Mr. Fox

It is still going to have all of the inherent problems, limitations and engineering defects associated with the fact that it is a BGA turdbook. Performing better because it is a newer hardware generation is expected and required as the price of admission, but that is not a good enough excuse to embrace the filth any more than it never has been in the past. Garbage is garbage no matter how you slice it.

5 hours ago, Papusan said:

 

It seems Microsoft go over dead bodies to try help their partners. 

 

And who is the fool's bro @Mr. Fox? The crying babies or Microsoft? None say he or others has to install the latest and bugged. Just go back to Win 10 and enjoy your pc. 

 

 

Windows 11 Watermark Showing Up On Unsupported Systems

Microsoft implements plan to annoy users into upgrading PCs (or downgrading Windows)

 

At the moment, it looks like unsupported systems will only have to deal with a mildly-annoying watermark, but this could be the first step toward more drastic measures. Microsoft has warned that it will disable updates on unsupported systems (though this clearly has yet to come to fruition, as you'll only get the watermark if you install the latest update).

 

So, just go buy a new CPU (says Microsoft). Or uninstall Windows 11 and downgrade to Windows 10

It always helps keep things in perspective to remember that (a) Micro$lop is evil at the core of their corporate existence, and (b) fanboys lack the ability to think rationally about things. If the sheeple want to use Winduhz 11, it doesn't matter how crappy it is. In their minds it is the ultimate destiny and they are too stupid to use logic. This is not unique. The same can be said of crApple and their sick little minority group of fanboys, fangirls, and fan-its that are confused about everything.

The Redmond Reprobates are fully aware that by making the use of Winduhz XI more difficult that makes it elusively desirable for fanboys and rebels alike. That's why they do it. It would be less accepted if it installed on a potato or a tomato. Their roadblocks fuel defiance and controversy about a product that is unworthy of any manner of special attention.

Somebody in a high ranking position gets their jollies from watching emo fanboys have meltdowns and technically challenged wannabe crybabies whine about it.

1 hour ago, Papusan said:

I can answer my own question.... 

 

 

This is retarded of lack of better word. I know the 6-pin connector support added wattage for the PCIe slot if it lack needed power but several other brands offer MB's  that can provide enough power to the PCIe slot without this restriction.

 

And I don't use much of the 12v line from the 24 pin MB connector. Etc the 11A (130w+) fan headers limit isn't in use. Only for fan signals so not much wattage go into these fan headers. So the 24 pin should be more than enough. Why castrate it at wimpy 27W? This idiotic design/engineering ideas is something I mostly can expect coming from Dell or F. Azor. Not from a real MB manufacturer that should know better. 

 

Now I need to find a proper solution for this due Asus own engineering stupidity. And that cost money. Not needed if they followed specs.

 

Then you have the second stupidity from Asus. Why in hell use the F8 command for the MB/bios functionality? The Z690 Apex is meant as a oc board and people use F8 command to go fast into Windows safe mode. So stupid has to be todays word.  And Asus earn it. Every single bit.

 

Asus deserve 2x tripple....  

 

What the heck? That's really crazy. PCIe x16 slots should provide 75W natively without an extra power source. It makes no sense that ASUS did this.

14 minutes ago, Reciever said:

I dont purchase anything from Corsair anymore. Their mods on various forums burned me from the brand altogether.

Were they actually Corsair employees? Not defending what they did at all, but just curious if their behavior was a reflection of being an outsourced flunky that doesn't actually care about the brand or the customers. If they were actually Corsair staff, that makes it a less forgivable breach of character. Most of the people I have needed to interact with at ASUS were truly horrible, so I wouldn't have a surprised look on my face if they were Corsair staff. But, I would still hope not.

Good help is hard to find, especially when the functional role and compensation package fail to make the employee feel like a mission-critical resource.

19 minutes ago, Reciever said:

My EVGA 550w did fine for the 3090 but keep in mind I locked it to 1v which translated roughly to 350w or so, still use it on my Am4 system with a 2700x and 5700XT. I pushed 325w-350w on the 5700XT as well on it. EVGA makes a solid PSU 🙂

Yes, everything EVGA makes is top notch. A 550W PSU is adequate for a lot of applications that do not involve overclocking and overvolting of components that are notorious for being power hungry running stock. For most typical uses you would not exhaust the 550W PSU capacity.

