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Everything posted by Aaron44126
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M6600 with m290x/HD8970m
Aaron44126 replied to toastofman's topic in Pro Max & Precision Mobile Workstation
Yes, this is how it works as I understand it. Not quite sure why they went this way. I think that the LVDS port on the board is just 40 pins? Probably needed extra bandwidth for the 10-bits-per-color display output to the IPS panel. And again... Dell was limiting IPS panel / eDP configs to NVIDIA GPUs only when this system released. No idea if it will work with an AMD GPU at all. (I don't remember hearing a story of anyone trying it.) It might just be that AMD GPUs of the day didn't support 10-bit color output, so there was no point pairing one with the IPS panel. Assuming that the eDP port works with an AMD GPU, you could also attempt to fit a "standard" eDP display by using the M6700 "3D cable" which I mentioned before. It should be able to connect directly from the eDP port on the motherboard to the back of an eDP panel. (Note that if you're using the IPS panel then you also need to replace the display enclosure. The one holding the IPS panel is slightly "thicker" than the standard one. All of the needed parts are in the post that I linked above.) I know that using the eDP port unlocked additional GPU upgrade options on the Precision M6700. It works with, for example, Quadro P5000 which does not support LVDS.- 11 replies
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- dell precision m6600
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About Windows LTSC (Windows 10/11 Enterprise LTSC)
Aaron44126 replied to Aaron44126's topic in Windows
Just some notes. While you do have to pay up for a license for Windows 10 Enterprise LTSC (which I have been "promoting", along with others), you don't have to pay anything to move from Windows 11 to Windows 10 if you just use the same edition (Pro or Home or whatever). Microsoft allows downgrades. In fact, Windows 10 and Windows 11 product keys are cross-compatible and come from the same pool, so I think you should be able to activate one or the other without issue. ...Now, going this route would only be advisable for users who are comfortable doing a fresh Windows install, and of course there may be issues finding Windows 10 drivers for a system that shipped with Windows 11 if the OEM is not providing them. (...Not really a problem at the moment, with most systems, but this will get worse over time.) Getting media is not a problem. Microsoft makes it available for free. No, it's not all bad. I'd argue that Windows 10 brought its fair share of legitimate improvements. Serious display scaling improvements, as you mention. (As an aside, I'm not of the same opinion as @Mr. Fox here. I love the increased sharpness/definition/readability from high-DPI displays. I run 4K systems at 200% and I don't have any scaling issues that can't be worked around. Admittedly, I do occasionally have to change compatibility settings on a broken app to disable scaling. 200% is nice because you get straight-up pixel doubling and not "blurriness" if an app runs with scaling disabled.) Other improvements that come to mind are WSL, a very awesome feature for people using Windows who are familiar with Linux (developer types in particular). System-wide dark mode is nice. While Windows 11 launched without any real improvements other than the "fresh coat of paint", I would say, it's getting some more interesting things like Android app support and (finally) tabs for File Explorer. My problem with the direction of Windows basically focuses on the increasing pervasiveness of monetization features, treating ordinary users as "beta testers" by pushing out new builds and features before they have been through a proper QC process, and Microsoft's lack of commitment to feature stability (functionality changes are rolled up with security updates — you can't take one without the other, and that's not the way that things used to be). I go into all of this in more depth in my "The problem with Windows 11" post (link in sig).- 171 replies
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M6600 with m290x/HD8970m
Aaron44126 replied to toastofman's topic in Pro Max & Precision Mobile Workstation
M6600, like M6700, has separate eDP and LVDS connectors on the motherboard (right next to each other). There was an IPS panel option that uses the eDP connection. M6600 and M6700 used largely the same parts for the eDP panel hookup. (It does include an "interposer" between the motherboard and the panel, but it did connect to the eDP port on the motherboard and not the LVDS port.) This thread describes the parts needed to "upgrade" to an IPS panel configuration, but most of those parts are probably hard to find now. M6700 also had a 120 Hz "3D" panel option which also used the eDP connection on the board. That configuration came with a "3D cable" which is an eDP cable that you could use to attempt to mount a different eDP panel in the system (without an "interposer" or anything). It appears to be still available on eBay. I believe @TheQuentincc had it working with a standard 4K panel in the M6700 at one point, and demonstrated that (in the M6700) you can actually use both the LVDS and eDP connectors at the same time to drive two different displays. There are some unknowns with regards to the M6600. I believe that the IPS panel configuration required an NVIDIA GPU (in both M6600 and M6700), so you may or may not be able to make use of the eDP port with an AMD GPU. And since NVIDIA GPU upgrade options are limited(/nonexistent) for the M6600... kind of stuck with AMD. AMD supported LVDS in their MXM cards a little bit longer than NVIDIA did (IIRC). If you attempt to use the eDP port, you'll probably have to pull the coin-cell battery to reset the BIOS/NVRAM after connecting the eDP display before it will be functional. So, yeah. I'm not that up to speed on the AMD GPU options, so I'm not answering your question... but hopefully providing some context (for you or anyone else who happens across this thread).- 11 replies
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- dell precision m6600
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Checked this out a little more carefully and I ran into something odd. I started with the XPS 17, which is available to order now, but Dell is only offering up to 2TB for that system. So, on the Precision 5770 spec sheet, they list a 4TB option but it says "only with discrete graphics configuration". Why would a dGPU be required? Precision 5470 and 5570 sheets list a 4TB option without that stipulation. (Still unclear if these are "double-sided" NVMe drives or if they have some manufacturer that is making single-sided 4TB NVMe drives.)
