Mr. Fox

3 hours ago, electrosoft said:

@Raiderman

 

I always say, when I want a new BIOS to drop, all I have to do is install the most recent.... 🙂

 

https://download.msi.com/bos_exe/mb/7D70v1J.zip

 

 

Luckily, the system recert was still taking place so I updated to this one and back to testing my dialed in timings on mem and other subsystems before a clean install tonight across the board.

Speaking of that... MSI finally dropped the new BIOS with MC 0x129 for the Z790I Edge. Working like a champ. No issues with stability or loss of performance. Memory tuned nicely. 57x P-Cores, 47x E-Cores, 52x Cache, VCore 1.290V, 8200 CL38-48-48-84. Sweet little monster now with the 3090 Ti FTW3.

8 minutes ago, Clamibot said:

 I wonder if this also applies to Windows 10 or even the LTSC editions of Windows 10. If so, this is yet another software tweak to further increase performance. I'll take it! Screw security, just gimme more performance!

To the extent it actually produces a measurable difference it is likely to be on a bone stock version of Windows 11. If a person has done a good job of exorcizing the demonic powers hiding in the smelly butt-crack of a vanilla cancer version I suspect it probably doesn't change much, if anything.

I am wondering to what extent simply logging out and then into a new/different account might produce a similar result. If there are fewer startup processes and no scheduled "maintenance" running in the background when logging in on a new or seldom used Windows user account this will definitely result in a performance boost.

2 hours ago, saturnotaku said:

For people who say they aren't fanboys, they sure act like it.

I just know what I don't want and know what I won't settle for as an alternative. Pretty cut and dry. Remember, it was not long ago that I gave it a spin with 5950X and then with 6900 XT and both were disappointing to me. Had I pretended that I was happy and been willing to settle then that would have made me a fanboy for sure. I don't care about brand. I care about getting what I want. I'd kick Intel to the curb in a heartbeat if AMD actually offered something that looked enticing to me on the surface and delivered on my expectations. I'm not ready to roll the dice again. Maybe someday, but the wounds are too fresh to even consider it. I've given them multiple opportunities to give me something that makes me happy over the past ~15 years, wasted some of my hard-earned money in the process, and it hasn't worked out for them. I'd say that is pretty open-minded, but I am not going to lower my standards as an accommodation.

57 minutes ago, jaybee83 said:

 

automatic encryption? wtf MS, hands off my storage!!!

For now we have to just settle for disabling the service. Even using NSudo does not allow manually deleting the BitLocker service. At least we can disable this trash. Maybe it can be removed from the ISO with NTLite like Defender.

Windows 11 truly does suck, but that may not be a legitimate crutch. It sucks for all CPUs, not just Ryzen 5.

Quote

10:25 - I guess is what I'm trying to say and it's really important to note that all the information this video changes nothing about the reviews. The gaming performance relative to Zen4 doesn't really change as we just saw. Relative to Intel processors this may improve Ryzen's position but that is also just an assumption... my fear was that someone would run with the story and in the process create mass hysteria online with claims that Windows 11 is to blame for Zen5's weak gaming performancee when in reality that does not appear to be the case for now... Zen5's gaming performance remains highly disappointing.

30 minutes ago, jaybee83 said:

with intel cpus basically all breaking down

That is patently false. Some might be, but a small percentage and far from "all" (contrary to what the AMD YouTube shills want everyone to believe).

30 minutes ago, jaybee83 said:

why would linux show such perf gains for zen 5, even in games?

That's easy. Linux is a better OS than Windows 11 no matter what CPU you are using.

Windows 11 has been a defective product from launch day and will never be a good operating system.

Quote

10:25 - I guess is what I'm trying to say and it's really important to note that all the information this video changes nothing about the reviews. The gaming performance relative to Zen4 doesn't really change as we just saw. Relative to Intel processors this may improve Ryzen's position but that is also just an assumption... my fear was that someone would run with the story and in the process create mass hysteria online with claims that Windows 11 is to blame for Zen5's weak gaming performancee when in reality that does not appear to be the case for now... Zen5's gaming performance remains highly disappointing.

Windows 11 truly does suck, but that may not be a legitimate crutch. It sucks for all CPUs, not just Ryzen 5.

1 hour ago, cylix said:

Windows 11 is crap as usual😁

Don't know why anyone would want to use it. It is truly disgusting. After Windows 7 to present, the newest version of Windows is always inferior to the one before it.