22 minutes ago, Papusan said:

But as I said... If I take out the 4090 and put in old cards with dual 8-pin I need to steal the 6-pin connector from the MB  to power the old GPUs. That may work. But the very best would be a 600W SFX PSU. Rather this option than swap out my main PSU with another one with dual 12VHPWR connector. I will have more PCIe cables this way and have huge power headroom to power up much more in my pc. And I don't want pay an arm and a leg for a SFX PSU. But it has to be quality. Failig PSU's tend to drag with the whole pc if it fails. Not expensive and not too cheap. And with proper Amp for each PCIe line out connecto from the PSU.

Yes, I think adding a second PSU is a better option. Both of us have cases that support dual PSU. You could also run the 4090 HOF off of the second PSU or the mobo off of the SFX PSU if you wanted to, and still have plenty of legacy PCIe cables available for older GPUs and not have to disconnect anything. As long as both of the PSUs have more than enough capacity to support what they are attached to you're good. Running the GPU from a dedicated PSU is never a bad idea. Most people do not have cases that support dual PSU installation. 

My case will support dual full-size ATX PSUs, but I am using the spare PSU bay to support the water cooling lines. I installed bulkhead G1/4 pass-through fittings with QDC fittings and ball valves mounted on a thick aluminum plate that is screwed in place where the second PSU would be installed.

44 minutes ago, Papusan said:

I have two choices... Go for a new 1600+ Psu or an SFX psu for my old cards(the box support 2 PSUs).  

 

Is there some good advices on what SFX PSU to buy rated +600W I can use for powering my old graphics cards? This is the cheaper way and I will have the benefits have access to +2100W power. Norwegian AC connectors here home is 3600W or 16x230v.

I am not sure on a SFX PSU. There might be some good options, but the systems that use them are usually compromised in a myriad of ways. If you are only using the SFX PSU to power some older GPUs it probably doesn't need to be top notch.

44 minutes ago, Papusan said:

Second question... I know you'll need the extra 6-pin connector on the motherboard to power more items connected to the MB. Without it could also make GPU stability problems. But I think more for only benching old cards and without having much connected to the MB. All strong fans is powered by the PSU and not to the MB (only rpm signals).

20 minutes ago, Papusan said:

 

Se also my second question... 

I have the extra 6-pin PCI-e connector on my Dark mobo and I always use that when it is available on a motherboard because it helps GPU stability to have the additional power available to the PCIe slots with an insanely powerful GPU like the 3090 KPE or other GPU with a 1000W power limit. It might not matter with the older GPUs, but I don't question that it would be wise to have it connected with your 4090 HOF beast GPU. It might work OK without it, but it certainly cannot hurt to use it. I would if I were you.

35 minutes ago, Papusan said:

Thanks. Yep, I only wanted the Strix of all nowadays new GPUs. And I would never even buy anything else. Only luck that I saw the HOF. Still on the table. I need do some changes. And I don't like the way Be Quiet put the connectors. For single 16-pin 12VHPWR thats not a problem but with dual 16-pin 12VHPWR for the HOF I should have more connectors for my hobby with older cards. The Dark Pro is a fantastic PSU but now I'm limited the way I want my setup to work. See pict and you undetstand.

 

The PCIe connectors is rated 45A so near 500W (one cable connector contain dual 8-pin. Aka 10x 8-Pin but with this layout I will missing PCIe connectors.

 

Regarding the US price... Dang! Without the Norwecian taxes and the added exange currency I pay less for the 4090 Asus than many other countries included US and you. Thats not normal bro Fox. Not at all.. This means parts is well overpriced now. 

 

What is normal Strix OC price (MSRP) in US?

