*Official Benchmark Thread* - Post it here or it didn't happen :D

[Rage Set]

1 hour ago, Mr. Fox said:

I have to figure out how I want to work it. I suppose I could compare it to my custom loop but that probably wouldn't be fair. I'm thinking maybe I should get a popular air cooler that the average gamer boy uses and run tests with that to establish a baseline on thermal atrocity, then switch to the AIO and repeat. Thank goodness I have invested in QDC fittings for everything. Makes something like this so less time consuming and inconvenient. I now have the male half on all the QDC settings installed directly on the CPU and GPU blocks on both systems to make it even more hassle-free. Moving components between systems couldn't be any easier because you don't have to worry about tubing being long enough, or too long, or having to drain and refill anything. Totally play and play.

 

Did you get the RGB version or the Dark version? I'll have to wait until I see it to render a verdict, but I like the fact that they're using the short wire daisy chain approach on the fans now. Should make cable management a whole lot better with the single PMW connection. This approach is fast becoming the new normal and it's a good thing. This is one of the rare examples of where the old way sucked and the new way actually is better. 

 

Compare it to your custom loop - as it has advantages and disadvantages over the AIO. However, if I were reviewing it for a publication, I would have a $50 to $60 quality air cooler as the first point of entry. This vantage point gives consumers a look at what they currently have, versus higher end water cooling (AIO) versus the best in custom water cooling. No need to get into GamersNexus level of detail..."Out of Box" stock settings to a "Gamer boy" OC is really all you need. 

 

I have my own private database of all of the air coolers (not many entries), AIO's and custom watercooling parts I've used over the past three years. I created it so I could have reference when I was in the early stages of a review channel/website. 

 

I got the black RGB version. I was also going to get the white version so I could create an all white PC to mess with @Papusan and yourself, lol. 

[Papusan]

And what is this? JonnyGuru say Corsair don't sell angled adapters.... Only Cables. But what is this below?

 

 

https://www.corsair.com/us/en/p/pc-components-accessories/cp-8920335/12vhpwr-gpu-power-bridge-cp-8920335

[electrosoft]

5 hours ago, jaybee83 said:

 

 

dont forget, Intel is also running Gear 2 ONLY on DDR5, while AMD sports Gear 1 in synchronous mode up to 6200/6600 (depending on IMC). So now AMD is basically following in Intel's footsteps and desynchronizing towards Gear 2. Will have to check and see how that impacts latency, and if going super high with the clocks might balance that out.

 

 

 

Doesn't change what I said..... 🙂

 

What I stated still stands and is sound. 😁

 

But I am curious will this be massively diminishing returns, bandwidth for the sake of actual throughput or proper async advantages (aka have our cake and eat it too).

 

If we look at Intel, you need ~7400+ 1:2 to match DDR4 4133 1:1 in many scenarios. Acknowledging they are not the same, using the same ratio for AMD we may find ourselves in the same boat *early on* waiting for ~ 10800+ 1:2 to match 6000-6200 1:1. This could be laying the groundwork for next gen DDR5 (See 11th gen Intel 1:1 vs 1:2 mode DDR4).

 

I am glad it was implemented and we can now will have the same choice and platforms to flesh out what works best knowing DDR5 will eventually take over (if it hasn't already on implementation).

 

 

[Raiderman]

12 hours ago, jaybee83 said:

oh btw guys, with regards to Asrock "tuning" their mobos for higher speed RAM on Ryzen: this is not their doing, but rather AMD preparing to release a new AGESA version providing Ryzen 7000 with the tools to finally catch up to Intel in memory speeds:

 

https://www.aroged.com/2023/07/20/amd-taught-ryzen-7000-to-work-with-fast-ram-agesa-1-0-0-7b-provided-support-for-ddr5-8000-and-even-higher/

 

DDR5-8200 confirmed booting on MSI boards mwahaha. lets goooooooooooooooo

 

the impressive thing here is that even "cheapo" boards in the 200-300 usd price range can apparently reach up to 8000 speeds... very exciting to see where highend boards and good cpus cap out!

Im excited for this! I will be looking for bios updates on MSI frequently, as will @electrosoftIm sure!

[electrosoft]

4 hours ago, cylix said:

Yeah early adopter prices are bleeding us dry.. got my ram with 260 now its 140.. CPU ..800 Euros now 650 🤣. Prolly the same with the highspeed ram in 6 months when intel and AMD will run only highspeed it will be  200 or less..

