Mr. Fox

Maybe my excitement about using the top X4 slot not ruining the motherboard caused me to speak too soon on bifurcation issues. Using the bottom PCIe slot with a PCIe card is definitely a no-go. GPU gets castrated to X8 if I do. It's fortunate that the top X4 slot allows me to use it or the Apex would be flat-out rejected as an unacceptable product. The AORUS Master still has it beat here. Gigabyte did it right. All three of the PCIe X16 slots can be populated without effing up the GPU lanes. So I have 9 NVMe installed in the Master without affecting the GPU and it looks like the Apex is going to limit me to 7. Same as the Gene except for the Gene runs the Sabrent card at X1. I'm going to try disabling USB4 in the BIOS and see if that changes anything with the PCIe bifurcation and lane distribution since I have no use for USB4. I am also going to test an X1 PCIe card in the bottom slot and see if it still kicks the GPU in the gonads. C'mon ASUS, pull your head out. If none of those tweaks works, then I'm going to put a dust plug in the bottom PCIe slot since will be viewed as worthless waste of motherboard space to me. Not sure why the idiots included it if it can't be used without pooping on the GPU.

OK Brother @jaybee83 I just installed the Apex. I have not updated the BIOS, just disabled TPM, Secure Boot, WiFi, BT. Left all of the CPU settings on Auto, manually set an 8400 memory overclock (not tuned, just set what I thought would work) and *BOOM* - it worked. This shipped with a pre-release BIOS so since it is dual BIOS I will leave that alone and try one of the recent uploads from Safedisk on the secondary BIOS chip. Also noticing no bifurcation issues. Sabrent NVMe Quad card running in top X4 slot and GPU is still X16. I am only using the upper Gen5 M.2 slot on the motherboard, both DIMM.2 and the Quad NVMe card. I left the other M.2 slots empty to avoid cutting the CPU back to X8. Time to hit the sack. Will see if tomorrow I can get some play time after celebrating Mother's Day with my best friend, Mrs. Fox. Next projects will be to delid the second 9950X and tune the memory and CPU overclock. @Papusan and @johnksss having a backplate didn't do anything for the bowed motherboard. It's bowed just like the Intel Apex and Apex Encore were. It wasn't flat until I mounted it to the chassis and bolted it down.

Nah, FE is not the Lexus of the industry. It's just a cult of people that love inferior products, like Alienware fanboys. 🤣 Congrats on the open box 9070 XT. UPS has the Apex on the truck. Supposed to be delivered between now and 8PM today. I will have to check out that Delta Mate block to see how she looks. Speaking of GPU blocks, I got the Alphacool CORE installed. It looks really good. Much more refined aesthetically than the Bykski block that has served me really well with the 4090 Suprim. It is much heavier than the Bykski block and brawnier in appearance. @johnksss the WireView does NOT fit with the CORE block. Not even almost. It is about a half inch short of being able to reach the connector socket on the GPU. So, now I have two WireView to sell. I'm going to miss it, but not the end of the world. Another thing I noticed after the fact is the switch to change between vBIOS chips is also covered up. If I were testing different vBIOSes still this would be a problem. I am not so I don't care. At least for the moment. Sorry for the low quality camera phone photos. My 5 year old phone camera does an amazing job of capturing dust and lint in photos, but not the finer details that one would want to capture. Too lazy to break out the DSLR for this, so these will have to do.

The "problem" with the Apex and many others is too many Gen5 M.2 slots and USB4 ports. This is a design choice and deliberate allocation of resources. Gen3 and Gen4 is fine for storage and hardly anyone benefits from Gen5 M.2 or USB4 on an overclocking-focused motherboard. It is a wasteful use of resources on things that shouldn't matter much. Thanks to the overrated and unnecessary PCIe 5.0 and USB4 rollout, now we generally have to choose between M.2 sockets and PCIe slots because there are not enough lanes to make everyone happy. I prefer to have usable PCIe slots over M.2 sockets because I can use the slots for whatever I want, whether it is for more M.2 or something else. Not being given a choice is the part that I object to. It is why the Taichi was installed less than an hour before I sent it back for a refund. Not being able to use a PCIe slot without halving the GPU slot bandwidth to X8 is unacceptable. The AORUS Master handled this the way I require, but that is unfortunately rare to find now. All of the motherboard development monkeys only know one way to do things and it is usually not the right way.

So, the X870E Apex is scheduled for delivery tomorrow. If it doesn't handle bifurcation on the PCIe slots the way I need it to then I will return it for a refund. I am pretty sure only one M.2 slot and DIMM.2 can be populated. Two of the motherboard M.2 slots must be ignored if you want PCIe X16 for the GPU. Same is true on the AORUS Master, but all of the slots can be used without gimping the GPU.