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- dell precision 7770
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Many memory modules have lifetime or 10-year warranties. You might be able to get it replaced!
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Microsoft starts offering Windows 11 ARM VMs in Azure. (...But they still won't license Windows on ARM for individual purchase, or use in a local VM setup for use with i.e. VMware Workstation/Fusion, or Parallels on a M1 Mac.) https://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-brings-arm-support-to-azure-virtual-machines/ https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/blog/now-in-preview-azure-virtual-machines-with-ampere-altra-armbased-processors/
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I noticed that for the docks. There's not a new dual-connect dock for >200W power delivery to the laptop. (Maybe there is something yet to be announced with the Precision 7X70 systems.) But... For Precision 7770 we have... CPUs moving up a notch in TDP (45W→55W base TDP — not sure what Alder Lake HX boost power will look like but seems like it'll have to be higher than Tiger Lake H) GPUs moving up a notch in TGP (140W→165W boost TGP) ...A chassis that looks like it is made to support a three-fan cooling solution, or at the very least a significant increase in the rear fin stack surface area for better cooling. Honestly, I'll be a bit disappointed if the 7770 still ships with a 240W PSU (at least for high-end configs like Core i9 HX + RTX A5500). We already have stories of the 7760 GPU getting throttled with a dock attached that can (supposedly) deliver full power to the system. They may have decided that dock users just have to also have a separate power brick plugged in for now. (Still speculative. Not that much longer until we find out, though...)
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Note – Speculative, my “best guess” based generally on past patterns. Announcement in first half of May. Available to order in late May or early June. First batch of systems received by customers in July. Intel announcing Alder Lake HX is the next thing needed to get things moving. (Not really up to Dell. They can’t announce until Intel does.)
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RetroArch has save states built in. (F2 = save, F4 = load)
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I feel like I should ask for clarification on your first post here, regarding support for Intel Thread Director and Windows 10, as this was not the answer that I expected. To date, this is a feature that Microsoft has supported only on Windows 11. There have been hints that support might be backported to Windows 10 but there has been no public or even rumored/leaked comment from Microsoft on the matter, as far as I know. What we are referring to with Thread Director is Intel's dedicated hardware thread monitoring / scheduling assistant feature. (Here's a page that describes how it works.) (Windows 10 does have some awareness of "performance" vs. "efficiency" cores and will schedule threads accordingly, but it does not utilize information provided by Thread Director for scheduling.) So the question is, to clarify — does Dell have some way of getting Windows 10 and Thread Director working together? Or are you aware of Microsoft adding support for Thread Director on Windows 10 in the near future? As for "why someone would want to do this" — There are some compatibility issues with regards to the two different types of cores and certain workloads. Some games that have DRM protections would fail to run, because P cores and E cores have different CPU IDs and the DRM software would flip out about that. (I believe that these have all been patched by now.) The main issue now is that some software which runs CPU-intensive workloads in low-priority threads will have those threads inappropriately scheduled to run on the E cores only, hampering performance. @AL123 posted a link to a review that has a good discussion on this issue. Disabling the E cores is one way to solve this problem. (In my opinion, this would be a "last resort" type thing — there are other ways that it can be addressed.) Ideally, problematic software will be updated in short order to address this and then such workarounds will be unnecessary.
