Official Clevo X170SM-G Thread

[Snowleopard]

1 hour ago, 1610ftw said:

 

The challenge will be to find a capable router for it that does not cost an arm and a leg. 2.5G would be the minimum but I would prefer to have a 10G connection and those routers will probably cost 400$ or more.

 

As I have kind of a hotspot in my house where there is a lot of WiFi usage with up to 4 laptops running at once I have been looking at this monstrosity but it is not exactly a steal:

 

 

https://rog.asus.com/networking/rog-rapture-gt-be98-pro/

 

Still it would be a worthy router for the X170 - not afraid to be big and powerful, same as the X170!

Yeah, the wi-fi 7 routers on the market now start at $699 and go up to $2499, how on earth did routers get that expensive, you could build a mini tower with 2 quad port nics, one for inbound and one for outbound traffic with opensource router software and make out about the same as an enterprise router for less than $1000.

 

[1610ftw]

5 hours ago, Snowleopard said:

Yeah, the wi-fi 7 routers on the market now start at $699 and go up to $2499, how on earth did routers get that expensive, you could build a mini tower with 2 quad port nics, one for inbound and one for outbound traffic with opensource router software and make out about the same as an enterprise router for less than $1000.

 

 

Looks to me like the Nvidia way of doing things, where both performance and price increase by the same percentage, no "free" intergenerational gains any more for customers!

 

To be fair this has been a trend in many areas of consumer electronics at least at the top end and it seems that customers have kind of gotten used to the top models in many categories getting ever more expensive.

[Snowleopard]

Ok, I am confused the Killer 1650 is what I pulled out of the x170 sm-g and I ordered the BE200NGW and NGW cards fit the x170-sm-g.

 

Did I miss something when ordering the new wi-fi card or will it fit as an "E" key card?

 

 

 

So it looks like it will take E/A or E key Wi-Fi cards and (I thought this was CPU dependent Intel CNVI cards also

[Snowleopard]

Has anyone tried this on their X170sm-g's? I cannot seem to get it to detect the fans and sensors.

https://getfancontrol.com/

[1610ftw]

On 12/22/2023 at 10:26 PM, Snowleopard said:

Ok, I am confused the Killer 1650 is what I pulled out of the x170 sm-g and I ordered the BE200NGW and NGW cards fit the x170-sm-g.

 

Did I miss something when ordering the new wi-fi card or will it fit as an "E" key card?

 

 

 

So it looks like it will take E/A or E key Wi-Fi cards and (I thought this was CPU dependent Intel CNVI cards also

 

Strongly doubt that will fit.

 

Just get the AX210 and be done with it. If you have W11 on your X170 you should also look into a 6E router if you are close enough to it when you need WiFi.

 

 

[Snowleopard]

1 hour ago, 1610ftw said:

 

Strongly doubt that will fit.

 

Just get the AX210 and be done with it. If you have W11 on your X170 you should also look into a 6E router if you are close enough to it when you need WiFi.

 

 

Installed the BE200NGW and it is working fine...... 160Ghz and 320Ghz Bands

[1610ftw]

Ah, I misread, thought that was the AX200.

Shame that all those superhigh 6E and 7 speeds as of now seem to be reserved for W11.

[Snowleopard]

4 hours ago, 1610ftw said:

Ah, I misread, thought that was the AX200.

Shame that all those superhigh 6E and 7 speeds as of now seem to be reserved for W11.

Well, I tried hacking the registry, apparently you can enable 6Ghz wi-fi through making some registry changes, but the 6Ghz  networks won't show up in the list of wi-fi networks.

Then I got serious about using NTLite to edit the ISO packages for windows, waited for 23H2 and spend a few hours here and there and after about 4 weeks messing with edited 23H2 ISO's settled on one with all the bloat from windows 11 removed or disabled and installed in on the computer as a fresh install.

 

[Snowleopard]

I saw a listing on amazon for the IETS GT600 , but its only a listing, nothing for sale yet and their website status hasn't changed at all. It must be vaporware.

[1610ftw]

On 12/31/2023 at 8:31 PM, Snowleopard said:

I saw a listing on amazon for the IETS GT600 , but its only a listing, nothing for sale yet and their website status hasn't changed at all. It must be vaporware.

 

This has been gong on for some time now, it is quite ridiculous.

