Mr. Fox

It is the new standard of normalcy for computer tech to carry defects, suck in performance, lacking in features and/or value. Nothing is actually any good or legitimately priced based on actual value.

The notion of buying anything good from the Redmond Retards is totally ludicrous. They evidently lack the ability to do anything right. The alternative is that their stupidity is either deliberate and malicious or they are so stupid they have no idea how stupid they actually are. I intentionally avoid purchasing anything from them because I know whatever it is, it is going to be effed up.

This was a really interesting video from Jay.

And, unless you find a used 4090 for sale by someone with a shred of integrity left you'll pay 5090 FE MSRP for a used 4090, even more if you buy it from dishonest marketplace sellers on Amazon and NewEgg. Hell, you cannot even buy a 3090 Ti for less than a 4090 from a commercial source right now. The pricing of 3080 Ti, 3080, 7900 XTX and 6900/6950 XT are equally idiotic. Even the Arc B580 sells out immediately at prices routinely 30-50% higher than appropriate, sometimes even more inappropriate. The industry is off the rails insane. It's not because "companies are in business to make money" because they would make money selling the parts at their intended prices. It is due to their excessive greed, immorality and corruption. I hope you are right, but I am skeptical that it will correct and fear it will worsen. The world we live in is circling the drain in terms of decency and common sense, so we will have to wait and see how this shakes out. Again, I hope you are right and hope I am wrong. I am unable to drum up the optimism I once held about the things all of us have enjoyed for many years. I think we are seeing our hobby systematically destroyed by unscrupulous tech industry leaders. What is so idiotic about it is the more they hurt us the more they will ultimately hurt themselves. They might temporarily rake in a lot of money by defrauding the public, but their house of cards will eventually implode when they run out of stupid victims volunteering to be taken advantage of and we will all be left holding the bag. The losses for manufacturers. retailers and consumers will be massive and painful for all.

Will do. Thanks, brother.

You and I will have to disagree about Elon. We are good friends, so that is totally fine. We do not have to agree on everything. Musk is one of the rare business executives with his head screwed on straight. He has unleashed an attack on an evil empire of corruption, starting with their financial resources secretly funded by taxpayer money, and it is natural he will be hated and smeared by the media. He and Trump were both once the darlings of the liberal left because they thought they were allies in their war against decency and sanity. The problem is US and World News is misreported in our own country, so I can only imagine it is exponentially worse in other countries that have governments run by people who have even lower ethical standards and more corrupt leaders than we do. The mainstream "news" media across the globe is almost entirely fake and disinformation and carefully organized lies by a left-wing cartel run by utterly insane nutjobs that have an agenda that is detrimental for the world. People need to stop listening to any and all information that comes from syndicated "news" sources because almost all of it is false narrative. When people with common sense, traditional Judeo-Christian and traditional conservative family values occupy any executive leadership position in big business or big government they land on this cartel's hit list and the smear campaigns begin. Their onslaught of lies is endless. They are having an emotional breakdown right now because they have lost control of the narrative. Trump and Musk are making them all look like the retarded monkeys that all of them are. As Trump, Musk, Patel, Bondi, Gabbard and other members of Trump's integrity posse reveal more of their tricks, lies and fraud they will scream louder and louder because their sins are being revealed to the world and they may (hopefully) never recover from it. Some of them (not enough of them) will land in jail and their leftwing kingpins will probably continue the assassination attempts on Trump and other leaders of his administration because they are all fundamentally evil and have an evil agenda that has been seriously threatened for the first time in my lifetime.

All good ideas, but AMD isn't known for having good business sense. This manufacturing defect basically makes 5090 not only a poor value proposition monetarily, but also loses what very few benefits it offers over a 4090 in terms of performance. AMD needs to take advantage of this and strike while the iron it hot. But will they? Maybe. Probably not.

You are in our thoughts and prayers, brother. Your perspective is the right one.

