*Official Benchmark Thread* - Post it here or it didn't happen :D

[electrosoft]

12 minutes ago, Mr. Fox said:

After I read your post I expected to find him on one of his childish, irrational, bipolar emo-Nazi potty-mouth meltdowns that have made it so difficult to respect him as a subject matter expert; but, this was a really good video and he communicated in a way that made him seem like an authority with an occassional teenager-grade unprofessional vulgar expression. The video is spot. DDR5 is just another gimmick/scam designed to make money and stop consumers from reusing their old parts across so many generations that the hardware manufacturers can't get richer. DDR5 is to memory benchmarks was the conceptual equivalent to RAM caching was to storage benchmarks.

Hopefully this won't be another sucky enthusiast wannabe example of a cookie-cutter sheeple metachurch product that performs well stock, but sucks at overclocking. And, hopefully it won't have the same reliability/stability issues and USB malfunction problems like Ryzen 9. What excites me even more is the anticipation of what kind of answer Intel is going to have for it. It's wonderful having the force of competition in play here again. AMD's progress is a win for everyone, including people that won't ever buy their brand.

 

Yeah, I very much enjoyed Jufe's last video and it has been my conclusion too all along. If you can get a decent IMC, decent memory and a decent motherboard that can handle 4000+, you're pretty much good to go. Get your latency to ~46ms or lower, bandwidth to ~65k (all in G1) or higher and you will have to go that extra mile to extract better gaming performance out of DDR4 and DDR5 and as seen it is some serious extremes but this has been par for the course for all new memories compared to refined previous iterations (IE DDR vs DDR2 vs DDR3 vs DDR4). Eventually DDR5 will reign supreme across the board in all aspects. It will just take some time.

 

I do have an EVGA Z690 Classified sitting on the shelf I ordered a few weeks back as they now toss in another free keyboard and their wireless mouse and associates code still works so $285 for the whole bundle. I was planning to wait for 13th gen to pick up a 13900k to mix and match between my Strix Z690 which does even 4200 G1 DDR4 and yjr Classified Z690 and some Hynix DDR5 sticks I picked up over on the overclock forums to play with but i'm also keeping an eye on the Ryzen launch to see what AMD brings to the table too. I have such a sour taste in my mouth over those USB issues and AMD neutering Ageisa with subsequent releases for overclocking where I ended up just abandoning their neutered PBO and clock offsets and just went traditional for consistent clocks across the board so we will see.

 

 

 

 

[Mr. Fox]

53 minutes ago, electrosoft said:

I have such a sour taste in my mouth over those USB issues and AMD neutering Ageisa with subsequent releases for overclocking where I ended up just abandoning their neutered PBO and clock offsets and just went traditional for consistent clocks across the board so we will see.

Yes, same. They almost regained my confidence, but the foul-tasting Ryzen 9 ownership experience hasn't left my mouth yet in spite of proper oral hygiene, and it re-revealed the folly of my naturally optimistic and forgiving nature. I guess it is fortunate for all of us that forgiveness is never earned or deserved or we'd all be irreversibly hellbound.

 

The most dangerous part of it is how the Team Red fanboyz go out of their way to say nice things and pretend the engineering flaws and design defects are imaginary. PBO overclocking is a joke, but you'd think it was something special the way the Kool-Aid drinkers embraced it. It caused me to lose more respect for the fanboyz than it did AMD to be honest. Nothing they say can be accepted as true or accurate because they're impaired by their intoxication on the red Kool-Aid.

 

"Stupid is as stupid does."

- Forrest Gump

 

 

[Mr. Fox]

22 hours ago, jaybee83 said:

soooooo tell me: if you ever give up on PC hardware n benching as a hobby, what would be the next best thing? somehow i cant imagine @Mr. Fox doing pottery or gardening instead (especially in the arizona desert lulz). how about joining a motorcycle gang or maybe switch to desert buggies including tinkering with the gear yourself 😁 definitely something along the lines of a grease head hahaha

It is hard for me to imagine. It used to be cars and motorcycles before computers, but I honestly do not see that happening. For one, it is far too expensive and frivolous for me to entertain the idea. I was with them the way I am now with computers and I do not have the financial resources needed to do that on a level I would find scintillating.