 

Overall the CPU cooling of these Clevo units probably is the best even without liquid metal and adding a leaf blower as a cooler. I bought the SM-G from brother @electrosoft some time ago and that one has a fantastic CPU and very good heat dissipation with the stock heatsink. I just did a 30 minute CB R23 run (16357) with the CPU consuming up to 169W and the temperature never went over 86°C - that is VERY impressive and the best laptops today would maybe manage 125 to 135W with that temperature. That is also only about 4.5% below the best result for a single run so a very high output can be sustained for a very long time.

 

[Clamibot]

9 hours ago, 1610ftw said:

 

This has been gong on for some time now, it is quite ridiculous.

 

Overall the CPU cooling of these Clevo units probably is the best even without liquid metal and adding a leaf blower as a cooler. I bought the SM-G from brother @electrosoft some time ago and that one has a fantastic CPU and very good heat dissipation with the stock heatsink. I just did a 30 minute CB R23 run (16357) with the CPU consuming up to 169W and the temperature never went over 86°C - that is VERY impressive and the best laptops today would maybe manage 125 to 135W with that temperature. That is also only about 4.5% below the best result for a single run so a very high output can be sustained for a very long time.

 

 

Yup. Mine has liquid metal plus the zTecpc mods, so it can cool a little over 200W sustained without the CPU thermal throttling. I definitely need that as pushing the CPU to the max + DXVK Async is the only way I can sustain 144 FPS in Jedi Fallen Order.

 

This laptop is just awesome and it's a shame nobody has made a similar one ever since.

[electrosoft]

11 hours ago, 1610ftw said:

 

This has been gong on for some time now, it is quite ridiculous.

 

Overall the CPU cooling of these Clevo units probably is the best even without liquid metal and adding a leaf blower as a cooler. I bought the SM-G from brother @electrosoft some time ago and that one has a fantastic CPU and very good heat dissipation with the stock heatsink. I just did a 30 minute CB R23 run (16357) with the CPU consuming up to 169W and the temperature never went over 86°C - that is VERY impressive and the best laptops today would maybe manage 125 to 135W with that temperature. That is also only about 4.5% below the best result for a single run so a very high output can be sustained for a very long time.

 

 

That 10900k crushed all my other samples including my LTX Gold Edition and another 10900k rated at SP114. It runs so cool. Just a monster chip for the X170SM-G along with a brand new 2080 Super in there too! I wish Clevo would make another X170/P870 type chassis for 14th, 15th (future) or AM5. The problem would be MXM support for newest GPUs.

 

 

[1610ftw]

13 hours ago, electrosoft said:

 

That 10900k crushed all my other samples including my LTX Gold Edition and another 10900k rated at SP114. It runs so cool. Just a monster chip for the X170SM-G along with a brand new 2080 Super in there too! I wish Clevo would make another X170/P870 type chassis for 14th, 15th (future) or AM5. The problem would be MXM support for newest GPUs.

 

 

 

Yep, that is a very nice laptop, still very happy with it 🙂 

 

This is why socketed CPUs are so cool - you can look around and get a sample that is a lot better suited for laptops than others that can consume up to 30% more power at a given speed.

 

Both my golden samples allow for 5.1 GHz all cores with a moderate amount of power and with 4.8 to 4.9 GHz all core speed they are actually still in a very sustainable power and temperature range for laptops while still allowing 5.3 and 5.2 GHz single core speeds despite being undervolted.

 

With the current state of things if a manufacturer would offer a DTR 18" with a socketed laptop that would already be very cool if it was AM5 or alternatively 15th gen Intel. The important thing would be to have an upgrade path for one or two generations, something that we have not had since Clevo and MSI allowed for updates up to Coffee lake refresh.

 

As for the GPU we have to accept that it is not up to Notebook manufacturers so I would be OK with a soldered GPU as long as I do not have to get the top GPU to get a socketed CPU.

 

[Snowleopard]

On 1/3/2024 at 7:06 PM, 1610ftw said:

 

Yep, that is a very nice laptop, still very happy with it 🙂 

 

This is why socketed CPUs are so cool - you can look around and get a sample that is a lot better suited for laptops than others that can consume up to 30% more power at a given speed.

 

Both my golden samples allow for 5.1 GHz all cores with a moderate amount of power and with 4.8 to 4.9 GHz all core speed they are actually still in a very sustainable power and temperature range for laptops while still allowing 5.3 and 5.2 GHz single core speeds despite being undervolted.

