Mr. Fox

2 hours ago, ryan said:

I wish I had a UZZI for hunting deers lol. man do I want a gun. you guys in the states are lucky. here in canada best route you can go is a shotgun like my dad has. this comes up from searching CCDL on @Rage Sets addy

The right to keep and bear arms is no less important than freedom of speech, freedom of religion, and all other articles of our Constituion. The push against it is diabolical and against everything that has made this the greatest nation on the planet. Disarming of citizens has historically been a first step in the powers of darkness establishing a totalitarian government.

5 hours ago, Rage Set said:

@Mr. Fox Looks like you will hopefully see improvement with the EK Kit

 

 

I am in a meeting and will watch the video when I have a minute. Ironic that I just said to @Papusanlast night that we would likely see reviews from Roman and Jay before I get mine.

Edit: Watching it now. I suspected that Roman was directly involved in the development, as he often is with EKWB, but I had nothing to base it on. His involvement enhances the likeliness that it will be good. @Papusanit looks like KitGuru's initial involvement was the prompting of the product and EK ran with the idea, rather than the other way. That probably explains the lackluster initial results as well.

Before Direct Die: Over 90°C

EKWB Direct Die: Below 80°C (roughly 13°-15°C improvement versus IHS)

10 hours ago, Raiderman said:

Side mounted connectors, marketing gimmick or useful?

 

https://www.techspot.com/news/97251-corsair-creates-new-psu-side-mounted-power-connectors.html#commentsOffset

 

 

That could be useful depending on the installation. An example of where it could be useful is an open bench setup. We are starting to see more examples of really goofy-looking cases as well. Weird doesn't even begin to describe how ridiculous some of them look.

With the fan facing downward, it would put all of the cables exiting the on the closed side panel side of normal tower case. If you had enough space between the PSU and side panel, it could be helpful to make extra space for drive cages in in front of the PSU and maybe help with cable management. On a case with very little space between the side panel and PSU it would not work at all. 

On a case that has no basement cover hiding the PSU and the horrible rat's nest of cables, this could also greatly enhance the appearance of the build, assuming there is enough air space between the PSU and side panel for the cables.

9 minutes ago, Papusan said:

 

If they follow AMD, then you never know how their QC and QM will pan out😁

 

Once again AMD screw up. This time a QC problem in thei sales department, LOOL

 

A heartbreaking mistake, AMD now says Ryzen 7000X3D is not launching on February 14th
https://videocardz.com/newz/a-heartbreaking-mistake-amd-now-says-ryzen-7000x3d-is-not-launching-on-february-14th

 

Time will tell. Almost everything sucks now. It is nice when we discover an exception and it doesn't suck. If it works as it should it will be a nice cooling upgrade.

If it works correctly it will be a helluva lot better than the SuperCool design that requires taking special steps to avoid dumping water on your motherboard. 

The 7000X3D not launching on Valentine's Day is a gift. It would be cruel to release a crippled CPU on a day where you should be honoring the people that love you.

57 minutes ago, Papusan said:

You saw the package power? He managed go down from 225w and +90C to sub 208W after the shaving and still +80C. I tested my sons setup with the 12900K... Around 80C with 280W load. And this with not the best wb as Alphacool XPX and fans tuned for less noise in the bios. He run default speed and the Cpu will never come above 65C in CBR-23 stress test. In games the Cpu max out around 52C. But the Cpu normally run well below 50C for his gaming. The Gpu is worse... In the small mid chassis the Gpu will run at around 65C due the heat dumped from the front rad. The pay of for the small form factor 🙂

 

+80C with 210W load is awful if he run with liquid metal and direct die regarless if the WB finish isn't finished. A undevolt to lower power below 210W would only cover the problem. 

 

Right, but it was obvious that the parts did not fit together correctly and it was a rough prototype barely under development. Hopefully, it will be turning out good, but it would be kind of wrong to believe that initial concept prototype shown in that video is the same result as the final product 5 months later. He was sanding it on a belt sander to try to get it to fit and I can't believe that they would sell a product like that and place their brand reputation in such jeopardy that way.

At least they took an extra 5 months time to get it right before sending it to production. I wish SuperCool would have done that instead of sending me a piece of garbage.

Anyway, we will find out together and if it is trash I will demand a refund or place a dispute with my credit card if they refuse.