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RetroArch with the Snes9x core. RetroArch is nice because it basically separates out the front-end and back-end configuration for emulators. You can set up your display config and audio config and so forth once, and then use that with any number of emulators (NES, SNES, Genesis, PSX, N64, handhelds, ...). I do a fair amount of gaming via emulation, and I'm rather picky about smooth video (vsync, no frame drops, no tearing) and smooth audio (in sync with no pops) and RetroArch not only handles these things quite well, it removes the need to "figure it out all over again" when I want to add another platform to the mix. It's got a small learning curve to get into how custom configs work, but it works pretty well "out of the box". It also has a ton of "shaders" (visual filters) so you can pick if you'd like you games to look basic/pixely or if you'd like to try out a CRT filter to sort of bring it more in line with what things used to look like. https://www.retroarch.com/index.php?page=shaders It also integrates with RetroAchievements if you'd like to try classic games with achievements. (For SNES, bsnes has also been ported as a RetroArch core if you want a 100% accurate emulator. It has a higher performance cost and does not support RetroAchievements.)
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Which type of USB device do you use most often?
Aaron44126 replied to Sandy Bridge's topic in Components & Upgrades
Technically, you could plug a USB "type B" device like an external hard drive or a printer into a USB-A or USB-C port on your PC, you just need the appropriate cable. USB "type B" is just the device-side connection. The actual USB data protocol is the same no matter which type of connector you use. (...Well, USB-C adds some additional optional capabilities like multiple streams and DispalyPort support.) You can totally get cables with a USB-C connector on one end and standard USB type B or micro USB on the other end. So, yeah. I have a USB mice with a USB-A cable and that's the only USB device that's always plugged in. My personal laptop doesn't actually have any USB-C ports, but when I replace it in a few months, I'll have a few and I think that I'll get some cables needed to switch other devices that I plug in (i.e. Xbox game controller or external hard drives) over to USB-C... If only because USB-C is less hassle to deal with because you don't have to worry about which way you orient the cable when you plug it in! -
The only thing Xeon brought really brought over Core H series CPUs (in prior generations) was ECC memory support. Alder Lake general consumer CPUs support ECC memory (...if the chipset/PCH supports it...) so there is likely no need to release Xeons. On the desktop side, systems with a Core i5/i7/i9 Alder Lake CPU and the W680 chipset will support ECC memory. Not quite clear on the specifics of how this is going to work on the laptop side yet, but I am suspecting that Precision 7X70 will support ECC memory without requiring a Xeon, and there will actually be no Xeon option available.
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I have Sabrent Rocket Q 4TB in my work Precision 7560. It fits and works fine. I have seen reports that double-sided drives like this do not fit in XPS-style systems. I am not sure if that is still the case with the latest ones. (I think Dell is offering a 4TB option in Precision 5770? Who knows what model or if it is double-sided.)
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I've been wondering if this difference will be even greater on the mobile side where thermal/power limits are more in play to push down the max clock speed of the P cores. ... In another note, Sabrent Rocket Plus 8TB drives have just recently became available. This is a possible option for people who want a very high capacity NVMe drive. While 8TB drives have been available for a while now, this is the first TLC option, the first PCIe4 option, and it has 8192 GB capacity (instead of 8000 GB). And while it is definitely on the pricey side... It's still costs less than what Dell is asking for a 4TB. Preview
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Seems likely. You can do so on Dell desktops with Alder Lake. All Precision laptops I have used have a BIOS option to select how many cores are active. (You can still use Windows 10 with E cores enabled. The issue seems to be mostly having to do with low priority processes/threads getting locked to E cores only, which is a problem if they are also computationally intensive. Disabling E cores is one of a few different workaround options.)
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Yeah, this is not expected until Intel officially unveils the Alder Lake HX CPUs. If I had to guess, I’d say maybe another 4-6 weeks? (That’d be just until an announcement, not necessarily actual ordering.) I’ve sort of been figuring that my 7770 will arrive in July… Earlier would be a bonus, but I don’t see it being before June.
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Sounds like you can recover by removing the coin cell battery (resetting BIOS settings / NVRAM)? Too bad they put that in a ridiculously difficult to reach spot. It used to be accessible just by opening the laptop bottom cover... Anyway, the "bricking" described in the post is a bit different than what I experienced. I had the system blinking the keyboard backlight on and off every 15-20 seconds. It wouldn't stop until I disconnected the main battery. (Holding the power button down had no effect.)