 

That's very weird. The BeQuiet PSU has 8+6 instead of 8+8? Technically, you only need 3x8-pin per cable. Some are 3x8-pin adapters and that is plenty for one 12VHPWR connection. In fact, the 3090 KPE can easily pull 1000W with a severe overclock and 3x8-pin provides ample power for that, along with what it can pull from the PCIe slot. I believe the 12VHPWR adapter cables that use 4x8-pin per 12VHPWR connector are using lighter gauge wiring and compensating for that by taking up the 4th PSU port. 

For example the cheap "Basic" CableMod 12VHPWR cable uses 4x8-pin PSU ports. The better "Pro" uses only 3x8-pin and uses heavier gauge cable and sells for $10 USD more than the "Basic" version.

The "normal" (meaning correct) price is $1999.99 direct from ASUS. I paid $10 more for a better experience dealing with NewEgg than the idiots at ASUS. If there is something wrong with it during the first month of ownership, NewEgg will take care of me better and faster than ASUS will. Most resellers are dishonest and live to screw their customers.

https://rog.asus.com/us/graphics-cards/graphics-cards/rog-strix/rog-strix-rtx4090-o24g-gaming-model/

It looks like it is available (at least at this very moment) direct from ASUS.

57 minutes ago, Papusan said:

Congrats bro Fox. I waited 3.5 months and gave up on getting the Strixs OC. And the Strix was nr 1 on my list of 4090 I wanted. 
 

I’m posting from my phone. But is that price correct? Or does this $2,395 pricepoint include 25% Norwegian tax if I ordered it from US Newegg? Or is this the price you have to pay in US?

Thank you. Yes, I know this is the one you wanted. It is sad that the NOK to USD exchange rate is 10:1 right now.

As I was waiting for Amazon to process my refund, I thought about the way the Suprim just died for no reason I could identify, and I remembered that my first Unify-X mobo lasted less than a day, I decided that was not better than the bad luck I have had with ASUS. I no longer have much confidence in reliability from either brand now. Figured that  I might as well get the Strix since it seems reliability for both brands is questionable. I almost pulled the trigger on a MSI Trio from Best Buy for $1600 and ready for pickup today, but decided that chances of me being happy with it are probably very slim. It's pretty wimpy in terms of power delivery, unlike the Strix and Suprim. The Strix and Suprim and HOF are the only 4090 GPUs built better than the FE. All others are weaker than the FE.

That is the US pre-tax price now on NewEgg, but it is the price from the scalpers. I did not pay that much and would never have ordered it at that price. The scalper price is ludicrous. I got the only NewEgg option in stock.

Here is what I paid for the "sold and shipped by NewEgg" GPU, which is still too much...

@PapusanI hope I don't end up being disappointed or hating myself for getting this thing.

Should have it by Friday.

Edit: looks like I got lucky. The price is now $400 USD more from a reseller scalper than what it cost me for the "sold and shipped by NewEgg" GPU. Even after sales tax and shipping was added it is still $235 less than the pre-tax scalper scam price.

2 hours ago, Papusan said:

Getting overpriced garbage is a hell lot worse than getting overpriced awesome. Paying top dollars for the new 4090 scam (laptops) is awful. You get the worst from both worlds. If you jump on the higher tier ADA laptops you’ are in short scammed. 

I agree with you. But, I will go a step further and say that buying garbage is never good. If owning garbage is one's destiny, they should spend as little as possible on it because... well... it's garbage. Garbage is worth only as much as garbage collectors are willing to pay for their trash. Right now it seems like garbage collectors are loving their trash way too much. None of this even contemplates the fact that sheeple lack the ability to identify garbage.

I still don't feel good about getting screwed on awesome though. For those responsible for screwing us all, I classify that moral defect as being conceptually the same as a rapist believing that their victim secretly wanted it. Surrendering on the basis that resistance is futile does not legitimize the character flaw.

54 minutes ago, ryan said:

if i put a steak dinner on a trash can lid. would people eat it? apparently they will

Honestly, it would not surprise me if some people eat while sitting on a toilet. The sheeple believe what they are told. That makes paying more to get less understandable because they're believing lies, trusting liars, and being mislead about getting less. But, it doesn't explain the rationale for carte blanche paying way too much no matter how truly great and amazing it might truly be (4090 is the example here). Everything is a poor value and nothing is priced consistent with the value it offers (or doesn't offer). It adds insult to injury when you are getting a piece of garbage that is severely overpriced.