 

Secondarily, I have mostly lost interest. In part, due to the way tree-huggers ruin everything with a modern hoax which has become their religion. They've poisoned the minds of our kids and their imaginary crisis has been embraced by millions of people that forego facts in favor of a cause to fill a godless void in their hearts.

 

A former passion that I would be more likely to devote a renewed passion for is guns. Here again, goofballs destroy everything desirable with their false religion. The viability of that endeavor remains in the hands of traitors holding public office and their church of misguided sheeple. If the woke  twenty-first century Ameri-Nazi agenda continues to erode our Constitutional way of life, that option will be off limits too.

[tps3443]

1 hour ago, Mr. Fox said:

It is hard for me to imagine. It used to be cars and motorcycles before computers, but I honestly do not see that happening. For one, it is far too expensive and frivolous for me to entertain the idea. I was with them the way I am now with computers and I do not have the financial resources needed to do that on a level I would find scintillating.

 

Secondarily, I have mostly lost interest. In part, due to the way tree-huggers ruin everything with a modern hoax which has become their religion. They've poisoned the minds of our kids and their imaginary crisis has been embraced by millions of people that forego facts in favor of a cause to fill a godless void in their hearts.

 

A former passion that I would be more likely to devote a renewed passion for is guns. Here again, goofballs destroy everything desirable with their false religion. The viability of that endeavor remains in the hands of traitors holding public office and their church of misguided sheeple. If the woke  twenty-first century Ameri-Nazi agenda continues to erode our Constitutional way of life, that option will be off limits too.

I try to keep a few hobbies alive. But cars are too expensive for me. Motorcycles are a little more reasonable, which is why I go that route. My mind set is, I can have super car like lambo or Ferrari performance for something that’s about $10,000+ brand new. But then of course upgrading it is also super expensive, because they too are restricted and gimped from the factory just like computer parts. We’ve got to reflash the ECU’s due to manufacturers literally neutering these poor engines stock fueling to maintain some new and very strict tree hugger Euro emissions which drastically hurts peak HP/TQ. Super Heavy steel exhaust systems with Catalytic converters and O2 sensors on machines that don’t actually have to pass emissions in my own state and numerous other states is also pretty stupid. Why do I want a catalytic converter and O2 sensor when it doesn’t even have to pass emissions? So far I’ve removed all of the factory exhaust on my current motorcycle it shaved 25 pounds and gained a lot of HP. The titanium headers and exhaust is also beautiful as it changes colors over time and gives a nice gold, blue, purple. It’s beautiful! If I could have a house built with titanium and carbon fiber I’d do it! LOL. One can dream! 

 

If you like guns, maybe consider getting in to 22LR pistols and suppressors. It’s a very cheap gateway in to SO MUCH fun. You can shoot in the back yard at 2AM if you like LOL. They have some suppressors now that read lower dB noise levels than dry firing the same gun with no ammo.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Reciever]

There is kool-aid for all stripes, each have their failings.

 

Intel held things back for a decade, AMD tries to position itself as the crown when its not, Nvidia comes with baggage from the top and the loss of a prized AIB because they prefer to act like Apple.

 

 

[electrosoft]

18 minutes ago, Reciever said:

There is kool-aid for all stripes, each have their failings.

 

This across all spectrums....

 

 

18 minutes ago, Reciever said:

Intel held things back for a decade, AMD tries to position itself as the crown when its not, Nvidia comes with baggage from the top and the loss of a prized AIB because they prefer to act like Apple.

 

AMDs greatest contribution is forcing Intel and Nvidia to innovate and not hold back products and punish the market with trickled releases at cyclic inflated costs...

 

Here's hoping their GPUs bring the high heat this time. Their leaked CPU scores are looking decidedly meh...single core is lacking and multi-core is less than I expected:

 

[Reciever]

3 minutes ago, electrosoft said:

 

This across all spectrums....

 

 

 

AMDs greatest contribution is forcing Intel and Nvidia to innovate and not hold back products and punish the market with trickled releases at cyclic inflated costs...