Go get it... @ryan Imagine being able to actually buy something worth having for $10. You can't even buy a pound of good beef steak from the grocery store or a Whopper cheese value meal that cheap today. And, you can grab the demo if you want to play it a bit first.

This game is a blast if you are anything like me. If you are annoyed by AI dialog, gathering objects and clues, crafting, storyline distractions and prefer the chaos and adrenaline rush of non-stop run and gun action like Left4Dead, CoD Zombies, DOOM, Unreal Tournament, etc. then you're going to instantly love this one. On sale for $10 until August 28 on Steam.

And, you can grab the demo if you want to play it a bit first.

1 hour ago, Papusan said:

@Mr. Fox AMD's Skylake moment. Intels's 14nm ++++ all over again. Is that what we call a progress bro @jaybee83? Newer has to be better @ryan Or only newer? AMD is now the brand in front that milking their customers. 

 

Well, there is a difference. Every new Skylake CPU was better and faster than the one it replaced. Intel was stuck in a rut but still managed to raise the bar with each '+' that got added. I liked them all. Those that complained were mostly AMD fanboys grappling for a reason to cast stones at the brand that was doing better. I do not remember anyone that preferred Intel losing any sleep over it. I know I didn't.

7 hours ago, raptorddd said:

it  seems to me that they all want is for intel to fail and go bankrupt. out of business

Yes, and that is an extremely stupid and misinformed approach for those fanbois to be taking. If that were to happen, AMD would lower the bar for itself because it would no longer need to compete. It would ruin things for all consumers.

Although, I do not agree that AMD has surpassed Intel. I still view their products as inferior. There will be times when one brand leapfrogs another in terms of winning benchmarks. As long as Intel is not permanently damaged by the media smear campaign they will not stand for second place. Winning means too much to them. The notion of AMD beating them at something seems to not set well with them as a company. That is one reason I prefer them. It is also one reason why Intel's lower quality silicon samples are committing hara kiri. They're pushing things harder to win. In contrast, AMD seems to be equally content participating in a race as they are with winning a race. We already see examples of them not feeling compelled to push themselves harder. Imagine if they no longer needed to compete. Prices would be higher and quality/performance would be lower.

At the end of the day they are both giant companies that will do shady things to one other, to their employees, and to the people that buy their products. Profits matter more than people.

48 minutes ago, Papusan said:

 

There is a slight difference. Zen5 is made from an brand new node and architecture.  

Newer is always better newer.

Doing more with less and dubbing it as "more efficient" is almost always code word for sucky. The best approach is always do MOAR with more. Getting higher performance from lower power is usually a joke that isn't a funny one. 1+1=2. If you build something with the goal of using less power there will be strings attached.

52 minutes ago, jaybee83 said:

intereting tidbit: Roman got a defective cpu, second one after GN's 9600X. not a good showing! CPUs crapping out on us left and right, Intel and AMD, yay....

I think an unfortunate sign of the times we live in. Quality isn't job #1 any more. If the RMA process isn't blazing fast (2 business days or less) and hassle-free it just adds insult to injury when consumers have to take a slow ride for something that isn't their fault. Sadly, the process is seldom fast or hassle-free. Usually the exact opposite of fast or hassle-free.

On 8/12/2024 at 3:11 AM, kojack said:

I am not a fan of intel's business practices right now, but I love how everyone piles on if they have the slightest issue with a chip, meanwhile, looking back through the threads, NOBODY piled on AMD for having burning chips last year with their 7000 series.  Why is that I wonder?

 

AMD Ryzen 7000 Overheating Issues: Culprit Found in EXPO & SoC Voltages (update) (guru3d.com)

20 hours ago, raptorddd said:

was the number high as intel.s.? are some you tubers and websites sponsored.? maybe harcore fans to the brand.?

The reasons is fanbois (which does not include everyone) never speak badly about their brand cult. Their love of inanimate objects is unconditional, but they sure don't have any problem joining the posse on a mission to smear their favored brand's competitors or those that dare prefer something different than them. I never noticed anyone that preferred Intel trolling AMD forums, ridiculing the AMD brand and those that prefer it, demonstrating glee or rejoicing over AMD's failures. 

According to at least one highly respected system builder (Puget) the current rate of CPU failure on Intel systems, while higher than normal for Intel, is still about half that of the AMD CPUs in the systems they build. While that has been publicly announced, it is not convenient for the social media influencer muppets to report that because it undermines their agenda.

