Mr. Fox

2 hours ago, tps3443 said:

I have been getting this “GPU out of video memory” error since 13th gen first launched, all of those errors in the video are probably from me lol. I would use it as my quick and easy stability test lol. I knew that if BF2042 would not spit that GPU out of VRAM error, or The Last of US, during their shader decompression, then my system was 100% stable lol. The largest reason for this error is simply from voltage/clock speed/ power/heat. There’s some sort of silicon issue with that initial launch load going from 10-180 watts in 0.3 seconds and if that voltage isn’t enough, or if those temps aren’t cold enough. It’s going to fail. I actually had one last night lol. This one popped up after closing the game though so it did not bother me 🤣

 

I always undervolt using LLC and AC/DC etc, so I stretch the CPU‘s to their lowest possible voltage required to save on power and reduce heat. And this is where I have always seen the errors. (Not from running the chips stock) now, I use a chiller so these chips stay cold so that would probably explain why I never see the errors when running stock/auto voltage. 
 

Asus updated the bios and moved away from their LLC3 standard to now using LLC5 which made many of them go away. If your load voltage is high enough you won’t get that error at all. Pretty wild seeing this though. It fixed the problem for most. But it always came down to just a weird silicon sensitivity problem. You can always force the error to happen on any chip out there I doesn’t matter how amazing it is. They all spit the same error if you starve them too much on voltage with these very quick ramping shader compiling loads. 
 

I’m not sure who to blame here. But it’s something wrong with the CPU’s I guess. I can always make them work either way though. Hopefully next gen won’t have the issue. I recommend anyone with an Intel 13th/14th gen to run Cinebench R15 a few times. If they can get through that, they should be okay. Something about R15 and the instruction set it uses is much harder to run on a 13th/14th gen Intel than R23/R24. If they can’t get through R15, add more voltage lol. Then once it can run reliably, add another +0.010 and you should be good for never having “Out of GPU memory errors” 

They should not be having any problems with BIOS defaults, and if that is the case then something is wrong with the BIOS defaults. I have only encountered that "out of memory" error one time and the problem was fixed by dropping the cache overclock from 52x to 51x. My impression is it is largerly caused by inexperienced people trying to overclock or undervolt incorrectly. Starving a CPU of voltage reduces performance and causes instability for sure.

I never run my CPUs or memory stock and never hestitate to give them more voltage when they need it to run right, but doing that is a common mistake made by many. I could be wrong, but I suspect these issues are primarily user-induced. Inexperience and ignorance are extremely common, and unintentionally misplaced blame often follows when things don't turn out as hoped. Games are sometimes not the most stable software coding examples and they can have stability issues of their own even when everything is tuned right from a hardware perspective.

On top of that, stability issues with gamer noobs getting overzealous with undervolting too much are certainly nothing new. When you have a product that is pushed to the near edge already in its stock form that is going to be even more problematic for them. Some may be undervolting where the solution they actually should be looking at with a sub-par silicon sample is over-volting, but they don't know enough to recognize that their tuning efforts are going 180 degrees in the wrong direction.

1 hour ago, Papusan said:

 

With not good enough cooling and with the Intel (mb manufactures cut costing) bend-gate, people risk problems like mentioned. Cheapo cooling is a no go even with Intel default crash-proof profile. People get what they wanted. Or just castrate the unlocked chips to 125W. Or even better.... Buy locked down cpus if you prefer cut down on the cooling. Buyers is their own enemy! They all think everything has to work correctly out of the box with+250w whatever cooling. Why you think thin an slimy jokebooks is so popular? 

Yes, I agree. I suspect thermal issues are often a factor. Expecting a caviar-level experience on a crackers and peanut butter budget doesn't happen. We know good and well there are going to be people dropping their i9 into a cheap motherboard with a $25 Amazon air cooler from China and expecting it to run the same as a system that someone else spent 300% more on their build. Not gonna happen.

3 hours ago, electrosoft said:

New TM5: https://github.com/CoolCmd/TestMem5/releases/tag/v0.13.1

Nice! Thanks for the link. Maybe it will be more optimal for DDR5.
Here was the Russian text: Часть секции ресурсов перекинута из TM5.EXE в TM5.DLL, чтобы тупые антивирусы заткнулись.
Google Translate: Part of the resource section is moved from TM5.EXE to TM5.DLL so that stupid antiviruses shut up.

