Mr. Fox

Lots of money for something that will be obsolete in a very short time, or displaced by a same-generation surprise SKU that suddenly moves your flagship GPU into the second fiddle chair. Not cool. Stepping up to pay for the best only to end up owning second best is no bueno. Maybe someday if Microcenter opens a Phoenix location where I can take back what I bought and apply the purchase price to an alternative.

LoL, I was thinking something similar but less humorous. Not only "no" but "heck no" ...putrid. NewEgg is now only offering $1350 for 4090 trade-ins and I don't think you can use trade-in to have in-store credit to use later. It has to be tied to a GPU purchase (literal trade-in) and the funds applied much like a post-sale partial refund or rebate after they receive and validate your trade-in. So, the idea of having the cash to pay for a X870E Apex from the previous trade-in credit doesn't look like it will work. As soon as 5090 releases I bet they will be offering only $800 or $1,000 trade-in value for a 4090.

Yeah, I can't wait to sell a 4090 at a loss and drop $2000+ (probably $2500-$3000 for A$$zeus) on a small upgrade. Sign me up. NOT.

Thanks. I think it was a great buy at $142 before tax. Plus, I have not owned a 1080 desktop GPU before, so I will get a few hardware points out of it. I'm thinking this would be a good candidate for the PTM7950 pad (rather than thermal paste) that I haven't used up yet. I think I already have all of the thermal pads needed as well. I installed the RX 590 in the computer I gave to my daughter's family and both of my teenage grand daughters are super happy. They are binge-playing DOOM, Fallout 4, Fortnight and Wolfenstein New Colossus. It was an affordable (under $100) upgrade to the Titan that was struggling to keep up. They actually could not even play Fallout 4 or Fortnight with the Titan Black due to low framerates and those games exiting to the desktop randomly. Now I need to decide if I want to sell the Gigabyte 4090 and use the 3090 Ti FTW3 in place of it or just have a spare GPU available if I need one. The Strix 1080 would be a great spare GPU to have handy if needed after it is repasted.

I got the GTX 1080 Strix. Works fine but BADLY in need of repaste. The original warranty sticker is still on the GPU screw so it is all original. It breached 100°C in less than 1 minute of Dyling Light and about 15 seconds in Fire Strike.

Whether the numbers support it or not, boasting that a third-fiddle product (5070) matches the performance of the prior generation flagship halo product (4090) is pretty silly. There would be no point in purchasing a 5070 to replace a 4090 for multiple reasons, but the most obvious one is you are wasting money and gaining nothing. Only a 5090 purchase makes sense if you own a 4090. 5080 would be a waste of money as well. Tiny improvement--probably not even enough to care about--for a lot of money. It seems pretty obvious that NVIDIA thinks most of their customers are stupid. And, a lot of them probably are.

Even a 3090 Ti sells for $750 or more still. That is ludicrous. That is tempting. You could get more for it on a private sale, but that is only like $150 less than what I paid for my Gigabyte 4090. I might have to look into that even though I was not planning to buy a 5090 unless there is a K|NGP|N offering. Although, I probably would not expect to find one for sale at NewEgg if one is released, and if so it would probably sell out in 30 seconds. I might end up with a credit that I can't use for the intended purpose. I wish there was a cash-out option. Maybe if I were lucky I could use the credit to purchase a X870E Crosshair Apex. That will probably also sell out instantly. I don't need more than a 3090 Ti for the kind of gaming I do. I am almost exclusively a FPS single-player campaign gamer, and it is not often enough (less than 4 hours a month) to justify the expense involved. I could use the Strix 1080 in my SFF work computer and the 3090 Ti in my Ryzen rig. There is minimal incentive to purchase a GPU for benching at this point because GPUs generally don't overclock worth a damn, and then HWBOT comes up with stupid rules like having to enable ECC. I'm like... "yeah, no thanks" because it's all for fun and if the fun is gone it no longer matters. At least 3090 Ti has Windows 7 driver support, and that still matters to me... a lot. There are some CPU-heavy benchmarks that can only produce good results using Windows 7. Failure/poor results are unavoidable on some of those benchmarks using Windows 10/11 because they are sucky OSes that are burdened by worthless bloat and littered with digital trash.

It is actually humorous that I almost made a comment that exactly that would happen and I changed my mind because it is logical speculation and I did not want to seem overly negative. I am actually surprised it hasn't already happened. It would likely have a similar effect to using NVIDIA Inspector for the LOD mod.

I can't say that playing a game has ever once overloaded my system memory or caused a "severe slowdown" but maybe they meant to say graphics memory. Regardless whether someone takes a position that "fake frames" are bad or beneficial, there is no escaping the benefit DLSS offers if it can make a gaming experience better for a weak GPU that wouldn't play well without the added help. I could see it saving some people of the necessity and cost of a GPU upgrade.

