electrosoft

Finding that sweet spot for power limits especially on laptops is a good thing for the CPU and GPU I always lock my frames even on desktop. Thereis no reason to abuse the GPU for those massive spikes (and heat, pull, noise) and work for a consistent window of performance. For me it is ~144fps as my locked point even on this 240hz killer display. Best way to test air flow is to try your laptop with the bottom off and on to give you an idea of how much airflow is being compromised and adjust accordingly (IE, cooling pad for more forced injection or modding the bottom to allow more air flow). Yep, boost clocks aren't always the end of all even on desktop use especially if your being GPU limited in many scenarios. Those temps are very good for laptop use. Down the road, cracking it open and using PT7950 or LM will probably net you even better cooling along with maybe analyzing the heatsink and cross airflow to invest in some low profile heatsinks strategically placed for extra heat dissipation. e-cores are a tricky thing. Some games love them and other don't. Also see if Intel's APB software can be used to increase performance. Best to test with them off and on per game to see if it's worth disabling them. You may find down the road as you address hardware cooling limitations and UV table unlocks become available, you'll be able to boost performance as needed. A good 13900hx setup should be hitting 32k+ in CB23 but you can address that later if needed depending on needs/desires. If you're hitting 18k+ in TS and gaming with those temps you are good to go atm. And as always, if you're unhappy, be wary of your return window. 🙂

Take away from this video is the massive increases in performance AMD has brought to the table in two generations from the 3600 to the 7600 (along with the argument that 6 cores is the sweet spot for gaming):

If it's any consolation, massive gains are gone on the desktop too with AMD, Intel and Nvidia using dynamic boosting to allow users to get a massive amount of clocking out of their chips and allowing each piece of silicon to smartly boost as much as possible based upon cooling, power and silicon quality. What's the warranty on it? That's more important than many other factors. 🙂

You're getting ~3080ti performance w/ 4000 series benefits (DLSS, FG, etc...) along with more than enough CPU power. It can definitely do 4k but if you want to lock in 120fps you will just need to dial in your settings to find the perfect balance per game just as you would on a desktop. I had to adjust the wife's settings in WoW even for 1440p to keep her fps consistently above 100fps at all times on her 32" 165hs display. It is doable. Like I said before, when I was stuck with a 3060 and a 3070 between my 3090 FE and 3090 KPE, I just massively dialed down my expectations/settings and I was able to game at 4k but it was ugly and I couldn't wait for my 3090 KPE queue to pop so I could get one ASAP. 🙂 If you keep it, shed 4-5 of your other laptops and keep one that has perfect portability and your gaming monster, bank the $$$ and call it a wrap. It is a market reality and the masses have spoken. Most people do not want to lug around tanks or tinker with their hardware but they do want decent performance. They want to plug it in, boot it up and go and there's nothing wrong with that. Everybody's built different. Having tested several thinner and lighter gaming laptops over the last few years or so sent to me for evaluation from Acer, Asus. MSI and Dell/Alienware, I can fully attest to the fact they do start up, setup and work relatively just fine and can game right out of the box and for most users that is all they want to do. Everybody I know (or just about everybody) in normal day to day life just wants to flick a switch and go and that's ok. Just like some want to just get behind the wheel of their car and go and that's ok too. 🙂 For myself, I see immediate areas of overheating, overvolting, poor cooling implementation, bios restrictions, bad memory selection (horrific timings or only including one module), bloatware, restrictive software and more and I have to separate MY reality from the average users reality when evaluating them because it isn't realistic unless it is such a gross abuse of design decisions that I need to address it. I really lament the loss of choice in regards to having at least one or two tanks available for us who like both. 😞 Just give me a P870'esque chassis with a Prema level BIOS and modern desktop hardware along with MXM level options beyond Ampere and I'm good to go. I love binning parts and tinkering inside while spelunking around the BIOS to dial everything in as much as possible but that has slowly eroded over the years to the point of near non-existence.

Intel's design spec like AMDs now allows and encourages CPUs to run up to 100c and 95c respectively. Our job is to maximize the cooling solution (IE fix flaws off the assembly line and/or beef up the cooler) and tune a UV if able to extract maximum performance under that thermal envelope. 🙂 In terms of full control of our laptops out of box and allowed by the makers, MSI reigns supreme in their Titan series as it is basically their desktop BIOS on a laptop. Second is Asus as they do provide some control including a BIOS level UV but it is neutered compared to their full desktop experience. Some of the Clevo models do have modified BIOSes to a degree but anything post 11th gen X170SM/KM hardware wise is thin and light in design in comparison except maybe the Titan which is a behemoth. If it wasn't so darn expensive I would consider getting one but it is stupidly expensive It still comes down to are you happy playing with dialed down settings? If so, even a 3060 will get you by in most cases. I'm a glutton for eye candy and max settings. Others don't care and it's about playing and that's it. Most fall somewhere in between. That's a nice chunk of doubloons you splashed out for that laptop. If you're not 100% happy, return it and contemplate do you want to wait for another laptop or buy a pre-built or slowly start building out a desktop.

