*Official Benchmark Thread* - Post it here or it didn't happen :D

[Papusan]

11 hours ago, johnksss said:

You got me. I have never bought GPU/PSU power cables from Aliexpress before. I also have a standardized 3.0 PSU with real Gen 5 single cable. (300V/80C/16AWG(per wire)) The sheath braiding seems tighter on my EVGA 1600W T2 than on my Thermaltake 1650W GF3. And before anyone decides to jump on those specs. My EVGA 1600T2 wires are spec'd exactly the same word for word(VCG) for the 8 pin PCIE cables.

 

Edit:

I will be getting the angled adapters from Cablemod just to have for any future projects that may need a 90 or 180 degree turn. Or I get an HOF 4090 that has 2 12VHPWR ports. 🙂

 

Edit:

I had to take a real look at my cables and see I do in fact have 2 12VHPWR cables so all ready for HOF card.

HaHa. I knew you got a new PSU with the needed cables. How is the cable from your PSU vs the one Thermaltake sell on their store? And yep, I know you wouldn't buy cables on Aliexpress🙂

 

The offering (to stop the smoke and melting) from Thermaltake. Yep, not from Alienxpress😀

[johnksss]

9 hours ago, Papusan said:

HaHa. I knew you got a new PSU with the needed cables. How is the cable from your PSU vs the one Thermaltake sell on their store? And yep, I know you wouldn't buy cables on Aliexpress🙂

 

The offering to stop the smoke from Thermaltake. Yep, not from Alienxpress😀

I'm not sure I understand the question? I thought I answered this.  Looking at the picture that was posted and this one compared to mine they look identical from different ends of two different cables I have. I do not own a cable like the one pictured. So I have no apples to apples comparison other than I found it odd that that guy went back and changed that Aliexpress part of his comment.

 

And the comment "how is this cable that is made by Thermaltake and sold by them vs my Thermaltake cables" from my Thermaltake power supply differ? I would think they would be the same quality as they are made and sold by the same company.(But that is speculations as I'm not about to be cutting mine open to find out) And I'm pretty sure they would not go out and by different plugs that take the same wires they already make their original 3.0 cables with. And his comment about "pins all over the place" the pins don't even move unless you are in there trying to break them to get them to move so you can say that. (12+4 connector) So I don't know...will just have to wait and see if they are crap or not, but going from mine.... They are solid so far. 

 

JMO

 

Edit:

Congrats on getting your new cpu though!

[electrosoft]

10 hours ago, Papusan said:

Congrats my friend. Hope you both enjoyed the day 🙂 Me and my wife have been married 27 years. And have been together 32 year 🙂 Love is a good thing bro Fox. So send my best blessings to your lovely wife.

 

 

The dam stupid bend mess from Intel eat up all my better thermal paste. Got it work at 3rd or 4th try. Was stuck at 800MHz and the SP prediction was total wacko.

As a footnote. Idiocy in high potense that you need to take out the Cpu from the socket, then clear cmos (or flash new/old bios with it's risk) if the Asus SP prediction fail due intel's stupid made ILM. How dificult is it to let the clear cmos button do the job, Asus? Halfbaked.

 

Here is few pict for bro @electrosoft You miss my "all black" crocs?😀 With the Governments robbery (25% tax) the chips cost $818 here home. Withous the greed the 13900K would cost around $615.

 

SP101 (P111 and 83 for the babies) right out of the box. I will probably keep it. There is lack of chips here home also.

 

And Asus follow Dell and added a new useless feature in bios. A temp cap alla Dell's TCC offset. Where do they get all the great idas from? 

 

 

LOL, especially when the Crocs match the gear!

 

True story, I was shopping with the wife and we were looking at shoes for her and I saw some Crocs and immediately thought of you @Papusan 😄

 

Grats on the new 13900k!

 

[Papusan]

4 hours ago, johnksss said:

I'm not sure I understand the question? I thought I answered this.  Looking at the picture that was posted and this one compared to mine they look identical from different ends of two different cables I have. I do not own a cable like the one pictured. So I have no apples to apples comparison other than I found it odd that that guy went back and changed that Aliexpress part of his comment.

 

And the comment "how is this cable that is made by Thermaltake and sold by them vs my Thermaltake cables" from my Thermaltake power supply differ? I would think they would be the same quality as they are made and sold by the same company.(But that is speculations as I'm not about to be cutting mine open to find out) And I'm pretty sure they would not go out and by different plugs that take the same wires they already make their original 3.0 cables with. And his comment about "pins all over the place" the pins don't even move unless you are in there trying to break them to get them to move so you can say that. (12+4 connector) So I don't know...will just have to wait and see if they are crap or not, but going from mine.... They are solid so far. 

 

JMO

 

Edit:

Congrats on getting your new cpu though!