8 minutes ago, Papusan said:

Yep, I expect improvements. Regarding they use bios default for 12900K hence high temps the 13900K will run at higher watttage anyway🙂 The big question will be... How much will the direct die cooler provide vs... standard delidde and liquid metal. Theyt can claim better results. But not because of the new Direct die cooler😎 

We will find out after I get it because I am running a delid with liquid metal on both sides of the IHS right now. My temperatures are higher than they showed in the video, but it's not a good comparison because they were using the default voltage and causing the CPU to overheat. The video is worthless from a technical perspective. It was poorly executed. But, it is interesting to see what they were working on. I think the video was not a good thing to release for a beta product because it shows results that may not be an accurate reflection of the final product. Viewers may form opinions based on flawed or inaccurate information.

Since it just now became available for pre-order we may see some reviews by Roman or Jay before I get mine.

2 hours ago, Raiderman said:

I've been doing some firestrike runs on this current system, not the one in my sig, but my 3900x, 6600xt, b350 board, and slow 2800mhz ddr4. I was trying to compare to the last system I had in early 2000, which was a 3900x, radeon vii, x570 board, and oc'ed ram at 3600mhz. I've been consistently getting better combined scores with the system I have now. A difference of 500 points between the two. Although my graphics score was lower with the 6600xt. Stange that I'm getting a better combined score on inferior hardware. Newer 3dmark version?

Newer versions of 3DMark are screw up and results over time are unreliable because they change too much between versions. It is no longer a good benchmark tool due to its flaws.

38 minutes ago, Papusan said:

This doesn't bode well. I wonder how much they could tune the performance with almost same parts...

 

That second "update" video was from 5 months ago when the product was a work-in-process beta prototype that did not fit properly. So, I do not think we can put much weight on it. Even so, the temps shown here after sanding down the frame are better than I saw with 12900K with the first (flawed) version of the SuperCool direct die block.

If I remember correctly, in that video they were using BIOS defaults, which would be far too much voltage and cause the CPU to run crazy hot. BIOS defaults voltage is always way too high. Both of my Z690 Strix and my Dark motherboard apply over 100mV too much with BIOS defaults appled.

If it is no good I will demand a refund for selling a defective product. But, I expect it will be good, and better than with an IHS. I do not believe EKWB would release it if it is not properly functioning. It would be harmful to their reputation. But, we will find out in 5 or 6 weeks when I get it.

3 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

It was a long wait since KitGuru started talking about it, but I was finally able to pre-order one.

 

3 hours ago, Papusan said:

I hope the results is better than the pre-production units. But I have my doubts until the opposite is showed. Todays tech isn't as good as you think it is. Often due cost cutting or bad engineering. EK needed 3rd gen socket 1700 chips to make it. And thats too bad for a well known cooling HW manufacturer as EK is.

This video was just posted today. They use the direct die kit. I am watching it now to see if it shows anything in terms of results. The early prototypes from 6 months ago that we saw on KitGuru had a way to go before being ready for prime time. Their new delid kit looks better than Rockit Cool. Man, what an ugly looking case.

Edit: No results on cooling, just a build video for the kiddos.

2 minutes ago, Papusan said:

No benefits from newer drivers may be correct most of the time, but this is not a good enough excuse to say you are are... nNw you are alone and we can't help.

The part they are missing is the complaint is not about "no benefit" but actually harm to the functionality of the 980 Ti. That is different than "no benefit" to older GPUs.

1 hour ago, Papusan said:

I cheched my older downloads. The Firestorm OC software that the support suggested... I have already tried that version. And yep, same outcome. New has to be better? Screw you Nvidia and Zotac. Nvidia for crippling own products and Zotac for washing their hands. 

 

'Pilate Washing his Hands'

 

With the response I got from Zotac.... Just dream that I'll spend my money on a Zotac boat. Or any other new cards they will throw out. Can't blacklist Nvidia... Because their competitors sucks even more.

 

To be fair, I would not expect a better response from any of the other vendors. NVIDIA is at fault for it. It affects all brands, correct? Remember all of the problems a long time ago with clock-blocking and the way they ruined 780M SLI performance? It is likely that nobody has the ability fix it except for NVIDIA because it was their cancer driver.

What would have been an appropriate response from Zotac is "Thank you for alerting us. We are sorry this has happened. We will see if we can confirm the problem in our product support team and reach out to NVIDIA to have the problem corrected." But, I doubt ASUS, MSI, Gigabutt or any other brand would do that. None of them give a rat's butt about end users. EVGA might have, but now they are out of the picture.

I agree the example of Pontius Pilate is fitting here.

Sadly, NVIDIA does do whatever NVIDIA wants. They do not care about end users, their AIB "partners" or any of their products that are not current generation. That is one reason why EVGA is no longer in the GPU business.