 

With the current state of things if a manufacturer would offer a DTR 18" with a socketed laptop that would already be very cool if it was AM5 or alternatively 15th gen Intel. The important thing would be to have an upgrade path for one or two generations, something that we have not had since Clevo and MSI allowed for updates up to Coffee lake refresh.

 

As for the GPU we have to accept that it is not up to Notebook manufacturers so I would be OK with a soldered GPU as long as I do not have to get the top GPU to get a socketed CPU.

 

Where can I find binned CPU's if I want to try a different 10900K or 10900KF in my X-170?

[1610ftw]

1 hour ago, Snowleopard said:

Where can I find binned CPU's if I want to try a different 10900K or 10900KF in my X-170?

 

Not sure - with the 9900K for example I have tried to find a reasonably priced binned one for some time and then just picked the best of a bunch from a number of them that I got at random.

 

Might be easiest to first have a look of what you already have.

To get an idea you may for example have a look at how much power your 10900K draws with 5 GHz on all cores with sensible undervolting applied.

 

My really nice sample is seeing a peak draw of 180W after one CB23 run, that is with settings that are stable for everyday use but I have set my all core speed in everyday use to 4.8 as that is enough for me.

 

I measure the power consumption with Throttlestop as I also use that for undervolting and setting multipliers.

 

I also have a good 10850K from some superhero edition that needs about 200W to complete the same run so if you are at 200 or below that is probably already pretty good.

 

@Clamibot may have the best 10900K among us so maybe he can also give us a point of reference with regard to power consumption - if he can do 5.2GHz on all cores than he may have an even better sample as my 10900K cannot quite make it there although it is still running nicely at 5.1 Ghz all cores and a power consumption between 204 and 208W.

 

Oh and all of that is stock except for slightly improved air throughput via the ventilation grills and with no external cooling but with the fans at full speed and the back lifted by about 5 or 6cm. Temps for all of the tests  up to 5.1GHz stay at 89°C or below.

 

 

[Clamibot]

14 hours ago, 1610ftw said:

 

Not sure - with the 9900K for example I have tried to find a reasonably priced binned one for some time and then just picked the best of a bunch from a number of them that I got at random.

 

Might be easiest to first have a look of what you already have.

To get an idea you may for example have a look at how much power your 10900K draws with 5 GHz on all cores with sensible undervolting applied.

 

My really nice sample is seeing a peak draw of 180W after one CB23 run, that is with settings that are stable for everyday use but I have set my all core speed in everyday use to 4.8 as that is enough for me.

 

I measure the power consumption with Throttlestop as I also use that for undervolting and setting multipliers.

 

I also have a good 10850K from some superhero edition that needs about 200W to complete the same run so if you are at 200 or below that is probably already pretty good.

 

@Clamibot may have the best 10900K among us so maybe he can also give us a point of reference with regard to power consumption - if he can do 5.2GHz on all cores than he may have an even better sample as my 10900K cannot quite make it there although it is still running nicely at 5.1 Ghz all cores and a power consumption between 204 and 208W.

 

Oh and all of that is stock except for slightly improved air throughput via the ventilation grills and with no external cooling but with the fans at full speed and the back lifted by about 5 or 6cm. Temps for all of the tests  up to 5.1GHz stay at 89°C or below.

 

 

 

My 10900K in my X170 can do 5.2 GHz all cores while consuming around 215-220 watts of power. This is specifically when playing Jedi Fallen Order, a pretty CPU heavy game. Cinebench R15 runs make that spike up to around 245-250 watts.

For giggles, I did try to see exactly how far I could push it, and I can manage 5.3 GHz all core in Cinebench R15 with the power draw spiking to 275 watts at the maximum. The laptop's cooling system on the CPU side can't handle this for very long and therefore I have never been able to complete a full run at that speed. Pushing it any higher results in a crash. It won't go any higher, regardless of how low I get the temperature. The good news is the power delivery on this laptop is very robust, so if you can manage to cool the CPU and have an excellent sample, you can push it very far in this laptop.

 

I also acquired an even better sample from @Mr. Fox a while back that can do above 5.5 GHz all core as long as you keep the temperature below 60°C. Go any higher, and the system will crash regardless of how high you push the voltage. I did drop this sample in my X170 to see what it could do in a laptop, and that one did 5.4 GHz all core in Jedi Fallen Order at a slightly higher power draw (225 watts) as my first 10900K at 5.2 GHz all core (215-220 watts) in game.