12 minutes ago, Raiderman said:

I agree wholeheartedly on single thread scores. It doesn't interest me in the least. I'd rather kiss my sister than to sit and endure a single threaded benchmark.

On another note, besides my hardware addiction, I've just purchased another money sucking hobby.

 

Wow, I am jealous. Sweet new toy.

1 hour ago, Papusan said:

 

From what I have read and learn,,,, You need exactly 1.150 to reduce/stop clock stretching om 4090s. People believe they run with correct boost clock but it isn't. This is properly tested from the author of the unlocked nvflash for 4000 series cards. No one should use any org vbios on revised cards with the 1.075. 

 

Edit. Can't remember his name now but i think its Kefi. He also posted about this on his reddit thread. And his youtube channel. 

How do you get the voltage to 1.150V though? Is there a vBIOS that allows more than 1.100V apart than owning a Galax HOF 4090 with XOC vBIOS and overclock software to increase the voltage? I am not aware of any way to increase the voltage unless you own a Galax HOF GPU or break out the soldering iron and use Elmore hardware mods.

1 hour ago, tps3443 said:

Sounds like your cards might be okay core wise and memory. I tried three different bios so far, and I did try locking the core yesterday to 1.100V. I physically can’t do 2,970Mhz unfortunately. The Galax Bios was working pretty well for me, I also tried the Gigabyte gaming OC bios with the unlocked 1.100V, and also a new Gaming OC bios from April 2024. I might just leave this one on air cooling and be happy with it like my 4080 Super. I really enjoyed that card on air.

Yours just might not be cold enough with the air cooler. I know for a fact that the Gigabyte 4090 will not do 3000+ stable on ambient water on the smaller (unchilled) loop. Core clock speeds since Maxwell forward are capped/throttled based on temperature ranges, and got capped worse from Turing forward. The 4090 Suprim has always been run with a much larger liquid cooling system with the chiller, so I cannot directly compare the two GPU in that scenario. I just haven't been motivated enough to test it on the loop with the 5 gallon reservoir and chiller. And, my office ambient temps are just way too hot to be ideal for regular water cooling, and truly terrible for air cooling. It's 7:30 AM here with the central AC set to 73°F and my office is already almost 80°F. It will be 85°F in my office before the end of the day. And, that is only with my ITX (work) computer running. If I turn on two or all three desktops the ambient temperatures go even higher.

8 hours ago, tps3443 said:

It’s a nice GPU. Not quite CPU limited. Even 1080P and hammering 300+ fps, it’s all GPU limits in the games I play. 
 

@Mr. Fox how did your gaming OC clock on air? And on water? 

I hardly used it on air. Ordered the water block and switched it as soon as I could. I do remember being impressed with the air cooler's ability to keep it cool. It has never been benched on the chiller so I haven't really done any serious benching with it. Memory overclock on both 4090s is stable at +1700-1800 depending on the task. I use the Galax 1000W vBIOS on both GPUs. I did not have good results with the 666W vBIOS. Both GPUs worked better with the stock vBIOS than they did with the Galax 666W and both work best with the 1000W. For 3000+ on core you need to keep the voltage locked at 1.100V. At least it do. If it drops below 1.100V (the wimpy max) stability gets sketchy. I use Afterburner curve tool to lock it at 1.100V. I think the 4090 Suprim may have a slightly stronger core, but I've not done a good head-to-head comparison on chilled water. The 4090 really needs a core max of 1.200V to shine. The 1.100V limit is pretty wimpy. The OEMs and NVIDA are probably worried about the crappy 12VHPWR sockets melting and castrated the voltage to keep the watts lower.

1 hour ago, Papusan said:

@Mr. Fox? You really want that single core performance uplifth? 

Nope. I don't really care about that. It's the least important measurement to me, and I don't do any single core benchmarks. When I consider the mentality of the people that do care and make a big deal about it, it makes me care about it even less.

22 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

I think maybe I am going to be holding the line and might be purchasing obsolete hardware going forward.