 

Here's hoping their GPUs bring the high heat this time. Their leaked CPU scores are looking decidedly meh...single core is lacking and multi-core is less than I expected:

 

 

My thoughts as well.

 

That all being said its easy to look at AMD as the underdog story considering where they are coming from performance wise but that hardship was a result of their own decisions at the time.

 

Im interested in AMD's next move mostly for how screwed we could be lol

 

Intel is hopefully going to stick to their guns and keep investing into the GPU space. Keep hearing about how their done but that all seemed to be second hand.

[jaybee83]

6 hours ago, cylix said:

Zotac 4090 just appeared at caseking at a whopping 2250 euros 😑@jaybee83

 

crap...about 150€ more than i expected / was hoping for. then again, some other shop in Spain listed the same card for 2050, so theres still hope....besides, still early! we still got 2.5 more weeks to go! fingers crossed! thanks for the headsup btw 🙂 

 

24 minutes ago, electrosoft said:

 

This across all spectrums....

 

 

 

AMDs greatest contribution is forcing Intel and Nvidia to innovate and not hold back products and punish the market with trickled releases at cyclic inflated costs...

 

Here's hoping their GPUs bring the high heat this time. Their leaked CPU scores are looking decidedly meh...single core is lacking and multi-core is less than I expected:

 

 

first up: no fanboy here, ive had both intel/amd cpus and nvidia/amd gpus going to whatever camp offers the best deal for my needs and wants.

 

that being said.... what exactly is "meh" about almost 30% more single thread performance and 25-42% more multi thread performance inside a single cpu gen? those kinda jumps we usually only see on the gpu side. look back a few years and this wouldve been unheard of! this kind of perf progression is basically what we got back in the Sandy Bridge days, only now we get these kinda jumps from BOTH intel and AMD! seriously, whats not to like about this? 

[electrosoft]

10 minutes ago, jaybee83 said:

 

crap...about 150€ more than i expected / was hoping for. then again, some other shop in Spain listed the same card for 2050, so theres still hope....besides, still early! we still got 2.5 more weeks to go! fingers crossed! thanks for the headsup btw 🙂 

 

 

first up: no fanboy here, ive had both intel/amd cpus and nvidia/amd gpus going to whatever camp offers the best deal for my needs and wants.

 

that being said.... what exactly is "meh" about almost 30% more single thread performance and 25-42% more multi thread performance inside a single cpu gen? those kinda jumps we usually only see on the gpu side. look back a few years and this wouldve been unheard of! this kind of perf progression is basically what we got back in the Sandy Bridge days, only now we get these kinda jumps from BOTH intel and AMD! seriously, whats not to like about this? 

 

When someone says not a fanboi that means they're a fanboi..... (zing!) 🤣

 

Who said I didn't like it? I'm loving it but can always want and expect more of a response overall.

 

I was hoping to see them do more than basically match Alderlake at best. 12900ks still rules the roost for single at stock vs the 7950x. If you're talking gains over the 5000 series then definitely. It is a worthy successor but I had already said Intel would retain the single core lead and that's exactly what they are going to do.

 

Full fat 16 core vs 8 + 16 hybrid mess I wanted to see more too. Architecturally though I prefer a proper full fat 16 core design vs 8 + 16 "we can't control the thermonuclear" approach but the fact Intel can tack on 8 more cores, add more cache, refine the process and still continue to compete against AMD's brand new architecture answer to Alderlake leaves me a bit meh.

 

On the other hand, knowing X3D is in the pipeline stacked on top of these nice improvements those should be monsters for cache sensitive (games basically) uses after seeing what the 5800X3D brought to the table.

 

Looking forward to the real reviews though but at least it is competitive. If AMD brings the high heat with their GPUs a full AMD buildout would be a viable alternative IMHO.

 

I won't be buying any new "new" hardware till everything is released and the dust settles and we get an idea of what seems the most fun / makes the most sense. I still have my master plan to get an NH55 and plop this 12900k in it. What I end up with after that? We will see.

 

Since you're going AMD, it will be nice to see some other numbers popping up in this thread. I liked it on the old forums when there were at least 2-3 of us with modern AMD hardware (myself, @Mr. Fox and @Rage Set) to toss in benchmarks and data for comparison.