 

4 hours ago, jaybee83 said:

in 6 months im expecting ddr5-10000+ kits being available hahaha

 

 

I waited and picked up a used A-die kit which is now priced around that new but I love seeing DDR5 being adopted so rapidly and prices dropping like crazy.

 

And at this rate, by this time next year I can see DDR5 kits around the 10k range.

 

 

[electrosoft]

5 minutes ago, Raiderman said:

Im excited for this! I will be looking for bios updates on MSI frequently, as will @electrosoftIm sure!

 

Absolutely! Nice surprise especially considering with 1:1 we were already maxed out with low tier memory speeds as 9000 is right around the corner with 10k on the horizon. AMD clearly sees bandwidth has its advantages. On the Intel side, there are plenty of benchmarks out there showing as DDR5 continues to gain in frequency it is finally vanquishing the last vestiges of any DDR4 superiority even at 1:1 and superior timings. I can see the same being true for AMD too.

 

 

[Papusan]

1 hour ago, Papusan said:

And what is this? JonnyGuru say Corsair don't sell angled adapters.... Only Cables. But what is this below?

 

 

https://www.corsair.com/us/en/p/pc-components-accessories/cp-8920335/12vhpwr-gpu-power-bridge-cp-8920335

LOOL😆 @Rage Set

 

 

 

[electrosoft]

So much for Brian's foray into using the 7900xtx as his main GPU (for now):

 

 

Reasons:

 

 

 

[Rage Set]

1 hour ago, electrosoft said:

So much for Brian's foray into using the 7900xtx as his main GPU (for now):

 

 

Reasons:

 

 

 

 

I watched it this morning because he mentioned in a pinned comment on his previous video about the audio issues. The first issue is a valid reason and if AMD is going to offer screen recording via its driver software, it should have this option. The second issue is a non-issue for the majority of users and there are many third-party macro apps that would fix this problem. 

 

The third issue is never really going to happen. AMD is not going to help its competitor nor is Intel. Adobe is going to have to fix it and considering their track record (hence why I stopped using all Adobe products years ago and switched to Final Cut and DaVinci Resolve), good luck with that.

 

The fifth issue has been a problem since the launch of the 7000 series. I don't think AMD cares at this point, lol. 

[jaybee83]

4 hours ago, electrosoft said:

 

Doesn't change what I said..... 🙂

 

What I stated still stands and is sound. 😁

 

But I am curious will this be massively diminishing returns, bandwidth for the sake of actual throughput or proper async advantages (aka have our cake and eat it too).

 

If we look at Intel, you need ~7400+ 1:2 to match DDR4 4133 1:1 in many scenarios. Acknowledging they are not the same, using the same ratio for AMD we may find ourselves in the same boat *early on* waiting for ~ 10800+ 1:2 to match 6000-6200 1:1. This could be laying the groundwork for next gen DDR5 (See 11th gen Intel 1:1 vs 1:2 mode DDR4).

 

I am glad it was implemented and we can now will have the same choice and platforms to flesh out what works best knowing DDR5 will eventually take over (if it hasn't already on implementation).

 

 

 

haha my post was expanding on yours, not contradicting it bud 😄 agreed on all points. the best thing about this is that we have more tuning options available and can rejoice about BIG NUMBERS 😛 but its cool, always good to be able and choose the path forward for either max bandwidth or min latency or find a sweet spot in between.

[Clamibot]

Well I made quite the discovery when doing some game benchmarking last night.

 

I've been playing Control a lot recently. It's a weird but very fun game that has just the right balance of exploration and combat. The supernatural and sci-fi theme fusion is very well done as well. I would highly recommend this game to anyone who enjoys action mixed in with an interesting storyline.

 

Now onto the benchmarks. I don't currently have anything super proper as this was more of an impromptu benchmark than anything else, but I noticed my newly completed desktop was getting far higher performance in the game than my X170. Yes, the graphics card in my desktop is much more powerful than the one in my X170, but I'd eliminated potential GPU bottlenecks already, so that wasn't a factor. Everything is tuned to give me 144 fps on both systems. The graphics quality settings are the same on both systems. The only difference in settings is resolution.

 

In intense fight scenes with lots of enemies and lots of destroyed object fragments flying around, I get around 100 fps on my X170 and get 144 fps on my desktop. That's a massive 44% increase in performance! I never experience any frame drops in this game on my desktop. It runs at a locked 144 fps. On my X170 however, frame dips are common in intense fight scenes. Again, there was no GPU bottleneck in play here. My framerate was being limited by the CPU.