@Papusan I am working our a deal for a ASUS ROG Rampage IV Gene and 4820K with 32GB (4x8GB) Kingston HyperX 2400MHz quad channel and a Titan GPU. I am doing an even trade for some spare parts I am not using. I should have those parts in another week or two. I will initially install them on the open bench. I think I will use it with the CR360 Dark AIO since that is just sitting on a shelf.

After extracting everything the 4820K can muster, I am probably going to grab a 4960X and a Xeon E5-1680 V2 to rack up some extra CPU hardware points. These CPUs are direct cheap on eBay.

After I am done racking up some points, I might put everything into the Dark Base Pro 901 case, load it up with mechanical HDDs and stick it under one of my desks to use it as a Windows 7 machine or Linux server. Not sure yet, just an idea. If I do that the Apex Encore and Gigabyte 4090 will move over to the open bench.

Since it is HEDT it has 40 PCIe lanes and will support X16 *2 GPU along with NVMe, SATA or NIC add-in cards. I might grab a second Titan or another 2080 Ti for some SLI benching if I can get them cheap enough. I am also thinking about grabbing a cheap 240 radiator to use with the 2080 Ti Waterforce GPU. I already have a spare D5 and reservoir I can connect to it.

In a couple of years I expect X299 parts will be just as cheap as these X79 pieces. I still have my X299 CPU delid tool.

It was 113°F today. Tomorrow the forecast is 115°F with a nighttime low of 103°F. But, it's a dry heat.

1 hour ago, ryan said:

Read that depressing article, as if it wasnt bad enough. Iv'e had my laptop for 2.5 years now and really dont see the need to upgrade! will I have to wait 10 years to see 64gb ram again. why is everything de-evolving?

De-evolving is how they succeed at sucking. When you make people stupid, it is easy to perpetuate lies and make them happy about being lied to. People that have a functioning brain and don't want to drink the Kool-Aid are nay-sayers. The tech space needs more nay-sayers and trouble-makers to stir up righteous levels of hate and discontent. The Goombah Gamers will believe what they are told. It reminds me a lot of this. Watch the clip... at least to 1:18. 

2 hours ago, Papusan said:

 

If the tech trend continue you'll see also desktop computing will follow same paths as mobile. Everything start one place. Mobile chips transformed into desktop chips doesnt bode well. Phone cores for high end desktops for power efficiency is perverse. Yup, you have still replaceable chips for your desktop build but they are still designed around mobile platforms. 

 

Hope Intel doesnt screw up for better power efficiency (HT increase power). If they do they will look stupid. Add the 4th big A.... Arrow lake. Everything with the A letter is Awful. 

 

This is why I purchased extra LGA 1700 CPUs that I do not need. I have two sitting on a shelf because, at this point, I am not planning to embrace next generation tech. I absolutely DO NOT care about gaining any energy efficiency unless it gets put to use as extra headroom. I do not support using more E-cores or discarding hyper-threading to use less power. I really only care about performance. If you can produce more performance using less power that's OK as long as you don't leave anything on the table by avoiding using up the power saved. We should always do more with more, not more with less. If new tech can use less power that is only nice if the response is to increase the clock speeds and add more cores and consume the same amount of power as we did before. Consume all of the extra headroom created. Treat power efficient gains in the same as you would lower temps. That is an opportunity to crank it up and use it all, push if further, not be happy about using less.

I think maybe I am going to be holding the line and might be purchasing obsolete hardware going forward. TIme will tell. I am not expecting to be impressed. I am expecting disappointment because priorities are getting all jacked up by stupid people with an agenda I do not agree with.

28 minutes ago, Papusan said:

Disgusting! What a failure.

 

But, while the news is shocking on its face, it’s not as bad as it sounds. This RAM change will actually help the average PC buyer, and it won’t be a long-term threat to people who want upgradeable RAM. Here’s why.

 

Lots of laptops already have soldered RAM, anyway

https://www.pcworld.com/article/2373541/intels-lunar-lake-laptops-wont-let-you-upgrade-your-ram-heres-why-thats-fine.html

Things will never get better as long as fake experts make lame excuses for trash that the zombie sheeple embrace. Mobile computing is perma-broken and will never get better. It needs a wooden stake driven through its heart. Absolutely hopeless lost cause And yeah... not enough axes...