You said the sheath braiding seems tighter on my EVGA 1600W T2 than on my Thermaltake 1650W GF3. When I looked on the spare part cable from Thermaltake's webpage I saw that the brading around the cable was pretty loose. Hence I asked "maybe wrong wording"... I should rather asked if they looked equal (the whole cable). Because making different versions of the sam cable is stupid. Remember thermaltake differenciate the design for the cables in the PSU package (the 12VHPWR cable is braided, the other ones are flat). So there is no reaason to make several design and matriale used for this new cable. 

 

Put it on the Papusan list of learning... My english isn't always 110% perfect. 

 

So, thanks bro John 🙂

 

Regarding 3rd party connectors/cables for nvidia's new burning inferno... 

 

It voids the warranty. https://www.tomshardware.com/news/right-angle-16-pin-connector-may-save-a-lot-of-rtx-4090-gpus

 

Updated 10/26/2022 9:00 pm PT: Added the relevant information about the usage of third-party adapters from Nvidia documentation included with the GeForce RTX 4090 Founders Edition.

"Use only the included PCIe Gen 5 compliant power connector adapter for your GeForce RTX 40-series Founders Edition graphics card. Use of non-compliant or third-party power connector adapters may cause technical issues, and may void your manufacturer warranty."

 

Heck, all should avoid NVIDIA'S melting disaster. And nvidia should be happy people use 3rd party parts from reputable brands if they are better quality than the frying cable from the green goblins. 

 

1 hour ago, electrosoft said:

 

LOL, especially when the Crocs match the gear!

 

True story, I was shopping with the wife and we were looking at shoes for her and I saw some Crocs and immediately thought of you @Papusan 😄

 

Grats on the new 13900k!

 

Haha. And thanks🙂

[Etern4l]

Has anyone ever faced difficulties removing SSDs attached to the board using these plastic clips (MSI ACE). Well intentioned MSI came up with an idiotic mechanism whereby the "convenient" clip seems permanently latched. Can't move it either way, can't unscrew the whole thing, won't budge in any direction. Any ideas? 

[Papusan]

55 minutes ago, Etern4l said:

Has anyone ever faced difficulties removing SSDs attached to the board using these plastic clips (MSI ACE). Well intentioned MSI came up with an idiotic mechanism whereby the "convenient" clip seems permanently latched. Can't move it either way, can't unscrew the whole thing, won't budge in any direction. Any ideas? 

You probably need to wiggle it loose. But be gentle.

 

You mean this little beauty?

 

 

 

Stupid new features is the norm nowadays. So what you experience is as expected.

ASRock Launches 13.3-inch Display for Mounting Inside the Case

Today, 14:37 

A while back, some ASRock motherboards showed up with an eDP connector, which seemed odd, as outside of the embedded market or notebooks, eDP isn't commonly found. ASRock has now revealed what it's for, namely a 13.3-inch display, or side panel kit as the company calls it. In other words, this is a 13.3-inch display that mounts inside your case, assuming you have a tempered glass side panel. It's meant to be used as a secondary display, rather than just being some kind of diagnostics tool, which similar products on the market today end up being.

However, ASRock provides a custom eDP cable with a 40-pin connector, as well as four mounting brackets, some cable clips and even extra adhesive strips, in case you'd want to move the display to a new case in the future. The panel measures 300.26 x 193.01 mm (W x H), so it might not fit all cases. ASRock also points out that you need to have a clear, transparent tempered glass side panel for optimal usage of the display, as a tinted panel would for obvious reasons reduce the light that could be transmitted through the glass. The panel is compatible with the ASRock Z790 LiveMixer, Z790 Pro RS/D4, Z790M-ITX WiFi, Z790 Steel Legend WiFi, Z790 PG Lightning, Z790 Pro RS, Z790 PG Lightning/D4, H610M-ITX/eDP and B650E PG-ITX WiFi motherboards.

 

Useless features only increase the complexity and price of the products. But this is well known. Overpowered VRM specs etc is meant to push price point higher than ever. They can't do that if they don't offer some new/more value over previous product models. 

[Mr. Fox]

26 minutes ago, Etern4l said:

Has anyone ever faced difficulties removing SSDs attached to the board using these plastic clips (MSI ACE). Well intentioned MSI came up with an idiotic mechanism whereby the "convenient" clip seems permanently latched. Can't move it either way, can't unscrew the whole thing, won't budge in any direction. Any ideas? 

I ran into that a couple of times on the Unify-X and the solution was to press downward slightly on the end of the M.2 with the retainer while attempting to rotate it to unlock the clip. Something about the design of the retention mechanism seems to get misaligned and not allow the plastic retainer to rotate freely in the notch on the end of the M.2 PCB. It is kind of a chintzy design. I don't see any way that simply using a screw and doing it the old fashioned way isn't a superior approach. The "new and improved" latching mechanism is a perfect example of why adhering to the KISS principle is the best approach. "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." 

12 minutes ago, Papusan said:

Stupid new features is the norm nowadays. 