It usually works out fine for me. I seldom vote for a candidate that I wouldn't want to win an election. It's rare that I think both are tragic options. I'm not a middle-ground type of person so it's probably different for me. With the minority party candidates I find they are often a cocktail of good and bad things from both sides and they've got enough bad ideas I wouldn't consider casting a vote for them for fear of the damage they might cause if elected. We do have a multi-party system here. There are elected politicians that are neither Republican nor Democrat. You don't see them in office often because most of the time they do not have enough support to justify having their name on the ballot. Once in a while a Green Party or Libertarian candidate gets elected.

While I like the concept and agree with the idea, in practical application there is also a downside to having more than two parties as well. The small niche party siphons votes away from the party that would have won an election and sometimes it can allow the wrong/worst candidate to win an election due to people wasting a vote on a candidate that has a snowball's chance in hell of winning. There are no perfect candidates, but the lesser of evils is usually not hard to identify.

Well, the Carbon is on its way back for a refund and the Gene is ready for business. I don't know much about Ryzen SP ratings, but I think this might be fairly average. It's really too bad this CPU can't boot with 2200 FCLK. Maxes out at 2167. God-bin Ryzen CPUs must be very rare or nobody is binning Ryzen CPUs, keeping the best one and selling the "almost as awesome" leftovers like the Intel enthusiasts do. Based on the frequency evident in screenshots, it seems like 2200+ FCLK is either a lot less stressful or challenging for a single CCD processor with half as many cores/threads. Which would seem logical as well.

Sorry to hear your mama wasn't well. I pray that she gets back on her feet swiftly if she hasn't already. If Vince's deal goes through with PNY and they release a K|NGP|N card I will probably buy one if for no other reason than to show support for Vince. I suspect the powers-that-be at the BOT will mandate turning on ECC and ruining benchmark scores for everyone outside the inner circle, so it will be purely for vanity and for Vince if I do. Brother @Papusan has had the right idea all along for benching. (I know it was you're idea, but he's gone wild with it, LOL.) Just buy old crap GPUs and bench the snot out of them and take all of the gold away from those who once held high scores with now antique motherboards, CPUs and memory. No need to worry about them taking it back because most of them don't own those old GPUs anymore. Keep what you kill.

This might be relevant to X3D stutters, chunks and dips. We get used to running monitoring software like MSI AB and HWiNFO64 and sometimes forget about things we already knew. Need to disable power monitoring in AB if enabled. Maybe the lower X3D core count contributes to it.

It's nice to see that ExtremeHW is not going to shut down. A couple of existing forum members took it over right before it was about to go offline. https://extremehw.net/topic/3960-new-site-owners/

12 P-cores (if they overclock well) with hyperthreading might be a 14900KS upgrade. But, 14 or 16 hyperthreaded P-cores would have been even better. https://www.techpowerup.com/331041/intel-bartlett-lake-appears-as-a-p-e-core-hybrid-p-core-only-cpus-could-soon-follow The X870E Carbon is all boxed up and label affixed to head back for refund. X670E Gene mysteriously went from today originally, to Friday with no tracking updates or movement of the package for 4 days, to sudddenly at my local post office and out for delivery today. Weird.

I cannot remember now who said it, maybe it was @chew or @domdtxdissar, but I think I can remember something about some of the ROG Crosshair boards not liking certain SKUs of the G.SKILL memory kits. The G.SKILL 8000 48GB memory kit that I tried on the X870E Carbon didn't want to boot with BIOS defaults for some reason. The TG Xtreem 8200 48GB kit never had any trouble booting with defaults, XMP or custom timings.

In typical ASUS style, the Astral name will likely be an accurate reflection of the price. Performance will be a secondary consideration as it has been with most Strix products.

Very sad to see such devastating losses. Nice job to all of the woke CA "leaders" that made this tragedy possible. Their DEI focus and defunding efforts made all the difference. I love Mexico, too. It is a beautiful country and an amazing culture, with many lovely people. The current state of affairs offers us a glmpse into how much damage can be expected when corrupt government and organized crime are allowed to grow unchecked, like a cancer spreading and only becoming evident to its victim when it can no longer be contained. It is tragic how all of that affects the good, God-fearing and hard-working families that live there. If we don't learn from it and take aggressive active steps to avoid it, we will end up with the same horrible mess in the US.