 

I use this super sample in my desktop now with the Cooler Master Masterliquid ML 360 Sub Zero cooler. The highest speed I've been able to achieve on this CPU so far with the TEC cooler on full blast is 5.7 GHz on 4 cores, and 5.6 GHz all core during Cinebench R15 runs. I don't remember what the power draw was at that speed, so I need to go measure that again. I just remember overwhelming my cooler after a while, but these speeds are definitely sustainable indefinitely for games.

 

These are the results you can expect with super samples.

[1610ftw]

14 minutes ago, Clamibot said:

 

My 10900K in my X170 can do 5.2 GHz all cores while consuming around 215-220 watts of power. This is specifically when playing Jedi Fallen Order, a pretty CPU heavy game. Cinebench R15 runs make that spike up to around 245-250 watts.

For giggles, I did try to see exactly how far I could push it, and I can manage 5.3 GHz all core in Cinebench R15 with the power draw spiking to 275 watts at the maximum. The laptop's cooling system on the CPU side can't handle this for very long and therefore I have never been able to complete a full run at that speed. Pushing it any higher results in a crash. It won't go any higher, regardless of how low I get the temperature. The good news is the power delivery on this laptop is very robust, so if you can manage to cool the CPU and have an excellent sample, you can push it very far in this laptop.

 

I also acquired an even better sample from @Mr. Fox a while back that can do above 5.5 GHz all core as long as you keep the temperature below 60°C. Go any higher, and the system will crash regardless of how high you push the voltage. I did drop this sample in my X170 to see what it could do in a laptop, and that one did 5.4 GHz all core in Jedi Fallen Order at a slightly higher power draw (225 watts) as my first 10900K at 5.2 GHz all core (215-220 watts) in game.

 

I use this super sample in my desktop now with the Cooler Master Masterliquid ML 360 Sub Zero cooler. The highest speed I've been able to achieve on this CPU so far with the TEC cooler on full blast is 5.7 GHz on 4 cores, and 5.6 GHz all core during Cinebench R15 runs. I don't remember what the power draw was at that speed, so I need to go measure that again. I just remember overwhelming my cooler after a while, but these speeds are definitely sustainable indefinitely for games.

 

These are the results you can expect with super samples.

 

Cinebench R15 is a good test, I think I can complete it at about 215W power consumption with 5.2GGhz all core but I have to recheck. Not sure if more would be possible but my bios seems to have some kind of limit where I cannot really go above 220W sustained on the CPU anyway which is probably better for longevity...

 

Regarding that super sample it looks like it would give you approximately another 0.2GHz over your already very good sample in the laptop and another 0.2 to 0.3 GHz in your desktop system which at the high end is very impressive. To me I would be interested in using it at something like 5 GHz at lower fan speeds and therefore noise levels as it is really nice to be able to have high performance without the high fan noise that our laptops develop at full speed.

[1610ftw]

On 12/14/2022 at 10:06 PM, MaxxD said:

For me (many system updates), Obsidian (Full Licence) does not run very well, and although it is written on their website that they are focusing on something else, the software can be bought and downloaded... there is no Support, there is no response. A full program update would be recommended, because it is not recommended to buy! It used to work perfectly! A PremaBIOS for my machine would be nice! If anyone could help me with this, I would appreciate it!

/Warranty expired/

 

Any update appears but not installed yet (MS or nV Display update) then Obsidian "PC FAN Control" GPU FAN is "Disabled" and after the update it will be good again...

 

In "Control Station" (also Obsidian), the multipliers are set, then applied, but jumps back to the factory settings. (there was no problem with this before either) Drivers and everything properly installed, configured and set. The thing is quite suspicious of incompatibility! Instead of this, a PremaBIOS would be the best!

 

 

 

Quick question about the Obsidian fan control: Do you still use it and does it still work properly aside from the licensing / registration issues?

 

If that is the case it would be really cool if they would open it up and make it a free software.

That would of course be great for people who did not want to buy it but it is also more fair to paying customers for whom it is now essentially broken in cases like yours where you aren't getting any support when you have licensing issues and downtime without the software working. 

[Bidelloman]

I'm so tempted to get a 3080 for my x170sm...but still kinda worried it wouldn't work on it

[Snowleopard]

Yesterday I called Falcon to look at a DRX laptop,,,, Unfortunately the high end i9 is an HX mobile processor and I was like yeah, nope. I guess I will have to buy a pelican case and build a full tower in it with a car battery to make a new laptop if I want desktop power in a portable form factor.