ASRock Launches 13.3-inch Display for Mounting Inside the Case

It seems that there is never a shortage of stupid gimmicks.

[Mr. Fox]

Interesting...

 

[tps3443]

17 hours ago, johnksss said:

Using same voltage, but started lowering the sa voltage. Going to try to get that out of the way...maybe it's the problem as I was using auto at first.

 

I run this for DDR5 7600 stable.

 

1.150v SA

1.500v VDDQ 

1.400v VDD2

1.435v Linked  DDR5 voltage.

 

All of my timings are the auto XMP 7200 timing profile except for tREFI at 262K+ “Maxed out” and 16 tFAW. 7600 is stable for hours in HCI Memtest full coverage CL36-46-46-46-84. 
 

I haven’t tuned timings much due to just crazy good performance as it is. SUB 125Gbps bandwidth and 51-52ns latency. 

I can run tighter primary timings and haven’t seen any issues with CL34-42-42-42-81 @DDR5 7600 with gaming and daily stuff, but I never re-tested HCI Memtest stability at those lower timings. But I know for sure 7600 CL36-46-46-46-84 is 100% stable in HCI Memtest which is (16) apps running with 1,920MB ram usage each. I tested for a little over 2 hours and called it good. 

[tps3443]

14 hours ago, Papusan said:

Congrats my friend. Hope you both enjoyed the day 🙂 Me and my wife have been married 27 years. And have been together 32 year 🙂 Love is a good thing bro Fox. So send my best blessings to your lovely wife.

 

 

The dam stupid bend mess from Intel eat up all my better thermal paste. Got it work at 3rd or 4th try. Was stuck at 800MHz and the SP prediction was total wacko.

As a footnote. Idiocy in high potense that you need to take out the Cpu from the socket, then clear cmos (or flash new/old bios with it's risk) if the Asus SP prediction fail due intel's stupid made ILM. How dificult is it to let the clear cmos button do the job, Asus? Halfbaked.

 

Here is few pict for bro @electrosoft You miss my "all black" crocs?😀 With the Governments robbery (25% tax) the chips cost $818 here home. Withous the greed the 13900K would cost around $615.

 

SP101 (P111 and 83 for the babies) right out of the box. I will probably keep it. There is lack of chips here home also.

 

And Asus follow Dell and added a new useless feature in bios. A temp cap alla Dell's TCC offset. Where do they get all the great idas from? 

 

 

Congratulations on 27 years of marriage. Also, that’s a very nice chip! Definitely good enough to not fuss over an exchange. You could potentially end up with less. Sometimes I’m glad I don’t know my SP rating lol. I know it overclocks good, and it does great work with very little power for the performance It puts out. That’s good enough for me. 
 

At the end of the day, the SP ain’t the be all do all. Some chips don’t care and punch above with the right setup too lol. 

 

 

[johnksss]

5 hours ago, Papusan said:

You said the sheath braiding seems tighter on my EVGA 1600W T2 than on my Thermaltake 1650W GF3. When I looked on the spare part cable from Thermaltake's webpage I saw that the brading around the cable was pretty loose. Hence I asked "maybe wrong wording"... I should rather asked if they looked equal (the whole cable). Because making different versions of the sam cable is stupid. Remember thermaltake differenciate the design for the cables in the PSU package (the 12VHPWR cable is braided, the other ones are flat). So there is no reaason to make several design and matriale used for this new cable. 

 

Put it on the Papusan list of learning... My english isn't always 110% perfect. 

 

So, thanks bro John 🙂

 

Regarding 3rd party connectors/cables for nvidia's new burning inferno... 

 

It voids the warranty. https://www.tomshardware.com/news/right-angle-16-pin-connector-may-save-a-lot-of-rtx-4090-gpus

 

Updated 10/26/2022 9:00 pm PT: Added the relevant information about the usage of third-party adapters from Nvidia documentation included with the GeForce RTX 4090 Founders Edition.

"Use only the included PCIe Gen 5 compliant power connector adapter for your GeForce RTX 40-series Founders Edition graphics card. Use of non-compliant or third-party power connector adapters may cause technical issues, and may void your manufacturer warranty."

 

Heck, all should avoid NVIDIA'S melting disaster. And nvidia should be happy people use 3rd party parts from reputable brands if they are better quality than the frying cable from the green goblins. 

 

Haha. And thanks🙂

Hummmm....

1: The braiding is only on the two 12VHPWR cables only.

2: It is loose meaning the wires move easily inside when turning or bending the cable in different directions. And can also be made to fit some what in a flat condition. 

3: The reference to my T2 is that the braiding on "all" cables is tight. So if you bend it the cables stay in their rounded form.

4: I gather the braids on this cable are to cover the fact that the wires inside are single strands. And the braided sheath is to make it easier to keep the single wires in check. (From what I can feel) And this translates across at least the 1200W PSU that I have from them.