 

The strangest thing is that I have a 10900K in both systems. I did expect there to be a significant performance gain on my desktop vs my X170 due to a few factors, but not this much. Here are the biggest differences between the two systems that I know that are contributing to the performance delta:

• AMD GPU in my desktop vs Nvidia GPU in my laptop (6950 XT vs RTX 2080 Super)
• 4000 MHz CL 15 DDR4 RAM in my desktop vs 3200 MHz CL 16 RAM in my X170
• 10900K running at 3.7 GHz in my desktop vs 10900K running at 3.5 GHz in my X170

These 3 factors combined deliver that 44% performance uplift in this game on my desktop vs my X170. I did expect a significant difference, say around 20%, but not this much! Seems like I did well with picking my parts out! I know for a fact that fast memory helps a lot in anything that's CPU bottlenecked as memory accesses are typically a very large fraction of a program's runtime instructions. Add in the fact that AMD GPUs don't have a driver bottleneck that steals CPU clock cycles, and you have another significant gain. It just feels weird that the performance difference is this massive given that the CPU in both my systems is the same model. I'll need to do some more testing tonight as this doesn't seem right.

In any case, I definitely made the right choice going with an AMD GPU this time around. Team red has won me over and I don't think I'll ever go back to using a Nvidia GPU since I no longer have a reason to need one. 25% of my game libary has a significant performance advantage on AMD GPUs, and all of those are titles released 2016 and after, which will just continue to become a larger percentage of my game library over time.

[Mr. Fox]

  

On 7/18/2023 at 2:34 PM, electrosoft said:

@Mr. Fox 13900k on sale for $410.99 if you want to return that 13700k

 

Amazon.com: Intel Core i9-13900K (Latest Gen) Gaming Desktop Processor 24 cores (8 P-cores + 16 E-cores) with Integrated Graphics - Unlocked : Electronics

 

Edit: Might be a scam seller, but you can always get a refund if so.

On 7/19/2023 at 11:34 AM, Mr. Fox said:

Wonder that happened to Brother @tps3443? Too busy with life maybe?

 

Brother @electrosoftI ordered one of those $410 13900K last night. Will be here tomorrow. Hopefully, it will be at least as good as the one that croaked. 

Nope. It was too good to be true. They waited until the expected delivery date to let me know I could buy one at the correct price. I didn't and don't plan to.

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5 hours ago, Rage Set said:

 

Compare it to your custom loop - as it has advantages and disadvantages over the AIO. However, if I were reviewing it for a publication, I would have a $50 to $60 quality air cooler as the first point of entry. This vantage point gives consumers a look at what they currently have, versus higher end water cooling (AIO) versus the best in custom water cooling. No need to get into GamersNexus level of detail..."Out of Box" stock settings to a "Gamer boy" OC is really all you need. 

 

I have my own private database of all of the air coolers (not many entries), AIO's and custom watercooling parts I've used over the past three years. I created it so I could have reference when I was in the early stages of a review channel/website. 

 

I got the black RGB version. I was also going to get the white version so I could create an all white PC to mess with @Papusan and yourself, lol. 

Yup. I have one that will be here tonight and I am going to do exactly that. I have the highly-rated 250W Deep Cool AK620 incoming for that three-way comparison. The AIO is still out for DHL delivery, but this got dropped a bit earlier today.

 

[electrosoft]

28 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

  

Nope. It was too good to be true. They waited until the expected delivery date to let me know I could buy one at the correct price. I didn't and don't plan to.

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Yup. I have one that will be here tonight and I am going to do exactly that. I have the highly-rated 250W Deep Cool AK620 incoming for that three-way comparison. The AIO is still out for DHL delivery, but this got dropped a bit earlier today.

 

 

I had a feeling but you're fully protected from any scams so why not take a shot? Nothing ventured....

 

 

There are those three 13900KS chips for sale over on the OCN forums. That SP111 for $650 is priced properly and a known decent chip with a good MC.

 

 

[Mr. Fox]

54 minutes ago, electrosoft said:

 

I had a feeling but you're fully protected from any scams so why not take a shot? Nothing ventured....

 

 

There are those three 13900KS chips for sale over on the OCN forums. That SP111 for $650 is priced properly and a known decent chip with a good MC.

 

 

Yes, I saw them but that's more than I want to spend. I pinged the guy again about the $500 13900K SP108 and will grab that one if it is still available. We're too close to them being obsolete to spend that much even on the better binned CPUs. It's just not worth the extra money for something I make no money doing. Those $600+ golden samples will be obsolete and worth a lot less in few months. The one I might buy is from a longtime OC.net forum member that has a good rep and lives in the US. 

 

This arrived a few minutes ago.