It is important to Micro$lop that all of our PCs are zombie machines that allow the Redmond Reprobates to monitor and control them and harvest data in whatever ways they deem appropriate. The machines that are not subject to their command and control ecosystem are non-compliant trash to them. They also loathe that these rogue machines are often owned by rebellious consumers that dare to defy them or bypass their mandates and edicts. And, this is precisely what makes the older PCs and properly deconfigured and overridden "features" on new machines come to be viewed as not trash to everyone else. It is also what makes a default Windoze dumpster fire installation a crappy piece of smelly trash OS to us. I say let them pucker up and plant a sloppy wet kiss on our collective unwashed bottoms. Nasty finger salute to them. May their future be bleak, their fortunes lost and their lanterns remain dim.

Please kill more CPUs to boost our sales.

It seems like this is not the first time I am hearing about A$$rock board killing Ryzen CPUs. I think their firmware team has made some mistakes causing it.

Welcome back. I was thinking about you the other day and wonder where you had gone. @jaybee83 I received final order confirmation on the X870E Apex. My payment processed with NewEgg and the price did not increase, so I did not cancel. It is in "packaging" stage now. I have to say that it is nice that the AMD Apex was not priced higher than an Intel Apex. It is the price I would have expected to pay for it, not inflated or even tariffed. Let's see how long this holds true since we already see the scalping happening on Amazon. Idiots armed with credit cards give these scumbags a reason to live by supporting their lives of crime.

If I end up with it and they don't pull any last-minute stunts I will for sure will share my findings, results and opinions. If it is does not sufficiently impress me within the first few days then it will go back for refund. If it is good enough to keep then I will sell the Gene on overclock.net. I suspect I can get what I paid for it, or close to it. It's definitely about to launch with the Asus webstore listing, showing up at Amazon for order and notifications on availability with trackers, etc. https://www.trackalacker.com/products/showcase/rog-crosshair-x870e-apex

Thanks. I like it obviously. My wife shields her eyes and says the white is too bright. It is difficult to get a true white out of PC lighting. Most of the time the white LEDs have a pale blue cast to them and a yellowed cast when shining through acrylics. The glass reservoir on the pump doesn't smudge the purity of the white light nearly as much. Mostly curiosity. Curiosity with respect to how many people disagree about the PCIe bifurcation, who is right and how many are wrong. Also, the rumors and speculation about CUDIMM support on the Apex, what is fact versus fiction. Curiosity about whether or not the 2-DIMM design will actually do more for AMD RAM speed and latency than it has seemed to before the Apex. I am not expecting to see as much magic in this area for an AM5 platform. I could be wrong. Curious if it will be better for overclocking than the Gene and which one I would like more, which one I would sell. The AORUS Master matches the Gene, so if the Apex cannot soundly beat it on performance and match it on intelligent PCIe bifurcation then the Apex is product only for losers and fanboys that love to frivolously waste their money on overrated products. Curiosity about what kind of shenanigans we will see with availability and the degree of scalping we will see. It is the most over-hyped motherboard launch I can remember since EVGA threatened status quo with an intent to jump into AMD-infested waters. If the order actually clears at $749 per the pre-order value I think I will have a product I can later sell for the new purchase price when I am done with it and never lose a penny. If NewEgg tries to reneg on the pre-order price it willl be cancelled. It is listed for the NewEgg price at Asus online store. https://rog.asus.com/us/motherboards/rog-crosshair/rog-crosshair-x870e-apex/

The insanity is contagious. Look at this joke. Talk about poor value... this is 5090-level retarded. $400 scalp on a product that hasn't even released yet. Find these people and exterminate them. I reinstated my $749 pre-order on NewEgg. Let's see if they try anything to extract more blood. https://www.amazon.com/ASUS-ROG-X870E-APEX-Motherboard/dp/B0F25LTGBN

While we worry about tariffs making PC parts and electronics unaffordable, this video shows a bigger picture and the strategy is working. What's interesting is that the US (Trump) is not the only nation executing this strategy. The USA is China's largest market and we are the greatest source of revenue for China, so China losing that... well. PC parts are not their primary export. Glad to see other countries taking similar steps against them. China was already in a state of recession with a real estate market collapse, so what better time to bring the pain for them than now? When they fall down, keep punching and kicking them... non-stop. Play the long game, not the quick fix.

I am really liking this build with the triple 360 rads. I did manage to shoehorn the IceMan dual D5 unit in front of the bottom radiator, so a total of three D5 pumps internally. I had to fabricate a mounting bracket from 2x2 aluminum angle to mount it to the chassis because the original bracket on the dual D5 was not designed for this orientation. So, the liquid path is from dual pump to GPU, GPU out to pump/res, from there to CPU inlet, from CPU outlet to top radiator in, top radiator to back radiator, back radiator (x-flow) to bottom radiator, then from bottom radiator into dual D5 block. GPU will get the coolest water. Brother @johnksss I also figured out how to easily switch between internal cooling to chiller without radiators. Note the QD3 fitting on the IceMan dual D5 inlet. I simply detach that, connect the chiller out line there and disconnect the QD fitting on the CPU block outlet to attach the chiller return line. This utilizes all three internal pumps without the radiators along with the single D5 mounted to the chiller body. Inline filters are on both pump block outlets to the GPU and CPU, so dual filtration to help keep trash out of the waterblocks. With all of this stuff on heavy-duty carts and 10 foot hoses on the chiller, I can use the chiller and wheel it over to the doorway with the exhaust blowing hot air out my door to heat the hallway instead of my office. Then, when I am done, just roll it all up and push it back against the wall when not using the chiller.