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@Dell-Mano_G Thank you. I assume that means that all of these systems will have the choice to ship out with Windows 10 preinstalled?
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@Dell-Mano_G, since the systems have been announced now, can you comment on Dell's plans to support Windows 10 on newer model PCs?
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Spec sheets. https://www.delltechnologies.com/asset/en-us/products/workstations/technical-support/precision-3571-spec-sheet.pdf https://www.delltechnologies.com/asset/en-us/products/workstations/technical-support/precision-5470-spec-sheet.pdf https://www.delltechnologies.com/asset/en-us/products/workstations/technical-support/precision-5570-spec-sheet.pdf https://www.delltechnologies.com/asset/en-us/products/workstations/technical-support/precision-5770-spec-sheet.pdf (3570 doesn't seem to have the same URL structure, if it's even out there yet.) Anyway, 5770 shows Windows 10 as an option, but 5470 and 5570 do not. Maybe their plans to support Intel Arc make the difference? Spec sheets have been off before, too. We'll see what the options are when these become available to order. I was thinking about this recently too. By my count, they announced sixteen new models today across the Latitude and Precision lines. (Not to mention existing lines like XPS, Inspiron, etc... or Precision 7000 which has not refreshed yet.) For comparison, I hopped over to Apple and it looks like they have four laptop models on sale right now. I know Dell is trying to fill all of these different niches, and a broader range of niches than Apple at that, but it seems like they could consolidate some.
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Hello! Precision 3570 and 3571 announced. Also launching in April. https://www.notebookcheck.net/Dell-Precision-3570-and-Precision-3571-mobile-workstations-announced-with-Intel-Alder-Lake-and-latest-Nvidia-workstation-GPUs.611020.0.html 3570 has Alder Lake U and Alder Lake P CPU options (lower power limit than Alder Lake H), an RTX A500 GPU option, and 16:9 displays (768p through 4K). 3571 gets Alder Lake H and GPU choices are T600, A1000, and A2000. Found spec sheets for 3570 and 3571 as well. Windows 10 is listed, looks like users won't have to jump through hoops to manually install if they would prefer to use it. (Will be looking for Precision 5000 spec sheets in a bit...) [Edit] Looks like there has been no change to the keyboard in the Precision 357X (compared to Precision 7X50/7X60). It has the same issues with Home/End and PgUp/PgDn.
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I checked the current Precision 5760 and it does similarly force you into a dGPU configuration if you choose the i9 CPU. These systems have both the CPU and GPU soldered onto the motherboard, effectively making each CPU/GPU combination a different motherboard "part". They probably (understandably) want to reduce the number of different motherboard variations that they have to produce. ... I checked out the three new docks and all of them appear to be limited to <100W power delivery (power from the dock to the laptop).
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No real surprises in the Precision 5X70 line. Alder Lake H CPUs (up to i9-12900H, 6P+8E, which is available in all three systems) (No Xeon) GPU: 5770 gets RTX A2000 (8GB) or RTX A3000 (16GB) 5570 gets RTX A1000 (4GB) or RTX A2000 (8GB) 5470 gets RTX A1000 (4GB) (Integrated graphics only options also available; indication that Intel Arc GPUs will be available in at least the 5470, but at a later date.) Up to 64GB DDR5 RAM (in all three systems) (No explicit ECC... but DDR5 includes ECC as part of the spec, for addressing errors in storage but not errors during transmission.) 16:10 displays 5770, 5570 – FHD+, 4K+ 5470 – FHD+ or 2560×1600 All 60 Hz, 500 nits Thunderbolt 4 ports, SD card slot & 3.5mm audio Wi-Fi 6E, Bluetooth 5.2 130W PSU (not sure about 5470, but there is mention of 150W fast charging via USB-C) Battery: 5770 – Up to 97 Wh 5570 – Up to 86 Wh 5470 – Up to 73 Wh 5770 and 5570 look basically the same as the recently launched XPS 17 and XPS 15 systems, just with NVIDIA's "RTX A series" GPUs instead of GeForce GPUs; basically what we are used to from the Precision 5000 line. 5470 doesn't appear to have an XPS cousin, though, unless I am missing something? It is 14", and the soon-to-launch "XPS 13 Plus" has a chassis that is clearly different.
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To answer my own question, I found the press release RSS feed, which doesn't seem to catch "everything" they release but it does include the products from today. https://investors.delltechnologies.com/rss/news-releases.xml
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