One of the most positive things I can find to say about the X870E Carbon is that it doesn't suck as bad as the X870E Taichi. It's certainly not the worst motherboard I have ever owned. I haven't had MSI motherboards kill multiple CPUs (so far) like ASUS. But, it feels like their efforts are kind of half-assed and it seems pretty evident that their firmware team doesn't know what they are doing. Other than the HydroCopper, I don't really care for how most factory waterblocks are made or how they look. Most are very garish and tacky-looking. I'd rather go with aftermarket personally. Having the stock air cooler will make the card easier to sell when you are done with it. Waterblocked GPUs are hard to sell because the market/interest level in water cooling is low and a general lack of technical knowledge and skill among most gamers. The design of the 5090 FE is unacceptable and I hope the AIBs refuse to follow that model. I would avoid buying a piece of crap made like the 5090 FE. Don't hold your breath about repairs. Being modular doesn't mean any of us would be able to buy any of the parts. All it would do it help the Green Gobin cut down on RMA/warranty repair costs and further maximize their bottom line. They wouldn't be repairing anything, just swapping out any small parts if they fail. We can be confident that NVIDIA is doing only what best serves the interest of NVIDIA, not what is best for the dumb-dumbs that buy their goofy video cards and not because it is a smart idea for end users. First it was the 12VHPWR abortion, now a modular GPU nightmare. That video from Steve is one of his best parodies of how obnoxious, absurd and deliberately misleading the tech industry has become. His use of sarcasm was masterful if not tongue-in-cheek. The reason all of the marketing mumbo-jumbo and lies are so effective is becase so many of the people buying the products are Kool-Aid drinkers that are about as dumb as a box of rocks. If PNY gives Vince as much latitude and autonomy to do things right that EVGA did, PNY K|INGP|N cards might end up being the only option worth buying. Quite a paradigm shift and potentially a path to market domination for PNY. Totally absurd design... Very sad to see such devastating losses. Nice job to all of the woke CA "leaders" that made this tragedy possible. Their DEI focus and defunding efforts made all the difference.

Reasonable compared to what? Compared to how bad they could screw us if they decided to? There is absolutely nothing reasonable about $2000+ for a GPU. Period. It's retarded. We're getting effed over because they know they can. We are partly to blame because we've continued allowing juvenile passions to drive poor judgment as consumers. The days where we could identify value and reasonableness are pretty much gone. I do not believe it will ever be good again. We should expect that getting screwed over real bad is normal, and ASUS and NVIDIA are our biggest abusers. You have to decide how much abuse you are willing to tolerate to own what you want. Lay down, apply Lidocaine liberally, followed by a water soluble lubricant. If you lay on your back and pull your knees to your chest it will be less painful. No, it is not a sign they love you. That would definitely be a first-world problem. The Galax HOF may as well not even exist for me because it's not available. Their market is limited. Acquiring one is not only difficult if you live in the US, but also so absurdly expensive that it makes no sense to even try. The differences that make it better are not consistent with the price and it comes at too high of a cost to be worthwhile. It's unfortunate that we had a 4-year setback with Sleepy Joe and Kameltoe. If we (the US and our allies) do not act swiftly to put China in their place and strip them of their ability to be finanicially sound and a nation of relevance in the world they hate so much we can count on a post-modern holocaust replay. China's intentions for the rest of the world are dark and nefarious. The CCP's extreme wickedness starts at home and is evident by how they (mis)treat their own. We need to make the most important things on Xi Jinping's mind having electricity and running water, worry about how he is going to avoid starving to death and how to evade assassination.

Well, the Gene is arriving later than expected. The shipper must have gone on vacation a few days because it stopped moving for 4 days once it reached the US. Now it is expected this coming Friday instead of Monday. ☹️ I hope I love the Gene. Looking to grab the X870E Apex when it becomes available, but hoping the Gene will make me happy in the meanwhile. I went ahead and started the return/refund process for the X870E Carbon. Nice motherboard other than being 4-DIMM (big strike against it) but very mediocre firmware support. If I were a typical gamer type I'm sure I would love it to death, but being more into overclocking it leaves a lot to be desired. MSI doesn't seem to pursue my niche as hard as some of their competitors do. They still need to fix the bugs in their firmware though. Every update seems to help one thing but throws something else off a bit. Running the latest beta BIOS fixed the broken Per CCD overclocking option, but on this new BIOS I have weird random glitches like both of the onboard NICs not being detected and once in a while when I boot everything is larger size like CSM mode is enabled even though it is not. Both of those glitches go away with a reboot, but putting up with nonsense like that is for the birds. Edit: Oh, a third glitch I just remembered that it does is the screen image in the BIOS randomly is the wrong size (not full screen) with fuzzy text and missing UEFI wallpaper. It generally coincides with everything being larger on the screen during POST like CSM is enabled even when it is not. Rebooting almost always straightens it out on the first try, but it is still inexcusable. MSI has released a ton of BIOS updates since I purchased this. It seems like their firmware team doesn't really know what they're doing. I've heard AMD firmware is easier to screw up than Intel because of all the extra crap AMD requires them to include in the BIOS. Whether true or not I don't know. Just wondering if that is part of why they (MSI) keep missing the mark.

Maybe they think bricking your turdbook BIOS will cause you to buy a POS Surface turdbook.

Smoke and mirrors... AI generated fake multi-frames is not "performance" LOL. It's a software snowjob. NVIDIA has never looked more sneaky and dishonest than they do now. They need to compare next gen to current gen with no frame generation, just bare metal without any stupid AI crap or silly software manipulation.