We need to stop caring about things like GPUs. They don't matter in the grand scheme of things. Far more is at stake than our hobby. We need more than tariffs. That's not going far enough. We should ban all forms of trade with China, seize all assets owned by China in the US and its territories, ban import and sale of all products manufactured in China, ban all travel to and from China, block the sale and export of any and all products to China, including food and natural resources, revoke visas and begin deporting all Chinese Nationals. The China Threat | Federal Bureau of Investigation - Counterintelligence The counterintelligence and economic espionage efforts emanating from the government of China and the Chinese Communist Party are a grave threat to the economic well-being and democratic values of the United States. Confronting this threat is the FBI’s top counterintelligence priority. To be clear, the adversary is not the Chinese people or people of Chinese descent or heritage. The threat comes from the programs and policies pursued by an authoritarian government. The Chinese government is employing tactics that seek to influence lawmakers and public opinion to achieve policies that are more favorable to China. At the same time, the Chinese government is seeking to become the world’s greatest superpower through predatory lending and business practices, systematic theft of intellectual property, and brazen cyber intrusions. China’s efforts target businesses, academic institutions, researchers, lawmakers, and the general public and will require a whole-of-society response. The government and the private sector must commit to working together to better understand and counter the threat. “The greatest long-term threat to our nation’s information and intellectual property, and to our economic vitality, is the counterintelligence and economic espionage threat from China.” FBI Director Christopher Wray The Threat Posed by the Chinese Government and the Chinese Communist Party to the Economic and National Security of the United States China is the primary source of most of the problems facing the US and the world abroad. The destruction of their economic structure and their ability to be a participant in global trade is essential to the health and well-being of the world.

That is an EXCELLENT video that very accurately describes the insane scamming, collusion and fraud that is taking place. He is spot on and it is a scam of epic proportions. This criminal behavior is extending to all PC components now. The only way to stop this is to starve the pig to the brink of death. Dead scammers don't scam. Dead pigs don't squeal, but they both squirm before taking their last breath of life. China's ability to survive needs to become a matter of doubt for China and the rest of the world, and we need to take the next steps and remove any doubt by taking them out for good and returning them to third-world status with no ability to buy or sell anything, anywhere. They need to be forced into having focus all of their attention to working their rice patties or starving to death, with no help from the rest of the world. What matters is performance and value. But you can't find either one from Team Red or Team Green. AMD isn't focused on adding value or performance. They're only focused on NVIDIA in order to figure how badly they can get away with screwing their own fanboys. AMD GPU stock was shipped and ready to sell some time ago. It is collecting dust, just waiting so they can copy the unethical behavior of their competitor and maximize the price of their own trash. They don't care about their own brand or the people that buy their brand. Same as NVIDIA. From relevant starting point...

It really is terrible right now. I also have not paid a lot of attention, but started looking closer after seeing some of the drama around 50-series and it's really bad. I think it has actually gotten worse since launch and the few people that were able to buy a 5090 or 5080 at the "expected" price still got treated wrong with reliability and functionality problems, but now the prices seem to have skyrocketed to even higher levels of unreasonableness. And, no... I absolutely do not believe that tariffs are increasing the prices by 50% or more. I do believe that the tariffs are being used as an excuse to gouge consumers and increase profits in an unethical manner. They would be doing the same thing in the absense of tariffs. If these companies were honest they would show the prices before tariffs are added and be accountable for the amount they are trying to tack on for the actual tariffs. Do I think that inventory was held back to create artificial demand and allow them to use tariffs as a lame excuse to justify exhorbitant predator pricing? Yes, I do. They're all scum. And, the scummy price gouging is not exclusively 50-series. It's everything across the board now totally out of control and getting progressively worse over the past year. We saw if first with necessities like food and other things that have nothing whatsoever to do with tariffs, Trump or Elon. The only products priced to value are the things most people don't want or need, so they have priced the trash to sell.

We are starting to see more and more issues that suggest the 50 series was rushed and released prematurely, and some of these problems are unforgivable. The 5080 pricing, although too high, would be in line with 4090 pricing. The problem is that 5080 is a downgrade from 4090 performance and specs, while priced roughly the same. The price of 5090 is just unacceptable by every measurement on face value. It's only a minor upgrade over 4090 with an absolutely absurd $1,000+ premium attached to it. Paying a ton of extra money for a small upgrade is a price to value disparity that makes no sense for anyone that has any sense. When you step back and look at everything it is totally ridiculous. Beyond not being exciting, I think it is something everyone should be very unhappy or even angry about it. It is blantant shafting to be totally blunt about it. There is no way in hell it costs such a substantially higher amount than a 5080 to manufacture a 5090. Certainly not $800 - $1500 more depending on what brand of crookedness is your favorite. As you make your way down the product stack to the mundane options like 5070 Ti price to value proposition does not improve. Anyone that doesn't see this as getting screwed over royally just isn't playing with a full deck or they are such a fanboy that they have lost their ability to think rationally and objectively. The problem is bigger than simple greed. It is a deliberately crafted scam that can only be viewed as an ethical failure. What I hope happens is that NVIDIA ends up taking a financial blood bath on this, but I fear there are too many stupid people that handle their financial affairs in a careless and scatterbrained manner to let them fail. They deserve to lose a fortune and incur devastating losses on this totally botched product launch and I hope that they get what they deserve.