And, in other news, AMD drivers are killing 6000-series Radeon cards. What a wonderful slice of heaven we have in PC tech today.

11 minutes ago, Papusan said:

 

Even better. Make a dual OS setup and test a couple of OS builds. @ryan need only 60GB for a second OS partition. 

 

Techpowerup have several 3DMark Suite versions for downloads. Click show older versions...

 

 Futuremark 3DMark for Windows

Yes. The point being is that the problem is probably driver and Windows and/or 3DMark version. Scores go up and down and things change, and it is rare that scores ever improve with 3DMark version updates. It is also rare that performance improves as the Redmond Retards update their trash OS. Things almost always decline. Sometimes scores can improve with NVIDIA driver version changes, but almost never does 3DMark or Windows performamce get better after an update. More often than not, Windows Updates actually impair performance and recovery from the performance loss is rare, if not outright impossible.

Like everything else, newer is always better newer. It is not a coincidence that it rhymes with manure.

56 minutes ago, Etern4l said:

What are they trying to do? Penalise early adopters? Induce dpuble purchase? 

Yes. Straight from the NVIDA playbook of dirty, rotten tricks like 3090 Ti.

40 minutes ago, ryan said:

no idea why im scoring so low. my old record exceeded 9200 gpu and 9300 overall..any help would be appreciated

Did you follow up on my previous post? Look at your unmatchable high score. Note the date and what NVIDIA driver was used. Go back to that NVIDIA driver and re-test. If still low, refer to the date and remove all Windows Updates installed since then, and retest. 

Bear in mind, 3DMark is known for being buggy. Sometimes you will get a high score than neither you nor anyone else can match because the test run with the high score glitched out.

Firestrike, for example, is notorious for having horrible results in the combined test (last test in the sequence) if you are using the wrong NVIDIA driver. Even with the same driver, you can reboot and rerun the test and the combined score can be much higher. The combined test result will have a major impact on the overall score as well.

13 minutes ago, Papusan said:

DIRECT DIE COOLING FOR THE INTEL 12TH AND 13TH-GEN CORE SERIES CPUS

It was a long wait since KitGuru started talking about it, but I was finally able to pre-order one.

1 hour ago, jaybee83 said:

haha lets see how long it takes to wear down your rational parts 😄 

I have had one in a shopping cart a couple of times. The money causes me to pause, but thinking about the lack of Windows 7 support has been the reason I emptied my cart. That has been enough to keep me from going over the edge so far. It does not help NVIDIA that their only drivers now are DCH feces.

Any tech company that relies on Micro$lop Store to deliver their digital dung is part of the butt-kissing problem and I hope their lack of good judgement measurably harms them to the same degree that it angers me. If I wanted that kind of worthless trash for zombie sheeple on my PC I would run ChromeOS and use Google Play Store. But, I don't want to and I have no respect left for Micro$lop. I would find great pleasure in witnessing their calamity and be glad about their ruin. I'd love to see Apple collapse as well. The world would be a better place without both of them.

5 hours ago, Raiderman said:

You misspelled stupid/insane/moronic

In case you haven't seen it, please take care about what drivers you use with your new GPU. It would horrible if this happened. The drivers released in December seem to be the issue if I am understanding this correctly.

4 hours ago, ryan said:

stock 160/160

 

no idea how at one point I broke 9200

Maybe go back and retrace your steps. See what drivers you were using at the time, and remove any Winduhz Update cancer that has been installed since that date. Drivers or changes to Windoze are the most likely explanations for the degraded performance.

3 hours ago, Papusan said:

Put the blame where it should be... On the big IDIOT! Use Google translate 🙂

 

That is a horrible story, indeed. It would be nice for a civil war to erupt and derail his criminal activity in Ukraine.

2 hours ago, Clamibot said:

I'm such a cheapskake and you guys all know it 🤣. I don't know how I balance being so frugal with being a hardware enthusiast. I'm basically subsisting on brother @Mr. Fox's used parts whenever he has some goodies up for sale on the marketplace, and also on any other bones thrown my way through deals I stumble across.

Speaking of goodies, I'll probably have more coming up soon when I stop being lazy and post them. If any of it is of interest to you, give me a shout. See below.

5 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

I don't really have any use for this NUC. After doing the initial review and the video I haven't used it, so I'm probably going to sell it. I have two fantastic desktops and a nice enough laptop for business travel, so I can't imagine that it won't just sit and collect dust if I keep it. If anyone is interested in it let me know and I'll put it up in the community marketplace.

 

I also have a nicely binned 12900KS and 32GB of Hynix DDR5 M-die that I am not using that I can also sell. If anyone is interested in that, I will put that up in the marketplace as well.