[jaybee83]

1 hour ago, Clamibot said:

Well I made quite the discovery when doing some game benchmarking last night.

 

I've been playing Control a lot recently. It's a weird but very fun game that has just the right balance of exploration and combat. The supernatural and sci-fi theme fusion is very well done as well. I would highly recommend this game to anyone who enjoys action mixed in with an interesting storyline.

 

Now onto the benchmarks. I don't currently have anything super proper as this was more of an impromptu benchmark than anything else, but I noticed my newly completed desktop was getting far higher performance in the game than my X170. Yes, the graphics card in my desktop is much more powerful than the one in my X170, but I'd eliminated potential GPU bottlenecks already, so that wasn't a factor. Everything is tuned to give me 144 fps on both systems. The graphics quality settings are the same on both systems. The only difference in settings is resolution.

 

In intense fight scenes with lots of enemies and lots of destroyed object fragments flying around, I get around 100 fps on my X170 and get 144 fps on my desktop. That's a massive 44% increase in performance! I never experience any frame drops in this game on my desktop. It runs at a locked 144 fps. On my X170 however, frame dips are common in intense fight scenes. Again, there was no GPU bottleneck in play here. My framerate was being limited by the CPU.

 

The strangest thing is that I have a 10900K in both systems. I did expect there to be a significant performance gain on my desktop vs my X170 due to a few factors, but not this much. Here are the biggest differences between the two systems that I know that are contributing to the performance delta:

• AMD GPU in my desktop vs Nvidia GPU in my laptop (6950 XT vs RTX 2080 Super)
• 4000 MHz CL 15 DDR4 RAM in my desktop vs 3200 MHz CL 16 RAM in my X170
• 10900K running at 3.7 GHz in my desktop vs 10900K running at 3.5 GHz in my X170

These 3 factors combined deliver that 44% performance uplift in this game on my desktop vs my X170. I did expect a significant difference, say around 20%, but not this much! Seems like I did well with picking my parts out! I know for a fact that fast memory helps a lot in anything that's CPU bottlenecked as memory accesses are typically a very large fraction of a program's runtime instructions. Add in the fact that AMD GPUs don't have a driver bottleneck that steals CPU clock cycles, and you have another significant gain. It just feels weird that the performance difference is this massive given that the CPU in both my systems is the same model. I'll need to do some more testing tonight as this doesn't seem right.

In any case, I definitely made the right choice going with an AMD GPU this time around. Team red has won me over and I don't think I'll ever go back to using a Nvidia GPU since I no longer have a reason to need one. 25% of my game libary has a significant performance advantage on AMD GPUs, and all of those are titles released 2016 and after, which will just continue to become a larger percentage of my game library over time.

i also just started playing control, seems like im in for a goodie based on what ure reporting here 🙂

i noticed its much heavier on my gpu than all benches n stress tests ive used so far to tune in my daily overclock, seems like ive found myself a new gpu stress test hahaha.

[Rage Set]

I am speechless but I have more testing to do and I have a few more different SSD heatsinks coming in.

 

My FireCuda 530 was idling at 58C and my SN850X idled at 56C when I was using the mobo's shared "heatspreader". The 530 would hit nearly 80C during use or throttle when I was using both SSDs at the same time. The only thing I changed was the unified heatspreader - with each drive using its own heatsink, no additional fans or anything else. 

 

Using a 7 dollar (link below) Thermalright M.2 heatsink, the FireCuda 530 idles at 33C and hits 42C max during CrystalDiskMark testing. The SN850X idles at 30C and never went over 40C during my testing.

 

Before I start celebrating Thermalright, I want to test more heatsinks. I think the mobo's "heatspreader" aka heat retainer was the problem. I'll keep you guys posted. 

 

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09HRN8QXY?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details

[Papusan]

52 minutes ago, electrosoft said:

 

There are those three 13900KS chips for sale over on the OCN forums. That SP111 for $650 is priced properly and a known decent chip with a good MC.

 

 

Nope. Not in Hell. 

 

On 7/15/2023 at 3:40 AM, Papusan said:

Or see if you can use a heatsink cooler. A lot to select from. This if you have the needed space.

 

Then we have the exact same testing with another 2TB FireCuda 530 with heat sink (and no airflow), and the difference is dramatic.

 

14 minutes ago, Rage Set said:

I am speechless but I have more testing to do and I have a few more different SSD heatsinks coming in.

 

My FireCuda 530 was idling at 58C and my SN850X idled at 56C when I was using the mobo's shared "heatspreader". The 530 would hit nearly 80C during use or throttle when I was using both SSDs at the same time. The only thing I changed was the unified heatspreader - with each drive using its own heatsink, no additional fans or anything else. 