 

 

 

 

 

[Papusan]

2 hours ago, electrosoft said:

 

This across all spectrums....

 

 

 

AMDs greatest contribution is forcing Intel and Nvidia to innovate and not hold back products and punish the market with trickled releases at cyclic inflated costs...

 

Here's hoping their GPUs bring the high heat this time. Their leaked CPU scores are looking decidedly meh...single core is lacking and multi-core is less than I expected:

 

It's weirdo/suspicious that both Intel and AMD follow so close each other with performance uplift. And AMD use an total different node shrink/arc vs Intel. They still manage to get about same performance from their top chips. Whom follow who, I don't know. But stock scores from the new gen AMD Ryzen isn't very enticing as I see it from my view of point. This is bare minimum from what to expect when you have competition. Damn Intel who continue with more and more baby cores. But this is to be expected due power goes bananas because of Intel 7 10nm++++++++++. 14nm up again but in new clothes. As well (an bigger die for more real cores will be too expensive to be made/used - due same 10nm+++++++++ problem)

The Emperor's Intel's New Clothes - Wikipedia

 

 

1 hour ago, jaybee83 said:

.... what exactly is "meh" about almost 30% more single thread performance and 25-42% more multi thread performance inside a single cpu gen? 

 

[Ashtrix]

33 minutes ago, Papusan said:

It's weirdo/suspicious that both Intel and AMD follow so close each other with performance uplift. And AMD use an total different node shrink/arc vs Intel. They still manage to get about same performance from their top chips. Whom follow who, I don't know. But stock scores from the new gen AMD Ryzen isn't very enticing as I see it from my view of point. This is bare minimum from what to expect when you have competition. Damn Intel who continue with more and more baby cores. But this is to be expected due power goes bananas because of Intel 7 10nm++++++++++. 14nm up again but in new clothes.

The Emperor's Intel's New Clothes - Wikipedia

 

 

 

 

I think to be fair. Intel 7 a.k.a Intel 10nm is very dense vs TSMC 7N node, look at the below chart 10nm is same as 7nm ofc because Intel renamed them esp how bad rep Intel got for almost a decade of 10nm delay they just do not want that name associated with them anymore probably lol.

 

I think It's not great for other products like TSMC factory where almost everyone wants to make their chips because Intel probably still makes their nodes only for their processors. Maybe that's why Intel ARC is not made on that node and instead done on TSMC N6.

 

 

Coming to AMD side, remember how Ryzen 5000 were running at 1.4v ? insane high voltage on all Ryzen 5000 for under 5GHz clocks. No wonder the damn IO Die was crapping out with BS issues and lot of drama with that stability as well. 5800X3D though is 1.3v fixed.

 

Ryzen 7000 is now is running at 1.2v, much higher frequency that too, 5GHz+ boost clocks. Because TSMC 5N (High Performance Custom 5N for AMD to be precise). I think that's a real improvement from AMD side to be honest. But for OC ? I doubt they are going to change anything. Their CPUs still might be needing that PBO2 with XFR and cannot lock a high Clock like Intel processors so worse for OC and Manual tuning. Time will tell though, esp that 5.7GHz boost clock on Ryzen 7000 parts.

 

Intel will move to their Intel 4 in 2023, unlike 14nm++++++ era they cannot do that anymore now damn that Intel they butchered Rocket Lake on purpose. I wonder if they plan to launch Meteor Lake with Z890 Chipset again or not. It's too frequent if you ask me, every year new motherboard and new processor lol...Also wonder about AMD Zen 4 X3D too, maybe they both will release.