5: And going by the picture once again. They "could" have taken a single 12VHPWR cable and cut it and added the two 8 pin PCIE connectors. Technically speaking as the wires are the same, but of course that cable would have come out to be shorter. Speculations of course.... 

 

Final conclusions....

The braiding is the same as on my 1200W PSU I have from them. Still holding up after 15 years.

https://bjorn3d.com/2007/06/thermaltake-toughpower-w0133ru-1200w-psu/

 

So to answer the main question. The cable "looks" to be identical as part of the Gen 5 12VHPWR cable.

 

[johnksss]

5 hours ago, Etern4l said:

Has anyone ever faced difficulties removing SSDs attached to the board using these plastic clips (MSI ACE). Well intentioned MSI came up with an idiotic mechanism whereby the "convenient" clip seems permanently latched. Can't move it either way, can't unscrew the whole thing, won't budge in any direction. Any ideas? 

Just push the M.2 closer to it's socket and it should come right out.

 

Now this is where I definitely disagree with the room. I'm more for less using screw drivers when I'm constantly changing things. For a permanent build then it would be fine. Losing or striping screws gets old real fast!

 

Edit:

To broaden that aspect to water cooling quick connects and the PCIE push button release. To screwless cases.

[tps3443]

7 hours ago, Papusan said:

You probably need to wiggle it loose. But be gentle.

 

You mean this little beauty?

 

 

 

Stupid new features is the norm nowadays. So what you experience is as expected.

ASRock Launches 13.3-inch Display for Mounting Inside the Case

Today, 14:37 

A while back, some ASRock motherboards showed up with an eDP connector, which seemed odd, as outside of the embedded market or notebooks, eDP isn't commonly found. ASRock has now revealed what it's for, namely a 13.3-inch display, or side panel kit as the company calls it. In other words, this is a 13.3-inch display that mounts inside your case, assuming you have a tempered glass side panel. It's meant to be used as a secondary display, rather than just being some kind of diagnostics tool, which similar products on the market today end up being.

However, ASRock provides a custom eDP cable with a 40-pin connector, as well as four mounting brackets, some cable clips and even extra adhesive strips, in case you'd want to move the display to a new case in the future. The panel measures 300.26 x 193.01 mm (W x H), so it might not fit all cases. ASRock also points out that you need to have a clear, transparent tempered glass side panel for optimal usage of the display, as a tinted panel would for obvious reasons reduce the light that could be transmitted through the glass. The panel is compatible with the ASRock Z790 LiveMixer, Z790 Pro RS/D4, Z790M-ITX WiFi, Z790 Steel Legend WiFi, Z790 PG Lightning, Z790 Pro RS, Z790 PG Lightning/D4, H610M-ITX/eDP and B650E PG-ITX WiFi motherboards.

 

Useless features only increase the complexity and price of the products. But this is well known. Overpowered VRM specs etc is meant to push price point higher than ever. They can't do that if they don't offer some new/more value over previous product models. 

 

My Unify-X has those quick release M.2 drives plastic turn things. But you don’t have to use them, they are also threaded at the top for use with a screw. So, it’s an option all together. You can use the plastic turn thing, or just the screw, or both lol. They also include in the box the standard M.2 mount studs without the quick release option. Although, I don’t see why anyone would change them since the original ones are threaded anyways. 


EDIT: 

Stock 13900KF 5.5-5.8 @1.190v in the bios Auto LLC, DDR5 7600. Breaking right past 41K in R23 is absolutely insane. Why do we overclock these again? Sub 250 watts (Water chiller off) 



upload

[Clamibot]

6 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

Interesting...

 

 

*manial laughter ensues

 

MWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!

 

I have the Masterliquid ML360 Sub-Zero, and that's what allowed me to push the super 10900K as far as I did. Cooler Master announced a V2 a while back. Now I see EK has made their own version just like last time, which means the next TEC AIO from Cooler Master will probably be released soon as well.

 

TECs are horribly inefficient, but their ease of use and small size is unparalleled compared to phase change cooling. Again, these coolers are meant for extreme high performance systems where power consumption at full load doesn't matter. I'd like to see some mainstream phase change cooling solutions in the future too. That'd be great! More performance for everyone! Plus, we as enthusiasts will be able to push things even further.

 

I was really hoping the EK version of this TEC would have at least a 300 watt Peltier element given its price. Hopefully Cooler Master has upgraded their 185 watt Peltier element from the V1 to something significantly more powerful. I can't wait to get my hands on one of these and a 13900K and overclock it to the moon. That will make for a killer gaming system!

[Clamibot]

1 hour ago, tps3443 said:

 

My Unify-X has those quick release M.2 drives plastic turn things. But you don’t have to use them, they are also threaded at the top for use with a screw. So, it’s an option all together. You can use the plastic turn thing, or just the screw, or both lol. They also include in the box the standard M.2 mount studs without the quick release option. Although, I don’t see why anyone would change them since the original ones are threaded anyways. 