Nice example documenting exactly what I have always said... PC gamers don't need to be performance PC enthusiasts. All gamers need is something better than a console. Which isn't very hard.

1 hour ago, Papusan said:

Im an viking you know.

As you know, I am married to a Viking. One of the most valuable things I have learned from my Viking bride is this...

37 minutes ago, Papusan said:

https://www.tweaktown.com/news/99179/intels-new-lga-1851-socket-uses-rl-ilm-loading-mechanism-improved-thermals-and-more/index.html

 

Pay more if you want the best for next generation. Why can't Intel make one simple single high quality proper ILM that can be used years forwards? One fifth all sockets and with the best contact. ILM for 1700 boards was awful. A lotteri. Some goth good contact while others had thermal problems. 

 

Btw. On my 1 month Canary summer vacation (outside Africa). Even with AC unit inside the bungalow l boiling. High humidity. I probably empty that Water box every 2 Hours. So this hot weather makes the life harder.

 

My newer heat/AC unit home I got last fall is much easier. Better effects and pump all water outside the house. I only need to clean the airfilter every 2nd week. Service every 2nd or 3rd year. And can last me 20 years from what I know. 

 

Home,,, Average temps is 13C and loads of rain. Coldest days have been sub 8C. The worst summer weather in many years. Juny was terrible and the start of July is equal bad. But who knows what August will bring home. We have to see 🙂

I hope the weather improves on your vacation. Sounds less miserable that last summer's heat without AC though.

I think the ILM lottery you refer to was more caused by a variety of third-party vendors producing them with poor quality control, which would not be the fault of Intel. It would be the fault of motherboard manufacturers cutting corners and paying less to get less for the sake of maximizing profits. Not to mention the fact that QC is in the toilet across the board for pretty much everything. Particularly true of products manufactured in China, the trash production capital of the world. The fact that some had problems and others did not pretty much negates the notion that the design itself is flawed and squarely places the blame on the shoulders of companies that produce sloppy crap.

I have never experienced the randomness personally because I never use the stock ILM. Everyrhing has bare die or Thermalright CPU frame. I prefer it even if QC was impeccable. Much cleaner design with the frame versus ILM. Also, much better mess control for thermal paste or liquid metal.

On 7/5/2024 at 4:37 PM, ryan said:

Pretty heavy music sir. Makes me want to..bad,..

 

Wonder if toms got anything new out

This is his latest masterpiece (released several weeks ago).

12 hours ago, ryan said:

Bought two tablets. Yoga 11 and p11 pro from Lenovo. Returned them. For a month they said wait 24 to 48 hours for refund. Shows they received it on UPS. They acknowledged receiving yoga tab and sleeve. Now they are saying package didn't have weight so they denied my refund. Out 750 dollars. Never dealing with Lenovo again, they operate like those scammers you see on you tube

If you have proof of the return take them to small claims court. You'll easily win and if they don't show up you'll win by default. It will only cost you time. Never buy Lenovo garbage. They are a trashy company that specializes in selling trash.

Why did you buy two tablets? You probably could have built or bought an insane high-end monster desktop with the cumulative money you have spent on disposable rubbish portable electronics in the past couple of years.

1 hour ago, Rage Set said:

I know Asrock was doing this but I didn't know Zotac and Gigabyte were placing Warranty Voided if Removed stickers.

 

I one of those that reported Asrock to the FTC about those illegal stickers.

 

https://www.techspot.com/news/103669-ftc-warns-pc-manufacturers-consumers-have-right-repair.html

 

 

Every person that files complaints and YouTube crusaders like Louis Rossman and Steve Burke at GN make a difference.

1 hour ago, electrosoft said:

Just a scummy move and another layer of companies trying to deny warranty claims to save $$$. Imagine if we didn't have the FTC what would happen? We need consumer protection laws like the EU has which are vastly superior to ours.

Nice to see it finally getting some attention. All the governments of the world need to hold Chinese manufacturers accountable for their scummy behavior. Allowing them to get away with the nonsense makes it easier for them to sell defective trash and get away with it. They're not alone, but it seems like most of the time (excluding crApple) when this right to repair interference surfaces it is with a Chinese manufacturer. They need to also start forcing the issue with making service part specs, part numbers, service manuals and schematics available. One of the few things Dell has done consistently well and better than competitors is publish service manuals and made components available, and offered reasonable warranty service and not tried to void warranties of those that service their own computers. But, they haven't released schematics.