 

 

[Mr. Fox]

3 hours ago, tps3443 said:

I try to keep a few hobbies alive. But cars are too expensive for me. Motorcycles are a little more reasonable, which is why I go that route. My mind set is, I can have super car like lambo or Ferrari performance for something that’s about $10,000+ brand new. But then of course upgrading it is also super expensive, because they too are restricted and gimped from the factory just like computer parts. We’ve got to reflash the ECU’s due to manufacturers literally neutering these poor engines stock fueling to maintain some new and very strict tree hugger Euro emissions which drastically hurts peak HP/TQ. Super Heavy steel exhaust systems with Catalytic converters and O2 sensors on machines that don’t actually have to pass emissions in my own state and numerous other states is also pretty stupid. Why do I want a catalytic converter and O2 sensor when it doesn’t even have to pass emissions? So far I’ve removed all of the factory exhaust on my current motorcycle it shaved 25 pounds and gained a lot of HP. The titanium headers and exhaust is also beautiful as it changes colors over time and gives a nice gold, blue, purple. It’s beautiful! If I could have a house built with titanium and carbon fiber I’d do it! LOL. One can dream! 

 

If you like guns, maybe consider getting in to 22LR pistols and suppressors. It’s a very cheap gateway in to SO MUCH fun. You can shoot in the back yard at 2AM if you like LOL. They have some suppressors now that read lower dB noise levels than dry firing the same gun with no ammo.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Yes, I was raised in a household where firearm ownership was an essential way of life and as normal as breathing air. We always had a least a dozen different rifles in our gun display case, and we used them all, all the time. My younger brother is still into it in a big way. He owns several dozen rifles and pistols, some antiques he has restore and others modern. He custom manufactures firearms from raw materials in his home garage machine shop, and has his Class 3 dealer license. Up until my mid-20's I had all sorts of rifles and a few handguns. One of my favorites was a Ruger 10-22 with a folding stock, pistol grip, barrel shroud. I had both 30- and 50-round magazines for it and converted it to full auto. It was fun and cheap to enjoy. I typically ran 500 to 1000 round through it every weekend. We owned about 50 acres where I lived and we didn't have to find a place to shoot for fun or hunting. Military-style weapons were always our favorite and my brother is very much into sniper rifles and massive handguns, like 500 nitro. I will probably end up going with something from KelTec, but whatever I do it will be via private party sales so I don't end up on a government control freak gun confiscation list. When we started raising a family and living in the city, I lost interest (lack of use) and didn't have the time for it. I am not a hunter (or fisherman) and don't enjoy that aspect of it, and my brother is both of those things.

 

I can't own motorcycles like that because I do not have the self-control, or the desire to find self-control, to behave in a socially acceptable manner when I get on one of them. I find it difficult to enjoy them if I can run them wide open on the highway and hotrod them between traffic lights. The power and noise are addicting and it is a different world now than it was back then. Instead of getting a ticket, you might go to jail or get shot by a rookie cop that is scared you are strung out on drugs rather than just having fun. (I often ran my bikes and cars with open headers and even that has potential to get you in big trouble today.) As a teenager and young adult, I was constantly in trouble for bad (but very fun) behavior with my streetrods and motorcycles. Age doesn't cure that kind of sickness, and when you have it you don't want to be cured.

 

Part of the allure of high performance PC ownership for me has always been the fact that I can be as wild and crazy as I want to be and not incur fines, become uninsurable or go to jail for being wild and crazy.

 

2 hours ago, electrosoft said:

AMDs greatest contribution is forcing Intel and Nvidia to innovate and not hold back products and punish the market with trickled releases at cyclic inflated costs...

Yes, I totally agree with that. Anyone that doesn't recognize that as a contribution isn't paying attention. It is valuable to all, whether they purchase AMD products or not.

[jaybee83]

11 hours ago, electrosoft said:

 

When someone says not a fanboi that means they're a fanboi..... (zing!) 🤣

 

Who said I didn't like it? I'm loving it but can always want and expect more of a response overall.

 

I was hoping to see them do more than basically match Alderlake at best. 12900ks still rules the roost for single at stock vs the 7950x. If you're talking gains over the 5000 series then definitely. It is a worthy successor but I had already said Intel would retain the single core lead and that's exactly what they are going to do.

 

Full fat 16 core vs 8 + 16 hybrid mess I wanted to see more too. Architecturally though I prefer a proper full fat 16 core design vs 8 + 16 "we can't control the thermonuclear" approach but the fact Intel can tack on 8 more cores, add more cache, refine the process and still continue to compete against AMD's brand new architecture answer to Alderlake leaves me a bit meh.