EDIT: 

Stock 13900KF 5.5-5.8 @1.190v in the bios Auto LLC, DDR5 7600. Breaking right past 41K in R23 is absolutely insane. Why do we overclock these again? Sub 250 watts (Water chiller off) 



upload

 

With your 13900KF, I'd expect 6.5 GHz across all P-cores while gaming to be possible with a TEC running in unregulated mode.

[tps3443]

3 minutes ago, Clamibot said:

 

With your 13900KF, I'd expect 6.5 GHz across all P-cores while gaming to be possible with a TEC running in unregulated mode.

Yeah the new EKWB tec cooler is really awesome, I wish I could just try one out without necessarily having to commit to that $530+ dollar waterblock purchase, more or less to see if I’d even run something like that. How do you think it would work with a waterchiller? Lol. 

[Etern4l]

8 hours ago, Papusan said:

You probably need to wiggle it loose. But be gentle.

 

You mean this little beauty?

 

 

 

Stupid new features is the norm nowadays. So what you experience is as expected.

 

 

Yeah, that's kind of like it, although, to add insult to the injury there is no way to unscrew this (unlike what the picture above would suggests).  Gentle wiggling  didn't quite cut it, this thing is seriously stuck. I do have to give it to them: installing the drive was indeed extremely simple.... 🤨

 

8 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

I ran into that a couple of times on the Unify-X and the solution was to press downward slightly on the end of the M.2 with the retainer while attempting to rotate it to unlock the clip. Something about the design of the retention mechanism seems to get misaligned and not allow the plastic retainer to rotate freely in the notch on the end of the M.2 PCB. It is kind of a chintzy design. I don't see any way that simply using a screw and doing it the old fashioned way isn't a superior approach. The "new and improved" latching mechanism is a perfect example of why adhering to the KISS principle is the best approach. "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." 

It seems that there is never a shortage of stupid gimmicks.

 

Exactly right, the design is flawed. Gentle (and not so gentle) pressing didn't do it, attempting to lever from different directions didn't do it. Need to get mini-pliers for this, as I can't even get a proper grip with my fingers. SSD dimensions could be a factor - this trapped a Firecuda 530 which seems to be very slightly on a thicker side.

 

3 hours ago, johnksss said:

The braiding is the same as on my 1200W PSU I have from them. Still holding up after 15 years.

https://bjorn3d.com/2007/06/thermaltake-toughpower-w0133ru-1200w-psu/

 

Running the same PSU. Only needed a new fan over the years. Now it's kind of hard to even consider other brands, however well reviewed, as those reviews don't take the all-important reliability into account (with the exception of the SuperNova T2, where reviewers piggyback on the mining reputation).

 

 

3 hours ago, johnksss said:

Just push the M.2 closer to it's socket and it should come right out.

 

Now this is where I definitely disagree with the room. I'm more for less using screw drivers when I'm constantly changing things. For a permanent build then it would be fine. Losing or striping screws gets old real fast!

 

Edit:

To broaden that aspect to water cooling quick connects and the PCIE push button release. To screwless cases.

 

I did try that, but perhaps not strong enough. Will give this another go armed with pliers.

 

I am not objecting to the idea of making things easier, but if you're going to do it - make it right. It needs to outperform the previous solution (including in terms of reliability), and this mechanism is very clearly too crude and flaky. I mean for starters one should be able to unscrew the whole retention mechanism if needed - there is no way to do that on this particular M.2 slot.

 

2 hours ago, tps3443 said:

 

My Unify-X has those quick release M.2 drives plastic turn things. But you don’t have to use them, they are also threaded at the top for use with a screw. So it’s a option all together. You can use the plastic turn thing, or just the screw, or both lol. They also include in the box the standard M.2 mount studs without the quick release option. Although, I don’t see why anyone would change them since the original ones are threaded anyways. 

 

Maybe it's done differently on the Unify-X, but on the ACE the retainers at the end of the M.2 slots are fixed!

There are extra spare ones that can be used for some short SSDs. The following excerpt from the manual illustrates. Looks like they saved up on a couple of screws here...

 

 

Edit: the manual is also wrong - the clips move on the opposite side - sort of from 12 to 6 o'clock forward to lock, whereas the manual suggests the mechanism is locked in counter-clockwise manner. Oh dear.

[Reciever]

7 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

Interesting...

 

Looks interesting, reminds me of the CoolerMaster V10 scenario. Some people modded those for much more capacity and it actually worked at that point.

[Clamibot]

26 minutes ago, tps3443 said:

Yeah the new EKWB tec cooler is really awesome, I wish I could just try one out without necessarily having to commit to that $530+ dollar waterblock purchase, more or less to see if I’d even run something like that. How do you think it would work with a waterchiller? Lol. 

 

With a water chiller, you'd probably be better off directly cooling the CPU with the chiller. The TEC will get overwhelmed if you produce more heat than it can pump out, and you'll end up with the heat stuck there, even with a chiller applying massive cooling to the hot side of the TEC.