6 hours ago, Mr. Fox said:

I have not installed it on my system with the 4K monitor, so 1440p is the highest resolution tested so far.

@tps3443 same settings as above only 4K. If you choose full screen instead of borderless you may find the benchmark doesn't read performance correctly for some reason. Not even close, but not sure why. (On my systems full screen reflects a single-digit average framerate, 0 FPS min and max about 100 FPS higher than actual, so there is some kind of bug with full screen setting.)

24 minutes ago, tps3443 said:

Yes, I actually owned that one already (I was thinking it was the 2nd one or something) I’ll give it a test though with my 4080 Super and see how it compares. Can you share the graphic settings? 

Sure, here they are:

I have not installed it on my system with the 4K monitor, so 1440p is the highest resolution tested so far.

9 hours ago, ryan said:

Sucks dealing with ignorance 

I agree. It ruins everything. But, Libtards are guaranteed the right to be ignorant and even allowed to place senile, geriatric, chimo, degenerate zombies with compulsive lying disorders in charge of destroying everything that makes our nation decent. It will be good to get back to Making America Great Again come November, and maybe send some of them to prison for their abuses of the judicial system, misappropriation of tax dollars, other conspiracies, high crimes, felonies and acts of treason.

@tps3443 did you grab that Zero Dawn on GOG? I snagged some cheap old games on Steam as well. Mortal Kombat 11, Injustice 2 and Terminator Resistance. I was sad to find two of them capped at 60 FPS, but haven't looked to see if there are any config file hacks to uncork that silly nonsense. (I think that capped FPS is common on fighting games for some stupid reason.)

4090

A770

12 minutes ago, tps3443 said:

It does look good. The Eisblock is still available though, and may get it just because it’s less expensive. Alphacool is stepping it up for sure though. All of their GPU blocks are less expensive than the EKWB, Heatkiller, and Optimus. And based on the comparisons they perform almost as well as the Optimus in GPU temps, and actually better than the Optimus in VRAM temps. 

Yeah, I really like mine. No complaints. Spending a whole lot more for minimal improvement isn't very smart. I've had acceptable results from my Byski GPU blocks as well, but the Alphacool block is built better (and a little bit more expensive) and I like it better than the Byski blocks. This was my first Alphacool GPU block. Even if all things were equal, I think I'd prefer to give my money to a German company than a Chinese company. I really like the fact that Optimus is an American company, but I don't like their high prices and limited availability. They rarely have anything available when I am ready to buy parts. If it were possible to never purchase anything produced by a Chinese company, I would choose that option.

3 minutes ago, raptorddd said:

cool i have the sweet spot anything higher it just freezes or artifacts start appearing on screen. i can go almost 200 mhz.

thanks

That is actually a pretty decent overclock. Have you tried bumping the GPU memory clock? That can be very helpful for gaming performance.

19 minutes ago, tps3443 said:

Have you seen the Alphacool Core V2? I’m gonna get one of these. It looks pretty nice. It wraps around the whole GPU, and the actual block is longer and covers the PCB. As for the terminals, it’s made to the block so the terminal and block are one piece. 
 

 

I do not think that it existed at the time I purchased my block. If it did, it wasn't available for my GPU yet. It does look very nice. One thing I really like about the Alphacool blocks is the o-ring does not have any goofy curves that make servicing the block more difficult. It's just square and installing a new o-ring should be easier to keep in place during assembly.

25 minutes ago, tps3443 said:

Hey, @Mr. Fox I notice you bought a Alphacool Eisblock for your 4090 Gaming OC. But did you buy the V2 version since you have a 4090 Gaming OC V2? I’m looking at three blocks maybe (3) versions Alphacool makes for the 4090 Gaming OC. 
 

#1 Alphacool Eisblock Gaming OC

#2 Alphacool Eisblock V2 Gaming OC

#3 Alphacool Core Gaming OC V2

 

I really like the Alphacool Core V2, it wraps around the whole PCB but it’s a little more expensive. I think since you had a solid experience, I’ll grab one. Don’t think I’ll leave the 4090 on air 🤣

 

When I placed the order from Titan Rig the V2 was not part of the product description. I emailed them about it and they said it was the V2. They had to email Alphacool to ask because it was not clear to them and the V2 was a new release.

https://www.titanrig.com/alphacool-eisblock-aurora-geforce-rtx-4090-aorus-master-gaming-v2-gpu-water-block-with-backplate-0320ac037101on.html?