 

On the other hand, knowing X3D is in the pipeline stacked on top of these nice improvements those should be monsters for cache sensitive (games basically) uses after seeing what the 5800X3D brought to the table.

 

Looking forward to the real reviews though but at least it is competitive. If AMD brings the high heat with their GPUs a full AMD buildout would be a viable alternative IMHO.

 

I won't be buying any new "new" hardware till everything is released and the dust settles and we get an idea of what seems the most fun / makes the most sense. I still have my master plan to get an NH55 and plop this 12900k in it. What I end up with after that? We will see.

 

Since you're going AMD, it will be nice to see some other numbers popping up in this thread. I liked it on the old forums when there were at least 2-3 of us with modern AMD hardware (myself, @Mr. Fox and @Rage Set) to toss in benchmarks and data for comparison.

 

 

 

 

 

 

ouch, i felt that zing! 😛 

 

thx for the clarification, that makes more sense now. i agree with the notion that even though AMD is actually kicking Intel in the butt and managed to get them "up to speed" again, it still seems like Intel is just doing the bare minimum to barely stay on top, even if its just on single thread performance. at the same time, AMD seems to have gotten a taste of "being on top" and what do we get? core stagnation. they could have surely progressed to a 24 core top sku, but why bother, right? from a business perspective, it doesnt make sense to go all out if there is no actual need.

in this context, im very very curious about how Intel will react to the X3D 7000 cpus next spring. afaik they dont really have anything in the pipeline to directly address that, except maybe a 13900KS overclocked to kingdom come? 😅 MLID recently made a good point on this, i.e. with X3D AMD might be in a position to basically offer 13900K gaming performance in a frigging laptop (thin n light crap of course), Intel wont have anything to offer against that since they cant go stupid in terms of wattage in a laptop form factor. but hey, who knows, maybe THATLL finally be motivation enough to bring back the glory days of big fat desktop laptops 😄 

 

all that being said, i think we also shouldnt step into the trap of "expecting too much". best example was all those rumours for the 40 series listing ever more crazy performance claims, 2x, 3x, 4x or even more. same for wattages going to 800W+ at stock. im not saying that none of those numbers MIGHT come true in the future (4090Ti) or in some special use cases (Nvidiot Racer X "game"), but the gist of the matter being: it would be silly to be disappointed at 50+% generational performance jumps!

this doesnt include pricing of course, purely performance perspective.

 

10 hours ago, Papusan said:

It's weirdo/suspicious that both Intel and AMD follow so close each other with performance uplift. And AMD use an total different node shrink/arc vs Intel. They still manage to get about same performance from their top chips. Whom follow who, I don't know. But stock scores from the new gen AMD Ryzen isn't very enticing as I see it from my view of point. This is bare minimum from what to expect when you have competition. Damn Intel who continue with more and more baby cores. But this is to be expected due power goes bananas because of Intel 7 10nm++++++++++. 14nm up again but in new clothes. As well (an bigger die for more real cores will be too expensive to be made/used - due same 10nm+++++++++ problem)

The Emperor's Intel's New Clothes - Wikipedia

 

 

 

 

hey bud, did u forget to add something to my quoted message? its just tacked on at the end of ur post 😄 

[jaybee83]

aaand we are live:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

time to watch! enjoy guys 🙂 

[Papusan]

5 hours ago, jaybee83 said:

hey bud, did u forget to add something to my quoted message? its just tacked on at the end of ur post 😄 

Nope. My reply to bro @electrosoftwas also meant for you 🙂 

[Reciever]

Interesting they chose temperature to be the key variable, casual enthusiasts will likely welcome the change I would imagine. 

[jaybee83]

6 minutes ago, Reciever said:

Interesting they chose temperature to be the key variable, casual enthusiasts will likely welcome the change I would imagine. 

good to know that the first thing im gonna change in bios would be TjMax to 115C, lets goooooo 🤣

[Reciever]

3 minutes ago, jaybee83 said:

good to know that the first thing im gonna change in bios would be TjMax to 115C, lets goooooo 🤣

I suspect reception to be mixed amongst the gamer only types but for system builders who like to push the envelope might appreciate temperature to be the limiting factor, getting a better cooler doesnt void the warranty inherently.