 

Using a 7 dollar (link below) Thermalright M.2 heatsink, the FireCuda 530 idles at 33C and hits 42C max during CrystalDiskMark testing. The SN850X idles at 30C and never went over 40C during my testing.

 

Before I start celebrating Thermalright, I want to test more heatsinks. I think the mobo's "heatspreader" aka heat retainer was the problem. I'll keep you guys posted. 

 

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09HRN8QXY?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details

Yep, a good heatink can make wonders🙂 And check out der8auer's youtube channel. He have tested a lot flawed M.2 ssd heatsink's. A lot trash out there.

 

Btw. I helped Jonnyguru to see the lights 🙂

 

 

  

[Mr. Fox]

12 minutes ago, Papusan said:

Yep🙂 And check out der8auer's youtube channel. He have tested a lot flawed M.2 ssd heatsink's. A lot trash out there.  

I have seen that video. It's pretty funny. Some of the garbage from China is so sad it is comical. What is more sad is the thought that some people would be interested in what looks like trash on face value. Not only do most of the "solutions" not work well, they are hideous-looking atrocities that should not be used even if they did work well.

[Rage Set]

9 minutes ago, Papusan said:

 

Yep🙂 And check out der8auer's youtube channel. He have tested a lot flawed M.2 ssd heatsink's. A lot trash out there.  

 

LOL. I will not use one of those huge M.2 Gen 5 SSD heatsinks even if I had the space. At that point, I would go off the deep end and buy SSD waterblocks like these https://www.amazon.com/Barrow-Storage-Waterblock-PCIE-22110/dp/B07J1T66N2

[Papusan]

5 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

I have seen that video. It's pretty funny. Some of the garbage from China is so sad it is comical. What is more sad is the thought that some people would be interested in what looks like trash on face value. Not only do most of the "solutions" not work well, they are hideous-looking atrocities that should not be used even if they did work well.

People often go with design over functionality. Fancy design and fancy lights.... And they are sold on it. They eat with their eyes. This is the sad truth bro Fox. Hence we will see more trash. Not less of it.

 

Is more always better than less bro @ryan😁

 

[Mr. Fox]

Just now, Papusan said:

People often go with design over functionality. Fancy design and fancy lights.... and they are sold on it. This is the sad truth bro Fox. Hence we will see more trash.

It is also scary what some people think looks nice. Not surprising, considering some of the freaky, creepy and downright repulsive things some of them do to their own bodies that they find attractive or cool-looking. Crazy world we're living in, and getting crazier by the day.

[ryan]

haha ryans confused by all his pretty lights

[Papusan]

3 hours ago, ryan said:

haha ryans confused by all his pretty lights

Don't be bro ryan 🙂

 

 

 

 

Edit. Yep, sure.

 

Didn't think it would happen :(

[ryan]

nice yeah, only thing I want rgb for is my keyboard but I have it set to white/blue leds to be easy on the eyes and easier to see when its dark, but yeah im not going to pay extra for a light stripe on the front of the laptop. as for my place I have rgb lights in the bedrooms and hallway, but I couldn't care less if they are blue green red ect. as for ram thats rgb I get it if your showing off your rig, but it just seems silly. some of the asus laptops have light bars and the laptops cost more to make and therefore to buy, people will always be consumer cows. gnawing on anything on their plate.

[Mr. Fox]

2 hours ago, ryan said:

nice yeah, only thing I want rgb for is my keyboard but I have it set to white/blue leds to be easy on the eyes and easier to see when its dark, but yeah im not going to pay extra for a light stripe on the front of the laptop. as for my place I have rgb lights in the bedrooms and hallway, but I couldn't care less if they are blue green red ect. as for ram thats rgb I get it if your showing off your rig, but it just seems silly. some of the asus laptops have light bars and the laptops cost more to make and therefore to buy, people will always be consumer cows. gnawing on anything on their plate.

I would be happy with just static bright white LED. That's all I care about in terms of lighting. It's unfortunate that I have to waste my money on animated RGB garbage to get that. It's almost impossible to find anything now with a static single color like white LED. It would also be much easier to deal with because it could draw its power for the LEDs from the same device power source and not need any extra wiring to control colors, or nasty filth software to change it from rainbow puke to white.

 

I think the crime bosses have figured that out though. They know they can charge me, and everyone like me, more for something I/we don't want in order to get something that I/we do want that should be super inexpensive.  That is just so special. They have the art of extortion down to a science.