Large companies seldom consider the impact on employees when they cut staff to save money. It is unfortunate and wrong, but it's not something out of the ordinary or a rare sin Intel is committing. This happens frequently, but seldom gets talked about unless there is already some kind of media buzz going on and it provides additional sauce for their juicy story. Big insurance companies are one of the more common offenders, like Progressive, Allstate and others. Employees are considered expendable to big companies that only care about profits and shareholder interests. In the service sector (like insurance) those let go first are often the smartest and most experienced because they are paid the most and it is cheaper to keep the noobs that don't know what they are doing. They go from being noobs to overworked and underpaid noobs with the company "doing more with less" to maximize profit.

29 minutes ago, Papusan said:

 

Exactly what some stupids ask for. It's a perverse world we live in now. Stupid is the new normal.

 

 

I hope that person was being facetious, but would not doubt the possibility that someone would be nutty enough to want it. Stupity has become very common.

10 minutes ago, Papusan said:

 

Oh' my gosh. Why use up all the slots when you can get RGB slot covers? Will you buy a few of them bro @Mr. Fox? Or is it too disgusting? The (a)RGB madness sees no end. It just becomes worse and worse for every year. What next?

 

 

Totally absurd. What next? RGB thermal paste and pads? 

7 hours ago, tps3443 said:

Does rebar and Intel application Optimizer work with Windows 10?

Application Optimizer? Is that the recent gaming enhancement from Intel for 13th and 14th Gen CPUs?  The X79 Rampage IV Gene is 4th Gen. But, I don't think I use it even on the platforms that support it. If that is what you are referring to, I am pretty confident it doesn't work on Gen 4. I have never even investigated this on my current tech systems because gaming isn't ranked very high on my list of priorities. I do enjoy FPS gaming and occassionally binge play, but I don't give a lot of time or effort to the pursuit of it. I put the 2080 Ti into this system just so it would not be a slideshow with decent settings (High versus Low or Medium) and resolutions above 1080p. Most modern titles (CoD MW, Battlefield 2042, Crysis 3 Remastered, etc) were a bit too much for the GTX Titan to manage gracefully. The first generation Titan is only 6GB of vRAM and the core and memory clocks are very slow by current standards. It did manage to play older games (released during its time) very smoothly.

The X79 platform does not have the necessary firmware support for Resizable Bar (decoding above 4G I believe is what is missing) and neither does 2080 Ti firmware from what I can remember. I know that was released like 6 to 12 month after 3090 was released because Vince (Kingpin) sent me an updated XOC vBIOS when that happened. I actually did look into this and I was able to add the module into the firmware along with NVMe support, but there is no BIOS menu option to enable decoding above 4G or Resizable Bar. I believe older GPUs like 20-series RTX cards would support it but you would need to have an updated vBIOS as well as motherboard support.

6 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

I lost access to one PCIe slot due to the extra slot being taken by the girth of the air cooler, so I will have to install a dual NVMe card in the bottom slot rather than using two single NVMe cards.

 

So, I pulled one of the two dual NVMe cards from the Encore for the X79 Gene. It already had eight, LOL. One less won't hurt anything. I sacrificed the Windows 11 drive since I almost never use that sucky POS cancer operating system anyway. Set that one on the desk for later, kept the one with Linux and put it on the single NVMe card in the Encore.

2 hours ago, tps3443 said:

Was the Titan not fast enough? What made you want to put a 2080Ti in that system?

Hearing about you building a home network for your kids brings back a lot of fond memories. I built each of my five kids their own desktop.

Correct on the Titan being too slow. It can still work on low to medium setting, but no ray tracing sucks. It's basically the same as 780 Ti. Nearly identical performance and in the same generation. 2080 Ti totally obliterates it. I had the 2080 Ti already. I bought it like about a year ago for Windows 7 benching. Just converted it to air cooling so I could use it in this system (no custom loop SFF).

I actually really like this antique. It performs surprisingly great. After the BIOS mod for NVMe support (which did not exist when X79 was released) it because a pretty compelling machine. And, the best thing about it is...

No driver mods required.

1 hour ago, Talon said:

Tech Yes City?  More like Tech Non Senscity

That YouTube channel is pretty worthless. Besides just being dead wrong about a lot of stuff, the guy is about as entertaining as watching paint dry. Not really any better than Gamer Meld. Lots of nonsense from some of these bobble-heads. Ignorance isn't a sin, but it is contagious. Simple fix for it is knowledge, but know-it-all folk are hard to cure.