 

I got my MasterLiquid ML360 Sub-Zero on clearance sale for $120. It's now $100. I'd imagine their V2 will probably drop to around the same price once 14th gen Meteor Lake is released. Cooler Master's offering is an AIO, and the Peltier element they use isn't that much worse than EK's version while being much cheaper than their waterblock by itself.

 

5 minutes ago, Reciever said:

Looks interesting, reminds me of the CoolerMaster V10 scenario. Some people modded those for much more capacity and it actually worked at that point.

 

How did people mod these? Did they just swap out the stock Peltier element with a more powerful one? I really want to upgrade the Peltier element on my AIO, but I don't know if I'd need a software modification to Intel's Cryo cooling software to get it to run at full blast.

 

I saw some 340 watt Peltier elements on sale on Amazon for around $25, and the dimensions are the same as the Peltier element in my MasterLiquid ML360 Sub-Zero. It'd be interesting if I could get it to work, but I'm not sure if the level of cooling is driven by the voltage applied to the TEC exclusively or if there's an artifical power limit somewhere. Modifying the software isn't an issue since I'm a sofware developer, but I need access to their source code. If there's an artifical power cap of 185 watts, then upgrading the Peltier element will do nothing unless I can also modify the software.

[tps3443]

Apex Z790 Pre-order $699.99 11/20 release date. I love the white. It would actually match my test bench. Tempting.  It is not worth it though. I’d probably gain 200-400Mhz in extra memory overclocking if that, maybe a little more. One thing nice about the Asus is how well they have dialed in the VID tables for Intel CPU’s. 
 

https://www.newegg.com/asus-rog-maximus-z790-apex/p/N82E16813119611?Item=N82E16813119611&Source=socialshare&cm_mmc=snc-social-_-sr-_-13-119-611-_-11032022

[Etern4l]

29 minutes ago, tps3443 said:

Apex Z790 Pre-order $699.99 11/20 release date. I love the white. It would actually match my test bench. Tempting.  It is not worth it though. I’d probably gain 200-400Mhz in extra memory overclocking if that, maybe a little more. One thing nice about the Asus is how well they have dialed in the VID tables for Intel CPU’s. 
 

https://www.newegg.com/asus-rog-maximus-z790-apex/p/N82E16813119611?Item=N82E16813119611&Source=socialshare&cm_mmc=snc-social-_-sr-_-13-119-611-_-11032022

 

Why would you hope to gain anything in terms of memory OC? The memory controller is on the CPU.

[tps3443]

55 minutes ago, Etern4l said:

 

Why would you hope to gain anything in terms of memory OC? The memory controller is on the CPU.

 

I’m not limited by the memory controller. I’m limited by my Z690 motherboard. 
 

13900K and on even lower end (4) Dimm Z790 boards are overclocking the memory higher than 8200+ stable my (2) Dimm Z690 motherboard cannot do that. 
 

Gigabyte has achieved DDR5 9333 on a (4) Dimm Aorus Tachyon Z790 board with air cooling and 13900K. This was a Hynix A-Die 7600 kit overclocked to a stable 9333. Crazy, I know! 
 

Z790 boards are looking great! And with Hynix A-Die freshly out it’s only gonna open up the true possibilities for it. 
 

The Z790 Dark, and Z790 Apex are essentially the two top dogs that’ll be running it.  But seeing such insane speeds on just cheaper (4) Dimm motherboards is nothing short of crazy. 

[jaybee83]

On 11/1/2022 at 9:57 PM, johnksss said:

You got me. I have never bought GPU/PSU power cables from Aliexpress before. I also have a standardized 3.0 PSU with real Gen 5 single cable. (300V/80C/16AWG(per wire)) The sheath braiding seems tighter on my EVGA 1600W T2 than on my Thermaltake 1650W GF3. And before anyone decides to jump on those specs. My EVGA 1600T2 wires are spec'd exactly the same word for word(VCG) for the 8 pin PCIE cables.

 

Edit:

I will be getting the angled adapters from Cablemod just to have for any future projects that may need a 90 or 180 degree turn. Or I get an HOF 4090 that has 2 12VHPWR ports. 🙂

 

Edit:

I had to take a real look at my cables and see I do in fact have 2 12VHPWR cables so all ready for HOF card.

 

noice, are you already making headway on getting your hands on an HOF card or is that more of a wishlist item currently? we want deetz if its the former! 😁 geez, 2x16 pins, completely bonkers...

 

On 11/1/2022 at 10:00 PM, Talon said:

 

Again, those cables they are packaging are not native 12VHPWR cables, they are cables that are adapted to meet the spec using existing power supplies, so potentially another point of failure if we use the same analogy you used for a CableMod cable. You do realize the CableMod cable is doing exactly the same thing the Corsiar or Seasonic adapted cables are doing, right? The difference is that CableMod decided to go for more redundancy and lighten the load per 8pin cable vs forcing 300w down the cable that is actually SPEC'd for just 150w. 