 

Something must be up with Far Cry 6 since the 5800X3D blows both 12900K and 7950x out of the water for that title.

[jaybee83]

Just now, Reciever said:

I suspect reception to be mixed amongst the gamer only types but for system builders who like to push the envelope might appreciate temperature to be the limiting factor, getting a better cooler doesnt void the warranty inherently.

 

Something must be up with Far Cry 6 since the 5800X3D blows both 12900K and 7950x out of the water for that title.

yep i noticed the same, GN was suspecting scheduling issues from the game side. all in all though surprisingly little issues mentioned. but best to check for real user input for this kinda stuff, since reviewers tend to run things utlra vanilla stock.

 

judging by the data ive gathered to far, Zen 4 beats ADL by a mile in terms of productivity, but only catches up / barely beats it in gaming. so RPL could be slightly behind in productivity and slightly ahead in gaming. should be very interesting match up!

[cylix]

Crazy temperature improvement with direct die cooling on Zen4. Like Der8auer says it. That IHS is too thick. Looks like this is the future of Desktop cooling aswell.

 

[jaybee83]

25 minutes ago, cylix said:

Crazy temperature improvement with direct die cooling on Zen4. Like Der8auer says it. That IHS is too thick. Looks like this is the future of Desktop cooling aswell.

 

absolutely, 20+ C lower is totally insane! and delidding doesnt seem to be as difficult as expected due to the SMDs on the cpu top. im curious to see how much improvent a simple delid and relid would bring. also, im betting custom IHS with SMALLER thickness could be incoming for Zen 4. maybe even with larger contact area? in any case, ill be on the lookout for that stuff 🙂

 

on a side note, anyone noticed this new teamgroup ram kit yet? DDR5-7200 incoming! surprisingly cheap, as well, considering DDR5 pricing.

 

https://www.newegg.com/team-32gb/p/N82E16820331923?Item=N82E16820331923

[Papusan]

2 hours ago, jaybee83 said:

good to know that the first thing im gonna change in bios would be TjMax to 115C, lets goooooo 🤣

You can do that also with Intel systems. But not a good idea for longevity of the chips. I expect same also for Ryzen 7000 series chips. A great idea if you want an new chips 🙂

[electrosoft]

Starting to watch the review videos. GN and De8auer are the best of the bunch. I love that Roman is always  all about the delids and outlier testing....

 

Monstrous list of reviews: https://videocardz.com/138525/amd-ryzen-7000-zen4-raphael-desktop-cpu-review-roundup

 

My take:

 

5800X3D is a gaming monster. As prices start to fall on older chips, if I was a gamer primarily with no need for massive amounts of productivity threads, I would build out a much cheaper 5800X3D platform even in the here and now. You can build out a 5800X3D with memory and motherboard cheaper than the 7950x itself.

 

Gaming at 1440p and greater, it really doesn't matter which CPU you pick from the top half of everything as the 3090ti is bottlenecking. Let's see what the 4000 and 7000 series bring to maybe cap some of this unbridled CPU power we're experiencing but for those of us gaming at 4k I'm sure the GPU will still be the bottleneck but we will see. 1080p gaming where CPU is the bottleneck was a mixed bag but man seeing that 5800X3D still in the top part of the list or outright winning shows the power of that design.

 

Did I mention the 5800X3D is a gaming beast? The 7000 X3D variants should be absolute juggernauts.

 

95c is the new normal taking a GPU type approach to let the chip boost as much as it wants depending on temps. Cooling REALLY matters now and the AMD CPU design now further minimizes traditional overclocking since the CPU is designed to boost as much as possible based on thermal conditions. This basically gives every buyer the bulk of performance the chip has to offer right out of the box versus leaving so much performance on the table like CPUs of yore where only overclockers could extract monstrous gains. (Power to the people?)

 

Welcome to the power hungry af club AMD...it pulls more than a 12900k at stock now (251w). AMD hit that efficiency wall and finally are letting their CPUs suck down as much as needed till it hits that thermal wall.

 

AMD 2021 "Efficiency is king"

AMD 2022 "Efficiency? What is that?"