They have a promo for 15% off right now.

15 minutes ago, electrosoft said:

 

Were you able to hit 8400 and 8600 for short term testing before temps became an issue? I do know the Strix board I tested briefly before (Z790i) wouldn't even post past 8200 while the MSI Z790i would hit 8400 and 8600 for at least posting with the 13900KS SP115.

 

 

Ugh, Gigabyte.....no thanks. 🤣 I have yet to have had a good experience with a Gigabyte board from Z390 through Z590. Reading over the Z790i Ultra from them I'm not doing backflips....

Yes, I was able to run it at 8400 but could not complete stability tests like TM5 due to the high temps. It would start throwing errors when the memory temps exceeded 45-48°C but didn't have any instability evident at temperatures below that. I still have that issue even with the Bykski heatsinks and fans blowing on the modules, it just takes longer for them to get that hot, so I dropped the speed down to 8200 and lowered the voltage accordingly. Running with the side panel removed and a fan blowing cooler air into the chassis was helpful, but doing that kind of negates any basis for having the parts installed in a SFF case instead of an open bench.

Overclocking the GPU is safe under any circumstances. Modern video cards are so crippled that there's not anything you can do to harm them in terms of overclocking. They have thermal protection, voltage gimped and capped power limits. The worst thing that could happen is it would be unstable from pushing the overclock beyond the wimpy voltage limits, causing operating system instability. If it gets too hot it'll just throttle to cool itself down. Even desktop GPUs are castrated in the same way.

On 7/2/2024 at 5:28 AM, epguy3 said:

 

Microsoft resumes botched up Windows 11 June update, but it now breaks taskbar - Windows Latest

Losers. To put it kindly. 😖

25 minutes ago, electrosoft said:

How far were you able to push the MSI Z90i edge memory? I was limited by my sticks at the time as tested across three systems, they just wouldn't do much over 8000 (G4 x670e, MSI z790i edge, G4 Asrock B650 2 dimmer) tested but could boot 8400 and individually 8600.

Temps are the challenge with air cooling. I have landed on 8200 C36 (see HWiNFO in last post with screenshots) as the daily driver. 8400 and 8600 just get way too hot on air, especially in a restrictive SFF case. Even 8200 was too hot with stock heating blankets. The fan helps a little, but didn't with the stock trash covers.

5 hours ago, tps3443 said:

I am sort of a patreon supporter for this guy named “Pure Dark” anyways, the guy makes mods for games that do not initially or never support DLSS, or Frame Gen etc. Some of his stuff is free, while the rest of it is behind a pay wall ($5 dollars per month, you can just pay once download everything and cancel lol). But, I think it’s worth it. Game devs are slow to incorporate the best Nvidia tech in some of these titles. And I think that’s where the Pure Dark modded comes in useful. I am using his mods in Avatar Pandora game, it added Nvidia DLSS3+FG and it worked 100% smoothly. He’s also done a lot of other older games, that were pre frame gen. He also did Starfield DLSS+ FG before Bethesda added it to the game officially like 4-6 months later lol. Anyways, I still have a subscription to him and I need to cancel it. 
 

 

@electrosoft Dis you snag that SP109 (14900KS) for $599? 😂

I supported that guy (don't remember what nickname he goes by) that does the AMD stuff when I was trying to make do with the 5950X and I currently support the OCCT dev, but I don't game enough to support  something like this for it to be worth it. But, I can see where it would be worth everything  penny for someone that does. It was worth it for the two  devs mentioned.

4 hours ago, electrosoft said:

I DID snag it! lol!

I couldn't pass up that price for an SP109!

Congrats. That was a good deal.

For anyone interested, GOG has Horizon Zero Dawn on sale for under $15. I don't care for the game genre, but I bought it just for the benchmark, as I have done with so many titles. The first thing I had to find out was how to skip that stupid long intro video, LOL. SO Painful! Solution: At+F4 > No.