20 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

 I am still waiting for the adapter cable for the fans to complete the Xtreme Waterforce conversion to Xtreme Air. I went ahead and installed the assembly. To install the cable I only have to remove 4 screws from the shroud. This looks really nice. I am glad that I ordered the kit that includes the backplate because it is different than the Waterforce. It has additional screw holes. I am eager to see how hot/cold it runs with this thermal unit.

 

I decided to go ahead and install this in Methuselah and put the Titan on the shelf. I don't have the fan cable yet, so this is running without fans. Just doing mundane tasks like web surfing and email until I get the cable. But, doing that the GPU core has never gone above 35°C core and hotspot 48°C. The fans mounted in the chassis floor seem to be providing enough air flow for low intensity normal use. I think it looks great. I lost access to one PCIe slot due to the extra slot being taken by the girth of the air cooler, so I will have to install a dual NVMe card in the bottom slot rather than using two single NVMe cards.

I bought some faster RAM for it as well. 2666 vs current 2400. Got it cheap on eBay.

2 hours ago, Papusan said:

Disable Intel default and the value of MC 0x129 fix is gone and worthless. 

All of the other stuff in your post is sad, but Buildzoid probably has no idea that 0x129 fixed the SA bug. So, for that reason only I would say it is not worthless, but extremely valuable.

 I am still waiting for the adapter cable for the fans to complete the Xtreme Waterforce conversion to Xtreme Air. I went ahead and installed the assembly. To install the cable I only have to remove 4 screws from the shroud. This looks really nice. I am glad that I ordered the kit that includes the backplate because it is different than the Waterforce. It has additional screw holes. I am eager to see how hot/cold it runs with this thermal unit.

52 minutes ago, Papusan said:

 

I see where you go. But this is not an option here home. KPx will cost me more. See...

 

I ordered this in early spring...

 

1099 nok = $101.60 USD

One bottle of Kryonaut Extreme is 33.84g = So $3 USD per gram. Still damn expensive. But other lower end brand pastes here home will cost the same or even more. Etc Noctua NT-H2 High Performance will cost me $4 USD per gram. Me... Haven't much options but I rather buy the small bottle Grizzly and at least can save some money. And as FYI. This is with the dreaded 25% Norwegian tax included. 

 

Edit. 2 gram Thermalright TF8 cost +32$ or 16$ per gram. Isn't that disgusting?

https://www.multicom.no/thermalright-waermeleitpaste-tf-8-2/cat-p/c/p1000445950

 

Yup it seems I have not many other choices than continue buying bottles with Kryonaut Extreme. A lot money to pay each time I need paste, but I haven't many other choices. Buy small syringes with thermal paste will cost me more. So that's not an option. Just pay and be happy🤢

Yeah, those prices are ridiculous. Given that they seem to have no meaningful difference in performance, then I would definitely go with the more affordable option. It would be silly to spend more for one or the other. The Kryonaut Extreme obviously works great and for me to purchase it again would be fiscally foolish unless it becomes less expensive than KPx. Simple logic. Since I use liquid metal on my bare die setups I do not use very much thermal paste (or liquid metal since it does not wear out).

I wish I had a good way to delid this Xeon. I believe it is soldered. I know it is not as popular with everyone as it used to be, but I really do not like anything that is not delidded and bare die. I will always do that when it is an option.

1 hour ago, tps3443 said:

Yeah I’m gonna try that TF9. I bought a big container of Kryonaut Extreme. Well it’s actually a tiny tub. But it’s like 33 grams worth of it. It was when Titan Rig or one of these other shops had it on sale for $89.99 and it was like $76 with a discount code. But I believe my wife threw it away on accident. We have been tossing some stuff getting ready for the move. 

10 minutes ago, electrosoft said:

Agreed.

 

I've tried it 3 times actually with two different BGA laptops and it sucks OR I got a bad/fake batch ordered from Amazon here. I had way better results with Nano extreme (the original go to for laptops and poor heatsink pairings).

 

Isn't this the same stuff 4090/7900XTX users are raving over as being the best though (outside of liquid metal)?

Don't believe it. People like to state preferences as though they are facts.

Here is proof. Just did the comparison today. Kryonaut Extreme is the same as KPx in terms of how it works. It costs A WHOLE LOT more. Good stuff, but not worth it. I will use it since I bought it, but I won't ever buy it again. No benefit unless the goal is to spend $10.00 per gram more for the pink color instead of blue. Literally no difference.

Newer is always better newer, right @Papusan?