life 2, see my point. somethings not right

 

Full Path Tracing is "end game" for rendering and the ultimate goal even decades ago when we were full blown away when we could spend minutes rendering a single frame of ray tracing on Macs back in the early 90s. Now we have real time RT and soon (1 or 2 generations) we will have real time RT as fast as raster is today and PT will be the new RT but everything is moving towards real time PT. This is how the industry moves forward.

 

53 minutes ago, tps3443 said:

I’m just struggling to get any CPU Overclock stable on this Apex motherboard at all. I can get them Cinebench stable, but that’s not exactly what I’m after. I’m trying to play a game (The Last of Us) PC release, and it does this shader compiling in first launch that uses tons of power on the cpu 300+ watts, and if it’s not stable it crashes. I’m limited to about DDR5 7400 on the memory. I did manage to get inside windows at 7800 (That was very very difficult to do) But definitely not stable. I can actually run my Unify-X at DDR5 8000 and game lol.  Or shader compile (The last of Us at 6.1Ghz with my Unify-X
 

I feel like the board is just crap… I like the OC of the EVGA and MSI bios. 
 

Set Pcore, set Ecore, set ring. Disable load line or set some heavy duty LLC!  Enter cpu voltage and go! 
 

Im gonna keep messing with it, but I’m leaning towards selling it or use as SP work

horse only, but it struggles to even do that right lol, probably going back to my MSI Unify-X. I hate the Apex…Wow, glad I got that off my chest. The Unity-X is a stability BEAST! This thing? 🤞🤣
 

 

 

I remember distinctly when I moved to EVGA boards how I was able to extract a bin or two. I know my MSI Z490 and Z590 boards outclassed my Asus and especially Gigabyte boards. I rocked a couple of Taichi boards before too. Didn't hate them at all but when pushed they weren't as stable as the top three.

 

I definitely liked the MSI Z690 Unify-X I had. Only reason I returned my Unify-X was because my 12900k topped out at 7400 and performance was at or lesser than my 4133 DDR4 G1 setup on the Strix Z690 D4 I've been rocking since December 2021. It was either pony up another 500-600+ for a 13900k on top of the $250 for memory I spent and $350 for the motherboard or just return the motherboard, sell the memory at no loss and wait saving ~$1100.

 

I'm flat out skipping the 13900k and waiting for the last RPL refresh this fall to potentially upgrade one last socket run or switch to the 7800X3D depending on results for my games.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Papusan]

4 hours ago, Rage Set said:

Hmmmmmm. Long story, short. Don't buy the 7950X3D nor 7900X3D (should be obvious). Also, don't buy the 7800X3D if you need to do other things besides gaming.

 

AMD really handicapped this CPU to ensure the 7950X3D/7900X3D were not too far behind and yet the 7800X3D made those CPUs and others obsolete. This is such a confusing launch of CPUs.

Hmmmmmm. Long story, short.... All you get is a gamer chips. Equal as a console. For one purpose only🙂

 

Btw. Going with AMD... Expect bugs. And expect they put all the works in the new and shiny. Exactly as bro Fox see with RDNA2. 

 

Baffling Windows 11 TPM Bug Is Wreaking Havoc On Some AMD Ryzen Systems

A new TPM bug has surfaced on AMD Ryzen-based systems where the CPU’s built-in TPM module fails to be recognized in Windows 10 and 11, in spite of the module being activated in BIOS. This has been recognized by Microsoft, however, there is no fix at this time. 

 

This issue is a big problem for users who actively use the built-in TPM module for data encryption. This bug can prevent encrypted data from being accessed, and in a worst-case scenario prevent boot-ups entirely if the boot drive is encrypted. 

 

This issue is highly reminiscent of the AMD fTPM bug that was plaguing Ryzen systems a year ago, causing system stuttering to occur. But this new bug is substantially worse since the issue can prevent the TPM module from functioning at all.

 

 

3 hours ago, Rage Set said:

 

It is full path tracing....bro, the optimizations will come as new generations of cards. And I mean, generations of cards to enjoy full path tracing at 60fps.

Yep, nowadays cards is fast as hell, but Nvidia need features to u-sell new gen cards. Just look at Nvidia's new gen laptop cards. Not much of a raw performance increase, but latest gen DLSS save the day.

[electrosoft]

1 minute ago, Papusan said:

Hmmmmmm. Long story, short.... All you get is a gamer chips. Equal as a console. For one purpose only🙂

 

Btw. Going with AMD... Expect bugs. And expect they put all the works in the new and shiny. Exactly as bro Fox see with RDNA2. 