Uh oh.....Asus repair is now in GN's crosshairs....

Switching to LM or PTM7950 for the CPU along with a dialed in UV and you will be blowing past 30k on CB23. Your TS score is definitely better than a 10GB 3080 and on a 3080ti level. For perspective, your laptop is performing slightly better than my wife's desktop with a Strix 3080 10GB and 12900k and once you dial everything in and optimize the cooling, you're going to blow past it even more especially on the CPU.

However you look at it, it is a monstrous upgrade over your old laptop! Down the road, PTM7950 + tuning the voltages will net even more performance. Congrats!

Congrats! I had a feeling in the end you were going to go with a laptop as they really are your true love computing wise. I love laptops too just as much as desktops so I get it. 🙂 Post up full specs on the system, a pic of it and a Timespy.

It really is. I tried to make the math work to upgrade the wife's Strix 3080 10GB but as much as I "Beautiful Mind"'ed it, it just didn't make sense. 🙂 Yup, you called this out weeks ago. Even when working with SFF 13900ks last year, the logic was to enforce the limits before fine tuning with a UV to work with a 280mm and it was still hitting 41.8k no problem in CB23 with killer temps. I ended up enforcing ~400a 300/300 and that 13900KS ran so smooth on that 280mm in the small case and never throttled.

I'll second this @ryan . I also like that NZXT has much easier to access components (they're all basically off the shelf and usually their brand) and they have good airflow. Along with checking "Facepoot" (lol), don't be afraid to check eBay. Plenty of good deals to be had there too. I still stick to building out your own from scratch to really dial in what you want and hand pick your components, but if you're wanting to go pre-built, NZXT is not a bad choice.

It's scary how so many have lost the ability to agree to disagree and remain amicable. Identity politics and extremism on both sides hyper inflated by social media makes it rough waters out there and I've seen life long friendships disintegrate over politics and/or religion. I have numerous friends and loved ones on both sides of the aisle and watching some of their life long relationships with each other obliterated is disheartening. As for hardware, everybody has their own personal criteria and use cases. I do see your fervent argument @Mr. Fox about neutering BIOS because Intel messed up big time and were over zealous with their CPUs in the need to compete and clearly as data has gushed in, Intel sees a need to cap PL/AMPS because they were redlining their chips. I'm all for issuing bios updates that change the default profile to Intel's new recommended spec which is a massive nerf (125w/188w? Wow). What I do not want to see happen is an AMD hardline cap to voltage and allow users to OC as they see fit at their own risk. Imagine someone who dropped serious coin on binned chips and top end motherboards like Encores and Tachyons to purposely overclock suddenly having to make the choice of being capped at the bios level or never being able to update their bios to retain full control over their chip. Lastly, As we enter the end phase of Ada, 4090 reigns supreme but for me this cycle's clear price:performance winner is the 4070 Super:

utilized variable length stalls/cycles versus virtual pipelined instructions is my guess. AKA reimagining hyperthreading for more efficiency is my guess but we'll see.

I would go with something like this in the here and now: No GPU: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/h7szrv w/ PNY 4080 Super: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/LcB8cH 7800X3D complete build out and all you need to do is add a GPU of your choice. Either a place holder or actually pick up a 4080 and the total cost is the same as a 4080 laptop but with much more zip, power and expand ability. Either way the base system is as good as gaming gets with the 7800X3D and it will be ready for Zen5.

I'll double down on this. AM5 or wait for Intel's Socket 1851. Socket 1700 is dead and AM4 is double dead (even if AMD keeps releasing silicon for it).

Agreed. I think I recommended this to @ryan several months back to slowly build the system starting with the bones and work your way up depending on prices and what's on sale. This is exactly what I do when I start to map out systems to build. I slowly start to accumulate parts over several months depending on prices as I love used/clearance items and go from there. You can literally slap together a very competent AM5 system with 32 to 64gb of ram and a 1tb SSD for killer prices right now and build off of that. CPU and GPU will almost always be the most expensive components.

Here's a run on my returned Asus G18 w/ full power 4080 to give you a good idea where it stand graphically. You're spot on with the ~3080 desktop performance metric. This is stock no OC on anything: One of our local best buys has the G18 18" 13980hx/4080 on close out for $1584.00 which is a killer price especially toss in 5% back and it has the same (if not greater CPU performance depending on silicon) performance basically as the 14th gen version. 4090 variant of the same laptop gets you ~21.4k so 3090+ power in a laptop so a ~16% uplift along with a jump in VRAM. Crazy to think just 2-3 years ago about a laptop with the former king desktop GPU power.