[win32asmguy]

2 hours ago, Snowleopard said:

Yesterday I called Falcon to look at a DRX laptop,,,, Unfortunately the high end i9 is an HX mobile processor and I was like yeah, nope. I guess I will have to buy a pelican case and build a full tower in it with a car battery to make a new laptop if I want desktop power in a portable form factor.

 

Yeah the DRX is just a Clevo X370 with a BGA CPU and GPU. It (the X370) does not have a very good cooling system. Basically even with max fans and setting on a cooling pad it can only do 225W combined load and 100W CPU only. Installing over 32GB of memory also makes the problem even worse as it adds even more heat into the CPU/GPU area. Mine has had an issue where if the GPU reaches temps over 75C it causes the audio chip to malfunction as well so both the speakers and headphone output become distorted. The area around the keyboard can climb to over 50C while the bottom panel can reach 55C without any supplemental cooling from a laptop stand.

[Snowleopard]

X170sm-g watching youtube

[Clamibot]

On 1/26/2024 at 12:27 PM, win32asmguy said:

 

Yeah the DRX is just a Clevo X370 with a BGA CPU and GPU. It (the X370) does not have a very good cooling system. Basically even with max fans and setting on a cooling pad it can only do 225W combined load and 100W CPU only. Installing over 32GB of memory also makes the problem even worse as it adds even more heat into the CPU/GPU area. Mine has had an issue where if the GPU reaches temps over 75C it causes the audio chip to malfunction as well so both the speakers and headphone output become distorted. The area around the keyboard can climb to over 50C while the bottom panel can reach 55C without any supplemental cooling from a laptop stand.

 

That's really bad since the X170 can cool a 480 watt combined load indefinitely without thermal throttling. It pains me to see the build quality of laptops going down the toilet.

 

My X170 will definitely be my last laptop unless something good comes out again when I will eventually need a replacement. Fortunately the loss of laptops from my arsenal of computers isn't much of an issue nowadays since my needs and wants are better served by a desktop + PC gaming handheld setup these days. It would be nice to keep having laptops, but again, not a requirement for me anymore.

[electrosoft]

2 hours ago, Clamibot said:

 

That's really bad since the X170 can cool a 480 watt combined load indefinitely without thermal throttling. It pains me to see the build quality of laptops going down the toilet.

 

My X170 will definitely be my last laptop unless something good comes out again when I will eventually need a replacement. Fortunately the loss of laptops from my arsenal of computers isn't much of an issue nowadays since my needs and wants are better served by a desktop + PC gaming handheld setup these days. It would be nice to keep having laptops, but again, not a requirement for me anymore.

 

The problem is getting laptop makers to re-invest in large, thick bulky laptops and that's just not where the money is for them profits wise.

 

The NH55 was their attempt to address the true DTR crowd while appeasing the thinner and lighter audience and based on no other follow up models (including just releasing a slight revision with 13th and 14th gen support) it was the last nail in the coffin.

 

I fully tamed the NH55 so it is power limited not heat limited now with this 12900k and I won't be upgrading for some time unless a worthy model comes along. Like I mentioned elsewhere, I bought and returned the Asus G18 13900k HX 4080 twice to Best Buy as there's just nothing you can really do with it.....oh and Armory Crate garbage.

 

There's just no way to cram enough heatsink and thicker fans in these thinner and lighter chassis to support real hardware and mobile computing is close enough now the makers see no reason to go in that direction ever again.

 

 

[Snowleopard]

1 hour ago, electrosoft said:

 

The problem is getting laptop makers to re-invest in large, thick bulky laptops and that's just not where the money is for them profits wise.

 

The NH55 was their attempt to address the true DTR crowd while appeasing the thinner and lighter audience and based on no other follow up models (including just releasing a slight revision with 13th and 14th gen support) it was the last nail in the coffin.

 

I fully tamed the NH55 so it is power limited not heat limited now with this 12900k and I won't be upgrading for some time unless a worthy model comes along. Like I mentioned elsewhere, I bought and returned the Asus G18 13900k HX 4080 twice to Best Buy as there's just nothing you can really do with it.....oh and Armory Crate garbage.

 

There's just no way to cram enough heatsink and thicker fans in these thinner and lighter chassis to support real hardware and mobile computing is close enough now the makers see no reason to go in that direction ever again.

 

 

Have you seen the videos about the solid state coolers without fans? apparently they are scalable for things as small as smart phones to rack servers.