On 2/19/2023 at 1:34 PM, Papusan said:

This is nothing new. They just can't make it right. 

It will never be a "good" OS, just as Windowz 8.X and Windoze 10 were never a "good" OS. Each release has merely been a different gradient of product development failure.

3 hours ago, KING19 said:

Good and bad are determined based on what supports or calls attention to the stupidity of their agenda, not what is actually good or bad. Common sense and an elemental, animalistic level of decency gets in the way of their agenda.

3 hours ago, johnksss said:

Not sure what this guy is doing, but don't do like him....

https://hwbot.org/submission/5204031_zippytek_unigine_superposition___1080p_xtreme_geforce_rtx_4090_22650_points

 

Almost all his scores are low with his HOF card.....

ZippyTek is from Egypt. Unless he is running his stuff inside of a meat locker probably everything is thermal throttled, LOL. That, or his HOF card wasn't a winner in the silicon lottery. I suspect there are some that are not.

Edit:  

1 hour ago, johnksss said:

Maybe his sample is trash?

I suspect so. Probably the most reasonable way to explain the poor results.

2 hours ago, Etern4l said:

Have yet to attempt running GPU-Z in Wine etc. Kind of procrastinating on this presumably frustrating endavour lol

I do not think there is a way to tell in Linux. Nobody doing Linux software development cares enough to have taken time to do it. They might be Linux enthusiasts, but it seems that none (or very few) are actually performance PC hardware enthusiasts. Those that are use Windows for that and Linux for everything else.

I have not seen Samsung or Hynix GDDR6X (only GDDR6 - no X). My Kingpin card Micron. My 3060 Ti FTW3 has Samsung GDDR6 (no X). You can see what brand the memory is on the main tab of GPU-Z.

14 hours ago, Papusan said:

If you get a card at $1800 in US then I have to pay $2250. And for that price you'll get the cheapest of the gamer cards. If thats the only option I would let it be and instead go for a cheap used card. For my needs. I don't want spend money on a card I don't want. Cheap or expensive doesn't matter. If I don't like it... I don't buy it.

I paid $1799 for the 4090 Suprim Liquid X and other than the HOF like you have it is the best 4090 money can buy. Excluding the HOF it is at the top of the food chain in terms of power delivery design and probably has no match except for the Strix that is never available and always overpriced, and has a terrible warranty by a horrible company. I would definitely pay the extra to get the HOF, but I would not pay extra for a Strix. I would accept a Zotac AMP Extreme AIRO if I could get it for $1799, or a Suprim X (no liquid). The only thing I did not like about the Liqud X was the AIO cooler. I never even removed the plastic film on it because I had no intention of leaving it.

4 hours ago, Etern4l said:

The link I posted earlier had people hint at durability issues. Again the conservative approach here would be to assume that the skunk hasn't really changed its stripes 🙂

In practice the stripes may have improved, but the 4090 is a relatively new card, will need more time and bold overclockers to guinea pig this and verify the reliability profile over time. 

Being able to identify with certaintly exactly what brand of VRAM is going to be used by a particular OEM on a particular GPU model is challenging. We have seen examples of them using what is available to them, which might fluctuate to some degree.

Looks like Roman is having issues with the Strix 4090 not functioning in 16x mode. I think he is right about the memory. I have noticed that on Port Royal scores as well. Applied to 3090 as well. 

9 hours ago, Papusan said:

LooL. I don't have the small ladies hands. What a useless gimmick/addons.

It kind of makes sense when you consider that Chinese people are generally not very large people. Those gloves are probably "normal" size in their culture. They are generally not very tall and do not have large hands or feet. They are generally healthier though, due to diet and lifestyle.

13 hours ago, Etern4l said:

Micron VRAM. Nuff said. Sorry to hear, must be annoying, but good thing you ordered from Amazon and it happened within the return period. 

12 hours ago, electrosoft said:

Micron is an issue on Turing. Do you have any links to multiple issues with Micron ram on 3000/4000 series?