Ya know, there's nothing wrong with preferring laptops. I know plenty of us go on and on about the "ultimate power" of a desktop but if laptops are your forte and you can budget it, go wild and get a monster laptop. Sell the bulk of your laptops you have now for funding. Keep the best one for portability and go get a monster laptop. I love desktops but I equally love laptops too. I always end up having 2-5 on hand at all times even when I eventually downsize they build themselves right back up again lol. If you can find a clearance/close out last gen 13th gen / 4090 laptop for a good price that will net you ~3090ti level performance. Even a 7950hx / 4090 is no slouch either. Don't ever waste your $$$ on a 4070 laptop. for Ada, it is 4080 and 4090 or seek out a last gen for a substantial discount.

So I take it you don't want to build you own? Did you do some price comparisons on PCpartpicker to see what you could build for a comparable price? I'm not really feeling the 5800X on that platform as even a 5800X3D will hamstring a 4090 let alone a 5090. I would price out and build an AM5 system in preparation for a 4090/5090 class card and slap a 4070 in there for now.

As always, it comes down to desired resolution, details and framerate. If your objective is to play at any resolution or settings and you don't care about sub 60fps, you can get away with a much much lower tier of hardware. Take Hogwarts for example. Everyone bemoaning how taxing it can be but if you are willing to compromise across all three criteria, I had it running on my daughter's P377SM-G at 1080p with a 4810mq and 970m and 32GB of 1866 DDR3 and it was playable. Details were at low but if you don't care about resolution, details or framerates have at it. 🙂 My objective is always at least 120fps+ with the best detail level possible at 4k with no compromises and that tends to dictate my hardware level. When I sit in front of my wife's desktop with a 12900k, 3080 10GB and a 32" 144p 165hz display I can see and feel the difference between my setup immediately. When she had my old 32" 60hz HP 10-bit display it was always nauseating to play on it after coming off my 144hz G7 and I used that HP for over 5 years for gaming! 🤣 As for Linux, I'm an Unbuntu and now Mint kinda guy and I keep Kali on thumb drives for other targeted work on the side. Nothing yet on the 5090 front but I'm fully expecting $1900-2000 for launch MSRP.

Stock Dell G15 13650HX / 4050 laptop.....fresh from Dell with the newest BIOS off my storage shelf.... "I think something is wrong with the laptop you loaned me to play Hogwarts" "Why?" "The fans go crazy and it locks up or shuts down when I'm playing sometimes" I give it a basic Timespy run....yeah there's a touch of overheating going on.....🤣 Pulling up to ~115w Incoming PTM7950 and UV on this hotbox...

Still crazy that it seems MSI has basically jettisoned AMD 7000 GPU sales (sans 7600 mech) but I understand lol.... At least they're staying strong with AMD motherboards though.

Nice little boost there Meaker and still showing the reason fully upgrade enabled laptops have meaning and purpose.

Agreed, mLED is such a step up from normal panels but OLED is just that much next level and the days of "OLED being too dim" are long gone. They are painfully bright even to me. One reason I decided to give it a try is I gave my daughter an OLED Acer laptop last year to finally replace her Clevo P377SM-A she had for years for college (She basically was tethered and weighed down by it no matter what and she needed to go and be flexible) and she uses it every day for hours on end with no screen mitigation in place for over 6 months and when I was improving her cooling the other week I couldn't help but notice she had zero burn in even on the task bar. She uses it easily 2-3hrs daily and on some days 5-10hrs and there was no burn in anywhere. I'm sure burn in is still an issue with OLED (even the newest stuff), but I don't know what magic is being worked on newer panels but she had none. I also have an Asus Vivobook 15.6" 1080p OLED laptop I'm using now with a basic 1080p screen so we'll see how that one fairs down the road. It has an Ultra 7 155h in it and it has become my new field/projects/raspberry/bookstore/Starbucks laptop. The Samsung Odyssey G7 43" will replace our bedroom 15yr old 32" LED display. It's so old it doesn't even support HDCP properly so many Firestick offerings wouldn't run. I'm still going to be pro-active for some very basic measures to thwart screen burn in just in case. Many games have static elements for HUDs and such and I am sure gamers play for many hours so we will see. I remember @tps3443 saying he spent plenty of hours gaming on his OLED and has had zero burn in.

I do actually use a Razer Deathadder V3 wired...... 🤣 I will never by an Alienware PC or KB. The Alienware M18 isn't all too bad if I went a modern large body laptop and accepted true DTRs are most likely never coming back. 😞 I completely understand. For my real work I still rely on my BenQ on my other desk that doubles as my diagnostic/workstation display. I just roll my chair over there and use a Cherry MX keyboard and actually an EVGA Mouse for real work. Even with all the modern "anti-burn" technology, I still switched my taskbar to disappear and set the screen saver to pop on after 60 seconds of non use to be safe. 🙂