2 hours ago, electrosoft said:

Yeah they lasted a good 3hrs overall which is definitely a good sign. Suprim Liquid X drifted in and out of stock a few times too.

 

Do you have a particular model that catches your fancy?

 

lol, at least I said I wouldn't be making any decisions till February 2023 so I'm eating just a touch of crow's meat. 🙂

Nothing particular in mind. I am deliberately avoiding comparing pros and cons with any level of seriousness because I am really pretty disgusted with tech in general right now. I do not want my judgment to be clouded with misguided excitement from my investigation of the options. 

EVGA exiting the GPU market also makes me apprehensive that anything I buy will either be a compromised product, have a horrible warranty process, or both. I am not confident that I will ever be enthusiastic to spend the amount it would require to own a 4090 even if EVGA was still in the picture. I don't even want to feel excited about blowing that much money. Of course I really want one. To say the performance interests me would be a huge understatement, and therein lies the problem.

I am seeing reports of issues with people that are having systems that will not POST with 4090 and 4080 cards installed, and I am not interested in that kind of drama. Seems there are some random firmware conflicts. And, I am still not particularly interested in giving up Windows 7, as I haven't reconciled the idea that 4090 performance is enough that I would view it as being an acceptable compromise. Defiance and rejecting the Redmond Retards' efforts to force using their latest trash is a good enough reason for me to want to keep using it. I would want to because of that even if I liked Windows 10/11 because their Nazi approach pisses me off real bad.

Whatever I would choose would need to have a waterblock readily available for it, preferrably from two or more manufacturers.  The one I am most interested in is the Zotac 4090 AMP Extreme AIRO. Optionally, one of the better MSI models, Colorful, PNY or (last choice, but not excluded as an option) a Gigabyte product.

I am least interested in owning anything made by ASUS or ASRock because I do not like what they stand for as companies, or their shoddy warranty processes. I do not want anything that is a hybrid or has a factory waterblock unless it were available at a freakishly weird price, but those seem to be among the most overpriced options. At least one of the liquid cooled options seems to perform poorly compared to most of the air cooled options (can't remember which one now) and that seems inexcusable.

There is a part of me that seriously wants to sell my 3090 KPE, use the money to buy the Acer Arc A770 and put the rest of the money in a savings account. The only reason I haven't already done that is the loss I would take on the 3090 KPE.  If I could sell it for $800 to $1,000 I am not even sure I that would be willing to spend the additional $700 to $1000 difference for a 4090 right now.

Knowing myself, there is a really good chance I will eventually cave in on this. I don't want to and I expect that if I do there will be some regret involved. For all of the above reasons I am making an effort to do nothing at the moment, and as much as I can, resisting the temptation to do any looking because I know that will just make it harder for me to keep a level head.

39 minutes ago, Reciever said:

If it helps we could have a banner made to shame you upon purchase, I wouldnt mind even getting commentary from @Clamibot articulating just how much money was wasted like those one liner quotes that OEM's like to use from Product reviewers. 

Here to help, after all 

It probably would be no more traumatic than the self-condemnation I endured after blowing an idiotic sum on the 3090 KPE. I still haven't really forgiven myself for that, and I haven't derived enough personal satisfaction from owning it to justify a repeat act of similar indiscretion. The kindest way to describe it would be: Good product, overrated, and poor value. The 4090 is all that, on steroids. At a certain point it becomes too difficult to balance desirability against repulsive pricing for a product that will be obsolete before it is old enough to get dirty.

Barring the possibility of a momentary lapse of good judgement, probably not going to happen. I am avoiding using the word "never" because I don't care for the taste of crow meat.

4 hours ago, electrosoft said:

We're getting to that point.

 

Gigabyte 4090 in stock for over 2hrs and counting at Newegg:

 

https://www.newegg.com/gigabyte-geforce-rtx-4090-gv-n4090gaming-oc-24gd/p/N82E16814932550?Item=N82E16814932550

 

All you had to do was just wait less than 3 months to get MSRP

That sure didn't last long. I looked at the link a couple of hours ago and it was about $1,700, but now it's back up to an idiotic $2,200 and the only option available.

Thankfully, the rational part of my brain is still functioning well enough that it convinced the irrational part of my brain that $1,700 was still an absurdly frivolous price. I was tempted to add it to my cart for a minute or two, though. It sucks being tempted by impulse, but the victory of overcoming it is sweet.