Definitely some truth to all that. The idea of rewarding bad behavior by supporting it still doesn't set well with me. The only way there is a chance that it will get better is if we can coordinate (conspire, boycott... whatever) to bring the pain and inflict retribution in a way that discourages the continuance of it. That will likely never happen because people don't think long-term and big picture. They only think about what they want right now, not what is best for them and certainly not what is best for everyone collectively. If enough of us were to commit to not purchasing any new NVIDIA GPUs and we drove their new GPU sales into the toilet to a catastrophic and severely alarming rate that is financially unsustainable the prices wouldn't stay so ludicrous. They'd be dumping stock to try to keep the lights on. This is what needs to happen. They need to be outsold by Arc and Radeon cards like a 5 to 1 ratio to get them to pull their heads out. A couple of quarters like that would produce the level of panic, frenetic anxiety and chaos that NVIDIA and their shareholders deserve. Here's to hoping 2025 brings financial catastrophy to them.

The allure of new PC component toys lives on and will likely never die, but the absurdly high non-scalper retail price I paid for the 4090 Suprim was already on the ragged edge of sanity. AI. Even the 4090 Gaming OC was a poor value at $500+ less. AI. So high, in fact, AI, that the pride and pleasure of ownership was greatly diminished by their ludicrous price tags. AI. The notion of spending an extra $1,000 or more for a 5090 makes me both sad and angry. AI. This is unrelated to any tariffs and absent any effect they may or may not be having; just (AI) a poor value overall and just not worth it. AI. The 50-series engineering flaws, scandalous performance limiting tactics, driver and functionality glitches we have witnessed would have pushed me over the edge. AI. I feel like I need to excuse myself from the table at this point. Sorry for the mindless use of "AI" but I guess that's how things are done now. AI. Mindlessness is the cornerstone of artificial intelligence.

Many of the Quadro cards have been a GeForce equivalent with some minor variances, but locked down with no voltage, core or memory clock modifications. I don't know if this overpriced "Pro" is like that or not. Has anyone been crazy enough to buy one and explore overclocking once they received it? The intended market is not one that cares about overclocking or gaming and it may not do either one as well.

💯 I cannot even come up with an intelligent or logic-based rationale for paying such grossly overblown prices for a 5090, so good luck with the rationale for that model. To be fair, I'd struggle to find an intelligent reason to buy one of those watches as well. The clock on my cell phone is free and works just as well. Plus it doesn't send a message to everyone that sees it that I am a legend in my own mind.

The PC tech freak show is all smoke and mirrors, snake oil and fake frames. They need to have a rude awakening and we need to treat them to a financial crisis unlike anything they have ever had to endure. And, while we are at it was can let them know our colons are not their personal sausage grinders.

It isn't AMD doing it. It is the retaillers doing it. If people are footloose and carefree enough to pay $2800 or more for 5090 it only makes sense that they would take advantage of the entire market in a similar manner. People buying 9070 XT either won't or can't pay that much for a 5090, or they are just AMD fanboys. They will have to be raped by the same predator, just not as hard and it won't hurt as bad. 1 was still in stock in Tustin at 10:00 PM local time.

The reason shunting works is because it deceives the GPU/firmware into believing it is pulling fewer watts than it actually is. Under full tilt load the GPU is pulling up to double what you see in GPU-Z or HWiNFO and I think you will find the WireView will confirm that. Voltage will also stay higher with the GPU pulling up twice the watts that it thinks it is using, although the voltage cap will not increase. It won't try to moderate itself because it has no idea what you're doing to it and won't attempt to decrease the voltage. Your software monitoring tools will become totally worthless with respect to GPU watts and show bogus information, but the core voltage reading should be as accurate as it was (or wasn't) prior to shunting.

Yeah, he is focusing on what matters most (family) and we probably won't see a KP card until next year at the soonest. He said as much. But, I think he could still drop them a few tidbits of useful information that would be actionable while they wait for him. For example, he could say something like "if you want to build a GPU that spanks everything else, just do A and B and you'll have something better than the cookie-cutter trash produced by your loser competitors."

Probably Vince's influence. If a PNY K|NGP|N 5090 (or 6090) drops I will be in. I'd feel like I was actually getting something worth having rather than paying a stupid price for an A$$zeus A$$troll 5090.

I buy everything from Thermal-Grizzly directly. They usually deliver from Germany in 3 to 5 days using FedEx or DHL. Did they send you the wrong one? ASUS uses the upside-down version. I believe they are the only ones and everyone else uses "normal" connections with the clip opposite the sense wire pins. ASUS have to be special (weirdos) and put the clip on the same side as the sense wire pins. I think their GPUs also burn more often than other brands, LOL. Nice you don't have to return it. Now you have a spare for either an ASUS or a normal GPU 12VHPWR connection. The opposite of what you need now, LOL.