11 hours ago, Etern4l said:

 

I know, Micron VRAM was doa on my Turing laptop, Micron makes the slowest DDR5 etc. As for the links, first hit on Google bro, looks like there are more. 

 

https://www.overclock.net/threads/rtx-4090-and-memory-chip-degradation.1804008/

 

The word is that SK Hynix and Samsung memory is better.

It was an issue for sure on 20-series. GDDR Memory (including Micron) has improved with time, but I generally agree that SK Hynix and Samsung are preferred for both GDDR and system memory. Micron is generally fine for normal use scenarios, but usually does not overclock well. That seems to not be true though with GDDR6X. Micron clocks right along fine with GDDR6X, but no intel on whether or not it is durable.

3 hours ago, electrosoft said:

I do have a question though. Is this bios reset light on the bottom supposed to be stuck on white 24/7?

White tells you that BIOS #1 is selected. If you  move the selection switch to BIOS #2 it will turn a really icky bright red color.  Both of the bright LEDs suck, but the red is a whole lot worse.

1 hour ago, electrosoft said:

 

Sounds like something besides the memory in that situation.

 

Either way, that sounds like an AP (Amazon Problem) not a YP (You Problem).

I agree. It acts like it has an onboard fuse that is blown or something. It was working fine. I wasn't using the computer when it stopped working, it was just idling with nothing open except for Outlook.

2 hours ago, electrosoft said:

That was a decent sample too..... 🥲 You could always work out logistics with @Papusan and really splurge on an HOF!

I would if I could get it for $1799 USD after Amazon refunds my money. But, I don't want to pay $2,000+ for a GPU. Too much. Even $1800 is too much. Since the only reason I want it is for benching, and I don't make any money benching or get cherry picked parts for free, it is too much money just for fun. That ludicrous cost starts taking the fun out of it if I think about how much it cost me, and then I start regretting it. As soon as I've benched it as far as it can go, then I start regretting it all over again because all the fun and games are over at that point and there is not left to do that is exciting.

1 hour ago, Mr. Fox said:

Well, my Suprim died today. While working on my other computer I looked over and saw the screen was black, like it had gone to sleep. I always disable that. Jiggled the mouse and tapped a few keys and nothing. Powered off and on and motherboard beeps and shows D6. Pulled it out and tried it on the other computer and same thing. Started a refund with Amazon. No exchange available, so I put the 3060 Ti in my benching rig while I ponder whether or not to bother finding another 4090.

 

I am so glad that I hadn't already sold the spare GPU. I'd be up the creek with no paddle if I had.

Just for giggles, I put the 4090 in the second PCIe slot on the Dark mobo and connected everything. Booted from the 3060 Ti in the primary slot and loaded Windows. Nothing in Device Manager. It does not even detect that it is in the slot, which is consistent with the BIOS error D6 (no graphics device found). 

8 minutes ago, Etern4l said:

 

Micron VRAM. Nuff said. Sorry to hear, must be annoying, but good thing you ordered from Amazon and it happened within the return period. 

That is exactly why I bought it from Amazon. It was a rare opportunity for the price on a "sold and shipped" option. All of the other sources are about $300 more. I never would have purchased it anywhere except Amazon or Best Buy (since I have no Microcenter) because of their return policy.

1 minute ago, Custom90gt said:

 

It's been a rough time for you and hardware recently.

It has. I'm not sure I am going to replace it. Had Amazon had another in stock and could have exchanged it, I would have. There was a part of me that regretted spending $1799 on it, so we'll see once the refund shows up. Definitely not going to do anything until the money is back in my account.

Well, my Suprim died today. While working on my other computer I looked over and saw the screen was black, like it had gone to sleep. I always disable that. Jiggled the mouse and tapped a few keys and nothing. Powered off and on and motherboard beeps and shows D6. Pulled it out and tried it on the other computer and same thing. Started a refund with Amazon. No exchange available, so I put the 3060 Ti in my benching rig while I ponder whether or not to bother finding another 4090.

I am so glad that I hadn't already sold the spare GPU. I'd be up the creek with no paddle if I had.