 

https://wccftech.com/atx-3-0-12vhpwr-gen-5-connector-major-safety-risk-using-adapter-confirms-pci-sig/

 

Obviously we all know the cables can handle far more, but why push it when you can not be cheap and provide a quality cable? Also they know some XOC community will want to push even beyond 600w, and future cards could easily draw beyond that. So again, redundancy and headroom is the way to go. 

 

The only PSUs that have native 12VHPWR are ATX 3.0 PSUs which have a 12VHPWR connection on the PSU, they do not use 8pin to the 16 pin. 

 

ok i think were misunderstanding each other here: "adapters" i define as added cables between the psu cables and the gpu. "native" cables i define as cables that go directly from the psu to the cpu. and im not just making this up, publications like GN share the same definition (i.e. as stated in their latest gpu power cable testing video).

for the latter with 8-pin connectors on the psu side, im not talking about third party or first party addon cables for pre-existing psus. there are actually brand new psus that come with such cables included in the box, so no aftermarket upgrade shenanigans going on.

as for why im being skeptical regarding the higher number of 8pin connectors on the cablemod offerings: that often quoted 150W spec is set for the gpu side connectors. has nothing to do with 8 pins on the psu side. i.e. according to corsair their psu sided 8pins are actually specced for 288W per item iirc, thus ure totaling 576W via 2x8 pin + 75W via the pcie slot = approx. 650W that would still be inside spec. but that is likely dependent on the psu manufacturer and psu model i could imagine. with that being said, if the cables ure offering are actually up to snuff and sport sufficient wire gauge, as well as high quality soldering job, why the need to branch out to 3 or even 4 connectors when the native cables from the actual psu manufacturers (again, included with brand new psus just recently launched, NOT as addon for pre-existing models!) only include two? AND are ALL rated for 600W or more with so far zero incidents reported?

 

sure guys, i get it, everyone loves cablemod, they make "nice looking" cables and winning hearts with their planned 90 degree adapter. doesnt mean we have to throw critical thinking overboard now does it? 😋

 

On 11/1/2022 at 12:31 PM, Mr. Fox said:

Well, 36 years ago today I tied the knot with Mrs. Fox. Doesn't seem possible it was that long ago. A lot has changed. A lot has not changed. I have made a lot of stupid mistakes in those 36 years. Marrying her was the smartest thing I think I have ever done. I'd be lost without her.

 

 

 

congratz man, 36 years is crazy! what did u guys do on your special day? hope u enjoyed it to the fullest! greetings from mexico btw, currently on my honeymoon with my lady, its "only" been ten years since we became a couple 😃

 

On 11/1/2022 at 5:30 PM, Mr. Fox said:

@tps3443 look at this post and check the photo of the IHS. This is EXACTLY how my delid turned out on the 12900K. I mentioned that I had to lap it to fix the damage the delid caused to it. The 12900KS sustained similar damage to the "wing" that sticks out on the side. I was able to repair that by sanding the underside (CPU-facing surface) flat. I have not delidded the 13900K yet. It looks like his got a little bit of damage in both places (highlighted yellow). I warmed the CPU the first time. Waste of time doing that. According to Roman (der8auer) it is actually detrimental because the soft solder smears instead of shears. He recommends doing it to a cold CPU to cause the solder to shear more easily. I have done it cold since and it was easier. No need to push it back the opposite direction because it was already loose. It wasn't loose the first time because the solder smeared or stretched. (The heating may have also softened the IHS... not sure on that.) The lapped IHS works better, but it's ruined in terms of identification markings.

 

 

yep ive seen Romans comments on the cold snapping during delids, deffo smth to keep in mind for upcoming ones! the last i did for my lady's 12600 was also with some prewarming via a hair dryer, fortunately no issues during that delid.

 

10 hours ago, Papusan said:

You probably need to wiggle it loose. But be gentle.

 

You mean this little beauty?

 

 

 

Stupid new features is the norm nowadays. So what you experience is as expected.

ASRock Launches 13.3-inch Display for Mounting Inside the Case

Today, 14:37 

A while back, some ASRock motherboards showed up with an eDP connector, which seemed odd, as outside of the embedded market or notebooks, eDP isn't commonly found. ASRock has now revealed what it's for, namely a 13.3-inch display, or side panel kit as the company calls it. In other words, this is a 13.3-inch display that mounts inside your case, assuming you have a tempered glass side panel. It's meant to be used as a secondary display, rather than just being some kind of diagnostics tool, which similar products on the market today end up being.

However, ASRock provides a custom eDP cable with a 40-pin connector, as well as four mounting brackets, some cable clips and even extra adhesive strips, in case you'd want to move the display to a new case in the future. The panel measures 300.26 x 193.01 mm (W x H), so it might not fit all cases. ASRock also points out that you need to have a clear, transparent tempered glass side panel for optimal usage of the display, as a tinted panel would for obvious reasons reduce the light that could be transmitted through the glass. The panel is compatible with the ASRock Z790 LiveMixer, Z790 Pro RS/D4, Z790M-ITX WiFi, Z790 Steel Legend WiFi, Z790 PG Lightning, Z790 Pro RS, Z790 PG Lightning/D4, H610M-ITX/eDP and B650E PG-ITX WiFi motherboards.