Now just is not a good time to spend money on computer stuff. Everything is a poor value, much of what is being sold is garbage and the desirable parts are either not available or marked up 50 to 100% more than their actual value, and marked up more than that with scalper scum. It is happening only because people buying at those crazy jacked up prices are cooperating and allowing themselves to get screwed. Everyone is in business to make money, but not all businesses are on a mission to screw everyone dumb enough to go along with their price gouging program. Businesses that take it up a notch or two and charge the maximum amount that stupid people are willing to pay do not deserve to remain in business. The world would be a better place without them and the stupid people they call customers. I could easily sell either of my 4090s for more than what I paid for them, but I wouldn't have enough money to buy something equal or better. I'd have to add more money or downgrade, or both add money and downgrade.

Did Microcenter have it priced correctly(under $800) or are they selling it for 5080 MSRP prices since everyone is selling 5080 for at or above 5090 MSRP price?

Looks like they are going to try to cram a 5070 Ti up everyone's tailpipes. It seems like an inordinately aggressive marketing campaign is playing out for something that isn't very special. For many that will be a big upgrade over whatever antiquated or under-spec'd low budget setup they are updating. But, it just feels kind of scummy that the middle-ground mediocre belly-button mama's boy GPU is sucking all of the air out of the room.

I think NVIDIA may be self-inflicting more damage than they might have ever imagined. AMD will gain market share selling inferior products that people will begin buying for no reason than they are sick and tired of being ripped off and scammed. I am even leaning that way now. I have hated every AMD video card that I have owned, but right now I feel like I hate NVIDIA as a company as much or more. I am skeptical that AMD will ever make a good GPU that I would genuinely like and be glad that I bought, but there is a decent chance that I will join millions of others in doing our tiny parts to contribute to the effort of bringing long-lasting financial harm to NVIDIA by purchasing an AMD video card next time. Whatever bad happens to NVIDIA will be a matter of their own devices and more than deserved. It won't have anything to do with AMD apart from being a 'not NVIDIA' GPU. Right place, right time. I honestly do not believe VR support would matter for Intel because it mostly does not matter to most people. Despite being pushed hard at gamers for a very long time, (for many years,) interest has never really taken off. This is a smaller niche and more of a novelty than even overclocking. Too many find it too expensive, unnecessary, inconvenient, and the participants look like dorks to anyone watching them use it. I am not being critical of it, just explaining why I do not believe it matters to most people in the grand scheme of things.

On top of the huge list of other reasons that need not even be mentioned, this unfortunate reality pretty much ruins the slightest chance that anything of special interest will ever surface. The overwhelming emphasis on producing petite, lightweight trashbooks is extremely repulsive to me. It's very unfortunate the industry have chosen to pursue form factors that more or less eliminate any opportunity for them to produce something that is even a little bit special by my measurements. Sad days for PC tech no matter what direction one looks.

Looks like you had some help from AI on the wording of your post. 🤣 It seems like that is happening to me more and more, and I'm not liking it even a little bit. I have actually watched Google change something I typed even though I have all that crap disabled. No, it does not matter and I do not find it desirable, but I was curious why it is priced about 1/3 less than normal. Something seems off with it being so much cheaper than normal. Hopefully it is coming from a trusted retailer and not a scam.

That seems cheaper than normal. Where did you find it that cheap? Isn't that like 1/3 less than typical for that model and spec? Usually $3K+ for that. Hardware, power and thermal limitations, and disposable soldered filth excluded, the biggest issue with laptops is horrible, locked-down firmware that leaves you with muted performance and no way of correcting the issues. The CPU will likely not deliver but about half the performance of what it is capable of and the memory will likely be sloppy loose timings, high latency and uncorrectable due to no tuning options.

I would recommend P5000. Unfortunately, it's not overclockable, but it has 16GB of VRAM. Mine plays BF2024, COD and other AAA titles just fine.

If you look at the price of leftover stock, refurbished and used, they have not normalized and obsolete products are priced at or above MSRP for the current generation equivalent. The price of the desirable models have increased over time. The only prices that seem to be falling are for e-waste GPUs that are too old and anemic to be taken seriously. I think the world as we know it is changing and the only rules that apply now are the ones that do not make sense.