 

Baffling Windows 11 TPM Bug Is Wreaking Havoc On Some AMD Ryzen Systems

A new TPM bug has surfaced on AMD Ryzen-based systems where the CPU’s built-in TPM module fails to be recognized in Windows 10 and 11, in spite of the module being activated in BIOS. This has been recognized by Microsoft, however, there is no fix at this time. 

 

 

Yep, nowadays cards is fast as hell, but Nvidia need features to u-sell new gen cards. Just look at Nvidia's new gen laptop cards. Not much of a raw performance increase, but latest gen DLSS save the day.

 

If this turns out like the 5800X3D vs tuned/un-tuned 12900k, a fully tuned 13900k will still beat it outright but for PnP simplicity, the 7800X3D will be better for gaming overall.

 

 

[Papusan]

6 minutes ago, electrosoft said:

 

If this turns out like the 5800X3D vs tuned/un-tuned 12900k, a fully tuned 13900k will still beat it outright but for PnP simplicity, the 7800X3D will be better for gaming overall.

 

 

Yep, as I said the new X3D gaming chips is the  computer worlds "console" replacement. And I don't only talk about the 7800X3D. All v-cashe chips is in short gamer chips.. The only difference between them is the price point.

 

Exacly the the way the average Joe/gamer Joe want it... Plug and play. Exactly as with a Console 🙂 Just more expensive.

[Etern4l]

29 minutes ago, Papusan said:

Yep, as I said the new X3D gaming chips is the  computer worlds "console" replacement. And I don't only talk about the 7800X3D. All v-cashe chips is in short gamer chips.. The only difference between them is the price point.

 

Exacly the the way the average Joe/gamer Joe want it... Plug and play. Exactly as with a Console 🙂 Just more expensive.

 

I do wonder though how many "average gamers" really game on desktop PCs as opposed to consoles, and frankly laptops. Just by the fact that someone built their own PC, they are no longer an average gamer in my book, even if they mostly use the PC for gaming. 

 

I also question whether a pure gamer would even care or notice any out of the box issues with the 13900K. I imagine very few games would push the CPU at stock settings past 200W.

 

But it's true though that Intel systems should be better out of the box, way too much voltage. Takes a bit of understanding of the various voltage regulation functions to get things right here. On the other hand, there are those auto-tuning tools as well, most of people here I imagine never bother with. I've only tried the automatic "gaming mode", available in the Ez mode of the MSI BIOS once, and recall not being too impressed in CB23, but that's not what that's for, and perhaps it's not that bad in actual games. Asus has some "AI" tuning as well. 

 

Intel will probably address the voltage issues by re-enabling the new voltage regulator in RPL (such that things run better out of the box, although the potential for gains from manual tuning will likely be reduced) and calling it a groundbreaking 2023 refresh :)

[cylix]

AMD Ryzen 7 7800X3D Review with Gaming and Workstation – Ultra-fast gaming with half the fuel of a Core i9-13900K

 

https://www.igorslab.de/en/amd-ryzen-7-7800x3d-in-gaming-and-workstation-test-ultra-fast-gaming-in-a-different-energy-dimension/12/

[tps3443]

@Mr. Fox

 

Just go buy a random retail KS (Maybe from like BestBuy). Not even kidding. I know some people are funny over SP rating and hold it as high as god lol. Let me tell ya this first!! 
 

My 13900KS is an SP104 Global lol. P-SP114, E-SP86. Low SP that I was not expecting at all! Chip is a straight monster though… 

 

I have personally tested over 10+ chips. There are plenty of crappy 13900K/KF out in the wild. I have ran some my self and literally laughed. Chips that needed 1.350+ volts for 5.7Ghz. 
 

My (SP104) 13900KS will do 6.0P/4.6E/5.1R with 1.305V in the bios and it’s solid as a rock. Not to mention run reliably with 6.4Ghz on (4) cores. (Good luck with that with a stack of random 13900K chips. 6.1P/4.8E/5.1R is also Battlefield 2042 stable. (Very tough to do) 

 

I could actually feel the slightly weaker E-cores on the KS. Even with the mere -2 lower E-Core SP. It is minor, but there. The P-Cores are just entirely different. 
 

Anyways, I already raved about how great this KS is on my Unity-X. And yeah lol. It’s an SP104. I am guessing this is all chips. 
 

(1) Buy a KS

(2) Open the box

(3) Delid it

 

Don't even check SP. 

 

This chip holds stability very well with really high wattage up past 420+ or so. And that is something difficult with a K/KF. They prefer that SUB 360 watts for stability, and most of them cannot stay inside of that with 6-6.1Ghz 

 

Intel is clearly testing them and seeing how they do, and they are selling some good chips as KS examples. 
 

This KS is just slightly better than my SP110 13900K. And I’m stoked with its performance. I just tested a SP117 13900KS which was just slightly better than my SP104 13900KS.