 

De8auer's delid was pretty righteous on that 7900x. The temp drops were insane. This thing is going to sing with a proper delid but I'm curious to see how it fares with a better/thinner IHS or a good lapping too.

 

I see Asus has SP ratings on their 7000 series motherboards. Looking forward to see how that pans out.

 

Intel retains the single thread lead....kinda. Based on the CB23 vs GB5 results with locked clocks for IPC evaluation, we will need a suite of locked clock results to see what's going on.

 

Multicore it is an absolute slaughter. The 7950x is just a beast....an absolute beast.

 

Hopefully Intel's refinements, cache, clocks and more sad_cores will level the multi-core playing field or at least staunch the blood letting.

 

I remember when Athlon dethroned Intel and I switched to FX-60

I remember when 5000 dethroned 10th and I switched to 5800x

 

I have no qualms switching back to AMD again if 13th gen is a sad response but we will see. If 13th isn't a worthy response, I'll skip 13th and build out an AMD system.

 

I would LOVE for AMD to come out of the gate with their GPUs too and wreck Nvidia. An All AMD build (last time I had that was back with the FX-60 and an ATI card) would be sweet.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[electrosoft]

9 hours ago, jaybee83 said:

 

ouch, i felt that zing! 😛 

 

thx for the clarification, that makes more sense now. i agree with the notion that even though AMD is actually kicking Intel in the butt and managed to get them "up to speed" again, it still seems like Intel is just doing the bare minimum to barely stay on top, even if its just on single thread performance. at the same time, AMD seems to have gotten a taste of "being on top" and what do we get? core stagnation. they could have surely progressed to a 24 core top sku, but why bother, right? from a business perspective, it doesnt make sense to go all out if there is no actual need.

in this context, im very very curious about how Intel will react to the X3D 7000 cpus next spring. afaik they dont really have anything in the pipeline to directly address that, except maybe a 13900KS overclocked to kingdom come? 😅 MLID recently made a good point on this, i.e. with X3D AMD might be in a position to basically offer 13900K gaming performance in a frigging laptop (thin n light crap of course), Intel wont have anything to offer against that since they cant go stupid in terms of wattage in a laptop form factor. but hey, who knows, maybe THATLL finally be motivation enough to bring back the glory days of big fat desktop laptops 😄 

 

all that being said, i think we also shouldnt step into the trap of "expecting too much". best example was all those rumours for the 40 series listing ever more crazy performance claims, 2x, 3x, 4x or even more. same for wattages going to 800W+ at stock. im not saying that none of those numbers MIGHT come true in the future (4090Ti) or in some special use cases (Nvidiot Racer X "game"), but the gist of the matter being: it would be silly to be disappointed at 50+% generational performance jumps!

this doesnt include pricing of course, purely performance perspective.

 

 

hey bud, did u forget to add something to my quoted message? its just tacked on at the end of ur post 😄 

 

lol, friends zing each other. 🙂

 

I am really liking what I see with the 7950X but for gamers? That 5800X3D continues to show value. If AMD drops the price a cheap 5800X3D buildout would still have no problems holding its own easily for gamers.

 

7950x will just continue to show the hybrid Intel design for the nonsense it is overall. I seriously would be content with a 10-12 core real P-core CPU from Intel and they can keep the e-core nonsense.

 

If they're able to move 3D stacking into mobile architecture that's game over as laptop GPUs are capped anyhow...it will be even moreso for the 4000 series thermal wise but architectural improvements will still be there. I prefer gaming on laptops at 1080p anyhow.

 

I don't think anyone on this forum at least really believed Nvidia was going to bring valid 2-4x performance gains. Same for AMD being able to bring all that CPU performance uplift in a 170w TDP. Marketing fluff as always on both sides.

 

 

 

 

[saturnotaku]

After seeing the initial reviews, I see nothing in Zen 4 that will compel me to upgrade from my 5950X. With the way NVIDIA has been behaving lately, I'm seriously tempted to ditch my RTX 3080 for a 6900XT considering the latter can be had brand new for $700 or less right now, though I have a feeling the launch of RDNA 3 could put even more downward pressure on the pricing of the outgoing GPUs.