 

Useless features only increase the complexity and price of the products. But this is well known. Overpowered VRM specs etc is meant to push price point higher than ever. They can't do that if they don't offer some new/more value over previous product models. 

 

i wouldnt call that gimmicky! im actually planning exactly that, to install an internal display for monitoring purposes. esp. since my enthoo pro 2 provides MORE than enough space for such addons! 

however, i have to agree that the execution by asrock leaves a lot to be desired...my plan involves a simple usb powered hdmi display at 10.1 inches thats normally used to raspberry pi applications. 

 

9 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

Interesting...

 

 

ha! i was smiling when i saw that vid, thinking straight of u and the rest of the gang here surely drooling over such a cooler 😂

 

58 minutes ago, Etern4l said:

 

Why would you hope to gain anything in terms of memory OC? The memory controller is on the CPU.

 

easy, cuz the imc is only part of the equation. the other three are dimm quality, dimm temps and mobo trace quality.

 

edit: ah, took too long with my reply, @tps3443 was faster 😋

[Mr. Fox]

55 minutes ago, jaybee83 said:

congratz man, 36 years is crazy! what did u guys do on your special day? hope u enjoyed it to the fullest! greetings from mexico btw, currently on my honeymoon with my lady, its "only" been ten years since we became a couple 😃

We spent the day just hanging out together and enjoying one another's company. We went out to eat at a nice restaurant, which is something we seldom do because of the high cost and less than ideal caloric implications. Awesome honeymoon getaway in Mexico. Congratulations on making your commitment official! Have a wonderful time. I hope you enjoy a lifetime of love and friendship through the good times and hard times. It is as much, perhaps more, decision and covenant than it is a feeling. Feelings can fade, but real love and real commitments do not... otherwise, they are not real love and commitments... only feelings that were mistaken for the latter.

55 minutes ago, jaybee83 said:

i wouldnt call that gimmicky! im actually planning exactly that, to install an internal display for monitoring purposes. esp. since my enthoo pro 2 provides MORE than enough space for such addons! 

however, i have to agree that the execution by asrock leaves a lot to be desired...my plan involves a simple usb powered hdmi display at 10.1 inches thats normally used to raspberry pi applications. 

The concept of having the display for system monitoring is wonderful. Using it as a USB device is ideal, because then it does not interfere with your configuration of graphics display output on a monitor that serves a limited purpose. Having an eDP port on the motherboard like a laptop is a gimmick that adds a proprietary element to the ability to use the feature when any other solution is totally non-proprietary. One of the many reasons laptops suck is proprietary garbage... why go down that retarded rabbit hole with a desktop if you don't have to? I shudder to think about what kind of configuration nightmare that getup is going to look like on the A$$Rock abortion, and how that display will be driven at a hardware level. Totally unnecessary complication and added point of potential failure.

55 minutes ago, jaybee83 said:

ha! i was smiling when i saw that vid, thinking straight of u and the rest of the gang here surely drooling over such a cooler 😂

This looks most interesting to me because the TEC is cooled as part of a normal custom water loop. That has potential to work a lot more effectively and efficiently than a normal TEC that is not part of a custom water loop. With the water cooling added, probably will get and stay colder and be less prone to condensation because the temperature delta between components is smaller... in theory anyway.

55 minutes ago, jaybee83 said:

easy, cuz the imc is only part of the equation. the other three are dimm quality, dimm temps and mobo trace quality.

I have not seen a more clear example of this than the G.SKILL Ripjaws V DDR4 memory in my Strix Z690 D4. I ran it at 4500 stable on multiple Z490 and Z590 motherboards with 10900K/KF processors. But, it could not boot above 4000 reliably with 12900K. I assumed the Z690 D4 board was the problem. Wrong... way wrong. Runs like a top at 4600 with the 12900KS and 13900K. Everything works together. If one element doesn't play nice with another, it is going to present an impediment.

[Papusan]

A couple of fast benches to see if the chips works as it should. I wish Intel could deliver a few more P-cores instead of the flod with babies. Imagine this chips come with 16 P-cores and reduced some of the E-cores. 

 

https://hwbot.org/submission/5112151_papusan_pifast_core_i9_13900k_9sec_230ms?recalculate=true

 

https://hwbot.org/submission/5112142_papusan_cinebench___r23_multi_core_with_benchmate_core_i9_13900k_44090_cb

 

You'll need LN2 for AMD's latest and greatest Ryzen Zen4 to come on par with an water cooled Intel chips😮 @jaybee83 isn't that correct? Or maybe I'm wrong?