5 hours ago, ryan said:

 

 

I love all your videos, you have to be the most laid back guy ever, really cool and look freakishly like my dad/ when I casually glance it is my dad I see. wild. but yeah keep them videos coming

Thanks brother. It's very kind of you and I appreciate the compliment. I'm flattered that I remind you of your dad. I'm sure he's an awesome man so I take that as a compliment as well.

On 1/9/2023 at 7:46 AM, Linux said:

I will never undestand the issue with BGA, because all of my former and current BGA machines never had any issues. In addition to my Clevo i am running Ubuntu server on an Intel NUC. The thing runs Nextcloud, an e-mail server and a Fediverse instance (and a couple of other services) and it doesn't even blink.

I'm not fond of the design (BGA) but when the cost is kept very low, and if the product will do what you need it to do, it's not the end of the world if you have to throw it away if it stops working. It offers good utility at a low price. It's only when something is both disposable and expensive that it becomes an unwise purchase.

I have to admit that, for what it is, it does a really nice job and it's great that it has some degree of expandability. I mean, there are laptops that have soldered ram and storage and this allows replacement and upgrade of both, plus expansion to add a 2.5 inch SATA drive. It's a lot more than you would get in a laptop at this price, that's for sure.

I don't really have any use for this NUC. After doing the initial review and the video I haven't used it, so I'm probably going to sell it. I have two fantastic desktops and a nice enough laptop for business travel, so I can't imagine that it won't just sit and collect dust if I keep it. If anyone is interested in it let me know and I'll put it up in the community marketplace.

I also have a nicely binned 12900KS and 32GB of Hynix DDR5 M-die that I am not using that I can also sell. If anyone is interested in that, I will put that up in the marketplace as well.

9 minutes ago, Papusan said:

Its all about QC and QM. 

Vapor gate and failure of the entire quality management? Background to the cooler problem of the AMD Radeon RX 7900 XTX (MBA)

January 10, 2023

Igor Wallosek

If the GPU killing driver thing were to involve an NVIDIA GPU I would be inclined to consider it a deliberate digital genocide maneuver on the part of the Green Goblin as a wicked plot to sell more GPUs to people that wouldn't otherwise spend any money.  We have already seen them in action enough times to know they are not an honorable company.

With AMD I would not think that and lean more toward a view of it being accidental or due to incompetence versus a deliberate act with nefarious purposes. However, what we are seeing with unethical pricing and market manipulation they are both shaping up to look like unscrupulous companies that don't care about their products or the people that buy them, as long as they keep making money.

On 1/9/2023 at 6:47 AM, Mr. Fox said:

It certainly smacks of Micro$lop incompetence and ineptitude. When you spend a lot of your time butt-kissing losers and idiots, their poop gets splattered on you and you eventually begin to smell and behave as badly as they do.

2 hours ago, jaybee83 said:

almost spit out my cheerios with milk while reading that 😄 

More humor... when my kids were little, if they cut wind (passed gas) my father-in-law would say, "hey kiddo, your breath smells the same, but your voice sounds different" or "if you're doing that in parts, please leave mine out" LOL.

30 minutes ago, Talon said:

 

Wow, that is really horrible. I feel bad for the people this has happened to. This should be covered by AMD, even if the GPU is out of warranty.

1 hour ago, Papusan said:

You're sure you aren't tempted bro Fox😀 You don't have to go with massiveluy overpriced 4000 series mobile graphics cards. 

Well, let me think about it for a minute.

*one minute later*

nope

4 hours ago, Papusan said:

This showed up in Nvidia's feedback thread for 516.40 https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/forums/game-ready-drivers/13/494630/geforce-grd-51640-feedback-thread-released-61522/3258957/

One single soule complained about this in the feedback thread at Nvidia. Yep, one single person. If not more people enjoy tuning/overclock their cards, then I can clearly understand why Nvidia castrate new and older graphics cards. No one bother. They are happy with what they get. Castrated, overpriced or awful value doesn't matter @Mr. Fox 

Probably among the small number of GTX 980 owners that still exist, only one possessed enough intelligence to identify there is a problem. The rest of them are merely examples of why we can't have nice things any more. 

1 hour ago, Papusan said:

Only $1,812 US Dollar for the GPU upgrade from Nvidia 4060 and up to 4090.Ready with the money bro @Mr. Fox?

The prophesies are coming to pass. We can all have whatever the lowest common denominators are willing to put up with.

Now it is only a question of who is the king of the bottom-feeders.

34 minutes ago, 1610ftw said:

If you look at a few tech channel guys around youtube you will now find them mentioning 6 to 7 lbs laptops as super heavy and huge when in weight they are below former 15" DTRs and in volume they are probably smaller, too.